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Eador: Master of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

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Lorini
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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Lorini » Fri Apr 19, 2013 1:36 pm

Exit Steam and re-enter. That will usually update the client to show new games properly. I'm playing the GoG version without ever having played the beta. Wow they changed the interface mostly for the worse.
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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ColdSteel » Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:07 pm

Lorini wrote:I'm playing the GoG version without ever having played the beta. Wow they changed the interface mostly for the worse.
I'm also playing the GoG version and didn't play the beta. I like the new interface fine. Especially the advanced building screen. The filters, search function and color coded stuff there is great. The rest of the interface isn't much different from the first one, imo. Just takes getting a little used to the changes. I think the radial menu for the hero is actually an improvement.

I've played about half of the first tutorial shard and everything has been rock solid for me. No bugs or glitches at all so far. Turns are quick. Combat has been no problem at all. It plays exactly like the Genesis version. And the start of the campaign at least is identical to Genesis. The updated graphics and sound are quite nice. The multi-save functionality is really, really nice to have. I'm only a little way in but so far I'm glad I bought it. These are just my quick impressions and I do have a pretty new PC and GPU so YMMV.
"This game is best played with a warm cup of Folger's coffee in your hands, so you can actually smell the oppression while you relive the greatest period of all time. The period when white people discovered the world, and decided they didn't like it." - EUIV Steam user review

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ColdSteel » Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:26 pm

Two more things: Make sure you look at "Options" when you first start the game. The combat animations default to "very slow". You'll need to change the slider there if you want combat to be snappier. Also, combat sounds are not missing so they obviously fixed that along with a lot of other stuff in the release version.
"This game is best played with a warm cup of Folger's coffee in your hands, so you can actually smell the oppression while you relive the greatest period of all time. The period when white people discovered the world, and decided they didn't like it." - EUIV Steam user review

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ColdSteel » Fri Apr 19, 2013 2:58 pm

Construction has build queues now. Awesome.
"This game is best played with a warm cup of Folger's coffee in your hands, so you can actually smell the oppression while you relive the greatest period of all time. The period when white people discovered the world, and decided they didn't like it." - EUIV Steam user review

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Butterknife » Fri Apr 19, 2013 6:09 pm

I downloaded my copy from GOG. I intend to give it some thorough time tonight. I'm going in with very little experience -- I put Eador: Genesis aside when I saw that this was going to come out, because I figured that the games would be similar and didn't want to burn out on it. I've been pretty excited for this one -- it shows a lot of promise. But if it doesn't work out, Fallen Enchantress: Legendary Heroes is actually good (fourth time is a charm, I guess).

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ColdSteel » Fri Apr 19, 2013 8:12 pm

I finished the tutorial. I haven't seen a single bug so far. Whatever shape it was in for the beta, it certainly appears rock solid now. Off to attack my first shard.
"This game is best played with a warm cup of Folger's coffee in your hands, so you can actually smell the oppression while you relive the greatest period of all time. The period when white people discovered the world, and decided they didn't like it." - EUIV Steam user review

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Butterknife » Fri Apr 19, 2013 10:33 pm

I too finished the tutorial and have started on my first shard. The tutorial map was exactly the same as it was in Genesis. The game is hard already -- glad I'm on beginner difficulty. I went with a scout on the tutorial, and I'm trying a mage on the first shard. So far so good.

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Freezer-TPF- » Sat Apr 20, 2013 9:38 am

Does the GOG version have an autoupdate feature for patches? I think GOG usually has you download and reinstall new versions, which would not be optimal for a game that may still have several patches in its future.
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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by IceBear » Sat Apr 20, 2013 10:14 am

The Witcher just had the patches as separate downloads that you manually had to install. Don't think you'll have to do a full reinstall

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Butterknife » Sat Apr 20, 2013 11:35 am

Well, I beat my first "real" shard. It was dicey for a bit -- I died 3 times in a row, I lost several lands to my enemy. Luckily for me I was able to expand backward and once I put some guards in my own lands my enemy stopped expanding into my territory. I was able to come back from defeat and conquer with little problems. My mage started by shooting the lightning bolts or whatever they are, and by the end I was summoning zombies like a madman.

