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[Bethesda] Fallout 76

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Rumpy
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Rumpy » Tue Jun 12, 2018 1:33 pm

You'd think they've never seen a solar eclipse! Didn't the last eclipse teach anyone to look directly at the sun without special filters? Some did anyway.

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by El Guapo » Tue Jun 12, 2018 2:00 pm

DOS=HIGH wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 12:11 am
Grifman wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 11:20 pm
Max Peck wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 10:22 pm
Grifman wrote:
Mon Jun 11, 2018 5:48 pm
Just saw an interview with Howard. No NPC’s, quests come from terminals, robots, etc. No raiders, factions, etc. It will be interesting to follow but probably not a purchase by me unless somehow these turns out really amazing.
Link?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdYtulRRfDU
From the link:
- PvP is still being tweaked to avoid greifing (I'd actually say they're trying to minimize the effect of griefing)
- Modding will be present in 76 but not at launch
- Private servers will happen (but not at launch)

I feel a bit better, but would still much prefer a regular Fallout or an FO version of ESO. The No NPC is disappointing even though it would create the problem with the normal FO ability to kill anyone. Then again, what's stopping you from destroying an NPC robot?
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Kasey Chang » Tue Jun 12, 2018 2:44 pm

If it's like when the vault "first" opened, it would kind of make sense there are no raiders and such (yet). It could come as Season 2 whatever.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Gryndyl » Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:43 pm

Fallout players: It'd be cool to be able to play Fallout with a couple friends.

Fallout Devs: It would! Hey, we'll also add in a couple dozen random players.

Players: Wait, no, that's not at all...

Devs: Too late! Tupac69L0L has nuked your base!

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Max Peck » Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:26 pm

"Bob" 1-1: In the beginning was the Slack, and the Slack was with "Bob", and the Slack was "Bob".

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by TheMix » Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:27 am

Gryndyl wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 7:43 pm
Fallout players: It'd be cool to be able to play Fallout with a couple friends.

Fallout Devs: It would! Hey, we'll also add in a couple dozen random players.

Players: Wait, no, that's not at all...

Devs: Too late! Tupac69L0L has nuked your base!
I chuckled. :lol:
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Daehawk » Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:58 am

Fallout 76: Never get out of the Vault.

I hear that in my head every time I see that 76 name tag. Hahaha I wonder if you can just stay in the vault? Some Mr Handy grab your ass and toss you out..."There you go sir have a good day sir"
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by killbot737 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:19 am

Max Peck wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:26 pm
v-v-v-v-v-video-o-o-o-ooooooo!
Some of the people in that interview are hopelessly naive. I know they've never played a PvP game. If someone Can do something in-game, they WILL. No matter how much it ruins another player's game experience.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Daehawk » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:25 am

Yep and a lot of times its totally out of the programmers thought process what they end up doing with their thought out stuff.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by GreenGoo » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:29 am

killbot737 wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:19 am

If someone Can do something in-game, they WILL. No matter how much Especially if it ruins another player's game experience.
FTFY. Seemed an obvious one.

There are a few types of pvp'ers. Those that like competition, and play hard to win but by the spirit of the rules (think sports), those who like to screw up peoples' days (think trolls utilizing everything including exploits) and those who like competition, but see the game as the ruleset and anything the game allows as fair game.

There are others, but those crossed my mind. The first group would actually stop if their opponents called time out because one of their players twisted their ankle, the second group would seek out the injured player just to stomp on his ankle, and the third group would simply shrug and keep playing until the game was won.

Ignore group #2 at your peril, game designers. You can't get rid of them, they will always be there, and can't be defeated with optimistic thoughts about the nature of humanity. Your design needs to actively take them into account in an organic and self policiing way, otherwise you'll spend all your time dealing with player complaints on the one hand, and disciplining others on the second hand. All because you fucked up the design from the start.

