Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

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Hipolito
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Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Hipolito »

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I don't think anyone predicted this. Fallout: New Vegas was not only a bottom-seeder, but had to win a bye round just to become a bottom-seeder! With pluck and sass, it beat Mount & Blade, Mass Effect 2, Solium Infernum, Civilization V, Portal 2, and Skyrim to win the title of Best Game of Last Five Years. Quite surprising for a game that, if I remember correctly, did not review as well as its predecessors.

We shall take a week or two off from tourneying for customary festivities and merrymaking. You also might want to think about your nomination list for the Best Game of All Time Tournament. That's coming next, and I'll allow you to nominate 20 games from all platforms and eras.

I hope you enjoyed this tournament as much as me. If you have any suggestions on how to make the BGOAT better, please let me know. Thanks for participating!

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Daehawk
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Daehawk »

Well it is a great game and it deserved to beat all those games...except Skyrim! I say we ban together and file a class action law suit against ourselves. Dont we have a lawyer on here who can handle this?
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by RMC »

Maybe on appeal we can get Mass Effect 2 to win instead. ;)
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by wonderpug »

I want to say this is a travesty, but I suppose I should probably get around to playing Fallout New Vegas first... :-?
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Gavin
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Gavin »

Impossible competition. This is the sort of thing that can only be broken down into the best game of the last five years according to genre. Because once you start putting different genres against eachother you go wildly into the realm of subjectivity whereas within the genre subsets you have at least some stable elements to add a degree of objectivity to them do to similar technological challenges. This is a nice broad overview and I agree that New Vegas is a solid entry. It would be nice to see a similar thing divided into genre at some point. Comparing several of these games is like comparing pies to cakes, both of which you may love for entirely different reasons (anyone else tired of apples and oranges getting all the glory in analogies?).

How the heck did Solium Infernum make the list and how did it beat The Last of Us? I think I'm almost through the game (just got past the whole hydro plant area, without saying where I am) and it's one of the best games I've played. The story, the enemies, the characters, all superb. It's sole fault being that it was ps3 only so it likely wouldn't have won unless everyone voting had actually played the game.

But [a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XQFusXsYyD8"]Solium Infernum[/a]? I can see the game being a very addictive game for a very specific genre/audience without any mass appeal. That it is even on the list at all is perplexing. I had no idea our site had individuals who leaned that heavily towards that genre but judging from the lack of comments on The Last of Us' thread I can see that it hasn't been played.

In the history I see the poll for what the competition should be about, and then a gap until round 3. So I can't find the answer.
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Carpet_pissr »

Gavin wrote:I had no idea our site had individuals who leaned that heavily towards that genre
Are you referring to Solium Infernum here? If so, that genre is turn based strategy, which is a pretty big favorite around these parts. Or it could be that we just have a small, vocal minority of loudmouths that won't stop blathering on about turn based this, and turn based that.

:whistle:
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by wonderpug »

Gavin wrote:I can see the game being a very addictive game for a very specific genre/audience without any mass appeal.
I don't see mass appeal as being one of the criteria for a contest like this. Kerbal Space Program, for example, I'd have personally voted for over many of the other contenders in this competition. It's very much not a mass appeal game, but it is a fantastic game.
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Gavin
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Gavin »

wonderpug wrote:
Gavin wrote:I can see the game being a very addictive game for a very specific genre/audience without any mass appeal.
I don't see mass appeal as being one of the criteria for a contest like this. Kerbal Space Program, for example, I'd have personally voted for over many of the other contenders in this competition. It's very much not a mass appeal game, but it is a fantastic game.
I don't recall saying that mass appeal was a criteria or should be. It's just an interesting title to see here because it means our community deviates from the norm. Such atypical occurances should be noted.
Carpet_pissr wrote:Are you referring to Solium Infernum here? If so, that genre is turn based strategy, which is a pretty big favorite around these parts. Or it could be that we just have a small, vocal minority of loudmouths that won't stop blathering on about turn based this, and turn based that.

:whistle:
I'm a fan of turn based games. Always have been. My favorite game of all time is FFTactics. This game just looks particularly dated in a way that would irk me.
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Ralph-Wiggum »

It would be great if only people who had played both of the games competing voted in that bracket, but then in some instances you might only get a few votes total. Otherwise, however, I'm not sure there's a way to give these console only (e.g. The Last of Us) or indie games (e.g. Kerbal Space Program) a fair shot in these tournaments.
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wonderpug
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by wonderpug »

Gavin wrote:
wonderpug wrote:
Gavin wrote:I can see the game being a very addictive game for a very specific genre/audience without any mass appeal.
I don't see mass appeal as being one of the criteria for a contest like this. Kerbal Space Program, for example, I'd have personally voted for over many of the other contenders in this competition. It's very much not a mass appeal game, but it is a fantastic game.
I don't recall saying that mass appeal was a criteria or should be. It's just an interesting title to see here because it means our community deviates from the norm. Such atypical occurances should be noted.
When you said "it has no mass appeal" followed by "it's perplexing that it even made the list", it made it sound like you didn't think it deserved to even be a contender. Is your intended point just that it's interesting how OO 'best game' polls can turn up games that would never even be noticed on most big box IGN/GameSpot type polls? If so, I agree, and that's what made this contest more interesting. : )
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by AWS260 »

Gavin wrote:How the heck did Solium Infernum make the list
Like everything else in the tournament, it was nominated by enough people to make the list (I think the nominations thread was lost in the Great Server Hiccup of 2013). Quite a few of us participated in -- and greatly enjoyed -- PBEM games of Solium Infernum a few years ago. There are several AAR threads in the bowels of the PC Gaming section.
Gavin wrote:how did it beat The Last of Us?

