LOST 2 - NEED replacement player for GAME thread. Please PM.

[Grundbegriff]

• Chaosraven
• Kenetickid
• Remus West
• Mr Bubbles
• theohall
• Lassr
• Newcastle
• Scoop20906
• stessier
• Brendan
• redrun
• tru1cy
• purge
• Unagi
• J.D.
• ...

[stessier]

Are we gonna get a peek at the rules before the kickoff?

[J.D.]

I'm assuming ... means that you're looking for someone else? I wouldn't mind giving this a shot, unless you don't want someone who is a bit of a n00b playing (I've played four simple WW games in my career).

[Grundbegriff]

Are we gonna get a peek at the rules before the kickoff?

Don't get sassy, punk.

[Newcastle]

I'm assuming ... means that you're looking for someone else? I wouldn't mind giving this a shot, unless you don't want someone who is a bit of a n00b playing (I've played four simple WW games in my career).

yeah that grund, he's kind of an elitist...i mean he never, ever, would give a noob a chance....though it's unfortunate you dont get to play with him this time around...he loves noobs...for dinner....and the rest of us, we like to watch the ensuing train wreck

...having said that welcome aboard, and i look forward to seeing you on the flight....hmm wonder what the movie is going to be? Oooh, what bout the in flight meal, them are always my favorites...


and grund...when we gonna see a rule set so we can bicker and dicker over em!

[Grundbegriff]

Patience, Grasshopper.

[Lagom Lite]

[stessier]

Are we gonna get a peek at the rules before the kickoff?

Don't get sassy, punk.

Fine - back to my hole to push my button.

[purge]

Are we gonna get a peek at the rules before the kickoff?

Don't get sassy, punk.

Fine - back to my hole to push my button.

I never understood some of the OO colloquialisms, inferences and euphemisms.

[Newcastle]

Are we gonna get a peek at the rules before the kickoff?

Don't get sassy, punk.

Fine - back to my hole to push my button.

I never understood some of the OO colloquialisms, inferences and euphemisms.

this is a lost reference...seek within the spoiler you shall find...

Spoiler:

in season 2 lost introduces desmond, who's been stuck pushing a button every 108 minutes, and if he doesnt, then he's been warned that catastrophe will occur if he stops pushing it. There is a bit more of a backstory then that, but that's the gist.

[purge]

... for example, "I am an unpowered villager" is the same as "I am the very essence of evil, and will twist your words until you lynch yourself, you pitiful mote."

[stessier]

Sorry guys, I'm out. Work is just to hectic at the moment.

[purge]

Much like the Battlestar Galactica, perhaps I should back out and watch the show first.

[Newcastle]

Much like the Battlestar Galactica, perhaps I should back out and watch the show first.

i dont think it will really be an issue. I played his first version of lost without having watched the show and i was fine.

I also play the BG games and havent watched any of hte current stuff. You should be fine.

[Scoop20906]

I have only watch the first season and none of the things in the first game I played are in the first season. You would be fine.

[Grundbegriff]

Sorry guys, I'm out. Work is just to hectic at the moment.

[Newcastle]

Sorry guys, I'm out. Work is just to hectic at the moment.

[stessier]

I only picked up that button pushing line in a completely unrelated podcast. I've never seen one minute of the series. You'll be fine playing.

Sorry guys, I'm out. Work is just to hectic at the moment.

Sorry. "Work is just too hectic at the moment."

Hate to see the guilt trip if I had left a participle dangling.

[Grundbegriff]

Is it because I called you a punk?

[purge]

Is it because I called you a punk?

Your comment WAS a little too gruff. Stess has a sensitive side too, you heartless bastard.

[stessier]

Is it because I called you a punk?

If only - then I'd still be getting home at a reasonable hour every night - albeit, a little more depressed than usual.

I like purge's response though.

[LordMortis]

Someone PM me before the game begins and explain the rules to me and I'll jump in.

[Newcastle]

Someone PM me before the game begins and explain the rules to me and I'll jump in.

Well, i think grund thinks we are all on his elevated plane of thought, since he somehow thinks folks should know know what they are..maybe he's sending em out via esp, who knows...

best bet is to read through them and ask questions initially. He should be posting them in the next few days (i think so, theoretically we are starting this sun. so i am hoping they are posted well before hand *coughcoughhinthint*)

[Grundbegriff]

I'll be posting them no later than Saturday, probably in the AM. Sooner if other factors in life cooperate.

