Fellowship of the Ring (WW) - Conclusion

Lagom Lite · Post by **Lagom Lite** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 3:31 am

RULES CLARIFICATION: A captured Hobbit Ringbearer still carries the Ring, even though ownership of it is considered to be with the Servants of the Eye. Therefore, a captured Hobbit Ringbearer (other than Frodo or Gollum) may become corrupted in captivity.

Lagom Lite · Post by **Lagom Lite** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 3:47 am

stessier wrote:
Chaosraven wrote: Or is anyone corrupted given the new role of Servant of the Eye?

Essentially, yes - corrupted players, whether they are Hobbits that carried the Ring for too long, or Free People converted by the Witch-King, have their role-specific powers and abilities stripped and are turned into non-powered Servants of the Eye.

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 4:30 am

I love the ingenious mapping of rule nuances onto plot points from LotR. Nice work, Lagom Lite!

Lagom Lite · Post by **Lagom Lite** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 4:31 am

Grundbegriff wrote:I love the ingenious mapping of rule nuances onto plot points from LotR. Nice work, Lagom Lite!

/bows

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:27 am

Grundbegriff wrote:Yeah, stessier. Why are you trying to mislead everyone?

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:52 am

theohall wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:Um... Wouldnt that get the nonhobbits slaughtered? Urukhai kills nonhobbits. Witchking converts. Halfway thru the game everyone is dead or evil except for the hobbits who no longer have majority to get 'unlocked' or lynch a bad guy...
This is what I was going to say. We have to vote someone to be a 'Scout' every day, which is essentially a lynch.

Actually, we don't. We have a choice.

During a Chapter, the Fellowship must vote to Appoint ”(player name)” as Scout, alternatively ”Hunt some Orc” within ”accuse” tags. A majority vote is needed. Once a majority is reached, voting is closed. Captured players may not be Appointed as Scout, may not vote nor post in the game thread.

Scout or Hunt.

Okay, I just wrote and erased a wall of text and decided that there aren't any holes. It's like someone put some thought into this or something.

My suggestion is Gandalf just find the King on the first night, the King hits a Hobbit, and we make the King Scout tomorrow. We can then clean up the Servants at our leisure. Simple really.

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:56 am

One does not simply walk into Mordor.

Lagom Lite · Post by **Lagom Lite** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:58 am

stessier wrote:Okay, I just wrote and erased a wall of text and decided that there aren't any holes. It's like someone put some thought into this or something.

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:58 am

stessier wrote:
theohall wrote:This is what I was going to say. We have to vote someone to be a 'Scout' every day, which is essentially a lynch.
Actually, we don't. We have a choice.
During a Chapter, the Fellowship must vote to Appoint ”(player name)” as Scout, alternatively ”Hunt some Orc” within ”accuse” tags. A majority vote is needed. Once a majority is reached, voting is closed. Captured players may not be Appointed as Scout, may not vote nor post in the game thread.
Scout or Hunt.

Correction: we have a choice (Scout or Hunt) iff captiveCount > 0.

Tha Rulez wrote:”Hunt some Orc” is a legal vote only if any uncorrupted Free People remain AND there is at least one captured Hobbit, Frodo or Gollum currently.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 6:03 am

Grundbegriff wrote:
stessier wrote:
theohall wrote:This is what I was going to say. We have to vote someone to be a 'Scout' every day, which is essentially a lynch.
Actually, we don't. We have a choice.
During a Chapter, the Fellowship must vote to Appoint ”(player name)” as Scout, alternatively ”Hunt some Orc” within ”accuse” tags. A majority vote is needed. Once a majority is reached, voting is closed. Captured players may not be Appointed as Scout, may not vote nor post in the game thread.
Scout or Hunt.
Correction: we have a choice (Scout or Hunt) iff captiveCount > 0.
Tha Rulez wrote:”Hunt some Orc” is a legal vote only if any uncorrupted Free People remain AND there is at least one captured Hobbit, Frodo or Gollum currently.

Yeah, that was the lead in to the wall of text where I showed it was a Brilliant Strategy(TM) to do some very unbrilliant things with Hobbits.

tru1cy · Post by **tru1cy** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 7:52 am

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 9:47 am

Grundbegriff wrote:One does not simply walk into Mordor.