I've got several questions about the astral plane, tactics, alignment, and so on -- guess I should read the manual. I can't remember the last time I read one.

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ColdSteel » Sat Apr 20, 2013 1:16 pm

Butterknife wrote:by the end I was summoning zombies like a madman
Well, just be aware that summoning dead things will turn your alignment blacker than black in a hurry. That's not a problem when playing stand-alone scenarios but it may have an effect on what you can do later on in the campaign. That's actually one of the questions I have. Is playing as an evil necromancer actually a viable way to win the campaign? Because I'd sure love to play it that way.
"This game is best played with a warm cup of Folger's coffee in your hands, so you can actually smell the oppression while you relive the greatest period of all time. The period when white people discovered the world, and decided they didn't like it." - EUIV Steam user review

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by LordMortis » Sat Apr 20, 2013 2:21 pm

ColdSteel wrote:
Butterknife wrote:by the end I was summoning zombies like a madman
Well, just be aware that summoning dead things will turn your alignment blacker than black in a hurry. That's not a problem when playing stand-alone scenarios but it may have an effect on what you can do later on in the campaign. That's actually one of the questions I have. Is playing as an evil necromancer actually a viable way to win the campaign? Because I'd sure love to play it that way.
I am wondering about the campaign as well. In the beta Zarr said something about 20 possible endings. At the same time as much as I enjoy this game going through the campaign 20 times is not bloody likely. I've been playing Genesis too much for months and I don't even think I'm halfway done with the first campaign at beginner level. (I just hit the ability to invade other masters shards)

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ColdSteel » Sat Apr 20, 2013 3:30 pm

LordMortis wrote: I've been playing Genesis too much for months and I don't even think I'm halfway done with the first campaign at beginner level.
The campaign in Broken Worlds is shorter than the campaign in Genesis. Snowbird said they realized it was too long in Genesis and needed to make it shorter. That's one of the reasons I waited for the new version to come out to play the campaign to the end. I should be able to actually finish the new one. The other reason is that they implemented different game rules for the different shards in Broken Worlds. So you can't play them all the same way using the same strategy. That's a nice addition.
"This game is best played with a warm cup of Folger's coffee in your hands, so you can actually smell the oppression while you relive the greatest period of all time. The period when white people discovered the world, and decided they didn't like it." - EUIV Steam user review

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by IceBear » Sat Apr 20, 2013 4:51 pm

Think I found my first bug. Took over a province, was offered a choice of fighting the bandits or installing them as guards. As I was weak, I took their offer to be guards. Noticed it made my province furious so I went back when I was stronger and attacked them. However, during the battle, I controlled both sides and after it was over it hung... Guess it was confused how I could have both won and lost

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Dave Allen » Sat Apr 20, 2013 6:16 pm

The manual is full of laughter and pants to piss in.
Jesus said, "Do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the One who can destroy both soul and body."[Matt 10:28] God can totally destroy us.

Jesus also said, "For my Father's will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”[John 6:40] Eternal life is conditional.

His disciple John wrote, "Whoever has the Son has eternal life; whoever does not have the Son of God does not have eternal life. [1 John 5:12] Eternal life is optional.

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ColdSteel » Sat Apr 20, 2013 6:40 pm

IceBear wrote:Think I found my first bug.
I found my first one too. After visiting the advanced construction screen one time, it wouldn't let me move my hero after that for some reason. I saved and reloaded and it worked fine then. That's the only thing I've seen so far. Fewer problems by far than FE has, that's for sure.

