Helherron 2.04(Windows and Linux) to be released Sunday.

Sepiche · Post by **Sepiche** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 4:10 pm

ColdSteel wrote:The file size is about 8MB. I'll be glad to send it to you for hosting, Sepiche, it that's not too big.

Yeah, 8MB should be no problem. You've got PM.

I'll let everyone know if/when I'm able to post it.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 4:23 pm

Sepiche wrote:
ColdSteel wrote:The file size is about 8MB. I'll be glad to send it to you for hosting, Sepiche, it that's not too big.
Yeah, 8MB should be no problem. You've got PM.

I'll let everyone know if/when I'm able to post it.

It looks like maybe an issue with gmail. For both the gmail accounts I emailed it to I got this message:

This is an automatically generated Delivery Status Notification.

Delivery to the following recipients was aborted after 19 second(s):

* peacedogxxxxxxxx

Reporting-MTA: dns; QMTA11.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.59.211]
Received-From-MTA: dns; omta16.westchester.pa.mail.comcast.net [76.96.62.88]
Arrival-Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2011 16:29:30 +0000

Final-recipient: rfc822; peacedogxxxxxx Action: failed
Status: 5.1.1
Diagnostic-Code: smtp; 552 5.7.0 review our attachment guidelines. r7si98432qcq.149
Last-attempt-Date: Thu, 10 Mar 2011 16:29:49 +0000

I did some checking of the internets and it appears that gmail considers zip files illegal attachments. I am going to try renaming the file extension to ".zap" and resending to all three of you. If/when you get it. just rename the file extension back to .zip.

Peacedog · Post by **Peacedog** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 4:29 pm

I would think the .exe might be a problem too. But who knows.

But hey, I got it. We'll see if it works when I get home.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 4:33 pm

Well, I didn't get the delivery error message this time so maybe it worked. You guys check your gmail and see if anything is there.

EDIT: Okay, I see that Peacedog got his so hopefully everyone is good to go now.

Sepiche · Post by **Sepiche** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 4:43 pm

Yup, got the file intact and looks like it's good to go now.

Helherron 2.03

Just let me know if that link doesn't work for some reason.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 6:54 pm

Okay, based on Peacedogs tips, I've decided to roll the following party for v2.03:

Troll Barbarian
Golem Fighter
Elf Priest
Elf Priest
Fairy Mage
Elf Mage
Lizard Monk
Elf Bard (will also use a bow and be my merchant as well)

I am planning to roll 25 for max starting int/wis and max casting skill 105-109 for the mages and priests based on Peacedog's advice
What are the crtical skill numbers I'll need to roll for the fighters and bard and monk, though? I obviously once knew this information from the guide but that is now gone and I haven't a clue anymore.
Anyone remember?

Peacedog · Post by **Peacedog** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 7:48 pm

Ok, 24 might actually be max starting int/wis. I mihave have been wrong there.

Golem max Str/Con is 28/28. Troll is 26/26. Attributes are 3-18 at base or thereabouts.

Hell, I will check the guide and post back here (I have it; we'll be putting it up at popehat over the weekend).

Latluy, I am trying to play 2.03. The title screen looks fine,. As soon as I get into party creation, however, I get insane graphics corruption (win 7 x64). Tried running in compatability as win xp sp3 and also with 256 colors mode. Nothing helped.

Dex is good on everyone, and so is learning (though it's not *great*). Lizard man monk can max martial arts at 75 (12 more than anyone else). Halfling is a really good bard class it looks like.

Golems will max weapon skills ~130, and the troll will be right there as well.

Madmarcus · Post by **Madmarcus** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 8:15 pm

I haven't been able to try it yet but the .zap file came through just fine.

Shinjin · Post by **Shinjin** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 8:54 pm

Peacedog wrote:Latluy, I am trying to play 2.03. The title screen looks fine,. As soon as I get into party creation, however, I get insane graphics corruption (win 7 x64). Tried running in compatability as win xp sp3 and also with 256 colors mode. Nothing helped.

Yellow and illegible? I poked around in Helh.cfg and found that setting GraphicsMode = 1 lets me run it in a window and that seemed to solve that graphics glitch. Haven't made it through party creation yet, so I don't know if that's the only thing.

Hopefully that window won't prove to be too small...

