Grimoire

Jag · Post by **Jag** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 3:10 pm

Elimage was confusing as hell. Much more a Japanese based RPG than a western one. I may have to see if I can get back into it.

The Grimrock's were decent as was Lords of Xulima and Fall of the Dungeon Guardians.

Just finished Ruzar- The Life Stone too.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 3:31 pm

Oooh, that looks good, too. How was it? I consider the Grimrocks probably the best of the modern 1 party CRPG's.

Have not tried Eliminage yet, myself, but it's on my wishlist. Now I may not (and reviews are not great either).

Jag · Post by **Jag** » Wed Aug 09, 2017 4:29 pm

Carpet_pissr wrote:Oooh, that looks good, too. How was it? I consider the Grimrocks probably the best of the modern 1 party CRPG's.

Wasn't party based, but short and fun. Picked it up on a sale and it was fine for what it was. Grimrock and MM-X are definitely the best so far.

baelthazar · Post by **baelthazar** » Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:44 am

I did not write RPS's Article on Grimoire, but it echoes everything I said, down to the being killed by bugs a few minutes in.

https://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2017/0 ... ore-467847

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:16 am

baelthazar wrote:it echoes everything I said, down to the being killed by bugs a few minutes in.

Looking at your screenshots, it appears that you chose to start in the Eerie Wastes, which I think is one of the hardest starting locations. One of the starting locations is supposed to be much, much easier than the rest of them so it would probably have been best to pick that one. I think most people don't realize you can set where you start the game in the configuration.

baelthazar · Post by **baelthazar** » Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:19 am

ColdSteel wrote:
baelthazar wrote:it echoes everything I said, down to the being killed by bugs a few minutes in.
Looking at your screenshots, it appears that you chose to start in the Eerie Wastes, which I think is one of the hardest starting locations. One of the starting locations is supposed to be much, much easier than the rest of them so it would probably have been best to pick that one. I think most people don't realize you can set where you start the game in the configuration.

Oh, I noticed this, but Eerie Wastes is the default location and - lacking ANY feedback or knowledge - I figured it was the normal starting location.

Suitably Ironic Moniker · Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:51 am

I really want to play this game successfully, which is why I'm giving it six months for it to be patched up somewhat, and also for there to be more on-line documentation (including the manual, hopefully, but that might be another 20

).

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:03 pm

In case anyone was waiting for a sale:

“I have decided it is just a nice thing to do for people who have been waiting years to play my game if I offered a 10% discount on the game during it’s first week. After this ends, I want to assure anyone waiting for the game that Grimoire will never, ever sell at a discount at any time it is on the Steam store ever again. I won’t permit it to be sold below it’s retail value for any reason. I am too proud of my finished product to permit it to be turned into simply another commodity in a Steam sale.”

Malacheye · Post by **Malacheye** » Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:06 pm

I just rolled a new party last night and began the journey this morning. Finished starter dungeon and some forest wandering, got an NPC (Rosy) to join my party and will start Aquavia soon. Played about an hour and no bugs or crashes on the current build.

My party was rolled with the intent to switch all classes at level 10. I tried to roll highest possible numbers (without spending hours to get a "30" or higher, I think all were rolls of 26-29 using 4d8) and save the points to add to attributes, for the difficult requirements needed to switch to the elite classes.

Giant Warrior-->Pirate
Dwarven Metalsmith-->Berserker
Naga Thief-->Assassin
Aeorb Sage-->Jester
Fey Wizard--> Necromancer
Durendil Bard--> Jester
Human Cleric-->Templar

One slot open for NPC's

If some patch or bug screws this one up, I may put it away for a month to see what happens. Lots of newbie guides and early area help now to get started, so the need for a manual is not so great as it was last week.

stimpy · Post by **stimpy** » Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:41 pm

Smoove_B wrote:In case anyone was waiting for a sale:

“I have decided it is just a nice thing to do for people who have been waiting years to play my game if I offered a 10% discount on the game during it’s first week. After this ends, I want to assure anyone waiting for the game that Grimoire will never, ever sell at a discount at any time it is on the Steam store ever again. I won’t permit it to be sold below it’s retail value for any reason. I am too proud of my finished product to permit it to be turned into simply another commodity in a Steam sale.”

