Mansions of Madness - second edition

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Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Smoove_B » Tue Jul 26, 2016 10:53 am

As I guessed, they're re-releasing the original and have added app support in a similar vein as the new Descent game. Official info here:
Fantasy Flight Games is proud to invite you to return to the insanity in Mansions of Madness Second Edition, the app-driven horror board game inspired by the works of H.P. Lovecraft.
What's new in Mansions of Madness Second Edition?

This fully cooperative adventure will take you and up to four fellow investigators through the dark and desolate halls and alleyways of Arkham. Much like the original Mansions of Madness, the second edition sends you through a series of thrilling and confounding scenarios in which you must explore unpredictable maps haunted by bloodthirsty monsters, in order to solve intricate puzzles and uncover ominous secrets. Focus your mind and grab a weapon…fast! The game will be available everywhere next Thursday, August 4.
Trailer

FAQ:
What’s new in the Second Edition?

Mansions of Madness Second Edition is now guided by a companion app that removes the need for a Keeper player, makes for a fully cooperative game, allows for single player gaming, and makes setup quick and easy.

Can I combine this with my first edition of Mansions of Madness?

Mansions of Madness Second Edition includes a conversion kit, which is designed to incorporate your first edition Mansions of Madness investigator figures, monster figures, and map tiles into the game. These additional components will significantly expand the app’s choices when generating maps and monsters, as well as the set of investigators from which you can choose.

Can I play the game without the app?

No. Because the app is in integral part of gameplay, and generates each scenario and all of the game’s tiles and events, you cannot play Mansions of Madness Second Edition without the app.

Where can I download the app?

The app will be available for iOS, Android, Mac, and Windows. You will be able to download it from the AppleiOS AppStore™, the Google Play™ store, or the Amazon Appstore. It will also be available for Mac and PC on Steam.
Good to know I can convert my dusty 1st edition game into being usable for this one. That makes it even more enticing.

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by hepcat » Tue Jul 26, 2016 10:57 am

Welp, I'm in. Damn it.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Isgrimnur » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:02 am

So you end up with twice the components, as you have to buy the second edition to get the conversion kit? I suppose it ups the scope and replayability if you're using both, but that seems like an awful lot of plastic and shelf space.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Lordnine » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:11 am

I was actually rather disappointed in this. Despite a hefty amount of fiddlyness, Mansions remains one of my favorite board games. I wanted refined rules and new scenarios, instead it replaces the game master and sounds like it does away with the scripted, role-playing-lite story-lines that made the original fun.

I suppose I still need to wait for actual impressions but it sounds more like it’s made for people who didn’t like the original instead of those who did.

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by coopasonic » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:12 am

Isgrimnur wrote:So you end up with twice the components, as you have to buy the second edition to get the conversion kit? I suppose it ups the scope and replayability if you're using both, but that seems like an awful lot of plastic and shelf space.
The conversion kit is to convert the first edition stuff for use with the second edition so it's more like enabling it as an expansion not converting it into the second edition.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Zarathud » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:16 am

Hopefully it replaces the "search for something bad to happen" mechanic. There was almost no chance of anything beneficial. Although I did like the time when we set the entry hallway on fire. That was comically terrible.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Smoove_B » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:16 am

If it replaces the adversarial role in the same way as the Descent app does, it will be a godsend. The problem for my gaming group is that we never play the same game two months in a row. It might be months between sessions and I think for games like Descent you really need to know the rules quite well to play the role of the Overlord as designed. That was half our problem in playing Descent - my buddy pretty much on tilt the entire time because he's trying to remember the rules AND play whatever cards make the most strategic sense. Now that the app handles that element (enemy strategy) it made the game much more enjoyable for us. I felt the same the few times we tried playing Mansions of Madness. Very fiddly setup that can completely ruin the game if you don't create the deck correctly. In the same way, having to manage all the rules and the role as the game master was just too much for a game that hit the table every three months. I was actually going to sell my copy last month during my local gaming convention but I held on to it thinking maybe this was going to happen. I'm actually happy now and hope to be able to play it again.