Sauronsblog on facebook wrote:One does not simply walk into Mordor. We have gates, tolls, that sort of thing. You must declare any fruit.

Brendan · Post by **Brendan** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 10:31 am

Yeah, as I re-read the rules, this is certainly a triumph of marrying game mechanics with theme. Bravo!

As an aside, LL, are you actually Swedish? If so, I am astounded by your mastery of idiomatic english.

Semaj · Post by **Semaj** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 11:00 am

Are there 14 sides in this one? Only 3 with gollum being the wildcard but one thats apparently needed.

Anyways... I'ma be in my bunk... lemme know when we get there.

redrun · Post by **redrun** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 11:21 am

Lagom Lite wrote:MOD NOTES: Everyone has received their role except redrun. I have sent him an e-mail.

-- Sorry, at a funeral yesterday, just getting back to email today. I've got my role, and will catch up today. Off_the_cuff stuff: mass reveal is bad, at least early on. How to tell the short folks from the tall folks, good from bad, corrupt from uncorrupt? The long term goal is to get the ring and an uncorrupt someone to toss it into Mt Doom.

redrun · Post by **redrun** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 11:23 am

Grundbegriff wrote:One does not simply walk into Mordor.

-- Tapdance. Mr. Evil Eye hates tapdancing, so he never watches it. We can tapdance into Mordor!

Lagom Lite · Post by **Lagom Lite** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 11:38 am

Brendan wrote:Yeah, as I re-read the rules, this is certainly a triumph of marrying game mechanics with theme. Bravo!

As an aside, LL, are you actually Swedish? If so, I am astounded by your mastery of idiomatic english.

Yes, and thanks. We get all your movies here.

Now stop sucking up to the mod, all of you!

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 11:43 am

they are hoping it will save them from a conversion/give them an extra night attack.

I would never do such a thing oh wise and benevolent Lord Lagom Lite Lager.

Newcastle · Post by **Newcastle** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 12:01 pm

Lagom Lite wrote:
Brendan wrote:Yeah, as I re-read the rules, this is certainly a triumph of marrying game mechanics with theme. Bravo!

As an aside, LL, are you actually Swedish? If so, I am astounded by your mastery of idiomatic english.
Yes, and thanks. We get all your movies here.

Now stop sucking up to the mod, all of you!

not to take anything away from our beloved mods linguistic talents, but i've found many europeans are very talented in the linguistic fields, often finding it common that they speak 2-3 languages, if not more. One of the very cool things bout europe i think.

/kissing ass off

Chaosraven · Post by **Chaosraven** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:20 pm

Unagi wrote:
Chaosraven wrote:Shit... Even worse, it gives the witchking a shopping list of hobbits to corrupt.
nope on converts (but yes on hunting for the ringbearer).

2. Convert one of the Free People by whispering sweet promises of power into the ear of one player. Corruption this way only works on the Free People but not on Hobbits, Frodo, Gollum or Servants of the Eye.

hmmm. On the other hand it gives the witchking the list of people not to waste his time on. Almost as bad.

Scoop20906 · Post by **Scoop20906** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:53 pm

Newcastle wrote:
Lagom Lite wrote:
Brendan wrote:Yeah, as I re-read the rules, this is certainly a triumph of marrying game mechanics with theme. Bravo!

As an aside, LL, are you actually Swedish? If so, I am astounded by your mastery of idiomatic english.
Yes, and thanks. We get all your movies here.

Now stop sucking up to the mod, all of you!
not to take anything away from our beloved mods linguistic talents, but i've found many europeans are very talented in the linguistic fields, often finding it common that they speak 2-3 languages, if not more. One of the very cool things bout europe i think.

/kissing ass off

We don't refer to Lagom as the silver tongued devil for nothing.

Scoop20906 · Post by **Scoop20906** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:56 pm

Ok, I've read the rulez and I think I understand most of it. I felt I was reading one of those damn books.

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Wed Apr 28, 2010 5:59 pm

Lagom: May I have your input on this issue?

