Gothic II

Two Sheds · Post by **Two Sheds** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 6:34 pm

I picked up Gothic II for $10 the other day, since I seem to remember it being pretty highly regarded around these parts. I've only played a little bit, but so far I'm . . . underwhelmed. Part of that is graphical. It's a little hard to go back to Gothic 2 levels fresh off of Half Life 2 and Bloodlines. What little voice acting I've heard is terrible. Controls and movement feel stiff and awkward, and combat hasn't been great so far. So, have I just wasted $10, or is there a really good game there if I just stick with it?

Head · Post by **Head** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 6:53 pm

Gothic II is not going to WOW you with it's voice acting or graphics. But it gets 5 stars from me for game play. I would say move on to something else if it has not grabbed you after 20+ hours of play. Gothic 1 and 2 are my all time favorite RPGs for the PC.

~Head

yossar · Post by **yossar** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 7:21 pm

I was pretty underwhelmed too. I think I quit somewhere shortly after joining the militia and didn't see anything that I could even imagine was responsible for all the raves this game got. Nothing to really complain about either, though. It was the very definition of mediocre for me.

Dirt · Post by **Dirt** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 7:50 pm

I couldn't get past the beginning of the first one.

DiscoJason · Post by **DiscoJason** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 7:52 pm

I enjoyed the heck out of it, myself. I went the mage route and really enjoyed how alive the world felt with the time schedules the NPVs had and such. To me, the game isn't about graphics, but is more about feeling part of the world I am playing in.

rrmorton · Post by **rrmorton** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 7:56 pm

I loved it. How much time have you put in, Two Sheds? Have you made it into Khorinis?

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 8:22 pm

Gothic I and II are one of the greatest series of RPG's ever created.

If you're just starting off, it can be daunting. It's not an action game like the fighting interface would have you think. You need to level up some, THEN head out. In a way it's like a defined MMORPG. At first there are areas that are blocked to you due to high level content, eventually you'll get there. That's part of the fun.

Plus, the NPC's really do seem alive at times.

I say give it a bit longer (at LEAST until you get your first set of decent armor...or some worthy spells if going the mage route). You may be surprised how it sneaks up on you.

Faldarian · Post by **Faldarian** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 8:28 pm

They seem like cool games, but I just could not get past the interface and the horrific control system. I spent more time fighting the controls than enemies, and just finally gave up on it.

With a mod for the controls to make them a little more streamlined or configurable, I'd probably pick it up again.

Captain Caveman · Post by **Captain Caveman** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 8:33 pm

I first began playing Gothic II a few months ago when rrmorton decreed the first and (thus far) only "get to it" weekend. I had received the game in a gonegold trade awhile back, but never got around to giving it a chance. I'm glad I finally did.

No, the game doesn't have the best visuals you will ever see or the most responsive or intuitive controls. What it does have, however, is one of the most "alive" gaming environments I have ever experienced. NPCs are imaginative and interesting, the quests are varied, and the story-line is engrossing. Perhaps most rewarding of all is the world itself. It is big, but not dauntingly so, and it has tons of room for exploration and discovery. The first time I sauntered into a hidden cave only to get mauled by a horde of goblins and a shadowbeast, I knew I was going to enjoy the game. I had been in a PC game rut before Gothic II, but now in hindsight I can tell that it was responsible for awakening the geeky gamer within me.

Jolor · Post by **Jolor** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 9:30 pm

I am playing this game at present.
The docs suck so bad that it defies logic - especially for a sequel that claimed it listened to Gothic I player feedback.
Having said that, you have to dig for the improvements and modifications.
For example, I have restarted the game and have switched from the default, Gothic1 keyboard controls to defining my own gamepad controls.
GameFAQs is a must read for fighting/gameplay tips if you are (like myself) new to the Gothic realm. There are some game tweaks (.ini) that are invaluable.
A difficulty slider (rumoured/anticipated for Gothic 3) is an unbelievable oversight for G2.
A superb game, despite the above criticisms, that could have been so much more accessible.

Dhruin · Post by **Dhruin** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 9:32 pm

Two of the best games, ever. Simply the best living fantasy game world ever created.