I was willing to look past all of the bullshit surrounding this game, but if he holds true to that way of thinking, especially given the totally borked launch, fuck em.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:22 pm

stimpy wrote:but if he holds true to that way of thinking

The thing about Cleve is, you just never know. He's said he's going to do something and then not done it so many times now it's crazy. He could put the game on sale at 50% off in the next big Steam sale and I wouldn't be surprised at all. Then again, he could never put it on sale again and I wouldn't be surprised. You just never know with him. There are certainly some devs out there, like the Rim World dev, that never, ever put their games on sale.

Suitably Ironic Moniker · Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:22 pm

I don't see anything wrong with that. It's not as if he is going to get rich off of this game, and this is how he values it.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Thu Aug 10, 2017 8:13 pm

Its not like the game will be less valuable because the graphics and design has become dated. Cleve is past that Rubicon.

Jeff V · Post by **Jeff V** » Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:16 pm

Suitably Ironic Moniker wrote:I don't see anything wrong with that. It's not as if he is going to get rich off of this game, and this is how he values it.

Just like a book that increases in value because it had a small 1st edition printing and is now rare, perhaps he thinks his bits will likewise increase.

Jeff V · Post by **Jeff V** » Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:35 pm

Zarathud wrote:Its not like the game will be less valuable because the graphics and design has become dated. Cleve is past that Rubicon.

Perhaps he took the pricing class at the HPS School of Game Design.

Suitably Ironic Moniker · Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:48 pm

Jeff V wrote:
Suitably Ironic Moniker wrote:I don't see anything wrong with that. It's not as if he is going to get rich off of this game, and this is how he values it.
Just like a book that increases in value because it had a small 1st edition printing and is now rare, perhaps he thinks his bits will likewise increase.

It also provides an easy excuse for those who are on the fence, but know deep down inside that they probably will never even dent the surface of this impenetrable slog (me being the exception that proves the rule).

morlac · Post by **morlac** » Fri Aug 11, 2017 5:19 pm

Suitably Ironic Moniker wrote:
Jeff V wrote:
Suitably Ironic Moniker wrote:I don't see anything wrong with that. It's not as if he is going to get rich off of this game, and this is how he values it.
Just like a book that increases in value because it had a small 1st edition printing and is now rare, perhaps he thinks his bits will likewise increase.
It also provides an easy excuse for those who are on the fence, but know deep down inside that they probably will never even dent the surface of this impenetrable slog (me being the exception that proves the rule).

He has indicated exactly this as the price reasoning. He figures if he price is set high enough to scare of the more "casual" fans that it will cut down on the complaints/bad reviews/etc by those who are less lenient on what is a labor of love throwback to Wiz 7. Not a bad philosophy for this type of game.

Buatha · Post by **Buatha** » Fri Aug 11, 2017 6:56 pm

I'll admit, I'm curious, but I don't like the idea of a game claiming 600 hours still having the possibility of incompatible saves.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:13 pm

To be fair, he's gotten the save issues squared away.

Malacheye · Post by **Malacheye** » Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:49 pm

ColdSteel wrote:To be fair, he's gotten the save issues squared away.

Yes, 2 1/2 days without a crash or issue...I am the farthest I have been in this game and the wife is getting pissed.

Buatha · Post by **Buatha** » Sat Aug 12, 2017 7:46 pm

Is there a story or is it just random adventures within the world? I keep hearing there isn't much of a story, but that would just mean there is no overall narrative and it's just footloose and fancy free with whatever is over the next hill?

Dave Allen · Post by **Dave Allen** » Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:01 pm

Buatha wrote:...a game claiming 600 hours...

Most of that time is spent clicking through obtuse menus.

Buatha · Post by **Buatha** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:17 pm

For those who may still be morbidly curious about Grimoire, it's now listed at $20.

