Lars Werewolf game 2 [Game is ended]

[Chaosraven]

I understood and agreed... I was still bitching about being stuck in the dontaskdonttell role...

[Remus West]

Now I'm confused. Why are you bringing up the time you enlisted?

[Chaosraven]

Dang...

and I was pretty close.

Werewolves
msteelers
Ralph-Wiggum
Harkonis
triggercut


I had sent a PM to triggercut, ralph-wiggum, and tru1cy accusing them.

On my little side note I had msteelers, mr bubbles, and harkonis for the fourth.

But I hadn't lumped msteelers and harkonis in together.

[triggercut]

The fact that a seer can immediately know the role of a wolf in one dream combined with three masons makes this scenario almost unwinnable for the wolves--especially if one or two wolves are people who fall under suspicion normally. As wolves, the only chance RWiggum and I have to stay alive is to pretend to be seers or some other village role...

...but we can't because the seer knows too much. Either Ralph or I was a great candidate to get seered up early on. About the only chance the wolves had in this game was to eat the seer in the first 2-3 nights. When that didn't happen, game was over.

[triggercut]

doobla-post, sorry!

[Chaosraven]

As *always* I'm confused. Why are you bringing up the time I was misquoted?

Geek.

[triggercut]

Let me just state that the sorceror role sucks.

You have the same intention: find the bad guys.

But how in the hell do you do that without letting the rest of the normal world know you want to be a pepper too???

The worst moment for me was when trig was fingered and spewed... I immediately tried to get connected.

I sent 2 PMs to the pair of 3somes I figured were the wolves but you can't just claim "I wanna play with the big boys" at random.

Hell, as it turned out I would have gotten lynched anyway.

Yeah, the sorceror's role is completely useless in this game as well. He's looking for one person out of 22, and trying to contact the wolves while staying alive. I mean, if I were a villager without a role and either had a good idea who a wolf was or had a seer tell me who one was, I'd contact the wolves and pretend to be a sorc....so it's a lose-lose proposition for both professions on the same team.

[ChrisGrenard]

I dunno. I think sorc could have been useful near endgame for killing our seer. I sent out to all friendly people the list of who to lynch. You could look at that list and notice who was NOT on the list, then, by weeding out people who obviously weren't the sorcerer (like yossar, myself and Leigh) you could have fed that info to the wolves.

It's a tough role, but I think you could do stuff with it.

[Chaosraven]

Not perhaps in the three days I was allowed to live...


Hey, remus guess who was my first vision for seer?

[Remus West]

Not perhaps in the three days I was allowed to live...


Hey, remus guess who was my first vision for seer?

How far'd that get ya? Or should I say, How far'd that get ya, Mr. Mayor?

[Chaosraven]

Yer a Khack.

[Spiff]

The fact that a seer can immediately know the role of a wolf in one dream combined with three masons makes this scenario almost unwinnable for the wolves--especially if one or two wolves are people who fall under suspicion normally. As wolves, the only chance RWiggum and I have to stay alive is to pretend to be seers or some other village role...

...but we can't because the seer knows too much. Either Ralph or I was a great candidate to get seered up early on. About the only chance the wolves had in this game was to eat the seer in the first 2-3 nights. When that didn't happen, game was over.

I visioned you the very first night. That kept me from throwing any accusations about until I found a vilager. I played off the bad accusation from the last game, hoping it would spare me from being eaten fairly early.

The one problem with the seer is that if you vision the sorcerer, all you know is that the person isn't a werewolf, you don't know anything else. You have to take an initial chance that your "villager" isn't aligned with the wolves.

When I found Remus, I didn't tell him I knew who the first werewolf was. I just told him I knew he wasn't one, and it all went from there. We just got lucky finding the masons so early.

I actually didn't know any of the other masons until Lars posted the roles. The only people I was ever in contact with were Chris and Remus. I didn't want anyone else to know who I was in case we accidentally brought in the sorcerer. I wanted to be visible, but look like i was following the mob so as not to draw too much attention. Last time I made accusations, I got eaten. I didn't wanna be wolf food in this one.