Discovering that orcs are fearsome and evolved warriors to be respected and not mearly cannon-fodder is one of my favourite gaming moments.

Croaker24 · Post by **Croaker24** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 10:00 pm

I love these games so much that I purchased the German Gold Edition of Gothic II that included The Night of the Raven add-on. I do remember that with Gothic I, I had initial misgivings about the controls and being a bit underwhelmed, but with a little patience I eventually found the game addictive with a high immersion level.

DiscoJason · Post by **DiscoJason** » Mon Dec 13, 2004 10:12 pm

I forgot to mention that I am in the minority in that I had zero problems getting used to the interface. To me, it was fairly intuitive and I never really struggled with it.

Rhett · Post by **Rhett** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:16 am

Great game, still need to finish it... damnit another game that I need to finish.

yossar · Post by **yossar** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 2:02 am

...and really enjoyed how alive the world felt with the time schedules the NPVs [sic] had and such.

The first time I sauntered into a hidden cave only to get mauled by a horde of goblins and a shadowbeast, I knew I was going to enjoy the game.

Discovering that orcs are fearsome and evolved warriors to be respected and not mearly cannon-fodder is one of my favourite gaming moments.

It's interesting to me that the things people seem to be raving about don't do much for me (orcs being tough says more about how tired and cliche the whole fantasy genre is than how great Gothic is) , but at the same time the biggest complaint (the controls) didn't much bother me either. But I'm probably the only one who finds that at all interesting.

Two Sheds · Post by **Two Sheds** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 9:41 am

How much time have you put in, Two Sheds? Have you made it into Khorinis?

Nope, not yet. Those were very early impressions. I haven't given up on it yet, though. Hopefully I'll get a little more time in this week.

Hetz · Post by **Hetz** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 10:01 am

Faldarian wrote:They seem like cool games, but I just could not get past the interface and the horrific control system. I spent more time fighting the controls than enemies, and just finally gave up on it.

With a mod for the controls to make them a little more streamlined or configurable, I'd probably pick it up again.

Yep the controls are what killed both Gothic 1 and 2 for me. It's a shame, since there is a great game lurking under there...I just know it, but each of the times I have tried to play Gothic 2, I get about 5 hours in and I just can't play any more due to the controls.

They really, REALLY, need to rethink their control system for Gothic 3.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 12:25 pm

I am considering picking this up, but I already have Morrowind...anyone care to compare the two since both seem to be sprawling, kind of "do anything you want" type RPG's?

yossar · Post by **yossar** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 12:54 pm

Carpet_pissr wrote:I am considering picking this up, but I already have Morrowind...anyone care to compare the two since both seem to be sprawling, kind of "do anything you want" type RPG's?

Gothic's big, but not nearly as sprawling as Morrowind. Not even close.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:35 pm

DiscoJason wrote:I forgot to mention that I am in the minority in that I had zero problems getting used to the interface. To me, it was fairly intuitive and I never really struggled with it.

I'm in that minority as well. I thought it was a fine control system, very efficient, letting you control a complex game with only a few keys. The only real problem with it is that it goes against established standard - everyone is so used to games like that using FPS controls that they expect Gothic to feel that way, too, and it doesn't.

xenocide · Post by **xenocide** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 1:51 pm

I'm in that minority as well. I thought it was a fine control system, very efficient, letting you control a complex game with only a few keys. The only real problem with it is that it goes against established standard - everyone is so used to games like that using FPS controls that they expect Gothic to feel that way, too, and it doesn't.

My thoughts exactly. The controls are not bad so much as different. They did take me a bit of getting used to in Gothic I, but in not too much time at all, I grew to like the controls. I think they work very well.

Oh, and Gothic is one of the best RPG series ever.

Dramatist · Post by **Dramatist** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 3:12 pm

I pickud up Gothic II about a year after it came out and loved it. I actually finished it, which was a first for a RPG since Might & Magic VII.