My first campaign shard is a small one. I just took out the first lord there but it says there's another one out there somewhere so I'll need to look around for him next. I wasn't planning on a second hero but I think I'll hire a warrior now. I just got a really nice halberd with first strike from an event I can give him so I figure why not. He'll make a nice one man army with that :D
"This game is best played with a warm cup of Folger's coffee in your hands, so you can actually smell the oppression while you relive the greatest period of all time. The period when white people discovered the world, and decided they didn't like it." - EUIV Steam user review

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by tgb » Sat Apr 20, 2013 7:39 pm

Well, I bit, even though I still had 11 more days of play in the beta. I just wanted the latest version, I guess.

Re the bug where you can't move your hero after leaving the building screen. I found that if you enter and then exit the stronghold (the big button on the left) that clears it up.
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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Qantaga » Sat Apr 20, 2013 11:09 pm

tgb, what's your experience with the release version's progression from turn to turn?

As you noted earlier, the second beta was painfully slow from "End Turn" to the start of the next turn being active. That's the main thing that has kept me playing Genesis and away from buying MotBW. If the turn resolution has been sped up, I'll probably take the plunge.
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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Butterknife » Sat Apr 20, 2013 11:19 pm

I've been playing since last night, about 13 or 14 hours total. I have completed 3 shards (tutorial, a tiny shard, and a small shard). I think I'm ready to give some impressions.

First, the game looks great. It has a lot in it. There are a lot of cool events, and the battles are fun, tactical, and the AI is really good. Auto-resolve is bad, so don't use it. Not being able to use it without extra losses makes games take too long in my opinion. If you want to do really well, you have to fight every combat.

The game is pretty buggy. I saw the bug mentioned above (and you can work around it as stated). There are some annoyances -- for example, when you try to read what a building does it can be hard to get the popup to stay or appear where you want (advanced mode -- I like it much better than the other mode). I had a couple major bugs, too: Once after defeating a very difficult combat with minimal losses the game froze, I reloaded and didn't want to do the 20 minute combat again so I autoresolved with poor results. I had a bad bug where my main hero was automatically killed after hitting the end turn button (but he hadn't fought anything). I had a really bad bug where after defeating the last shard I couldn't click on the button to win because the popup was over the top of the button and couldn't be dismissed (this happens every time I beat a shard).

I'm also doubting how much replayability the game has. It feels very similar to defeat each shard - you use the same techniques each time. I'm guessing I'll get 20-30 hours out of this game before I set it aside. Still, that is well worth the money. Overall I'd say the game is a pretty solid B.

Oh yeah, I think I figured out how the karma/alignment system works:
Spoiler:
I'm pretty sure you get more good random events if you are good, and more bad random events if you are evil. My first match as evil I got a lot of bad events, my second match had several good things happen to me. You won't get all good or all evil either way, but the difference between the games was marked

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ioticus » Sat Apr 20, 2013 11:31 pm

Sounds like I made the right decision to wait on this one. I loved and hated Genesis at the same time. I really liked some of the ideas but the punishing difficulty and event spam (another "poison slug" event, *groan*) and the monotonous searching (oh look, I just increased my area by 3% for the 20th time, oh joy!), and lack of English docs explaining what the hell is going on under the hood just killed it for me. I was hoping Broken World would address some of these things but it sounds like it's just a prettier, buggier version of itself with a worse UI. Oh well.

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Freyland » Sun Apr 21, 2013 12:43 am

I wonder what's wrong with me. I used to love TB games, and by everyone's reports I should really love Genesis and now MotBW. But I'm not. Combat just seems so... tedious. And I am really not thrilled about the "your hero just explored 6%" issue mentioned above. I'm not far in, having just taken my first province outside of Whitehold, explored a bit, and taken a site, but I'm not feeling good about this. It's late, and I'm starting to doze at my desk. :(

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by tgb » Sun Apr 21, 2013 6:07 am

Qantaga wrote:tgb, what's your experience with the release version's progression from turn to turn?