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Isgrimnur » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:29 am

At least it's a value-add for the consumer in the double-dipping. I have to give them credit for that, at least.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Smoove_B » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:33 am

I'd be much less interested if it was a 100% replacement of the original as I do have about half the figures painted (story of my life). Being able to click a few toggles in the app to have it somehow magically add this content? Definitely value added. I went over to Amazon and noticed the pricing on the 1st edition game and expansions. If nothing else, hopefully this brings the game out of the extreme hobbyist category with premium prohibitive pricing.

EDIT: Ohh. Price is $99.99 for new set. That seems...steep. What do they think this is? Star Wars?

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by hepcat » Tue Jul 26, 2016 11:50 am

I think the trend of pricing these things at 99.99 is to offset the online pricing. I'm guessing this will be around 69 bucks online.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by YellowKing » Tue Jul 26, 2016 4:08 pm

I'm embarrassed to say I own this (the first edition) and haven't played it once. The one time I brought it out, the rules and setup were just too long and complex and we ended up playing something else. It never made it to the table again.

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by hepcat » Tue Jul 26, 2016 4:12 pm

That was my issue with it too. I played it a couple of times, but the set up was just so damn exhausting. Plus, I've decided I'm not a fan of games that require a "GM", so to speak. I wanna play too, you know!
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Smoove_B » Tue Jul 26, 2016 4:31 pm

If I'm to believe the grognards online, you can probably sell your unused 1st edition copies for enough money to fund the purchase of a second edition.

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Chaz » Tue Jul 26, 2016 4:49 pm

I preordered the first edition, then was sad to discover it was kind of clunky as a system, and a little bit broken. Sounds like this version is closer to what I was hoping the first edition was. I've still got my first edition, mostly unplayed.

I'd kind of like to get the new version, but the price is way too high for me. I guess it's nice that if I ever do, I'll be able to incorporate my first edition stuff. But given how infrequently I get to play anything, I'm not sure how much good the extra variety would really do me.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Smoove_B » Tue Jul 26, 2016 4:56 pm

Ahh...but now you can play solo. You know for all that spare time you have as a new parent.

(pauses here for laughter)

Don't worry. It will get better...in about 8 years. By then we'll be on the 3rd edition. :wink:

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Chaz » Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:01 pm

I think I'm full up on solo games. Between four COIN games, Mage Knight, and Robinson Crusoe, I'm well covered in the solo board game front. I'm hoping that for at least a while I could be "watching the baby" by wearing him while playing a game.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by YellowKing » Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:45 pm

Chaz wrote:I'm hoping that for at least a while I could be "watching the baby" by wearing him while playing a game.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Smoove_B » Tue Jul 26, 2016 7:03 pm

Solo games are my new (~6 months) obsession. It's a phase...but a useful one.

On topic - they have an extended preview up now with lots of the artwork featured. I thought this was interesting:
Insanity, on the other hand, will affect each investigator differently, potentially altering their win condition or limiting their abilities.
Limiting their abilities, sure...but does this mean a hidden (insane) traitor victory is possible?

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by coopasonic » Tue Jul 26, 2016 7:21 pm

hepcat wrote:I think the trend of pricing these things at 99.99 is to offset the online pricing. I'm guessing this will be around 69 bucks online.
$85 at CSI
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Lordnine » Tue Jul 26, 2016 7:25 pm

Smoove_B wrote:Solo games are my new (~6 months) obsession. It's a phase...but a useful one.

On topic - they have an extended preview up now with lots of the artwork featured. I thought this was interesting:
Insanity, on the other hand, will affect each investigator differently, potentially altering their win condition or limiting their abilities.
Limiting their abilities, sure...but does this mean a hidden (insane) traitor victory is possible?
There were one or two missions in the original that did the whole hidden traitor mechanic. Everyone received a hidden information card near the start of the mission, most of them were fairly mundane but one prevented respawning on death and another made it so the character could only win if the Keeper won. It was pretty fun when the traitor came out because she literally stabbed her husbands’ character in the back as he was walking up the stairs to the final objective.

