WoW - Have they nailed down PvP?

McNutt · Post by **McNutt** » Wed Nov 17, 2004 4:26 pm

How is PvP going to work in WoW? I had read an interview a long time ago, but I never heard if it was implemented yet.

Rabid moth · Post by **Rabid moth** » Wed Nov 17, 2004 5:52 pm

I know they are planning some of kind of honor system, but personally, unless they implement a penalty in pvp I won't find it very interesting. Currently there is no penealty for pvp and all the battles devolve into a endless cycle of death and ressurection until people start getting bored.

Also, the pvp is completly level and item based, due to each level you are above someone grants you a higher chance of evading and resisting their spell by a decent margin. At level 16 I fought a level 22 and 90% of every spell I casted was resisted. Even if there were 5 of us firing it would make no difference as 90% of all the spells would just get shrugged off. We had a single level 30 just come to one o our town and utterly gank 12 of us and there wasn't a thing we could do about it, even with all 12 of us working together. I know some people like that but I despise it and I just can't take the pvp in this game seriously.

Just my opinion.

Kraegor · Post by **Kraegor** » Wed Nov 17, 2004 6:00 pm

my understanding is that PvP is not planned to be nailed down at release.

unless dev plans have changed, last i read the acknowledged procedure was that PvP would be in at release, but it would not be balanced or finished.

Tareeq · Post by **Tareeq** » Wed Nov 17, 2004 6:29 pm

Rabid moth wrote:Also, the pvp is completly level and item based, due to each level you are above someone grants you a higher chance of evading and resisting their spell by a decent margin. At level 16 I fought a level 22 and 90% of every spell I casted was resisted. Even if there were 5 of us firing it would make no difference as 90% of all the spells would just get shrugged off. We had a single level 30 just come to one o our town and utterly gank 12 of us and there wasn't a thing we could do about it, even with all 12 of us working together. I know some people like that but I despise it and I just can't take the pvp in this game seriously.

There's a name for those people: ex-Dark Age of Camelot players. Until they brought in the battlegrounds it was foolish for players below level 48 even to try realm vs. realm.

Koz · Post by **Koz** » Wed Nov 17, 2004 9:48 pm

PvP is technically in now in that you can duel other players. But all the battlegrounds and honor stuff isn't in, and I don't think will be for release.

fancydirt · Post by **fancydirt** » Thu Nov 18, 2004 2:30 am

PvP is not currently in the game and never has been. At least not in the terms that McNutt is asking or Blizzard refers to it in.

One of the main things that irritates me the most about the beta test was that a lot of us played on the PvP Beta Server expecting to beta test a PvP system that promised to be a lot of fun. That never happened. All we got to do was play on a server that allowed griefing with no recourse. It was a lot of fun at times, but usually just proved to be frustrating.

It'll be nice if they have a fully tested and balanced system in game for retail release, but nothing else that was tested in house and added to the greater beta proved to be without tons of problems and exploits so I don't have hope that whatever PvP system they have now will run well anytime soon. One of quite a few things that has me holding off on playing the game at retail. Sad, since a focus on PvP has been one of the things that they've been saying will set them apart from other MMORPGs.

Toe · Post by **Toe** » Thu Nov 18, 2004 9:53 am

I have to admit that even though I am not a huge fan of PvP, I feel that Blizzard definately dropped the ball on it. They kept telling us how important it was their game and all the jazz then have nothing but an unfun, skeleton of a PvP system in place at launch. They might suprise us at launch, but I have a feeling what we say yesterday is about what we are going to be getting at launch.

PvE, though, is fun, and thats what draws me to WoW the most right now.

Gedd · Post by **Gedd** » Thu Nov 18, 2004 10:06 am

Koz wrote:PvP is technically in now in that you can duel other players. But all the battlegrounds and honor stuff isn't in, and I don't think will be for release.

You've actually been able to duel other players for a long, long time (way back in the closed beta). The plan for PvP is here, but the current system is not anywhere close to that.