Lagom Lite · Post by **Lagom Lite** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 1:48 am

Chapter 1 – The Doors of Durin

The others waited huddled together, watching until Semaj dwindled into a black speck in the whiteness. At length he passed from sight. The time dragged on. The clouds lowered, and now a few flakes of snow came curling down again. Semaj did not return. In the distance they heard drums.

A cold wind flowed down behind them, as the survivors turned their back on the Redhorn Gate, and stumbled wearily down the slope. Caradhras had defeated them.

”How far is Moria?” asked Remus West.

”There was a door south-west of Caradhras, some fifteen miles as the crow flies, and maybe twenty as the wolf runs,” answered Isgrimnur grimly.

The Company were footsore and tired; but they trudged doggedly along the rough and winding track for many miles. At length they came to a sharp bend. There the road, which had been veering southwards between the brink of the channel and a steep fall of the land to the left, turned and went due east again. Rounding the corner they saw before them a low cliff, some five fathoms high, with a broken and jagged top. Over it a trickling water dripped, through a wide cleft that seemed to have been carved out by a fall that had once been strong and full.

”Indeed things have changed!” said Grundbegriff. ”But there is no mistaking the place. There is all that remains of the Stair Falls. If I remember right, there was a flight of steps cut into the rock at their side.”

They found the stone steps without difficulty, and Chaosraven sprang swiftly up them, followed by Brendan and tru1cy. Scoop20906 pressed on at a great pace, and others followed as quickly as they could. They reached the strip of dry land between a lake and the cliffs: it was narrow, often hardly a dozen yards across, and encumbered with fallen rock and stone; but they found a way, hugging the cliff, and keeping as far from the dark water as they might.

The Moon shone upon the grey face of the rock. Slowly on the surface, faint lines appeared, like slender veins of silver running in the stone. Steadily they grew broader and clearer, until their design could be guessed.

”What does the writing say?” asked Unagi, who was trying to decipher the insciption on the arch.

”The words are in the elven-tongue of the West of Middle-earth in the Elder Days,” answered theohall. ”But they do not say anything of importance to us.”

”They say only: The Doors of Durin, Lord of Moria. Speak, friend, and enter,” said redrun.

”What does it mean by speak, friend, and enter?” asked Newcastle.

”That is plain enough,” said stessier. ”If you are a friend, speak the password, and the doors will open, and you can enter.”

”But do not you know the word, Arcanis?” asked Remus West in surprise.

”No!” said Arcanis.

”What are you going to do then?” asked Remus West, undaunted by the LotR lore master’s bristling brows.

”Knock on these door with your head, Remus West,” said Arcanis. ”But if that does not shatter them, and I am allowed a little peace from foolish questions, I will seek for the opening words.”

With a suddenness that startled them all Isgrimnur sprang to his feet. He was laughing! ”I have it!” he cried. ”Of course, of course! Absurdly simple, like most riddles when you see the answer. Mellon!”

Slowly the rock divided in the middle and swung outwards inch by inch, until both doors lay back against the wall. Through the opening a shadowy stair could be seen climbing steeply up; but beyond the lower steps the darkness was deeper than the night. The Company stared in wonder.

But that moment several things happened. Grundbegriff felt something seize him by the ankle, and he fell with a cry. Chaosraven gave a wild cry of fear, and turned tail and dashed away along the lakeside into the darkness. Brendan leaped after him, and then hearing tru1cy’s cry he ran back again, weeping and cursing. The others swung round and saw the waters of the lake seething, as if a host of snakes were swimming up from the southern end.

Semaj has been slain by Uruk-Hai!
Semaj was one of the Free People.

The Fellowship is carrying the Ring.

Players:
1. Arcanis
2. Semaj of the Free People, slain by Uruk-Hai
3. Remus West
4. Isgrimnur
5. Grundbegriff
6. Chaosraven
7. Brendan
8. tru1cy
9. Scoop20906
10. Unagi
11. theohall
12. redrun
13. Newcastle
14. stessier

Fellowship, how will you proceed?

You must appoint a Scout.

Majority is 7

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 5:31 am

”Knock on these door with your head, Remus West,” said Arcanis. ”But if that does not shatter them, and I am allowed a little peace from foolish questions, I will seek for the opening words.”