As you noted earlier, the second beta was painfully slow from "End Turn" to the start of the next turn being active. That's the main thing that has kept me playing Genesis and away from buying MotBW. If the turn resolution has been sped up, I'll probably take the plunge.
Turn resolution times are definitely improved from the second beta, but I don't know how much of that is work by the developer vs. the fact that I had to get a new computer between betas and now have more RAM (6 Gb vs. 4), so ymmv.
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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Qantaga » Sun Apr 21, 2013 9:06 am

tgb wrote: Turn resolution times are definitely improved from the second beta, but I don't know how much of that is work by the developer vs. the fact that I had to get a new computer between betas and now have more RAM (6 Gb vs. 4), so ymmv.

Some help you turn out to be. ;-)

I'll still be slogging away on my same 4GB rig.

I want to support them and I believe they will continue to improve the game. So, I will probably take the plunge and keep my fingers crossed that the turn resolution has been addressed in the game engine and not just by your extra RAM. :-)

Thanks for your reply.
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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ColdSteel » Sun Apr 21, 2013 9:56 am

Butterknife wrote:I'm also doubting how much replayability the game has. It feels very similar to defeat each shard - you use the same techniques each time.
One thing I think it's important to realize is that at the point you are in the campaign you have seen very, very little of the game. What you can do is severely restricted for a very long time in the campaign as you have to unlock stuff bit by bit (by bit). It will take you forever before you see everything the game has to offer via the campaign. Early on it is indeed the same stuff over and over because of that.

What you should do is put down the campaign for a little while and play a randomly generated scenario on a large shard. In my opinion this is where the game really shines. I had 10 (maybe 20) times the fun playing the game this way instead of the campaign. All options, strategies, units and buildings are open to you this way and you can form a real opinion of the game. The longevity does not come from the campaign at all, it comes from the random scenarios (which are really excellent). This is the real core of the game, imo.
"This game is best played with a warm cup of Folger's coffee in your hands, so you can actually smell the oppression while you relive the greatest period of all time. The period when white people discovered the world, and decided they didn't like it." - EUIV Steam user review

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Butterknife » Sun Apr 21, 2013 9:00 pm

ColdSteel wrote:
Butterknife wrote:I'm also doubting how much replayability the game has. It feels very similar to defeat each shard - you use the same techniques each time.
One thing I think it's important to realize is that at the point you are in the campaign you have seen very, very little of the game. What you can do is severely restricted for a very long time in the campaign as you have to unlock stuff bit by bit (by bit). It will take you forever before you see everything the game has to offer via the campaign. Early on it is indeed the same stuff over and over because of that.

What you should do is put down the campaign for a little while and play a randomly generated scenario on a large shard. In my opinion this is where the game really shines. I had 10 (maybe 20) times the fun playing the game this way instead of the campaign. All options, strategies, units and buildings are open to you this way and you can form a real opinion of the game. The longevity does not come from the campaign at all, it comes from the random scenarios (which are really excellent). This is the real core of the game, imo.
I'll give it a shot! Thanks for the advice.

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ColdSteel » Mon Apr 22, 2013 8:20 am

I took my own advice and started a random scenario on a "big" shard yesterday. I wanted to try some new strategies and heroes that I normally don't use. I almost always use a scout first followed by a warrior so this time I started with a wizard and turned him into a necromancer. My second hero is a commander which I've never tried before but I've heard a lot of people say how great they are so we shall see.

The practice of the black arts has damaged my reputation as expected but I have been taking the "good' choices on the events which counterbalances that. So right now my reputation is "the dishonest" which isn't too bad at all. So far I've taken the ring of provinces around my castle and that's about it. This shard is freaking BIG so this is going to take a while. I'm hoping I'll be able to level my heroes to 25 or 30 when it's all said and done. There are some high level spells I'd love to be able to field test, so to speak.

So far my wizard is level 7 and has the necromancer and summoning skills which is good. He can still only summon zombies and skellies right now because I haven't been able to build the second level necro building yet. Ghouls are what I need (and soon) in order to expand further. And once I get ghosts, look out world..

I noticed there is an official statement on the Snowbird forums about the release and upcoming fixes. It also looks like a massive unit guide is incoming sometime this week. That should be really helpful for new players. They seem pretty humble and apologetic.
Hello guys.