[Remus West]

As Spiff said above, we got lucky due to his finding me early and therefore hooking up with the masons. We did however get very lucky, both in the choices the wolves made missing our little group until it had grown and in the strategy Spiff played. I kept rereading through the thread to check if there was anything to point to him as being more than another lost villager but he did a masterful job of remaining to noisy to be "the quite one" and thus become a lynch target (although if that had happened Chris and I had discussed declaring me as seer and using that to clear him), but he was also enough of a "follower" in the public posts to stay out of the wolves targets, although they would be able to speak better to that.

As for the lurkers being bored, I think that the role of wolfsbane villager, while a great idea, forced the majority of the action to be PM. As someone who was "in" I had a ton of fun with this game but can completely identify with those who were left in the dark. If you know when a wolf is hung you at least can put some trust into the ones who called for the hanging but when you get no information at all you have no play to make which in a long game can be frustrating.

[Lars]

First, let me say that I appreciate everyone giving this varient a shot. I expected there to be some rough spots, which was why I wanted to get some feedback from everyone. The feedback that I've read so far has been really helpful in giving me some different ideas to improve it, which I've been thinking about in the back of my head all day. So, thanks!

How about an opinion from the lurkers? While I recognize that there's no reason for you to cater to the spectators, this was by far the least interesting Mafia varient so far to watch. The large volume of participants made it move at a glacial pace initially, and then almost all action took place off screen via PMs due to the fact that there were so many important roles. Add to this that there's no official public word on whether or not a hanged man was a werewolf, and you have a game with virtually no public activity to follow. And then once Chris and co. got their shit together, everything became so public that all the mystery and fun was sucked out.

Actually I'm glad to hear from the spectators, regardless of how my initial post may have read. You bring up an excellent point about most of the action taking place with PMs, it doesn't make interesting reading. That, along with Rowdy's point about the regular villagers not really being involved is a clear sign that it needs to be changed.

Let me just state that the sorceror role sucks.

I knew going in that the Sorcerer role would be a challenging role. I'm not surprised that you couldn't handle it. Remus has some good ideas to make the role a little more interesting that I think I'll incorporate into the rules.

The fact that a seer can immediately know the role of a wolf in one dream combined with three masons makes this scenario almost unwinnable for the wolves--especially if one or two wolves are people who fall under suspicion normally. As wolves, the only chance RWiggum and I have to stay alive is to pretend to be seers or some other village role...

...but we can't because the seer knows too much. Either Ralph or I was a great candidate to get seered up early on. About the only chance the wolves had in this game was to eat the seer in the first 2-3 nights. When that didn't happen, game was over.

Just to be totally clear, I used a random number sequence generator to assign the roles for this game. I seriously reconsidered running the numbers again when I saw triggercut and Ralph-Wiggum in the werewolves slots, due to the reasons that triggercut mentions, but I decided that would be unfair. That's just the way the numbers fell.


I'm going to think this over some more, and post some proposals for rules changes, so I can get some feedback on that as well.

[Chaosraven]

Let me just state that the sorceror role sucks.

I knew going in that the Sorcerer role would be a challenging role. I'm not surprised that you couldn't handle it.

[yossar]

As for the lurkers being bored, I think that the role of wolfsbane villager, while a great idea, forced the majority of the action to be PM. As someone who was "in" I had a ton of fun with this game but can completely identify with those who were left in the dark.

I agree with that. After declaring priest I thought I was dead, but I actually became one of the most influential villagers after Grenard. I think I made more PMs than posts on the forum so I can see how a lot of people had no idea what was going on.

[ChrisGrenard]

Yeah, lots of PM's this game. I am not lying when I said I probably *wrote* about 200. Another 150-200 received. It got pretty hairy, if you will pardon the pun.

[Ralph-Wiggum]

It got pretty hairy, if you will pardon the pun.

I won't. That was pretty bad.

[Stitch]

I would also like to add that despite the mixed reaction many of us have had, I do applaud Lars for trying to mix things up and add new elements to the game. As dull as I claimed this game to be, I'll definitely follow the next, revised Lars game.