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by TheMix » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:31 am

killbot737 wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:19 am
Max Peck wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 9:26 pm
v-v-v-v-v-video-o-o-o-ooooooo!
Some of the people in that interview are hopelessly naive. I know they've never played a PvP game. If someone Can do something in-game, they WILL. No matter Because of how much it ruins another player's game experience.
FTFY. I didn't have time to watch the entire thing. I jumped around a bit. But I caught someone talking about the nukes and how they can be used to create a high level zone. And he prefaced it with something like "they'll nuke an unused area...". Yeah, right. Clearly he's never played an online game. Hell, I've dealt with tons of griefers in PvE games. There doesn't even need to be a PvP requirement.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Grifman » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:34 am

Kasey Chang wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 2:44 pm
If it's like when the vault "first" opened, it would kind of make sense there are no raiders and such (yet). It could come as Season 2 whatever.
Why? Raiders aren’t former or decendants of vault dwellers.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Max Peck » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:44 am

Grifman wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:34 am
Kasey Chang wrote:
Tue Jun 12, 2018 2:44 pm
If it's like when the vault "first" opened, it would kind of make sense there are no raiders and such (yet). It could come as Season 2 whatever.
Why? Raiders aren’t former or decendants of vault dwellers.
The problem with having human NPCs is that it wouldn't make sense for them to be 100% hostile to the player characters, and the design seems to preclude friendly NPCs, at least for the time being. If you see it, you can kill it with no inconvenient moral qualms.

According to the noclip documentary, there will be early-stage ghouls that take on the role of raider NPCs. Apparently they're feral enough to be irredeemably hostile, but not so feral that they don't use weapons.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Daehawk » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:57 am

When it comes to a PvE where others can grief you and you cant do anything at all Ill take full PvP so I can remedy that.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by GreenGoo » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:27 am

Daehawk wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:57 am
When it comes to a PvE where others can grief you and you cant do anything at all Ill take full PvP so I can remedy that.
Agreed, but I thought we were talking about PVP? If it's simply griefers, then yeah, PvE griefers are often even more frustrating.

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Max Peck » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:31 am

Spoiler: Not a gameplay demo, just an interview.

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by GreenGoo » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:32 am

Love the leather straps. It's like plastic (and every material related to it) was never invented.

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Max Peck » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:34 am

Maybe it's pleather. :coffee:
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Isgrimnur » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:36 am

Polygon: Build your own Pip-Boy with Fallout 76’s special edition construction kit
For $150, you can build your own Pip-Boy with the Fallout 76 Pip-Boy Construction Kit, coming later this year from ThinkGeek and Bethesda Softworks.

The kit is available for pre-order now. ThinkGeek (which is owned by GameStop) promises that the kit has more than 250 parts (“in a vegan leather case”) plus the tools necessary to put it together. Fans will be able to customize their own Pip-Boy 2000 Mark 6, the one seen on the protagonist’s wrist at the end of the Fallout 76 trailer shown last month.

The Pip-Boy 2000 Mark 6 is an earlier model than the Pip Boy 3000 Mark 4, which was a premium offered with the Fallout 4 special edition when that launched in 2015. Canonically speaking, the unit is an earlier model (powered by vacuum tubes, even) and may lack some of the functionality the user had with the Fallout 4 Pip-Boy.

There are more Fallout 76 goodies coming from ThinkGeek, too. They include 1:1 scale replicas of the game’s Plasma Rifle, Plasma Pistol, Fusion Core, Sledge Hammer and the Power Fist. Liberty Prime, the mech who saved the day in Fallout 3, gets a collectible statue, as does Dogmeat, the game’s faithful canine companion. Players can also pick up a figurine of the T-51 power armor, a model of the “Fusion Flea” vehicle, and “Vault Girl,” a more lifelike, female representation of the Fallout series’ bobblehead mascot
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by GreenGoo » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:37 am

Max Peck wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:34 am
Maybe it's pleather. :coffee:
The wear and tear look legit to me. I wasn't being critical. I was thinking about the alternate timeline mentioned earlier with no transistors but tiny reactors. Also, no plastic apparently.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Isgrimnur » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:39 am

New VATS
It will be present, Todd Howard said in an interview with Geoff Keighley, but not quite as we've seen it previously.