I think you're correct that The Last of Us hasn't been played by most of the people voting because of its platform, which limited the pool of people who could potentially vote for it.
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Kelric »

Ralph-Wiggum wrote:It would be great if only people who had played both of the games competing voted in that bracket, but then in some instances you might only get a few votes total. Otherwise, however, I'm not sure there's a way to give these console only (e.g. The Last of Us) or indie games (e.g. Kerbal Space Program) a fair shot in these tournaments.
I sat out the votes where I hadn't played both, which was almost all of them. I guess I need to get around to playing this backlog of mine...
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Archinerd »

Carpet_pissr wrote:
Gavin wrote:I had no idea our site had individuals who leaned that heavily towards that genre
Are you referring to Solium Infernum here? If so, that genre is turn based strategy, which is a pretty big favorite around these parts. Or it could be that we just have a small, vocal minority of loudmouths that won't stop blathering on about turn based this, and turn based that.

:whistle:
Yeah, we love our TBS around here. I'll send you a PM with all the reasons why.
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Isgrimnur »

But will he have to send you a reply to get the next reason on the list?
It's almost as if people are the problem.
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Carpet_pissr »

I feel like I'm missing something... :confusion-scratchheadblue:
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Isgrimnur »

Spoiler:
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Gavin
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Gavin »

wonderpug wrote:When you said "it has no mass appeal" followed by "it's perplexing that it even made the list", it made it sound like you didn't think it deserved to even be a contender. Is your intended point just that it's interesting how OO 'best game' polls can turn up games that would never even be noticed on most big box IGN/GameSpot type polls? If so, I agree, and that's what made this contest more interesting. : )
Very puzzling. Meaning, it is out of place on the survey. "One of these things is not like the others...".

So yeah, it is interesting that we deviate from the norm in what appears to be a statistically relevant number of voters. Any way in which an entity deviates is what makes it unique and should be noteworthy. My point wasn't to spark any sort of controversy or to call us dumb for putting a game in there that didn't deserve it.
AWS260 wrote:
Gavin wrote:How the heck did Solium Infernum make the list
Like everything else in the tournament, it was nominated by enough people to make the list (I think the nominations thread was lost in the Great Server Hiccup of 2013). Quite a few of us participated in -- and greatly enjoyed -- PBEM games of Solium Infernum a few years ago. There are several AAR threads in the bowels of the PC Gaming section.
Interesting, a community event would explain the variation. Thanks.
Gavin wrote:how did it beat The Last of Us?

I think you're correct that The Last of Us hasn't been played by most of the people voting because of its platform, which limited the pool of people who could potentially vote for it.
Hmm, it's a shame that it is platform specific. I rarely see writing, acting, or pretty much anything done that well and in one place, regardless of the media.
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Zurai »

There is essentially a 0% chance that any console-only title will ever win one of these tournaments here. This community is too biased (by population rather than prejudice) to make them anything but passing amusements; you certainly can't draw any kind of statistical conclusion about anything related to them.
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Lordnine »

I’m amazingly happy with this victor!

I do wonder how this might have played out differently if it had been posted in PC Games instead of General. Personally, I almost never come in this forum and so I missed almost every round of voting and I’m sure a lot of people are similar.
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Hipolito »

Gavin wrote:It would be nice to see a similar thing divided into genre at some point.
I floated the idea of having a genre-based tournament back in our Pleistocene era, but there was not enough interest at the time. There is also the problem of how to define genres, an inexact science at best. I would support anyone who took up the challenge.
Lordnine wrote:I do wonder how this might have played out differently if it had been posted in PC Games instead of General. Personally, I almost never come in this forum and so I missed almost every round of voting and I’m sure a lot of people are similar.
That is a good point. For the BGOAT, I may post a spam thread in both the PC Games and Console & Mobile Games forums just to say "hey, this is a thing, come on over."