First of all, we want to sincerely apologize for the difficulties many of you encountered upon the game release. We're very sorry to let you down and we're doing our best to fix the most critical problems of the game as soon as possible.

Eador. MotBW is the first big project for our small team and clearly we were not completely ready for the international release. Seeing how many problems are caused by the difference in PC configurations, we realize that we should have tried to go with the 'Early Access' option first. Unfortunately, we couldn't foresee the current outcome back in January when the game was greenlit to be on Steam.

In the next few days we'll fix the the siege and story progression bugs, add 'hotseat' mode and an option for private matches in the multiplayer. A more detailed list of the upcoming fixes will be posted on this board on Monday.

We'll also be adding a 60 page guide with a detailed units, heroes and skills description in addition to the current manual next week.

The studio is keeping track of your reported technical issues so constructive feedback is very much appreciated.

Thanks,

Snowbird Games.


Dan Spivakov, Yesterday at 4:33 PM
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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Madmarcus » Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:34 am

I haven't jumped into Broken World yet (still on Eador Genesis) but I have a general question. How fast do the rest of you expand?

In a normal 4x game I tend to expand fairly fast. Not breakneck speed; for example I prefer not to attempt to get 12 provinces in Dom 3 in the first year, but I generally want to be expanding. In Eador I've found that the search mechanic slows me down. I want to get a province fully searched and the easy sites controlled before I move on even though I'm not sure its worth it. Should I just go with the flow and remind myself that its a slower paced game or will I be giving too many provinces to the opposing lords?

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by LordMortis » Mon Apr 22, 2013 10:57 am

Madmarcus wrote:I haven't jumped into Broken World yet (still on Eador Genesis) but I have a general question. How fast do the rest of you expand?
Depends on my mood and the shard (I've only played campaign). If there is only one competitor, I tend to expand quickly, find him, box him in, explore the rest of the shard for the exploration bonus (not sure what that means for the long game) and then finish him.

If there are three competitors (the most I have seen so far) I tend to expand slowly. I don't know if that's the right move or not and I always end up with big negatives on time to completion penalties but I don't want to get involved border skirmishes that I either can't win or require my main heroes attention constantly.

My biggest slow down is that I OCD on these maps and I want to put down every province upgrade before grabbing the next one. By shard 16 (where I'm at now) that's between 4 and 5 turns spent on every province until I feel that I can overwhelm the map.

I used to B Line to my adversaries and take them out right away but my end score seemed to suffer dramatically for not completing my build tree, hiring 4 heroes, doing quests, finding rares, etc... etc...

I still haven't done things like find the heart of the labyrinth event (not for lack of trying) or even played in an arena (for having watching one and seen how tough the competition is).

I'm also wondering when it's appropriate to invade another character's shard or if I should at all. I have no idea what you gain for doing so or how much tougher they get as time goes by. The "goal" of the story is still unclear to me.

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ColdSteel » Mon Apr 22, 2013 3:17 pm

New patch due today apparently:
Hello everyone,

Today's patch for the game has the following changes and fixes:

- Updated HUD for provinces.
- Multiplayer stability is improved.

Fixed:

- While attacking his own guard a player could control both sides during the battle.
- While attacking an enemy hero who besieges an allied province, players could get a wrong description of the enemy's army.
- Missing battle results during exploring of a province's sights.
- Number of taken shards wasn't updated in the statistics.
- 'Keys of Truth' questline was considered complete after the tutorial ended.
- On the strategic map death of the last unit in an enemy AI's army by poisoning could lead to the game's crash.
- Tooltip display bug after conquering a shard.
- Impossible to hire heroes during the tutorial.
- Game crash during a battle with a unicorn.
- Dead units appearing during tactical battles.
- Game crash during a battle with no restriction for magic.
- Fixed 'Necromancy' skill.

During this week we'll also be adding to the game:

- Hotseat for the tactical mode.
- Turn timers in multiplayer.
- Faster unit animation.


