Zombie II: ArmyofOne can't do it alone. Villagers win.

st_dysan · Post by **st_dysan** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 5:41 pm

Ya know...I have to go with my original feeling on this...I will withdraw my vote for pr0ner and go with Chaosraven

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 5:48 pm

There ya go...

Ok, now once again I call for the doctor... look... if I'm an innocent, then
The information doesn't get to the bad guys.

If I'm a bad guy, I'm going to get decapitated today, and the only remaining bad
guy will go for you instead of the psychic or ND or their unnamed allies.
Leaving him all alone and letting the good guys build up even more.

So it's a no lose proposition.

As to what *I*m going to do with the information?
I can't tell the bad guys (i.e. out here in public)
but I might tell you...

Calling for the doctor, paging doctor who...

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:04 pm

Current vote count:

pr0ner - 3
Chaosraven - 2
ArmyofOne - 1

5 neeed for a majority.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:12 pm

Chaosraven, too bad you can tell your zombie friend before you die.

I'd prefer the doctor stay hidden, but if he has some pressing need, tell dysan.

Oh, and FWIW it wasn't the 'psychic's' idea to investigate dysan, it was mine, so the 'psychic' AND dysan can't be playing me.

Theoretically, the 'psychic' AND I can be playing you all AND dysan, but that wouldn't make much sense, because dysan knows the identity of the seer.

Less likely is that the 'psychic' is a figment of my imagination and dysan and I are playing all of you. But since there are only two zombies left, it wouldn't make much sense for that to happen either.

So, bottom line, you can't trust me (yet), but you can trust dysan.

Someone please poke a hole in that, or otherwise the doctor does need to talk to dysan (and dysan, you should withhold the name from the seer and I, just in case).

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:22 pm

Pr0ner said during this game wrote: So, after reading this thread, I see we've gotten absolutely nowhere in outing some zombies.
Does anyone even have more than one vote yet?

Volunteering only makes the zombies' job easier.
Bakhtosh gets my vote for now.

Well then. I change my vote.
Yankeeman84 it is!

Fascinating list.
Just to get some discussion going, I'll vote setaside for now, as being a bandwagon jumper, following in the wake of the known dead zombie.

We started yesterday, YM.
Oh, and I withdraw my vote for setaside for now. I think we need to reason things out a bit more before any rash voting.

I'd like to know the answer to that, myself.

The more I think about it, the more I realize Chaosraven is just confusing everyone.
A zombie trick, if you ask me, to throw people off his trail.

That's good enough for me.
I'll swing my vote to noxiousdog for now, to keep things moving.

I, do, withdraw my vote for NoxiousDog until he can present his information. No reason to be rash.

ArmyOfOne posted this morning in response to what tgb had to say on the Charosraven issue.

setaside, your sacrifice will not be in vain.

What's nr0mal supposed to be? A play on my screen name or something?
Oh, and tgb to be beheaded. Yes, I've changed my vote alot, but dammit, you all are confusing with your information and leads!

Even as a government employee, some days I do have to work, you know, arcanis. Been a little quiet as a result.
I agree I've been a little erratic with my voting style this game. But, I've mostly been confused by most of the evidence that's being thrown about in the game, as no one has really stepped forward with anything solid.
And since there have been people more erratic than I, throwing out accusations left and right, I vote ChaosRaven as being zombie. Throwing doubt and clouding up everything is definitely something a zombie would do to throw people off his scent.

Your guess is probably as good as mine right now.
No one has PMed me with any evidence one way or the other.
No one has presented any evidence in the thread one way or the other, other than NoxiousDog's claim that st_dysan is innocent.
And for all we know, since the psychic hasn't come out yet, NoxiousDog could be having information fed to him by a zombie.
It's tricky.

Do NoxiousDog and st_dysan mind sharing what their info is that makes me a zombie? I definitely would like to know.

Votes bolded.