The Fellowship was 14.

4 hobbits + Frodo + Gollum + 2 Evil = 8 who wouldn't have died last night. 6 Free People who could have. That's less than 50% chance of someone dying. Clearly this expedition is cursed. We're doomed.

tru1cy · Post by **tru1cy** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 6:06 am

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 6:10 am

tru1cy wrote:

You're volunteering to Scout? So kind!

theohall · Post by **theohall** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 7:18 am

stessier wrote:
tru1cy wrote:
You're volunteering to Scout? So kind!

Looks like a volunteer to me.

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:30 am

Just due to who was slain last night. I suspect Grund, but he has played enough of these games to not hold a grudge right?

I need to make a spreadsheet with names and notes today.

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:59 am

I don't hold grudges. I forgave (but didn't forget!) in the previous gamethread.

Depending on which free person bit the dust, we are potentially hosed.

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 9:10 am

possible roles of Samaj:
Aragorn, Gandalf, Boromir, 3x Warriors of the Free People.

So there is a 50/50 chance that we lost a special. Not counting chance of corruption by the King.

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 9:53 am

Grundbegriff wrote:
Arcanis wrote:Just due to who was slain last night. I suspect Grund, but he has played enough of these games to not hold a grudge right?
I don't hold grudges. I forgave (but didn't forget!) in the previous gamethread.

Although... it could be a ham-handed attempted attempt to frame me on the part of someone who doesn't realize that it would be out of character for me to "get back at" someone in a game-spanning way.

Candidates for clumsy framing of me would include any who haven't been in many games with me. I guess that would be redrun most of all, and perhaps Brendan.

The perennial question -- "Why so-and-so?" -- has several answers, but grudge-punishment is the one that comes first to mind in the case of Semaj. That's addressed above, but are there any other reasons someone would select Semaj as the first to be Uruked(-Hai)?

tru1cy · Post by **tru1cy** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 9:57 am

Send me to scout if you like...

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:08 am

self quoting. interesting.

suspecting you was the knee jerk reaction not one born of calculation. There is always a reason for any player to eliminate another, normally that reason being tactical but occasionally it would be emotional or comical.

What tactical reason could anyone have for taking out Samaj? I didn't see any clues as to his role in the thread so that seems out. What kind of threat did he pose if they were to assume he was powerless?

Who would think it is funny to take out Samaj on night 1 or had a reason to want him eliminated irregardless of role? No one other than the knee jerk of Grund being a bit spiteful for the disintegration, and that doesn't seem likely.

Who would try and set up Grund? I know i'm one of the most inexperienced players and there are some others who haven't played much either, but our numbers are too small to have gotten someone scouted right now. So it would either be someone who thought the experienced players could be convinced to bandwagon Grund, or it wasn't an attempt to set up Grund.

The final reason i could see for picking Samaj, dumb luck. They had to target someone and happened to nab Samaj.

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:12 am

tru1cy wrote:Send me to scout if you like...

?

Don't you want to play?

Tools

Players

Arcanis
Brendan
Chaosraven
Grundbegriff
Isgrimnur
Newcastle
redrun
Remus West
Scoop20906
Semaj (One of {Aragorn, Gandalf, Boromir, W01, W02, W03})
stessier
theohall
tru1cy
Unagi

Teams

Fellowship: Hobbits: Frodo, Hobbit01, Hobbit02, Hobbit03, Hobbit04
Fellowship: Free People: Aragorn, Gandalf, Boromir, Warrior01, Warrior02, Warrior03
Servants of the Eye: Witch-King, Uruk-Hai
Gollum: Gollum

Days

Journey 1: Caradhras
Chapter 1: The Doors of Durin
Journey 2: Balin’s Tomb
Chapter 2: The Mines of Moria
Journey 3: The Bridge of Khazad-Dum
Chapter 3: Lothlorien
Journey 4: The Great River Anduin
Chapter 4: Rohan
Journey 5: Helm’s Deep
Chapter 5: Fangorn Forest
Journey 6: Isengard
Chapter 6: Minas Tirith
Journey 7: The Black Gate of Mordor
Chapter 7: The Cracks of Doom