There'll be a season of Q&A, but I'm aiming to provide a streamlined set of rules so that we don't start the game by bogging down in confusion and ambiguity.

In the previous game, most of the complexity arose from trying to parse who can see whom in a given space and how the powers of that space, if any, affect the calculation. I want something more straightforward than that this time.

The basic game mechanism this time will be Flash Elsewhen. There will be two maps, each like the map used in the previous game. They reference the same space (the Island) at different times (now and before).



The Center Map will contain new hidden sites (reflecting later show lore) with interesting powers that affect each team's efforts to resolve the conflicts that motivate the game. Players will be assigned to teams that have competing goals on the Center Map, and players will have a good amount of information about what's happening there/then.

The Bygones Map, in contrast, will be a place where each player can pursue his Hidden Agenda and where the secret actions of other players may be discovered/thwarted/supported. The Bygones Map will include most of the same sites as the map we used in the first game (in different hexes, of course), but with new relevant powers, and each of these will offer a way of manipulating/disrupting whatever's happening on the Center Map.

Two maps, one open and in the present, the other hidden and in the past. What you do on the hidden, past map can potentially alter the consequences of what anyone does on the present map. That's the concept.

After all, what happened happened!

[J.D.]

This sounds mind-blowingly awesome.

[Grundbegriff]

Thank you. I kind of like it, too, both as a game mechanism and as a way of reflecting the spirit of the show.

I hope stessier will reconsider his decision not to play. He might've been scared away by the prospect of having to manage too much complexity (i.e., as much complexity as the first game entailed). I'm here to say that although it'll be somewhat complex, it won't be obscure and (I hope) it won't be tedious.

Please feel free to ask questions, if any, based on what I've revealed.

[Arcanis]

Once the rules are up I may be willing to step into Stesser's old spot. I have never even seen a episode of lost but your game mechanics sound interesting, so if i can get my head around them i would probably be interested. Though i will defer to Stess if he wants to come back and play.

[Grundbegriff]

Once the rules are up I may be willing to step into Stesser's old spot. I have never even seen a episode of lost but your game mechanics sound interesting, so if i can get my head around them i would probably be interested. Though i will defer to Stess if he wants to come back and play.

You're welcome to join whether he plays or withdraws. I haven't set a cap on the number of participants.

Not knowing the show won't be a handicap with respect to gameplay. You can find out a bit about some of the characters by following the youtube links provided in the previous game's first post, if you're interested.

[Scoop20906]

Can we play as Before Scoop and After Scoop? Trust me when we say it won't be hard from our perspective.

[Grundbegriff]

Can we play as Before Scoop and After Scoop? Trust me when we say it won't be hard from our perspective.

I have no idea what that's supposed to mean. Sorry.

[Grundbegriff]

I'm going to start posting rules here, and updating as I go. So this will evolve. Once it's locked down, I'll start the game thread and copy the final rules to it.

The Past:_________________________The Present:______________________


Three Teams with conflicting goals:

The Losties ("Team Lostie")

• Members: 6 members: 4 Candidates and 2 decoys. The Candidates do not know that they are Candidates. The members of Team Lostie do not know one another -- they have trust issues after all they've been through -- and must scan to confirm their allies.
• Goals:
  (a) To perform the following steps in sequence: (1) unstop The Bottle, (2) kill the Man in Black, (3) restop The Bottle.
  (b) to disable or destroy the Beechcraft.
• Victory condition: achieve the goals (a) and (b) with at least 1 team member surviving.
• Skills:
  Two of the Losties have the one-time power to kill a player. This takes place by day, and the target is specified by player name, not role name. The shot is public but does not reveal alignment.
  Jack can restore one dead player to life by carrying that player to The Temple.
  Candidates (but not decoys) are immune to the Man in Black's hex-kill. The fact that they were attacked in a hex-kill will not be announced. Non-candidates in the hex, if any, will die.

The Widmore Team ("Team Widmore")

• Members: 6 members: Charles Widmore and 5 hirelings.
• Goal: To eliminate all the Candidates AND to contain or eliminate the Man in Black, in any order.
• Victory condition: achieve the goal with
  (a) at least 1 team member surviving AND
  (b) with the Beechcraft intact AND refueled
  (c) AND with all living team members on the hex containing the Beechcraft.
• Skills: Miscellaneous research and tactical capabilities, including deployment and removal of Sound Barriers and laying of explosive traps. This is the only team with a private forum.
  Two members of Team Widmore have the one-time power to kill a player. This takes place by day, and the target is specified by player name, not role name. The shot is public but does not reveal alignment.