When he came back to life as a new character he made it his number one agenda to hunt her down and since I am an evil man, I put lots of monster between him and her. Mechanically, keeping her alive didn’t matter but thematically I made it look like she was behind the whole thing. :lol:

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by baelthazar » Wed Jul 27, 2016 12:47 am

I do not know what to make of this. MoM is one of my favorite games, but it is hampered by the fact that I cannot solo play it. The second edition seems to fix that using the app (although app use in boardgames does bug me a bit). But I wonder how much crossover there is with the old version - I do not want or need two copies of the game just to get access to the app. It does look like new dice and some new monsters (the star spawn in the pic is new) so I hope that means all new stuff.

That being said a 2-3 hour play time is going to be almost impossible with a 4 month old in the house. And the $85 price tag is staggering. I may sit this one out for a while and think about it as a Christmas gift. FFG's games usually stay well stocked.

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Anonymous Bosch » Wed Jul 27, 2016 1:51 am

Smoove_B wrote:Solo games are my new (~6 months) obsession. It's a phase...but a useful one.
OT: Have you tried Hostage Negotiator? I've been quite impressed at just how well it manages to evoke the theme for a solitaire game. It makes for a terrific travel game too, as it has relatively few components, and sets up and tears down in no time at all (and games never take long, due to the ticking timer of the Terror Deck). The publisher's out of stock of the original game, but are currently running a Kickstarter for the larger, stand-alone expansion, Hostage Negotiator: Crime Wave (which can optionally include reprints of the original game). Well worth investigating if you missed out on the original, particularly if you have any interest in solo games.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Smoove_B » Wed Jul 27, 2016 7:46 am

Missed the original and reprint, current backer of the new one, but thanks. :D

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by hepcat » Wed Jul 27, 2016 8:51 am

Oooh, I've been dancing around Hostage Negotiator for a while. I think I'll go in at the 90 dollar level and get everything.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Smoove_B » Thu Jul 28, 2016 6:43 pm

Third preview is now up. Of note:
The presence of an app also changes the way you set up your scenarios. By drawing elements from your game collection, the app can procedurally generate infinite map variations, monster spawns, mythos events, and puzzles. In the settings menu, you will select which games, from the original edition to expansions, the app should pull components from. Your map for each scenario will start with the same few tiles, but down halls and through doorways, you will often find different rooms and streets than the last time you played. With 24 double-sided map tiles, the possibilities within the core game are already vast, but each scenario will become even more varied with each piece of additional content you incorporate.

...

A favorite obstacle carried over from the first edition to this one is puzzles, which are now generated by the app. You may encounter a puzzle at any time throughout your investigation, but it is through solving these puzzles that you may gain valuable tools. Each of the three puzzle types—slide, code, and lock—may be completed in a number of steps. The amount of time it will take you to complete the puzzle will vary, depending on how complicated the puzzle is, how many chances your lore skill allows you to take at solving the puzzle, and how efficient you are with your moves. Once completed, the puzzle may reveal information, an item, or even a new area of the map.

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Lordnine » Thu Jul 28, 2016 7:30 pm

So I have a problem with that. If you have the original game and expansions, you have a ton of board pieces. If the app procedurally generates tiles as you explore I expect there to be a ton of downtime looking for the right board piece. Considering that many of the boards are also quite large, without knowing the final size, I could see the board veering off the side of the table.

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Smoove_B » Thu Jul 28, 2016 7:40 pm

It's hard to say without seeing the app in action, but I can say that my buddy has just about every Descent expansion known to man and of course he added them all to the 2.0 app released earlier this year. Setup was a bit difficult (but not impossible) and when we had to find a new set of tiles (when a door was opened) it wasn't difficult enough to be annoying. I'm betting as we play more his organization method will get better and for people that own the original (15 tiles), using another 24 double-sided tiles shouldn't be too bad.

But yeah, you're likely going to need a lot of room regardless. I'd imagine (hope?) they have the randomizer configured as to generate random tiles in a fixed area (say 3'x3'), not an amorphous blob that could be 8 feet long and 1 foot wide.