Eratic to say the least, and very quick to jump on the Yankeeman AND tgb bandwagon.

ArmyOfOne · Post by **ArmyOfOne** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:41 pm

Well, I fucked up by misjudging tgb. So I'm really leary to just cast a vote. He vouched for CR. So I would tend to think CR is cool. Which leaves the Dyson/Dog tag team who are gunning for him. So for now NoxiousDog gets my vote.

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:48 pm

noxiousdog wrote: Oh, and FWIW it wasn't the 'psychic's' idea to investigate dysan, it was mine, so the 'psychic' AND dysan can't be playing me.

Theoretically, the 'psychic' AND I can be playing you all AND dysan, but that wouldn't make much sense, because dysan knows the identity of the seer.

Less likely is that the 'psychic' is a figment of my imagination and dysan and I are playing all of you. But since there are only two zombies left, it wouldn't make much sense for that to happen either.

So, bottom line, you can't trust me (yet), but you can trust dysan.

Someone please poke a hole in that, or otherwise the doctor does need to talk to dysan (and dysan, you should withhold the name from the seer and I, just in case).

How about with some mysterious seer connected to the two of you,
that makes the two of you "beyond suspicion"

So you are a pair of zombies that can one by one steer the votes the
way you want as you "steer us away from the psychic"

And yes, so everyone knows, I'm sowing more confusion here as that
is what I do... devil's advocate for every possible ramification.

What's more likely?

That Arcanis and setaside are the zombies.

How's that for a "Random Accusation"?

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:49 pm

ArmyOfOne wrote:Well, I fucked up by misjudging tgb. So I'm really leary to just cast a vote. He vouched for CR. So I would tend to think CR is cool. Which leaves the Dyson/Dog tag team who are gunning for him. So for now NoxiousDog gets my vote.

That is odd.

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 7:54 pm

ArmyOfOne wrote:He vouched for CR. So I would tend to think CR is cool.

ArmyofOne: tgb did not exactly vouch for me. he was willing to have his
vote swayed by those who held the opinion I am innocent more than they
suspect me a zombie. I have no proof other than my word.

And unfortunately one of those people is now dead.

I have received PMs from almost half the people still in this game,
whether informational or just basic conversation.

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 8:06 pm

Chaosraven wrote:So you are a pair of zombies that can one by one steer the votes the way you want as you "steer us away from the psychic"

Mathematically this one does not work as they would need to provide a zombie before they could win and if they are both zombies they can not do that.

I.E. We are at a 7-2 split right now. 3 "cleared" - the two of them
and "psychic"
next turn we are 5-2 after lynch/night. must be 4 "cleared" one real
next turn we are 3-2 after lynch/night. must be 5 "cleared" two real

You can see the problem there.

And just think what happens to the trust given them if they are not eaten but the folks they add on are. So they can not claim both zombies to be clean and hope to get to the end unless one of them wants to change their story and be the psychic then we have the issue of their other vision from the first round and why that wasn't mentioned as right now they have 1st vision ND, second vision Dysan. If they say one of them is the psychic then they would need to have a first vision to go with that claim.

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 8:55 pm

I think the psychic needs to stay out of the public eye (but yes, I did
ask for a personal connection to them) as the zombies are quite likely
to eat that person first.

Has the doctor contacted (preferably) St_Dysan and been put in contact with
the psychic? The downfall of this plan, ND is that anyone can claim to be
the doctor and have their name put thru to the psychic and therefore be
able to "protect" the seer.

What if a zombie puts their name through? The psychic's only reason to know
who the doctor is (and yours and st_dysans) is to have the doctor protect the
psychic.

But in order for that to happen the psychics name must be given to the
"doctor"

I don't trust that.

Yes, you state that as a zombie I could inform my partner who the doctor
is. But what does that matter? Without the doctor being connected in any
way the guess involved in his protection is a random shot in the dark.