The Man in Black Team ("Team Evil")

• Members: The Man in Black and 1 collaborator, but may expand to as many as 4 members.
• Goal: To leave the Island, which can only occur by
  (a) eliminating Jacob (whom he cannot directly kill)
  (b) eliminating all the Candidates (whom he cannot directly kill) AND
  (c) escaping in Widmore's fueled Beechcraft.
• Skills:
  The Man in Black may kill everyone in a single hex. This takes place as the first event of the night, and the target hex is specified by map and number.
  The Man in Black can restore one dead player to life by carrying that player to the Temple.
  Up to 2 times, the Man in Black may force the conversion of another player (by name) who then joins his team. The conversion and hex-kill are mutually exclusive.
  Because he has been on the Island for so long and knows his way around, the Man in Black may move up to 3 hexes on the Present map and up to two on the Past map..

Team Lostie
Jack

Desmond

Hurley

Kate

Sawyer

Sayid


Team Evil
The Man in Black

Ben


Team Widmore
Charles Widmore

Martin Keamy

Daniel

Charlotte

Naomi

Zoe

[J.D.]

[Grundbegriff]

Places:

7 Dharma Stations

The ARROW
A storage depot and defense research facility. In the present, a single indestructible unit of jet fuel may be found. In the past, the finder may not keep the fuel, but may move it to another hex. In the past, the finder may rig the ARROW so that any solo person (other than the MiB) who enters it in the present will die.

The FLAME

A telecommunications center. In the present, a player may broadcast a message to his teammates if no other team is represented at the station. In the past, 3 packs of C-4 may be found here but may only be taken away one pack at a time per person per visit. These may be carried or hidden in another hex. Traps set in the past will explode in the present. A payload may be transferred from past to present by meeting oneself in a hex (i.e., you leave it for yourself in the Treehouse Past and find it in the Treehouse Present on the same turn).

The ORCHID

A time/space distortion research facility. In the present, a visitor may teleport to any other hex by number. In the past, a visitor may turn the wheel that moves the island. This results in a random reassignment of everyone's position in the present.

The PEARL
A surveillance station. A visitor here may scan for the population roster of another Dharma station. If applicable, the visitor may then scan for the team alignment of any single person in that station. In the present, this applies to the present population; in the past, this applies to the past population.

The STAFF
A medical research and treatment facility. In the present, any person other than Jack or the Man in Black who enters this station solo will die. In the past, any person who enters this station solo will learn how to revive the dead at the Temple.

The SWAN
An electromagnetic containment facility. In the present, any person entering this station solo may trigger a massive EMP blast that will disable all sonic barriers and disrupt the use of any other facilities in the present on that night. This destroys the station and renders its hex unnavigable. In the past, any person entering this station may sabotage the station so that triggering the EMP blast in the present will no longer be possible. In that case, the station in the present will allow its user to remotely disable all sonic barriers touching any single hex.

The TEMPEST
A chemical armament research facility. In the present, anyone who enters this station solo may gas another hex by name or number. Anyone trying to operate in the targeted hex will be thwarted by sleepiness for that night. In the past, anyone who enters this station solo may flip a channeling switch so that use of the station in the present results in death instead of sleep. Daniel or Charlotte has the ability, in the past, to flip the switch back from death to sleep.

12 other sites

Barracks

In the present, a message left here for one's teammates will be found by them if they enter this site. In the past, if the Man in Black is alive, then anyone who visits here alone causes the smoke monster to randomly attack a hex in the present and kill every non-Candidate in it.

Beechcraft Wreckage

In the present, a single indestructible unit of jet fuel may be found. In the past, the finder may not keep the fuel, but may move it to another hex.

Black Rock

In the present, three bundles of dynamite may be found here but may only be taken away one pack at a time per person per visit. The finder may not keep the dynamite on his person since it is extremely unstable. Instead, a bundle of dynamite may be carried for only one turn and must then be left in the next destination hex. Another person may take it from there for a turn, or the person who left it there may depart, return to that hex, and transport it again. In the past, this works the same way. A payload may be transferred from past to present by meeting oneself in a hex (i.e., you leave it for yourself in the Treehouse Past and find it in the Treehouse Present on the same turn).