"It's real-time," Howard said. "It doesn't slow time. But it lets you target and pick parts and all of that, but it's in real-time. It still works great. It's different, obviously, because it's real-time, but the basics of it, which are, 'I can't really—I'm not that good of a twitch shooter' … You can kind of picture how it works. Like, I'm not as good as lining up someone and getting a head shot, but I've made my character good at VATS, and now I can do that."
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Daehawk » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:39 am

If you look Thinkgeek has a lot of fallout stuff. I especially like the Dogmeat statue.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by killbot737 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:50 am

Todd Howard wrote:That doesn't mean you can choose to completely remove yourself from the dangers of the Wasteland, however, as Howard made clear in his hesitant response when asked if players can opt out of PvP entirely. "We want a little bit of drama there, without them ruining your game," he said.
That last statement is logically inconsistent. Getting killed in-game by another player is already ruining my game if I don't want to be involved with PvP.

I bet it's going to be like UO where the griefers stand one square outside the guard's reaction range and gank you incessantly the second you exit the vault.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by GreenGoo » Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:47 pm

I'll take that bet.

That's pure irrational pessimism. You're suggesting a return to gameplay that hasn't existed in that form in over 25 years.

If you don't want to PvP don't play a PvP game. That's not a flaw in game design, it just means the game is not something you want to play. There are tons of games I have no interest in, but that's no one's fault. Not every game is for every gamer.

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Isgrimnur » Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:56 pm

If they go with the Conan level of players per server, there won't be more than 50 people online at any one time. The levels will split, the map will be huge, and those wanting to grief people will be few and far between, and avoidable.

When you respawn in Conan, you have three possible locations available once you respawn. The original point, your base with a bed, or a bedroll that you've dropped wherever you wanted. The good stuff in terms of resources is located far away from the noob areas. And there is no fast travel. If someone wants to grief the newbies, they will have to spend a significant time travelling away from their base to get to that area.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Grifman » Wed Jun 13, 2018 6:16 pm

Isgrimnur wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:56 pm
If they go with the Conan level of players per server, there won't be more than 50 people online at any one time. The levels will split, the map will be huge, and those wanting to grief people will be few and far between, and avoidable.

When you respawn in Conan, you have three possible locations available once you respawn. The original point, your base with a bed, or a bedroll that you've dropped wherever you wanted. The good stuff in terms of resources is located far away from the noob areas. And there is no fast travel. If someone wants to grief the newbies, they will have to spend a significant time travelling away from their base to get to that area.
It has been stated that there will be between 24 and 36 people per server. In addition you will always know where eveyone is via the radar map. So not avoidable. And distance is never an obstacle to griefers.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Rumpy » Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:41 pm

GreenGoo wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:29 am
All because you fucked up the design from the start.
Yep, you give tools the tools, and they'll use them. Willing to bet that just a month or two into the game, it will be unplayable for anyone venturing into it alone. Everything will be stacked against them and I'm imagining it will be difficult to make progress unless you're with a team or even join one, and thus will be the cycle.

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Blackhawk » Wed Jun 13, 2018 9:54 pm

killbot737 wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 11:50 am

I bet it's going to be like UO where the griefers stand one square outside the guard's reaction range and gank you incessantly the second you exit the vault.
Except UO with sniper rifles and portable atomic bomb launchers.
[This space left intentionally blank.]

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Kraken » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:00 pm

I wish I could pretend that I want to play this game, but I've been killed within 15 minutes in every online shooter game I've ever tried. It would need an offline, single-player mode to draw me in, and that describes the normal Fallout game that they are diligently removing from the engine. But I still haven't played FO4, so I've still got that to look forward to.