Pretend I am a zombie. I am contacted by the doctor.
What are our options? Kill him?
Ok, so then we are at 8 players, three of which are connected by your
statement. And we will not have taken a shot at the psychic, who either
id's another innocent, putting the good guys at 4 of 8 in a block, or
discovers one of the zombies who is then outed by the vocal members
of the psychic block and killed.

The funny thing about public innocents (powered or id'd) is that the
bad guys are suddenly in a really bad situation. Every day they don't
try to kill the random victim and hit the seer, they either give the
good guys a new member or one of them is discovered (best case
scenario for the bad guys is the seer, next is an id'd innocent).
But if they leave the Public Innocents alive then the villagers grow bold.

Honestly? That's why I get killed.

Because I try to make everyone talk, in public or with each other, I will
post anything I think people ought to notice so they can add it to any
information they have but are unwilling or unable to share.

They kill me to shut me up, and to try to shut the others up.

Which, funny enough, makes my death have meaning.

Because my death is one less death that matters.

The psychic isn't going to id me, as I am likely to be lynched/murdered
based on my general suspicious actions.

The protector shouldn't waste their time protecting me.

But when the bad guys take a night to kill me, they haven't killed one
of the powered people we need.

My opinion as to why they haven't killed me in the night so far is
either

(a) they are playing it smart and going after who they think the seer
(b) they figure the village will lynch me anyway

(feel free to point out that I neglected the possibility I could be a zombie)

But when people do things you have to distrust it automatically.
Long enough to determine their motives for doing what they did.

Am I willing to share information? Yes... anything I don't deem detrimental
to my side. If I think it will enhance the chances my side has better than
the other side I will. If I think it too overbalancing to the other side there's
no way I can give it up to either side (and don't forget I suspect everyone
who isn't me)

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:26 pm

Chaosraven wrote:(and don't forget I suspect everyone
who isn't me or the other zombie)

Fixed for you.

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 9:27 pm

Thanx, fellow zombie

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 10:01 pm

Chaosraven wrote:Thanx, innocent bystander

No problem.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 10:10 pm

Uh, we're not telling the doctor who to protect, we simply don't want to scan him

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 10:14 pm

Hmmm... so you'll trust the first person who claims to be the doctor?

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Wed Oct 04, 2006 10:49 pm

Chaosraven wrote:Hmmm... so you'll trust the first person who claims to be the doctor?

Of course! Come one come all.

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:29 am

No progress yet I guess.

setaside · Post by **setaside** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:42 am

I am NOT the doctor!!!!

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:45 am

setaside wrote:I am NOT the doctor!!!!

Well good, because I didn't trust you anyway.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:52 am

I've made a vote, but if somone else wants to do analysis, I'm certainly willing to listen.

There's plenty of people on my watch list.

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 10:51 am

hey can i join the club too, i wana know who the psy and doc are.

ArmyOfOne i understand you wanting to go after ND since it does look like he is railroading people, but he also claims to be in line with the psy.

There are 2 things going on here that need to be adressed one is he manipulating us to vote to kill innocents on purpose or is he just guessing wrong. Also if he were a zombie makeing this claim the psy or one of their allies would out him as a liar and he would be lynched it is too risky of a move for a zombie to take unless they know the real psy is dead which no one has been able to say or prove.

I thought TGB was a zombie before Nox even mentioned something so that one i can let slide. Right now he is after Pr0ner but has said that this is just his gut nothing else.

Honestly the only ones partisipating in the thread right now are: Myself, Chaosraven, Nox, Remus, and St_dysan. you have hardly posted in the thread though you could be doing a lot of behind the scenes work that i haven't seen, and the rest still in the game have had few posts that i've notices either so that makes them look guilty also. I mean to imply nothing more than ya'll are quite and that is to the zombies advantage.

pr0ner · Post by **pr0ner** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 11:13 am

Hey now. I'm participating, mostly by reading what everyone has to say. I still think there's too much clutter in the thread to make any sort of rational judgement. I'm looking at you, Chaosraven; your style of posting anything and everything is not very conductive to making an accurate play.