Colossal Statue

In the present, anyone who visits this site solo will encounter Jacob, and he will (one time only per visitor) reveal the team alignment of any single player. If the Man in Black arrives here with a minion, he may induce that minion to kill Jacob; the cost of this operation is that the Man in Black may neither kill nor convert on the following night. In the past, Jacob is not here and the site is inert.

Heart of the Island

The identity of this hex can only be discovered by the Man in Black or a Candidate. Everyone else will find a well (type randomly determined). In the past, this site is inert. In the present, any two Losties or Desmond on his own can remove the stone stopper from its hole. This results in death for the one(s) performing the action. If the stopper has already been removed, any single Lostie or Desmond can replug the hole. Replacing the stopper does not result in death.

Hidden Runway

Somewhere on the island is a hidden runway containing Charles Widmore's fully functional Beechcraft airplane. It's out of fuel. Everyone on Widmore's team knows where it is.

Jacob's Cave

In the present or past, anyone who goes alone into this cave on the face of the cliff may learn the team alignment of a single dead player. May be repeated only by leaving and returning. If and only if he has no minions, the Man in Black may, in the past, use this site to involuntarily corrupt any other player.

Lighthouse

In the present, any Lostie can scan himself to find out whether he's a Candidate and the MiB can scan any other player to find out whether the target is a Candidate. In the past, anyone can scan another player to find out that player's team alignment.

Pneumatic tube dump

In the present, a message left here for one's teammates will be found by them if they enter this site. In the past, this site is inert.

Temple

In the present, anyone who knows how to use the Temple (i.e., Jack, the MiB, and anyone who has learned at the Staff) can bring a body here and revive it. In the past, if the Man in Black is alive, then anyone who visits here alone causes the smoke monster to randomly attack a hex in the present and kill every non-Candidate in it.

Well

Wells come in two types. For this one, in the present, anyone who enters the well will be teleported to the Orchid station with an option to use it. In the past, anyone who enters the well will be trapped there until another person enters the hex and chooses to liberate the captive.

Well

For this type of well, in the present, anyone who enters the well will be trapped there until another person enters the hex and chooses to liberate the captive. In the past, anyone who enters the well will be teleported to the Orchid station with an option to use it.

The Widmore team has the power to set up as many as six hex-wall barriers and to remove as many as three by night. Sonic barriers block entry into the affected hex from the blocked direction.

[Grundbegriff]

Gameplay:

START
At the game's beginning, everyone is randomly scattered across the island. Players are also scattered randomly across the Past island. Locations need not match. No player knows the identity of his starting hex; it must be reentered from another hex to count as explored.

The members of Team Widmore know their teammates. No Candidate knows he's a Candidate and no decoy knows he's a decoy. The Losties do not know one another. The Man in Black knows Ben, but Ben does not know the Man in Black.

Players who join Team Evil retain their capabilities, if any.

DAY PHASE
By day, the community must vote (with a true majority) either to kill a single player among their number ( Bubba 
 
) or to end the day without an execution ( No execution 
 
). If the Man in Black is the target of the majority's vote, he will not die unless the stopper at the Heart of the Island has been removed and has not yet been replaced.

During the day, any or all of the living Candidates may expend a one-time shot to kill any other player. Death will be immediate. This does not take the place of the community's option to execute. If the Man in Black is the target of a one-time shot, he will not die unless the stopper at the Heart of the Island has been removed and has not yet been replaced.

NIGHT PHASE
At nightfall, the Man in Black may either (a) attack a hex (by number) to kill every non-Candidate in it or (b) forcibly convert another player into a member of Team Evil. The player will learn the identity of the Man in Black. The Man in Black may also choose to do neither. He may only exercise this power of conversion twice; after that, he loses this power.

By night, each player may move one or two hexes (player's choice) on the Present map, explore the destination hex to learn its identity, and perform an operation there if any is legal. The player will learn who else has landed in the destination hex. The Man in Black may move up to three hexes on the Present map and up to two on the Past map.