Also, thanks for hosting this, Sepiche

Skeptic · Post by **Skeptic** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 11:21 am

2.03 is hosted here:

http://www.hotud.org/component/content/ ... -Helherron" target="_blank

Scroll down on that page to find my post(a bit below my review) with name & registration code if you need such.

Skeptic · Post by **Skeptic** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 11:54 am

ColdSteel wrote:Okay, based on Peacedogs tips, I've decided to roll the following party for v2.03:

Troll Barbarian
Golem Fighter
Elf Priest
Elf Priest
Fairy Mage
Elf Mage
Lizard Monk
Elf Bard (will also use a bow and be my merchant as well)

I am planning to roll 25 for max starting int/wis and max casting skill 105-109 for the mages and priests based on Peacedog's advice
What are the crtical skill numbers I'll need to roll for the fighters and bard and monk, though? I obviously once knew this information from the guide but that is now gone and I haven't a clue anymore.
Anyone remember?

First of all ...I think you meant Golem Barbarian(they cannot be fighters).

Other than that your party looks like it will be easy enough to use for a beginner party. I myself never take more than two casters,in 2.04. A shaman and a a priest. In 2.03 I probably still would only take a mage and a priest(I can get away with that though because I have played this game a thousand times it seems) but having 2 priests(and one mage) is not a bad idea. The reason I personally only use two casters is because I like having both a bard and an archer(usually a thief and usually halfling). I figure that by late game(when bard's songs become less useful) my bard will have magic skill to make him a decent secondary caster and, if you are not taking a merchant(which I never do), the bard is the best merchant you will get.

For casters I can see no reason to take anything other than fairies(with the sole exception being the Orc shaman in 2.04). Elves just don't cut the mustard. yeah they can survive a hit or two from monsters who get into your back row but your casters should not ever be fighting anyway and fairies make elves look pretty weak when it comes to MPs, Intelligence, Wisdom, Willpower, etc.

Using a bard as your archer is a bad move. Bards should ALWAYS be playing music(at least until the late game when they MAY be better off casting magic spells, using wands/scrolls etc.). You will be losing much experience(bards get exp. when trying to play music. They probably get none for missing with arrows) and a bard's bow skills will never be worth much anyway. Also, since it seems you are taking 4 casters(2 priest/2 mage) then this means that your bard will be one of your front line warriors?! That will cause you problems to no end. Ideally you should have something akin to:

Troll Fighter
(*Other*) Fighter(I usually go with a dwarf axe man)
Either a Lizardman Monk or another fighter/barbarian(in my current game I took a second golem here)
Golem Barbarian

Those are your front line guys. For your second row:

Elf Bard(elves have highest Charisma and great Dex)
Fairy Priest
Fairy Mage(though in 2.04 I take an orc shaman here)
Either another priest OR a thief to use as an archer.

*In 2.04 the "Stealth" skill determines a monk's chance for ignoring zones of control. In 2.03 monks do this automatically. Lizardmen are the best monks because of greater all-around stats and skill maxes as well as much higher resistances.

*Spread out your weapon skills. If you have two barbarians then have one concentrate on one two-handed weapon skill(say 2-hand axe) and the other concentrate on another(say 2-handed sword). Taking the "Maces/hammers" skill is also a good move since, for some reason it applies to both single handed versions as well as two handed versions.
Along the same lines have one fighter concentrating on swords(since they seem most common types of weapons found) and any others on something else(axes for dwarves since they get the +25% bonus).

*Monks only benefit from martial arts when unarmed so do not give them weapons or bother raising weapon skills(unless playing the solo game after beating the regular game).

JC Anejo · Post by **JC Anejo** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:12 pm

tried to roll a party in 2.03 and all the stats are coming up in the 1300's. never had that before. Anybody seen it or have any ideas

Skeptic · Post by **Skeptic** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 12:26 pm

JC Anejo wrote:tried to roll a party in 2.03 and all the stats are coming up in the 1300's. never had that before. Anybody seen it or have any ideas

Weird. I am assuming you are using either Vista or Windows 7? Those are the only OSes I have heard of weird problems like this.

Edit: did you try compatibility mode(if using Windows 7)?

JC Anejo · Post by **JC Anejo** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:43 pm

Skeptic wrote:
JC Anejo wrote:tried to roll a party in 2.03 and all the stats are coming up in the 1300's. never had that before. Anybody seen it or have any ideas
Weird. I am assuming you are using either Vista or Windows 7? Those are the only OSes I have heard of weird problems like this.