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 11:14 am

Maybe I need to reread the thread but I was under the impression that I chose tgb. Which shouldn't surprise anyone as I suck at picking the bad guys. Although I did start the lynch on Orinoco the first of the last zombie game.

As for ND, I am not sure I trust him 100% but if he is lying that will soon be evident to all. Every turn he must give another player the name of the psychic or name a zombie. Right now dysan knows who the psychic is. Next turn they have to share with another person or give us a zombie. Same the turn after that.

I am willing to follow ND's lead this turn and check prOner for brains in his stomach. I would also be willing to follow dysan's lead and vote for chaosraven but think it best to get the quieter ones first.

pr0ner · Post by **pr0ner** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 11:18 am

So you think it's safer to kill the one who is quiet and not making things more difficult over the one who posts EVERYTHING in long, rambling, difficult to follow tomes that merely serves to cloud things up rather than make things more clear? Yeah. That's not the way to do it.

Yes, Chaosraven has been more 'active', but that's because he posts EVERY piece of information he gets. He doesn't sift through it to make a point. He just throws it out in a big jumbled mess. How are you supposed to accurately glean any information from his postings if they're such a muddled mess?

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 11:21 am

pr0ner wrote:Hey now. I'm participating, mostly by reading what everyone has to say. I still think there's too much clutter in the thread to make any sort of rational judgement. I'm looking at you, Chaosraven; your style of posting anything and everything is not very conductive to making an accurate play.

i understand where your coming from but i can't tell when your sitting there reading and choosing not to say anything or if your on the beach drinking pinacolatas and smoking cuban cigars.

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 11:22 am

Chaosraven = Cliffnotes for the thread.

pr0ner · Post by **pr0ner** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 11:23 am

Arcanis wrote:
pr0ner wrote:Hey now. I'm participating, mostly by reading what everyone has to say. I still think there's too much clutter in the thread to make any sort of rational judgement. I'm looking at you, Chaosraven; your style of posting anything and everything is not very conductive to making an accurate play.
i understand where your coming from but i can't tell when your sitting there reading and choosing not to say anything or if your on the beach drinking pinacolatas and smoking cuban cigars.

Haha. No worries. The only times I haven't been keeping up with what's been posted are when I'm not at home/work, or when I'm asleep.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 11:26 am

Remus West wrote: I am willing to follow ND's lead this turn and check prOner for brains in his stomach. I would also be willing to follow dysan's lead and vote for chaosraven but think it best to get the quieter ones first.

Quieter ones is a good strategy, however, bad guys have a habit of posting too much.

Who did you have in mind? Tru1cy? Setaside? AoO?

Remus West
noxiousdog - cleared
pr0ner
setaside
Arcanis
tru1cy
ArmyofOne
ChaosRaven
st_dysan - cleared

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 11:52 am

noxiousdog wrote:
Remus West wrote: I am willing to follow ND's lead this turn and check prOner for brains in his stomach. I would also be willing to follow dysan's lead and vote for chaosraven but think it best to get the quieter ones first.
Quieter ones is a good strategy, however, bad guys have a habit of posting too much.

Who did you have in mind? Tru1cy? Setaside? AoO?

Remus West
noxiousdog - cleared
pr0ner
setaside
Arcanis
tru1cy
ArmyofOne
ChaosRaven
st_dysan - cleared

I actually meant that prOner is (or had been) quieter than chaosraven. I am not going to choose someone for fear of hitting the psychic. I am going to follow whichever you and dysan finally settle upon. If you switch to join him on chaosraven then I will to. Until you switch I am going to stay voting against prOner. I have no concrete information to work with right now so following you guys is my best bet. Either you will lead us to victory or you will trap yourself in lies.