I remember him saying he would never lower the price...but I guess never is now!

Archinerd · Post by **Archinerd** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 1:09 pm

Not a "sale", it's just a lower retail value.

DD* · Post by DD* » Wed Nov 07, 2018 1:43 pm

Buatha wrote: ↑Wed Nov 07, 2018 12:17 pm

For those who may still be morbidly curious about Grimoire, it's now listed at $20.

I remember him saying he would never lower the price...but I guess never is now!

LOL, I definitely remember words to that effect and thought, "sure, that's never going to happen..."

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:10 pm

He said the original wouldn't ever be cheaper - he's maintained that promise. What is cheaper is "Version 2" of Grimoire. Enjoy it.

DD* · Post by DD* » Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:45 pm

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Wed Nov 07, 2018 2:10 pm He said the original wouldn't ever be cheaper - he's maintained that promise. What is cheaper is "Version 2" of Grimoire. Enjoy it.

Oh, well, that explains it then.

Buatha · Post by **Buatha** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 3:13 pm

I pulled the trigger and will give it a go once his V2 + inevitable hotfix patch is ready using this handy guide someone created.

morlac · Post by **morlac** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 6:04 pm

I got 15ish or so hours in it last year on the "launch" version. There is a lot to like if you enjoyed Wizardry style game as It is certainly a spiritual successor and has this odd quirky charm to it. There is also a lot to hate if you played a game with a UI that was designed in the last 20 years. Some of that was patched a bit better but it was still a slog. V2 promises to fix some of that (screenshots support this theory), while also completing/tweaking systems that never worked (crafting, a spiritual system that is like a fear meter that can build up, etc.). In addition there is more game balancing promised, new content, etc. Earlier in this thread I mentioned every thing is turned up to 11, V2 seems to continue this trend. Example: in a fight you have to manage HP, Magic/mana, Stamina and now spirit (fear) for all EIGHT 8! characters in your party. I am kind of looking forward to trying it again if/when v 2 comes out as it should be finally be "complete"

p.s. Cleve and I are still Steam friends and I got a new copy after my refund

morlac · Post by **morlac** » Wed Nov 07, 2018 6:08 pm

Buatha wrote: ↑Wed Nov 07, 2018 3:13 pm I pulled the trigger and will give it a go once his V2 + inevitable hotfix patch is ready using this handy guide someone created.

That guide is fairly outdated but maybe a decent crash course. There are now in game tool tips over abilities and skills that make things a little less head scratching. Rolling characters has been tweaked to allow for higher rolls and ability to start as advanced classes (not all of them and be prepared to reroll and reroll and reroll). I am no expert but know enough to be dangerous so feel free to ask away.

Buatha · Post by **Buatha** » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:17 am

Thanks, man. The one thing that would help is party make-up. I don't have a lot of free time to try out combinations of parties, so when I play a party-based game, I usually try to find someone who is doing well enough to use their race/class combinations since I'm way less likely to restart games once I'm far into them. If I find out that I'm gimped 15+ hours into a game, that's almost a death knell for it.

The only oddities I heard were Drow have terrible mana as well as Humans, but that was a while ago.

morlac · Post by **morlac** » Thu Nov 08, 2018 5:14 pm

Ok, let's talk party build....

Things to keep in mind:

All 8 slots can melee but the first two slots (going left to right not up and down)generally get hit the most with melee. This has been/needs to be tweaked via a patch. I tested and the #1 slot character got hit exclusively in roughly 50 straight rounds of combat. Supposedly Cleve is tweaking the attack AI to go after more targets of opportunity for V2. We shall see.

Spells always go at the end of combat rounds. Healing, attacks, buffs, etc. Speed only effects melee not casting.

You can min max the crap out of this game if you want with rapid class swaps and save scumming on level ups. They are unlimited as long as min attributes are meet. Stats, hp, magic are completely random on level up. Old school style! I don't bother because it is a rabbit hole I never get out of.

Here's how I go:

I like to fill all 8 slots. If I really need an NPC to join, I can kick one to the curb and have them rejoin later.