Dan Spivakov, Today at 9:27 PM
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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Jag » Mon Apr 22, 2013 3:25 pm

Yay. Faster unit animation!

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Sepiche » Tue Apr 23, 2013 1:28 pm

Man, this game is kicking my butt, even on beginner. :P

I finished the tutorial shard, but I've tried twice now to take over my first real shard and not had any luck. The first time I went with a mage hero, but I don't think I expanded fast enough and just got worn down once the enemy showed up. The second time I thought I was off to a much better start with a commander hero, and had a good amount of land taken, but when I finally ran into the enemy hero he was level 10 to my level 6 and completely destroyed me in battle.

So a few questions:
Does anyone know how the AI is taking my provinces and immediately having 10 units as a garrison? He always seems to take my provinces and then there's immediately a hunter unit, or something else guarding it. Is there some building that gives access to guards? I generally only have the one adventurer contract that comes with one of the buildings, but the AI seems to have an endless horde of garrison units.

How fast do people usually expand? I felt like I was doing a pretty good job of taking land in my second game, but that didn't seem to do me much good against the enemy hero. Do I need to balance expansion with attacking sites?

How soon should I save up to get a second hero? Right from the start? If I don't do it immediately it seems like it takes me a while to get the money together to do it later.

Is it just me or does the warrior hero seem really overpowered? In the battle I had with that level 10 hero I somehow managed to bring him down at the cost of most of my units, only to have him immediately respawn at full health due to one of his abilities. That's about as close to an "always win" card I've seen in the tactical battles. I mean, warriors are already hard as nails and it seems pretty crazy to have to fight them twice potentially.

Is there a way to skip the tutorial? In my campaign I'm starting to run out of shards to attack and I feel like if I end up having to restart I'm just going to pass instead of having to get through the tutorial level yet again.

I feel like there's probably just a few key things I'm missing, but my frustration is starting to make me less and less inclined to play.

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Jag
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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Jag » Tue Apr 23, 2013 2:37 pm

There are better players out there, but this is what I have learned to answer some of your questions:

-I think the mage hero is hard for beginners. Scout and Warrior are probably best.

-There is a building that gives you the ability to build guards on your land. I forget which one it is, but the description says it. Think it has a few prereq buildings first. Basically the AI takes your land and immediately builds cheap guards on it (50g). You can only build one guard per turn.

-Think of the land squares as a Risk board. I try to expand and put guards at bottleneck chokepoints so he can't get through.

-I would expand enough to generate some income, especially your close ring and any nearby resources, but make sure you are exploring those areas too if you get overcrowding warnings. A second hero helps here as well. I would say get the hero once your first hero is strong enough to take on most properties and you have the cash to buy another.

-At level 10 heroes get their second ability which can make them OP. You probably need to level faster, either through exploration or visiting sites.

-You can definitely skip the tutorial. In fact, your first real shard is crippled in the tutorial since you only have access to a few buildings. The real game doesn't start until you do a campaign. If you are comfortable with the mechanics, move on to a Campaign, but be warned there are ALOT of choices and buildings to choose from. This game has some serious depth in that area.

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by LordMortis » Tue Apr 23, 2013 3:16 pm

I need to pick up Masters to know the difference between it and Genesis.

In genesis there are lots of buildings so far that give guards. The first and easiest and cheapest and least effective is the one that gives you peasants. But you still have to put the guards in place. They are not automatic.
-At level 10 heroes get their second ability which can make them OP. You probably need to level faster, either through exploration or visiting sites.
Leveling and obtaining loot is more important than expanding IMO. They key in this game is learning how to fight your enemies. Which heroes are better for which combats and at what level to fight.

Until I am ready to conquer, I tend to grab the first ring around me and the explore until I need more income to support the troops attached to my heroes. I usually like to support troops +100 gold and +1 gem per day and keep a minimum of 500 gold on hand to pay from random events.

I am not an expert at Genesis and am still learning the game and I've not bought Masters yet.