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 11:56 am

Remus West wrote:
noxiousdog wrote:
Remus West wrote: I am willing to follow ND's lead this turn and check prOner for brains in his stomach. I would also be willing to follow dysan's lead and vote for chaosraven but think it best to get the quieter ones first.
Quieter ones is a good strategy, however, bad guys have a habit of posting too much.

Who did you have in mind? Tru1cy? Setaside? AoO?

Remus West
noxiousdog - cleared
pr0ner
setaside
Arcanis
tru1cy
ArmyofOne
ChaosRaven
st_dysan - cleared
I actually meant that prOner is (or had been) quieter than chaosraven. I am not going to choose someone for fear of hitting the psychic. I am going to follow whichever you and dysan finally settle upon. If you switch to join him on chaosraven then I will to. Until you switch I am going to stay voting against prOner. I have no concrete information to work with right now so following you guys is my best bet. Either you will lead us to victory or you will trap yourself in lies.

i think your right and since i was just proding to get more activity i'll pull my vote for ArmyOfOne and change it to ChaosRaven to keep with the block we can trust to either be zombies or lead us to victory.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 12:03 pm

Current vote count:

pr0ner - 3
Chaosraven - 3
noxiousdog - 1

5 neeed for a majority.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 12:13 pm

Ralph-Wiggum wrote:Current vote count:

pr0ner - 3
Chaosraven - 3
noxiousdog - 1

5 neeed for a majority.

In the interest in moving along and throwing a bone to Remus West, I'll change my vote to Chaosraven.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 12:25 pm

Current vote count:

pr0ner - 2
Chaosraven - 4
noxiousdog - 1

5 neeed for a majority.

Just so you guys know, I'll be gone after 1:00 until about 4:00 (or maybe even 4:45, Remus!). I'll be checking the thread up until then.

ArmyOfOne · Post by **ArmyOfOne** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 1:14 pm

You know, I hate to say it but I'm going to go along with Remus's logic. I don't really trust ND/St.D. But as they say, the proof is in the pudding.

I withdraw my vote for NoxiousDog and cast my vote for Chaosraven

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 1:33 pm

I had really prefered we lynch prOner since chaosraven had come out proclaiming he was a powerless innocent but as I said, I will follow the lead for now and vote Chaosraven even though I am now the sixth vote so immaterial.

added: I suspect we will find him to be innocent but as long as the psychic survives we are o.k. and I trust him completely when he said he wasn't the psychic.

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 1:36 pm

And now, having read Ralph's post in full I now know I don't need to comeback here until after 4:45. I'll be patient this time Ralph, I promise.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 1:41 pm

Remus West wrote:And now, having read Ralph's post in full I now know I don't need to comeback here until after 4:45. I'll be patient this time Ralph, I promise.

I lied.

Voting closed. Write-up coming around 4:30.

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 1:43 pm

Ralph-Wiggum wrote:
Remus West wrote:And now, having read Ralph's post in full I now know I don't need to comeback here until after 4:45. I'll be patient this time Ralph, I promise.
I lied.

Voting closed. Write-up coming around 4:30.

Now that just makes me impatient again. Thinking you were not checking the thread was fine. Knowing we have to sit and wait for you to write it up sucks.

Damn Duke fans always making life difficult for us Tarheels

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Thu Oct 05, 2006 4:00 pm

After switching votes back and forth, the crowd finally decided to test Chaosraven for zombiehood. They yanked him to the floor and with one or two chops sliced through his neck. Without hesitation, his stomach was cut open. However, it only contained Subway sandwiches. Chaosraven had not lied - he was not a zombie.

The villagers' hopes were dashed - they had failed again. "Well, look on the bright side," one of them said. "At least we don't have to listen to his ramblings anymore".

Evening was fast approaching. After a few more minutes the group split apart and went to their own houses. It would be another long night.

It is night. Those that need to send PMs can send them now.