As to the notion that console-only games are disadvantaged, I thought I'd do a breakdown of the PC-only and console-only games in the tournament and how well they did:

PC-only
Kerbal Space Program: bye round
Dawn of War II: round 1
Don't Starve: round 2
Mount & Blade: bye round
Torchlight II: round 1
Solium Infernum: round 2
FTL: round 2
Civilization V: round 3

Console-only
Rock Band 2: round 2
Shadow Complex: round 1
Uncharted 2: bye round
The Last of Us: round 1
Red Dead Redemption: round 3
Valkyria Chronicles: round 1

So yeah, PC-only games did fare better than console-only games, but not by a huge margin. And of the Elite Eight, exactly one game was PC-only and one was console-only. I think this demonstrates how much convergence there is. (Convergence is why we voted to open this tournament to all platforms in the first place.) Maybe next time, console games will do just as well as PC games. (But not better!)
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Gavin »

Hipolito wrote:
Gavin wrote:It would be nice to see a similar thing divided into genre at some point.
I floated the idea of having a genre-based tournament back in our Pleistocene era, but there was not enough interest at the time. There is also the problem of how to define genres, an inexact science at best. I would support anyone who took up the challenge.
There's only about 6 main buckets. Something like Action (platformers, shooters, fighting, hack and slash), Action-Adventure(stealth and/or survival horror), Adventure (might as well call this the Walking Dead category right now, but games like Zork, Myst, and all that), RPG, Simulation (life, vehicle, construction) and Strategy (all our RTS games and such).

You do get some blurring when they cross over. Like an action game (FPS) that has strong RPG elements. For example, Skyrim calls itself an Action-Role Playing game. If you find that a lot of games match the criteria for a sub-genre like that, you throw in an extra sub-genre. I think Skyrim and the fallouts would be here or if you created a sandbox category you'd get those and red dead as well as a few others all in one place. The game of the year (or five years) competition would then be between the heads of each genre.

The thing to remember is that where subjectivity is involved in the setup, the person actually taking the time to set it up is the decision maker. Feedback is a must but at the end of the day you're the one doing it. I'd be up for setting up a few of the genres and helping with defining what games would go where.
Zurai wrote:There is essentially a 0% chance that any console-only title will ever win one of these tournaments here. This community is too biased (by population rather than prejudice) to make them anything but passing amusements; you certainly can't draw any kind of statistical conclusion about anything related to them.
You can regarding the nature of this community of which the results were a legitimate subset of the overall set which is Octopus Overlords.
Last edited by Gavin on Thu Sep 19, 2013 10:35 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Blackhawk »

I'd make it even simpler. Make just a few broad categories (action, strategy, RPG, adventure, misc), then let the peoples' nominations determine what fits where.

It is possible that a game might end up in more than one category, but if enough people nominate it to put it there, then that may be legitimate. Deus Ex is one of my favorite RPGs. It is also one of my favorite action games.
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Post by LordMortis »

While I didn't like the results :p I like the survey and format. The search was for an OO opinion not a Steam Opinion or Gamer Magazine Opinion. The last thing I'd want to see is Madden NFL or Angry Birds showing as the best game in the last 5 years and seeing games like SI make a showing, which I thought was one of the best games in the last five years that I played and allowed me to look at others who vote similarly and look games they liked that I haven't played.

If you wanted to break things into Console and portable OS formats, I'd be fine with that. I could pass by them easily enough.

If we harumph the subjectivity of the poll because of sample, then we're sort of harumphing the subjectivity of the sample that chose to be here.
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Post by Gavin »

Blackhawk wrote:I'd make it even simpler. Make just a few broad categories (action, strategy, RPG, adventure, misc), then let the peoples' nominations determine what fits where.

It is possible that a game might end up in more than one category, but if enough people nominate it to put it there, then that may be legitimate. Deus Ex is one of my favorite RPGs. It is also one of my favorite action games.
Hmm, since the action-adventure is a small number of games I think absorbing it into the others would be acceptable.

I'd still be open to a couple sub-genres/cross genres if they prove particularly possible like Action-RPGs or sandbox titles.
LordMortis wrote:If you wanted to break things into Console and portable OS formats, I'd be fine with that. I could pass by them easily enough.
Hmm, it'd be interesting to see a competition on console exclusive titles. I found myself extremely partial to PS3's exclusives this generation and just less and less impressed with Microsoft's handful of shooter exclusives.
If we harumph the subjectivity of the poll because of sample, then we're sort of harumphing the subjectivity of the sample that chose to be here.
I'm sorry my comment was seen as harumphing the subjectivity. I've spent the last several posts explaining that my comment was regarding my interest in the ways this specific community deviates from the norm. I was in no way saying that this community should magically allign with the norm like good little commies. Especially seeing as I often find myself sharing interest in things on this forum that I wouldn't find others sharing elsewhere.
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Re: Best Game of Last Five Years - A Winner is ...

Post by Hipolito »

For the best-of-genre tournament, I like Blackhawk's suggestion of starting with a few broad categories and letting voters decide which game goes where. I'd go farther by letting voters propose more categories and placing games in them. Say you want to nominate StarCraft, but you don't think it would be interesting to put it in the "Strategy" category against the likes of HOMM and Panzer General. You'd say, "New category: RTS," and put StarCraft there. Others can voice agreement or harumph, but, as Gavin said, it would be ultimately up to the tournament chair.


The BGOLFY did get me to try some games that had been sitting unplayed in my Steam library or to-buy list so that I could make more informed votes. I've now played a little FNV, Torchlight II, FTL, Civ V, Tomb Raider, and Portal 2. Of those, I enjoy Tomb Raider the most.
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