I go melee in first 4 slots
Fighter x 1 or 2 (typical fighter, less damage than zerker due to no lethal blow)
Zerker x 1 or 2 (lethal blow is best melee skill in game and they get it first)
Assassin (you can roll one at start now if patient) (lethal blow + thief skills)

Other options:
Ranger
Metalsmith (V2 promises to finally make this class more viable) they do get spells and lethal blow eventually)

Back 4:
Cleric (Must have, everyone likes healing, becomes more necessary later as they get they better heals than other classes can)
Sage Borderline must have. So many critical utility spells (detect secret needs to be running almost permanently) plus charm is close to game breaking at beginning of game.
Bard not a must have anymore since singing/instruments got nerfed but still fun imo. be patient as the song skills suck at first and never land.
Insert caster here: I'm partial to Thaumaturage (like a Druid sorta) Wizard is fine or Necro but I have little exp with them.

Really just pick 1 fighter, 1 zerk, a sage, cleric and then fill in the gaps as you see fit.

Races: I'll dig up a chart showing best race/class combos later but the worse mana regeneration is Drows and Humans iirc. (I suspect this to get tweaked at some point as there is zero reason to roll a human or Drow caster, its just that painful). Aerobs have freakishly fast mana regen but terrible stamina. Barrower/Dwarfs make the best casters currently imo which is odd...shrug. Some races have special abilities/attack. Saurons can bite, Drakes can claw and breath fire, giants can pummel you with a fist, etc. These can be a huge help at the beginning before weapon skills get decent. Some equipment is race restrictive but I have no idea how that unfolds through the game. Almost all the in game portraits suck so don't let that persuade your decision

All i got right now, it's been a few since i really played, i am holding out for V2...any day now.

Jaymann · Post by **Jaymann** » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:48 pm

Can you give info on the rolling process. Do you keep re-rolling each slot until you are satisfied?

morlac · Post by **morlac** » Fri Nov 09, 2018 11:34 am

You get three reroll attempts then you have to back out to pick race again to reset the roll attempts. You want a 30+. It's not too painful. Once attribute prerequisites are meet for your chosen class you get the leftover points to spend on : increasing attributes, HP, MP or skills. Just like Wizardry 8 certain classes/race combos get bonus points to play with so keep that in mind.

there is a chart here:

https://gameplay.tips/guides/860-grimoire.html

Lastly, starting HP and MP are random but influenced by Class, race, sex, attributes. To what extend or variables...who the hell knows. You can get a 35+ roll on fighter but he only has 12 HP to start making you reroll regardless. You could put extra points into starting HP but I hoard those for attributes.

Buatha · Post by **Buatha** » Tue Nov 13, 2018 3:17 pm

On the Steam page:

V2 Grimoire To Be Released First Week Early November 2018!

Buatha · Post by **Buatha** » Tue Nov 20, 2018 10:58 pm

Updated:

V2 Grimoire To Be Released First Week Early Mid in November 2018!

Buatha · Post by **Buatha** » Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:23 pm

Apparently, it's now only $10.

I was checking to see if he ever released the V2 manual (he released an online V1 manual) and noticed the price drop.

morlac · Post by **morlac** » Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:36 pm

It's had 2 or so patches since V2 launched as well. It's still a clusterfuck of ideas and systems but I find it oddly charming. Still not sure I would recommend it unless you really have thing for Wizardry 6-7. It is basically a direct sequel.

Suitably Ironic Moniker · Tue Feb 26, 2019 7:31 pm

Buatha wrote: ↑Tue Feb 26, 2019 5:23 pm Apparently, it's now only $10.

I was checking to see if he ever released the V2 manual (he released an online V1 manual) and noticed the price drop.

I guess it’s not a sale, technically.

MindToyGames · Post by **MindToyGames** » Thu Feb 28, 2019 12:33 pm

I still remember Cleve proudly proclaiming there would never be a discount, that it would always be $30, come rain or shine. So much for that. Even Cleve wasn't a match for Steam.