Edit: did you try compatibility mode(if using Windows 7)?

It is in Vista and I had tried XP mode as that was what I last ran it in but that didn't work. When you said the same thing I was thinking tried 98mode and that fixed it.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 6:42 pm

Peacedog, did you try running 2.03 in Win98/95 compatibility mode to see if that fixed your graphics problem? I might try 2.04 in that mode to see what happens with the horde crash and lockups. I ran it normally the other day at it locked up at the title screen. I tried again in Win95 mode and no lockups in the short time I messed around with it.

The other thing I was wondering about is the horde crash which is supposed to be due to running out of memory. Modern PCs have 2gb or more of memory which was rare when 2.04 came out. I have 3gb available on mine. Of course any 32 bit application is limited to 2gb max but you would not expect to see the horde crash very often on a PC with that much memory unless something else is going on there. That an awful lot of memory for a game like that to use. I might do some messing around with it just to see what the parameters are.

A shame the author abandoned the game without releasing the source code into public domain. It should be pretty easy to fix something like that if it's just a garbage collection issue.

After seeing the comments and tips from Skeptic (thanks), I think I might try rerolling my party again to go with one less caster for my first time through. Plus I think I gimped the stats on my first mage because I wasn't sure what all his core stats were. And it took an hour to roll them up too, damn it. I have no idea what the core skill stats are for bards and monks. I figured music and martial arts but what else? I went with higher stealth for the monk and I can't remember what for the bard. Hopefully that guide will be up over at Popehat soon.

Skeptic · Post by **Skeptic** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 9:34 pm

ColdSteel wrote:Peacedog, did you try running 2.03 in Win98/95 compatibility mode to see if that fixed your graphics problem? I might try 2.04 in that mode to see what happens with the horde crash and lockups. I ran it normally the other day at it locked up at the title screen. I tried again in Win95 mode and no lockups in the short time I messed around with it.

The other thing I was wondering about is the horde crash which is supposed to be due to running out of memory. Modern PCs have 2gb or more of memory which was rare when 2.04 came out. I have 3gb available on mine. Of course any 32 bit application is limited to 2gb max but you would not expect to see the horde crash very often on a PC with that much memory unless something else is going on there. That an awful lot of memory for a game like that to use. I might do some messing around with it just to see what the parameters are.

A shame the author abandoned the game without releasing the source code into public domain. It should be pretty easy to fix something like that if it's just a garbage collection issue.

After seeing the comments and tips from Skeptic (thanks), I think I might try rerolling my party again to go with one less caster for my first time through. Plus I think I gimped the stats on my first mage because I wasn't sure what all his core stats were. And it took an hour to roll them up too, damn it. I have no idea what the core skill stats are for bards and monks. I figured music and martial arts but what else? I went with higher stealth for the monk and I can't remember what for the bard. Hopefully that guide will be up over at Popehat soon.

Josh's guide is awesome but a lot of it does not apply to 2.04(which added the "stealth" skill for monks, the "shaman" class and various tweaks to the whole game). But a lot of it DOES apply to 2.04 and all of it is good for 2.03 pretty much.

One other advantage of 2.03 is that you can access Tiku's island using the "Gate" spell-scroll if you wander to a certain spot on the world map. In 2.04, presumably due to changes in the LOS code, Tiku's cannot be accessed because the island never shows up from any vantage point you wander to on the map.
Tiku's has some of the best loot and a good amount of EXP. in the game.

As for the 'horde crash' bug, I do not know enough about coding to say whether it was a memory issue or not but it seems to only occur when teh following conditions are present:

A)A HUGE number of enemies(see various encounters with hordes of spiders & grid bugs, skeletons and at least one encounter with orcs(the leader IIRC) in the orc caves).

B) ANY creature physically attacking any other creature. This could be due to an enemy slipping on ice and crashing into one of his own allies, an enemy attacking one of your PCs, etc. That is why the way around this bug is to kill all enemies BEFORE any attacks occur, using scrolls, spells, and wands.

Core skills:

Assuming you are not taking a Merchant, your bard should concentrate on Music first, then trading/merchant skill(whatever it's called...I always forget). If your bard is also to be your lockpicker(assuming you don't just 'K'ick open all chests and doors) then that should be the third or fourth skill you focus on(with 'Magic' being the other). After 'Music' and "trading', everything is pretty relative to your own preferences/tastes I think.