By night, each player may move one hex on the Past map, explore the destination hex to learn its identity, and perform an operation there if any is legal. The player will not learn who else is in the destination hex since players might be operating at different times in the past. The one exception is when a player enters a hex and another is trapped in a well there; the entering player will have the option to rescue the trapped player.

RESOLUTION, etc.
Movement and operations performed in the past will be resolved before movement and operations in the present. Movements in the past need not correspond to movements in the present.

When the night's activities, past and present, have been resolved, daybreak occurs and any relevant results are announced. Team alignment of the dead will not be revealed automatically; it must be discerned via Jacob's Cave.

MISC OBSERVATIONS

Desmond alone knows where everyone is on the Past map. This information will be provided to him every morning.

Team Widmore has a private forum, and may collude there by day or night.

The Beechcraft on the Hidden Runway may be disabled by a single detonation of dynamite or C-4. It may be destroyed by a double detonation. Martin Keamy is able to repair the disabled airplane, but cannot repair it once it's destroyed.

To revive a dead player at the Temple, the one attempting the procedure must first go to where the body is lying and collect it.

[Arcanis]

ok I think I can handle this. It is a bit complex but could be fun. I see team Lostie has an advantage in that it can irrevocably end the other teams' victory chances if they can blow the plane. This is very much a game where everyone looses is a viable and practically likely end.

[stessier]

What happens if a non-Candidate Lostie (or decoy) tries to shoot someone?

What prevents Team Lostie from getting an immediate voting majority by wiping out 4 people from the other side (and maybe getting lucky and taking out Ben in the process)?

(Perhaps these were going to be answered in planned updates, but I thought I'd get them out there while I remembered. )

[Grundbegriff]

General observations about Team Widmore:

Team Widmore is the only team with a forum. This means they can carefully plot their escapades both in the Present and in the Past. Offsetting this is the fact that they have limited offensive capability (can kill outright only twice) and no defensive capability (cannot protect). Therefore, they must either use Island features to trigger attacks, try to control the vote, or set explosive traps.

Team Widmore has control of the Present map insofar as they can do one of the following each night:

(a) nothing
(b) add one sonic barrier
(c) add two sonic barriers
(d) add a sonic barrier and remove a sonic barrier
(e) remove two sonic barrier
(f) remove one sonic barrier

Team Widmore can influence the lines between the hexes by raising or removing sonic barriers that prevent travel through that side of the hex. Only Sayid can cross these barriers.

When a sonic barrier has been raised on a hex, nobody can enter or traverse that hex through that side-- not even Team Widmore. Therefore, there are two major uses and one minor use for barriers: to protect the hidden runway, to contain the Man in Black, and to opportunistically thwart the plans of other players. The Man in Black is contained when (a) he is surrounded by sonic barriers AND (b) nothing in the hexes to which he has access (now or in the past) enables him to free himself AND (c) none of his minions (if any) can free him.

C-4 can be carried on one's person or left in a hex. Dynamite can be carried on one's person for one turn and must then be left in a hex. Unconverted members of Team Widmore, however, can set a trap when leaving C-4 or dynamite behind; the next solo person to enter a trapped hex explores too thoroughly, sets off the trap, and dies in the explosion.

Upshot: Team Widmore is playing a blocking game as well as a killing game.

[Grundbegriff]

What happens if a non-Candidate Lostie (or decoy) tries to shoot someone?

(a) He finds out the hard way that he's not a candidate; (b) everyone else finds out that he incorrectly thought he was a Candidate.

What prevents Team Lostie from getting an immediate voting majority by wiping out 4 people from the other side (and maybe getting lucky and taking out Ben in the process)?

They would be revealed as Candidates, drastically simplifying the task of whoever's trying to kill them. Meanwhile, the people they slaughter could (in theory) be revived at the Temple either by the Man in Black or by anyone who has gone to the Staff in the Past to learn Temple lore.

(Perhaps these were going to be answered in planned updates, but I thought I'd get them out there while I remembered. )

Thanks! Keep it coming!

[redrun]

Thanks! Keep it coming!

-- Movement - how does one get between the past/present maps?
-- Things dropped in other hexes (C4, Dynamite, fuel, ?) - does anyone else entering these hexes find them there? Dynamite has to be dropped, but I'm wondering why folks would drop anything else (I've not seen a method of knowing what someone is carrying). Can items be given to other folks in the same time/hex?

[Unagi]

Will every player have a role, and if no, what team is a villager (roleless player) playing for?