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Isgrimnur » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:11 pm

Buncha Cassandras in here.

Enlarge Image

Menu option #2 is SP/Co-op. It gives you difficulty settings or custom sliders to cater it to your desires.

If Bethesda has any clue as to how to do this right, the option to play it by yourself and/or with friends only will be baked in at the start.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by killbot737 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:12 pm

GreenGoo wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:47 pm
I'll take that bet.

That's pure irrational pessimism. You're suggesting a return to gameplay that hasn't existed in that form in over 25 years.
Prove me wrong, Pollyanna. We shall see. The proof shall be in the seeing, in which the proof shall be revealed! In this way we shall see the proof, and the revelation that will be shown by the proof, where we shall see the proof! The seeing will be the proof!

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by killbot737 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:21 pm

Isgrimnur wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:11 pm
Buncha Cassandras in here.
Unless you're referring to the Greek Cassandra who preaches the truth but none believe her I don't grok your meaning.

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Daehawk » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:34 pm

Kraken wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:00 pm
I wish I could pretend that I want to play this game, but I've been killed within 15 minutes in every online shooter game I've ever tried. It would need an offline, single-player mode to draw me in, and that describes the normal Fallout game that they are diligently removing from the engine. But I still haven't played FO4, so I've still got that to look forward to.
I used to be the one doing the killing now I am the prey. I die and dont know who or where from then come back somewhere else and repeat until I get mad and quit. Like maybe 5 deaths is enough for me now.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Blackhawk » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:43 pm

I usually die more than I kill in multiplayer shooters these days, but there's a big difference between something with rounds like Rainbow Six: Siege or Overwatch, and something with progress to be lost.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by GreenGoo » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:44 pm

killbot737 wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:12 pm
GreenGoo wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:47 pm
I'll take that bet.

That's pure irrational pessimism. You're suggesting a return to gameplay that hasn't existed in that form in over 25 years.
Prove me wrong, Pollyanna. We shall see. The proof shall be in the seeing, in which the proof shall be revealed! In this way we shall see the proof, and the revelation that will be shown by the proof, where we shall see the proof! The seeing will be the proof!

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I'm not the one who's suggesting the sky is falling. We absolutely will see.

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Isgrimnur » Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:47 pm

killbot737 wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:21 pm
Isgrimnur wrote:
Wed Jun 13, 2018 10:11 pm
Buncha Cassandras in here.
Unless you're referring to the Greek Cassandra who preaches the truth but none believe her I don't grok your meaning.

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Chicken Little, then.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Max Peck » Fri Jun 15, 2018 10:33 am

Ah, who am I kidding. I'm not going to start not buying every Fallout game that's released just because I'm scared of PVP.

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by MonkeyFinger » Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:14 pm

LOL

I'm sure I'll get it an some point for the exact same reason. I've played every single other dang one, gotta keep the streak going. :shifty:
-mf

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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Daehawk » Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:29 pm

Few of you guys should get together and form an Overlords Puss Posse and rule a server with an iron teste tentacle.
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Re: [Bethesda] Fallout 76

Post by Max Peck » Fri Jun 15, 2018 12:59 pm

We already know that you don't get to pick and choose a server to play on. My guess is that they're utilizing a matchmaking infrastructure that uses things like a friend list and geographical proximity to assign players to instances. If that is the case, I'd hope there is also a way to set up an ignore list of some sort that lets you flag players with whom you do not wish to play. Something like that would go a long way to mitigating serial griefing. I'd also like to see them try to implement some sort of social/antisocial scoring system that factors into matchmaking, so that players that prefer a particular style of gameplay end up playing together. I'd also hope that the "power level" (for lack of a better term) of a character factors into the matchmaking, so that new characters don't get matched with random strangers who have end-game gear for example.
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