In terms of when you can be attacked and when you can attack, this page explains the difference between the two server types. There is also a consensual system in place where, if both characters type /pvp, they get assigned a PvP flag and can fight each other.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Thu Nov 18, 2004 11:47 am

Blizzard appear to be more driven by dates than their reputation leads them to be. Thanksgiving weekend is often a huge release weekend for them.

I'd think that this being a Warcraft game, as one of the pillars of the rise of the PvP realtime that this would have to be the heart and goal of their game. I think I will be watching someone else play this before I debate dropping money for it. The sad thing is that I was waiting for someone like Blizzard to put MMORPG. As it turns out, this may become another genera that never grabs me.

Meghan · Post by **Meghan** » Thu Nov 18, 2004 2:02 pm

I feel the same LordMortis, although my opinion of Blizzard has been dropping for years.

I play with the Amazon Basin and I was looking forward to being in at the start of something big and special but after listening to Peacedog and others talk about it I'm having a hard time feeling enthused.

Peacedog · Post by **Peacedog** » Thu Nov 18, 2004 3:05 pm

I play with the Amazon Basin and I was looking forward to being in at the start of something big and special but after listening to Peacedog and others talk about it I'm having a hard time feeling enthused.

My pvp experiences all consisted of me being ganked by people whose levels I couldn't see (to the uninitiated: that means they were at least 15 levels higher than me). A number of times. It got tiresome pretty quickly, but luckily I wasn't on the business end of very much serious griefing (as in, getting killed, running back to find your corpse camped, rinse repeat. Or having the Spirit Healer camped by the guys friend as well. It did happen, though). It was about as fun as jock itch (the pvp aspect, I mean, though the rest of the game didn't exactly make me forget reality).

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Thu Nov 18, 2004 5:39 pm

It seems to me that this would be hard for Blizzard to pull off. On the one hand they are known for Diablo which is rat/lever/cheese-reward system and on the other they are known for the -craft games putting you in varied circumstance and letting skill prevail in a very well balanced situation. These styles of games are very much at odds with each other. As a roll playing game it appeals to the Diablo fans, but as a -craft game, the name says strategy-skill above crafting a character.

I until the release of DII I would have had unshaking faith in Blizzard. After DII and WCIII they are a wait and see company. That's still way ahead of most companies. So kudos to them. It's just a bummer that they aren't the beacon they used to be.

I still have hopes for the TriForge game. (for that matter I have hopes for WoW, I'm just waiting and seeing)

Koz · Post by **Koz** » Thu Nov 18, 2004 6:17 pm

I have to disagree with you Mortis. Diablo 2 is probably their best game yet, IMO. Warcraft III would have been better except it just felt like #2 with spiffier graphics.

WoW is definitely an amalgamation of the two, and I think they're trying to stick to the "as simple as possible" formula. I do think one thing they overlooked was how difficult it is to include a balanced PvE and fully-functional PvP environment in the same game. As someone who's made MUDs in the past, I know first-hand how hard it is to create balance between killing mobs (or NPCs) and killing players.

That being said, I still think WoW is a very fine game. The lack of real PvP doesn't lessen the current game at all, it's just a major feature that isn't in yet (and it should be by now, even though I could care less about it).

Doctor Hillbilly · Post by **Doctor Hillbilly** » Fri Nov 19, 2004 11:51 am

WOW will clearly fall short of the ambitious goals Blizzard set out at the beginning. They are still lacking the battlegrounds & honor system. There are still some classes that need serious love (druids, I'm looking at you.) Back when I was playing AC2 I remember reading all the "we'll never nerf post-launch the way other games did" quotes that they were tossing around with great envy.

Having said all that, WOW's still a pretty great game. They'll be making money hand over fist, which will allow for them to grow and expand what's already, IMO, a mighty fun MMO. Plus, from what I've seen in Beta, Blizzard is wiling to listen to the users when appropriate. They're far from perfect, of course, but the potential for real greatness is there.

This contrasts with my last MMO love, AC2, which, while filled with wonderous potential, will remain forever sidelined by a lack of developer resources. Turbine's making the correct business decision with regards to AC2 for sure, but to the detriment of what might have been, given sufficient resources and time.