Roles

Frodo
Hobbit01 (Sam)
Hobbit02 (Merry)
Hobbit03 (Pippin)
Hobbit04 (Harpo)
Aragorn {Protects}
Gandalf {Scans}
Boromir {Wins with Servants}
Warrior01 (Gimli)
Warrior02 (Legolas)
Warrior03 (Eowyn)
Witch-King {Seeks, Corrupts}
Uruk-Hai {Kills, Uruk-Haijacks}
Gollum

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:16 am

Grundbegriff wrote:I don't hold grudges. I forgave (but didn't forget!) in the previous gamethread.

Depending on which free person bit the dust, we are potentially hosed.

Yeah, I was thinking about that on the treadmill.

The Hobbits are proven by being captured. The problem is, the method of capture (1 at a time) will also tell everyone who has the Ring. The Ring can only be passed during the day, but a Prisoner can't pass it.

So one morning a Hobbit is captured and suddenly the Servants have the the Ring. So we Hunt Orc. Unless Aragorn protects the Hobbit that night, the Hobbit is just recaptured. Rinse and repeat until Day 7. We lose.

The only way to break the cycle would be to kill the Uruk so they can't continually capture. But then all the Servants will be running interference.

And if we run out of Free People, we're just plain out of luck. We could lose by Day 3 in the worst case as the Servants would outnumber the remaining Hobbits + Gollum (assuming Gollum would even vote with the Hobbits).

So yeah, this is gonna be tough.

Also, I wouldn't count Boromir as a Good Special. He's the Sorcerer.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:19 am

Arcanis wrote:self quoting. interesting.

suspecting you was the knee jerk reaction not one born of calculation. There is always a reason for any player to eliminate another, normally that reason being tactical but occasionally it would be emotional or comical.

What tactical reason could anyone have for taking out Samaj? I didn't see any clues as to his role in the thread so that seems out. What kind of threat did he pose if they were to assume he was powerless?

Who would think it is funny to take out Samaj on night 1 or had a reason to want him eliminated irregardless of role? No one other than the knee jerk of Grund being a bit spiteful for the disintegration, and that doesn't seem likely.

Who would try and set up Grund? I know i'm one of the most inexperienced players and there are some others who haven't played much either, but our numbers are too small to have gotten someone scouted right now. So it would either be someone who thought the experienced players could be convinced to bandwagon Grund, or it wasn't an attempt to set up Grund.

The final reason i could see for picking Samaj, dumb luck. They had to target someone and happened to nab Samaj.

It's "Semaj". Show the dead some respect!

I'm not sure what to make of the high lighted section.

Arcanis · Post by **Arcanis** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:21 am

that is weird. I looked at grund's post and saw that he hadn't included the abilities of the Uruk-hai or gollum, but now the Uruk powers are there and no edit is shown.

Grund did you edit that post?

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:22 am

stessier wrote:
Grundbegriff wrote:I don't hold grudges. I forgave (but didn't forget!) in the previous gamethread.

Depending on which free person bit the dust, we are potentially hosed.
Yeah, I was thinking about that on the treadmill.

Wasted on cross-country! Very dangerous over short distances!

The Hobbits are proven by being captured. The problem is, the method of capture (1 at a time) will also tell everyone who has the Ring. The Ring can only be passed during the day, but a Prisoner can't pass it.

But the one who was captured doesn't necessarily have it. He'd be captured rather than killed on account of race/species, not foreknowledge of ring-possession. The Witch-King cannot communicate (in anything other than a raspy grunt) to the Uruks.

Also, I wouldn't count Boromir as a Good Special. He's the Sorcerer.

What he counts as and what he scans as are separate factors. We have to watch both (unless it turns out Semaj was Boromir).

Grundbegriff · Post by **Grundbegriff** » Thu Apr 29, 2010 10:23 am

Arcanis wrote:that is weird. I looked at grund's post and saw that he hadn't included the abilities of the Uruk-hai or gollum, but now the Uruk powers are there and no edit is shown.

Grund did you edit that post?

Yes. "Edited by" only shows up if someone else has posted below the edited post. Nobody had done so yet.