I think for us the puzzle solving might be more difficult as we'd be using a laptop connected via HDMI to a 26" LCD TV. Needing to figure out how to pass that laptop around or have someone get up and move over to the guy that's running the app might be a bit awkward. On the other hand, no more shuffling of decks.

Also: It's on Amazon, Prime shipping for $99.95 for those that care.

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by baelthazar » Fri Jul 29, 2016 2:10 pm

I am going to be needlessly negative because I need to talk myself out of pulling the trigger with Amazon Prime (because the price there is the same as MM or CSI with shipping... of course you add card sleeves and... NO BAD BAEL). I am with LordNine on this - that sounds like a huge nightmare of digging through cards, tiles, and monsters to get the one the app spawns. Also, I am not real keen on solving the puzzle through the app - if I wanted to play an iPhone puzzle game, I would play an iPhone puzzle game. Maybe I am an old fogey, but there was something about the tactile nature of the puzzles that made them interesting (and, let's face it, those puzzles were fairly weak and broke the flow of the game in a major way, now think about them breaking the flow with everyone gathered around the iPhone).

Another aspect that I am wondering if it will work or not - if the app randomly pulls stuff from your collection, what provides the coherent narrative of the game? While Descent may be fine as a dungeon crawl with random tiles and encounters, a Lovecraftian game needs to have some theme to make sense (and the first edition, while random, at least had scenarios that made some sense and gave the Keeper certain monsters and actions that followed the scenario's theme). I just would not like to be walking in a strange mansion, following a maniac who killed his family, just to randomly have a Star Spawn walk around the corner for no rhyme or reason. Surely they have thought about this, but that preview did not reflect that.

Again, this is mostly just me trying to talk myself into waiting for Christmas. :shock:

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Smoove_B » Fri Jul 29, 2016 4:25 pm

If I hadn't used the Descent app I think I'd be much more concerned overall, but I am really confident this is going to be a really valuable tool for people like me that had problems playing this game with a small group. For people that really liked playing as a Keeper or liked the adversarial nature of the game, this isn't likely an interesting development. But for someone like me and for our group I'm very excited to give it a spin. But no, I'm not pre-ordering or expecting to have this before year end. I'll wait until it's out for a bit and can hear some official impressions but for me it's more of a matter of logistics and getting it to the table. I'm on gaming overload right now (as well as improving/updating) my basement gaming area - it would likely sit in a box for the next 3 months anyway.

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Lordnine » Fri Jul 29, 2016 5:21 pm

baelthazar wrote:
Another aspect that I am wondering if it will work or not - if the app randomly pulls stuff from your collection, what provides the coherent narrative of the game? While Descent may be fine as a dungeon crawl with random tiles and encounters, a Lovecraftian game needs to have some theme to make sense (and the first edition, while random, at least had scenarios that made some sense and gave the Keeper certain monsters and actions that followed the scenario's theme). I just would not like to be walking in a strange mansion, following a maniac who killed his family, just to randomly have a Star Spawn walk around the corner for no rhyme or reason. Surely they have thought about this, but that preview did not reflect that.
Yep, this was my initial concern as well, although maybe I didn’t vocalize it as well. MoM was special to me largely because it was so story focused. It made up for some of the shortcomings of the game (Combat was simplistic and balance was occasionally questionable). The funny thing is that if you are playing a Lovcraftian horror story, those shortcomings actually make sense within the setting. The heroes should feel oppressed and unable to cope with what they are experiencing.

Now there is a chance that this app gets everything right, in which case I will be reluctantly on board but it sounds a lot more like it will turn the game into a fairly generic dungeon crawl with Lovecraftian monsters.

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Octavious » Mon Aug 01, 2016 3:22 pm

I could see me actually being able to get non-gamers to play it with the app. Curious to see how it works out as this is a game I always wanted to play.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Daveman » Thu Aug 04, 2016 9:33 am

I called my FLGS yesterday to order/put aside a copy and was told they'd just opened their shipment, so I picked it up. My son and I played the first scenario, which is listed at 60-90 minutes but our learning attempt (we've not played the first edition) with more than a few rules lookups took about 2.5 hours. We really enjoyed it.