I used to buy two heroes right out of the gate but I have since changed my formula to 1 hero until the first hero has a compliment of Archers, and the basic spells. Then I buy the second the hero quickly putting up happiness and guards after. Then I worry about generating more money. Then I get a third and possibly fourth hero.

I've grown to like a commander with archers as my starting hero, who can usually take the surrounding area and explore for goblins and orcs fairly easily and undead too as long as your spells in tact to take out the skellies that your archers can't take down. I reduce upkeep whenever possible. As soon as I have bit of equipment I can throw on a warrior, whom I send out without any troops at all, still allowing me to save money. This is dangerous as a solo warrior can't fall back on his troops. Until he's leveled, you have to pick your battles carefully but by the time he gets to level 7 or 8 with any respectable equipment, he's a province taker by himself with no upkeep (on beginner). Province defenders so far, don't have a decent mid game warrior killer (like medusas or slugs or spiders)

The midgame warrior may seem unbalanced but I screwed around in the arena with my level 30 beefed to the max warrior against a level 30 mage and it took many many turns but he wore me down and won. I've never worked up a high level mage but whatever mage combo I went against, I couldn't hardly do anything against it.

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Sepiche » Tue Apr 23, 2013 4:27 pm

Thanks for the tips guys!

I suspect then my main problem was indeed spending too much time expanding territory and not enough time exploring sites. I noticed only toward the end of the second game that there's a pretty big tradeoff between the steady income you get from taking territory and the quick infusion of money and items you get from taking sites.

I think part of the problem for me with sites is also that it can be pretty hard to guess at how difficult a site is unless you visit it. In my last game I kept seeing sites defended by mages, demons, adventurers, etc. and never even attempted them because I assumed they were too tough. I think I just need to get more comfortable with saving and trying it.

And about the tutorial, I should have been more clear... I was talking about the first mission in the campaign where you take that first shard. I wouldn't mind restarting the campaign now that I have a better idea of the game, but I just wasn't sure if there a way to skip that first mission since I've played it a number of times now between this and Genesis.

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by tgb » Tue Apr 23, 2013 4:32 pm

I'm in the same boat as Sepiche. I started my first campaign with a Commander, which was a mistake (I can't even beat the tutorial level). I want to restart the campaign but not go back to square one.
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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by LordMortis » Tue Apr 23, 2013 4:37 pm

Sepiche wrote:I think part of the problem for me with sites is also that it can be pretty hard to guess at how difficult a site is unless you visit it.
Yep. Even with the simple stuff by the time you get to the second ring I've seen a Ogre snuck into goblins and even a ghost snuck into the undead. It's rare but it happens. Then if you aren't ready, you either concede a lost you are unprepared for or you concede going backwards and losing the points. It sucks but it happens.

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by Jag » Tue Apr 23, 2013 5:04 pm

This thread has some helpful beginner tips that addresses the ones listed here:

http://www.snowbirdgames.com/forum/inde ... tips.1427/" target="_blank

Here's one from there:
Spoiler:
There are many tips for beginners.

There is no fixed strategy, you can do what you want, however, there are some tips that are global.

* In the campaign for the first shards, it is easier to select a Warrior or Scout to begin with. Wizard and Commander are doable, but you only have access to the low level spells/troops, so you have to be more skillful.

* Make sure to delete your heroes slinger troop and place the militiaman in the garrison.

* Decide on your starting troop. Some basic combinations are Warrior/Brigands or Scout/Swordsman. Generally with the Warrior you want to have throwaway troops, for this purpose it is better to go the evil starter like Brigands. They only cost 10 a piece and you are going to be killing them off each round. For the other heroes you will likely want to make a bit more investment in your troops, I still don't see Barbarians as throwaway, but thats just me. For a general idea, good troops are expensive but will last longer and have no negatives. Evil troops are cheaper, but they have a lot of negatives like plundering and population unrest.