For monks, martial arts first, stealth skill second and dodging third. My reasoning being that Stealth skill determines how well you can ignore zones of control(in 2.04 that is. In 2.03 monks automatically ignore these) and Dodge skill because they get +6 per skill up when raising this and it gives them great defensive bonuses which they need since they cannot wear the heavy armor that golems and trolls wear(well...they CAN but this would be wasteful IMO).
After those you can dump points into prayer to make your monk (eventually) a capable back-up healer.
I would not bother with weapon skills even though monks CAN use them because you do not get your MA benefits when using weapons(Monks do great damage bare-handed later in the game and the less weight they are carrying, the better for dodging and such).

For Mages, Magic first then scribing and/or alchemy as per your taste/strategy. I would also make sure that your mage has SOME skill with knives so you can buy Eternium enchanted daggers from the artificer in Galatako and still get whatever 'Defensive' bonuses you can by setting your 'T'actics to "Defensive", though I suppose you could make due with 'Staff' skill(but then you can use no shield, should you find a good one).

For Priests, Prayer skill and then scribing. If you are not using a bard as your merchant then they can also put points into trading skill and do well enough.

As far as attributes go(In order of importance for the classes):

Barbarians - Strength, Constitution, Dexterity, Learning, Willpower(unless Golem since they are immune to most mental attacks)
Fighters - Strength, Constitution, Dexterity, Learning, Willpower
Rangers - Strength/Dexterity/Constitution(all seem equally important to me), then Wisdom/Learning, willpower
Monks - Dexterity, Strength, Constitution, Learning, Wisdom, Willpower
Thieves -Dexterity, Constitution, Strength, Learning, Willpower
Bards - Dexterity, Charisma, Constitution, Learning, intelligence, Willpower and Strength
Merchants - Charisma, Dexterity, Learning, Constitution/Strength
Mages - Intelligence, Willpower, Dexterity, Learning, Constitution
Priests - Wisdom, Willpower, Dexterity, learning, Constitution(or Charisma if your priest is your merchant)
Shamans - Wisdom, intelligence, Willpower, Dexterity, learning, Constitution

These are just my thoughts but my reasoning boils down to:

A)While Strength is important to anyone(since it determines how much loot you can lug around), this is mostly important to big armor/big weapon guys as it also determines amount of damage done in melee as well as how much you can carry. Goelms can carry far more than even their high strength scores would indicate. I usually have at least one golem to carry ALL party food and basically act as the mule.

B)Learning is of relatively equal import to all characters since it determines how many skill points you get upon leveling up. I think Golems, who are worst at this, max out at around 12 and I always shoot for around 10-12 when rolling golems because it sucks having only 2 skill ups upon leveling. Trolls are slightly better at learning and I correspondingly aim a little higher when rolling them.

C)Intelligence is the prime stat for mages(primary determinant of Mana Points) and Wisdom for Priests(determines their mana). Willpower adds to these mana point totals and also determines resistance to mind control type attacks/spells. Willpower is not as important for non-casters because enemies which will charm your PCs are fairly rare and you can get by them by strategic placement and use of your golem(s) and/or a Lizardman monk(they have pretty good stats/resists and, especially with the use of an invis potion, they can make their way to the backside of the creature doing the charming).

D)Dexterity determines starting weapon skills and dodging/Defense bonus and, IIRC, helps with certain spells so it is fairly important to all but especially Monks and warriors and thieves/archers. Might also influence your 'Movement' points but I don't remember.

BTW, trolls start with '4' Move just like everyone else except for Golems who start with '2' Movement. Whether Constitution and/or Dexterity influence this score at all I do not remember.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 12:14 am

Thanks Skeptic. I rolled another 2.03 party up before I saw your post, so back to the drawing board, lol. I sure wish you could reroll just 1 character rather than having to redo all 8 of them when you need to change something. It's painful.

Shinjin · Post by **Shinjin** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 1:54 am

For bards, how exactly do you use instruments and how do you find out what they do? Mine seems to have started with a flute, but playing it (inventory, use) doesn't do anything obvious during combat.

Skeptic · Post by **Skeptic** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 2:05 am

Shinjin wrote:For bards, how exactly do you use instruments and how do you find out what they do? Mine seems to have started with a flute, but playing it (inventory, use) doesn't do anything obvious during combat.