I have no idea how this compares to the first edition, but I'll just explain a little about the scenario. I do know that room placement, monster spawns and mythos events (bad things at the end of most turns) are semi-random so each play through should be different in the details. The prologue simply mentions that there's been a bunch of disappearances in the area and that we've been looking into them. One night the butler of a wealthy local calls us to say odd things are going on in the mansion and he suspects his master is up to something. We show up to investigate.

And that's all the game tells you going in to this scenario. On setup the app tells you to place the entry lobby, tokens to be searched at certain places of interest in the room with some flavor text "a small table in the center of the room with a pile of envelopes" and so on, and other tokens at doors indicating places where new rooms will come up. When one such token was placed it noted we heard screams or other scuffling from that direction. We thought that sounded like a bad way to go, or that maybe it was just some added flavor to spook us out so we ignored it. Without spoiling anything, that might have been a bad decision, or more to the point, it was a decision and we didn't even realize it. There were consequences later on... it wasn't just some fluff comment so when you play, pay attention to the details. We're curious to try it out again and check out that door first.

As we explored we started finding unique quest items that were all various forms of "evidence". We kind of got the impression that if we collected enough in a certain time that might have been a winning condition but we didn't. A bad series of mythos events and monster spawns, plus some really bad rolling held us up for several turns, at which point we started getting hints from the app that we were taking too long "you hear a rising chanting from elsewhere in the mansion" and some turns later someone spawned announcing that "the ritual is complete!" and then things went crazy.

We wound up "winning" although afterwards we learned we'd done something wrong. Monsters are often directed to attack the player with the most Will, or the least items and so on and didn't know how to handle ties so we said "well no one has the most" so we skipped I think 2 possible activations/attacks. Searching online it seems a rules entry on "Conflicts" suggests it's up to the players to decide who gets picked on in ties.

In what was one of the funnier moments I, playing the Butler, suffered enough horror to go insane. In this game going insane basically resets your sanity (good) but gives you a condition you must keep secret from the others. If you suffer enough horror to go "insane" again you're dead. My condition was that I couldn't win the game unless I had died in the process. Which is kind of hard to get the timing right since if a player dies the others only get one more turn to win. I had been "playing" him as a combo of Marvin the Robot and Woodhouse to my son (who was playing as the Millionaire). "That's alright sir, you take another weapon. I'm fine with this broken whiskey bottle." So the idea that I had to die in order to win fit in perfectly!

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Chaz » Thu Aug 04, 2016 3:13 pm

My wife and I would both really like to get this thing, but neither of us can stomach the $85-100 price tag. Makes me sad, because I think we'd both really dig it, and it'd let me get some use out of my first edition stuff. That's been gathering dust on my shelf for years because of the overhead involved in finding fixed versions of the content and actually playing the thing.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by coopasonic » Thu Aug 04, 2016 3:48 pm

Can each of you stomach $50? Maybe if you went in together on it. :)
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Chaz » Thu Aug 04, 2016 4:23 pm

That's some logic I can usually get behind, but I'm also kinda morally opposed to the constantly-increasing price of FFG games.
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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by El Guapo » Thu Aug 04, 2016 5:01 pm

Ask the baby to chip in.

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Chaz » Thu Aug 04, 2016 5:08 pm

It'd make a great baby present!

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Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by El Guapo » Thu Aug 04, 2016 5:20 pm

Chaz wrote:It'd make a great baby present!

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You can't start preparing them for the horrors just beyond the edge of their sanity too young, I say.

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baelthazar
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Location: Ohio

Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by baelthazar » Thu Aug 04, 2016 7:41 pm

El Guapo wrote:
Chaz wrote:It'd make a great baby present!

Sent from my Nexus 5X using Tapatalk
You can't start preparing them for the horrors just beyond the edge of their sanity too young, I say.
Be sure to put this in with the Amazon order for the game.

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Smoove_B
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Location: Kaer Morhen

Re: Mansions of Madness - second edition

Post by Smoove_B » Fri Aug 05, 2016 9:04 am

Good to see board game pricing follows the same logic as video games now. Pre-order? $99. Today? It's $78 Amazon Prime.

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