* Learn the starting troop distributions, also pay attention to the number of enemies, it may seem not so important, but 4 Lizardmen can be beaten without a loss and 5 will rip you apart. A general list of ease for starting heroes:

Easy Tier (Level 1+)

Goblins
Free Settlement

Middle Tier (Level 2+)

Ancient Undead
Orcs
Brigands

Harder Tier (Level 3+)

Barbarians
Lizardmen

* Don't underestimate spells. Get your Library up and running ASAP. Fatigue is your best spell at level 1, for example with Orcs you normally get 2 Goblins plus 2-3 Orcs. You can let the Goblins run at you and kill them easily. Then just Fatigue the Orcs as they cross the map, by the time they reach you, they only have a couple of attacks in them.

* Use the terrain. They have lots of range, stay in the Woods. They have lots of melee, get up on the hills. Try to position your lines so that they have to stand on swamps when they reach you. Also learn what stats each enemy has. You don't really want to be attacking Spear or Pikemen as they have a greater counterattack. You want to take the initiative on some creatures as they have a lot stronger attack. You want to rotate your frontline with Orcs as they decrease Defense with each hit.

There is a lot to learn and one of the reasons why this game is so great, is that there are a lot of strategies and the actual battles require a lot of thought from the start. Don't be shy to retreat from some battles, if you have a gut feeling that 5 Lizardmen are probably too much then you are probably right.

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ColdSteel » Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:46 pm

As has been pointed out, scout and warrior are best to start with for the beginning of the campaign because so much stuff can't be unlocked. I like scouts to start because even if you can't beat the defenders of a province, many times you can just bribe them instead. I like to get swordsmen or pikemen ASAP for his protection. Mage is awful at the campaign beginning because you can't get the buildings you need to really make him a powerhouse. Necromancer is certainly probably viable though.

It's best to rush the AI when you can and not allow him to build an economy or hire guards. Take all the provinces surrounding your capital and expand from there. Fast. On my second campaign shard I took out both AIs very quickly and they had nada because I expanded before they had a chance to do much. My scout was level 10 and I had a level 2 warrior. If the AI had a warrior in your game with resurrect on a small shard, you waited way too long. In general it's best to expand with your best hero and use a second, weaker hero to search sites while the other expands your territory. If you wait too long the AI becomes a beast to deal with. Turtling is not good in this game.

Getting that first ring of provinces is critical because you need to grow your economy to support troops and upgrades. If you use a warrior you can use him solo after he gets some levels and equipment and that can save a lot on troop hire cost and maintenance. Commanders are the most expensive to field. They use a lot of troops. Because of this they make better second or third heroes if your starting economy isn't strong.
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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by ColdSteel » Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:54 pm

Sepiche wrote:Is there a way to skip the tutorial?
tgb wrote: I want to restart the campaign but not go back to square one.
Yes, you can skip it. When you first meet the wizard, choose the last option in the image (click to enlarge) below. It's the one that calls the demon by his name. That will skip it.

EDIT: Also everyone make sure you're patched up to version 1.02 (it shows the version on the main screen at the bottom right)

Enlarge Image
"This game is best played with a warm cup of Folger's coffee in your hands, so you can actually smell the oppression while you relive the greatest period of all time. The period when white people discovered the world, and decided they didn't like it." - EUIV Steam user review

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Re: Masters of the Broken World (new 4X fantasy TBS)

Post by tgb » Tue Apr 23, 2013 7:26 pm

ColdSteel wrote:
Sepiche wrote:Is there a way to skip the tutorial?
tgb wrote: I want to restart the campaign but not go back to square one.
Yes, you can skip it. When you first meet the wizard, choose the last option in the image (click to enlarge) below. It's the one that calls the demon by his name. That will skip it.

EDIT: Also everyone make sure you're patched up to version 1.02 (it shows the version on the main screen at the bottom right)

Enlarge Image
I've read that there is a bug that keeps that from showing up for some people.
I spent 90% of the money I made on women, booze, and drugs. The other 10% I just pissed away.

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