You highlight the instrument in your inventory and hit the 'U' key. Early on, most of the time you will just get a message like "<charname> plays a little tune"(or something like that) which means the song had no benefit. Keep playing the music anyway, every turn because you get a lot of experience for doing so(My bards ALWAYS outpace my other PCs in terms of leveling) and once your skill gets higher the frequency by which you will achieve magical effects via your songs increases but even in the early game you will get the occasional 'mega damage to all enemies' or 'heal entire party' type effects.

Shinjin · Post by **Shinjin** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 3:11 am

Does the type of instrument matter?

Skeptic · Post by **Skeptic** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 3:19 am

Shinjin wrote:Does the type of instrument matter?

Not other than some magic instruments(of any type) will grant +5 to +50 or something like that.

Effidian · Post by **Effidian** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 1:05 pm

Mr. Fed wrote:I'll host it at Popehat if you let me. Ken at popehat dot com.

Just want to confirm if you got the zip file?

Effidian · Post by **Effidian** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 7:40 pm

I just noticed that my guide was for 2.02. So he added the new skills (two weapon fighting, stealth, shaman) in 2.03?

Peacedog · Post by **Peacedog** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 9:30 pm

Effidian wrote:
Mr. Fed wrote:I'll host it at Popehat if you let me. Ken at popehat dot com.
Just want to confirm if you got the zip file?

Yes, but I was out of pocket for awhile. I'll try to get it hosted tomorrow.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 10:06 pm

Effidian wrote:I just noticed that my guide was for 2.02. So he added the new skills (two weapon fighting, stealth, shaman) in 2.03?

Well, I'm playing 2.03 at the moment. It has the two weapon fighting and stealth skills but no shaman. Shaman was added in 2.04.

Shinjin · Post by **Shinjin** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 1:10 am

Wow, the difficulty of this game is just brutal. I'm getting my clock cleaned in just the first cave. In addition, I've turned up quite a few magic items, but only a single identify scroll...

Skeptic · Post by **Skeptic** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 2:56 am

Shinjin wrote:Wow, the difficulty of this game is just brutal. I'm getting my clock cleaned in just the first cave. In addition, I've turned up quite a few magic items, but only a single identify scroll...

There is a guy in the first town you start in that identifies items for pretty cheap. I am not sure I EVER got an identify item scroll or ever saw a spellbook with that one in it. Luckily in most of the towns there are identify people. In the starting town the guy wanders around and wears a gray hooded robe. In Burgliry(or whatever that second town is called) there is a girl who usually hangs out on the tavern, she looks native American and wears tan robes(she also sells scrolls).
In Galitako(or whatever the main city is called) the identify guy is at the temple(right down main street from entrance and on the right...just past the first inn).

Shinjin · Post by **Shinjin** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 9:43 am

Thanks. I started out with the intent of talking to everyone, but after about the third generic 'go talk to the mayor' response, I figured the town was just filled with useless NPCs.

Mr. Fed · Post by **Mr. Fed** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 10:55 am

Effidian wrote:
Mr. Fed wrote:I'll host it at Popehat if you let me. Ken at popehat dot com.
Just want to confirm if you got the zip file?

I handed it over to Peacedog to handle.

Mr. Fed · Post by **Mr. Fed** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 10:57 am

I've done the goblins, the Dwarf Temple, the kobolds, and most of the bandit farm. Bard and troll (who ran the arenas) are 4, the rest are 3. Finally found a quickness item. Game seems to be going quicker this time.

Skeptic · Post by **Skeptic** » Mon Mar 14, 2011 12:20 pm

Mr. Fed wrote:I've done the goblins, the Dwarf Temple, the kobolds, and most of the bandit farm. Bard and troll (who ran the arenas) are 4, the rest are 3. Finally found a quickness item. Game seems to be going quicker this time.

I have done(in my new game) the goblins, kobolds, Ba-Dong, bandit farm, the cultists(yellow dagger) and am now working the orcs. My Troll-fighter(who does the arenas) is level 5(close to 6), everyone else is level 4. I got a quickness ring early on...at the kobolds I think(?).

EDIT: Finished with orcs(VERY quickly, which was weird. See below also), the undead guys in the halfling town, killed the mayor of the halfling town(Cador or something like that?), arena champion in Galatako, and bee hive. Will be headed to that undead castle north of Gitala next or maybe the slugmen caves.