The first part was hard, but once I made it to about lvl 12 it got easier and was an amazing experience.

qp · Post by qp » Tue Dec 14, 2004 5:00 pm

In Gothic I really enjoyed the world and the story. The controls did take some getting used to, but really weren't bad at all (I think I remapped action to E or something like that which helped quite a bit). I liked that you could inadvertently run across monsters far beyond your level and have to run (or die), but later you'd be able to come back and hopefully kick their buts. The NPCs where well done and entertaining, although some of the voice acting wasn't the greatest - but some of it was quite funny too (like i swear the protaganist pronounced Xardas' name as Xard-ass on purpose sometimes).

It's hard to pin down why I enjoyed both games so much, but I actually finished both of them, and I don't often finish RPG's.

Dhruin · Post by **Dhruin** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 5:10 pm

yossar wrote:
...and really enjoyed how alive the world felt with the time schedules the NPVs [sic] had and such.

The first time I sauntered into a hidden cave only to get mauled by a horde of goblins and a shadowbeast, I knew I was going to enjoy the game.

Discovering that orcs are fearsome and evolved warriors to be respected and not mearly cannon-fodder is one of my favourite gaming moments.
It's interesting to me that the things people seem to be raving about don't do much for me (orcs being tough says more about how tired and cliche the whole fantasy genre is than how great Gothic is) , but at the same time the biggest complaint (the controls) didn't much bother me either. But I'm probably the only one who finds that at all interesting.

Yes, it does go to how tired most of the fantasy genre is...but I don't see why Gothic doesn't deserve credit for doing some of these things better than others. Gothic isn't a good game because it has tough orcs - it's a good game because it creates a unique and compelling gameworld among other things - the orcs are just one little part of the world that I liked.

Faldarian · Post by **Faldarian** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 6:01 pm

Blackhawk wrote:
DiscoJason wrote:I forgot to mention that I am in the minority in that I had zero problems getting used to the interface. To me, it was fairly intuitive and I never really struggled with it.
I'm in that minority as well. I thought it was a fine control system, very efficient, letting you control a complex game with only a few keys. The only real problem with it is that it goes against established standard - everyone is so used to games like that using FPS controls that they expect Gothic to feel that way, too, and it doesn't.

Yep, I'd agree with that... I just couldn't get used to them. It was maddening partially because even though it IS so different, there's no apparent option to customize the controls to something you're comfortable with.

I'm one of those guys that reconfigures the controls for virtually every game I buy as soon as I boot it up, though.

Exrod · Post by **Exrod** » Tue Dec 14, 2004 8:53 pm

I got the same deal, Gothic II for ten bucks at GameStop. I couldn't pass it up having spent some time with the first one. Loaded it up on Nov. 8 figuring it would be a diversion while I waited for HL 2 to come out. It is now mid Dec and I am still playing Gothic II every day while HL 2 sits (although I am playing some CS: Source which absolutely rules).

I love how open the world is, I am totally sick of on a rail games like Call of Duty etc. I like some freeedom to do whatever I want. My dream game would be Gothic III using the Farcry engine. I set up a profile for my nostromo speedpad that I really like and have no problems with the controls.

Re: Morrowind - I really wanted to like Morrowind but the animations really left me uninterested. It always seemed like the guy was floating in space while the environment moved around. Kinda like Night Driver on the 2600.

Fun stuff:
Needed an orc weapon but was way too weak to defeat one - found an orc and managed to have him chase me to the city gates where the guards killed him. I hung back until - tadaa - an orc weapon laying on the ground.
Ventured into a cave filled with bandits who promptly kicked my ass. Ran outside and found a nasty skeleton warrior in a field who I pissed off, got him to chase me into the cave. I ran outside and hid in the bushes until the battle ended. The skeleton wandered back to his area leaving me a bunch of bodies to loot.
Visiting the Red Light tavern to "Have Fun"
I like how you can defeat someone with swords, loot them, and they will survive and then be pissed at you. Hit them with an Oblivion spell and they are your pal again.
I killed my first Shadowbeast last night. Used my crossbow.

Game On.

D.A.Lewis · Post by **D.A.Lewis** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 10:12 pm

Faldarian wrote:[
Yep, I'd agree with that... I just couldn't get used to them. It was maddening partially because even though it IS so different, there's no apparent option to customize the controls to something you're comfortable with.

I'm one of those guys that reconfigures the controls for virtually every game I buy as soon as I boot it up, though.

That was Gothic 1, Gothic 2 was configurable