Something weird is...I have not run into the 'Horde crash bug' at all yet. The usual encounters that spawn the bug(in the bee hive, the orc caves and in Ba-Dong's temple for example have not caused the crash, even when I allow the monsters to swarm me and attack all over.

Skeptic · Post by **Skeptic** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 11:46 am

Just finished the undead castle("Nigedagh or something like that?) and half of the Galatako sewers. Still no horde crash bug encountered. This is extremely weird! I am still using Win XP and now I am actually trying to cause the4 crash just to make sure it still happens but so far no luck. It is like the 'Bug-fix fairies' came by since the last time I played and fixed this one.

Peacedog · Post by **Peacedog** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 12:09 pm

You can download the guide here. Proper hosting may come later.

The Guide, with more web viewability.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 5:50 pm

Peacedog wrote:You can download the guide here. Proper hosting may come later.

The Guide, with more web viewability.

Fantastic!! Thanks to all involved in putting this together and making it available.

I'm up to level 3 on most of my characters and I'm loving this game since 2.03 is so stable.

Peacedog, you can get 2.03 working in Win7 without the grapchical corruption issues you're seeing if you turn off Aero. That's the main culprit. I had the same problem in Vista. Running it in a window will auto disable Aero as well. I also had to set it to Win95 compatibility (not 98/ME/2000) and check the disable visual themes and comosition boxes on the shortcut. Ran fine then. Give it a try.

Peacedog · Post by **Peacedog** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 7:18 pm

I got it (2.03) working but running it in a window, but I don't want to run in a window. Or have ot disable Aero. So I'm not sure what I'm going to do yet.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 7:30 pm

Peacedog wrote:I got it (2.03) working but running it in a window, but I don't want to run in a window. Or have ot disable Aero. So I'm not sure what I'm going to do yet.

Peacedog, to disable Aero, all you have to do is set the Windows theme to "Windows Basic". Then to set it back to Aero, rechoose the default Win7 theme. I'm sure there must be an app out there or a batch file you can set up to do that automatically for you whenever you run Helherron. I'll look around the Internets some and see what's what.

EDIT 1: Success. This works in Vista and in Win7 identically. You should be able to create a batch file that sandwiches the helherron shortcut between these two ccommands. Or you can just create two shortcuts to disable and enable and run them before and after the game.

Shortcuts to enable and disable Aero

You can use the following command-line to disable Aero:
net stop uxsms

To switch Aero On, use this command:
net start uxsms

Note: The above commands need to be run from an elevated Command Prompt. This stops the Desktop Window Manager Session Manager service, which in-turn disables Aero and switches automatically to the Windows Vista Basic scheme. If need to create desktop shortcuts to the above commands, make sure that you right-click on the shortcut and choose Run as Administrator in order to run it.

EDIT 2: Here's how to actually create the batch files:

Short and simple, may help others disable/enable Aero on Win7/Vista easier, through the use of batch files.

Create a new file in notepad and input just the following (without quotes)
"sc start uxsms"
Save the file as something like Start.bat, all that matters is the .bat at the end.

Create another new file in notpad and input just the following (without quotes)
"sc stop uxsms"
Save the file as something like Stop.bat, again all that matters is the .bat at the end.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 8:05 pm

^^ And actually, i think you may be able to skip all of the above and just check this box on your shortcut to helh.exe

Skeptic · Post by **Skeptic** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 9:04 pm

Almost done with the Galatako sewers, then it's off to the slugmen cave(which i probably should have done earlier but I forgot). Still no horde crash bug. It seems that maybe some update to Win XP somehow fixed this or something. My 2.04 is just as stable as 2.03 now.

Peacedog · Post by **Peacedog** » Tue Mar 15, 2011 10:14 pm

ColdSteel wrote: Peacedog, to disable Aero, all you have to do is set the Windows theme to "Windows Basic". Then to set it back to Aero, rechoose the default Win7 theme. I'm sure there must be an app out there or a batch file you can set up to do that automatically for you whenever you run Helherron. I'll look around the Internets some and see what's what.

I know how to do it; I simply don't want to.

Also, I think you have a bad screen shot.

Weird, it finally loaded I guess (it didn't after like 5 refreshes, heh).

Hmmmm, clicking that option makes the viewable area in game look right but the UI is still screwey. Odd.

ColdSteel · Post by **ColdSteel** » Wed Mar 16, 2011 7:58 am

Peacedog, try also checking the 'disable visual themes' box. Works for me.