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Hearthstone

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Lorini
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Lorini » Sun Sep 03, 2017 9:10 pm

Changes coming to Druid this week. My bet is on the removal of Innervate and Wild Growth from Standard.
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Ralph-Wiggum » Sun Sep 03, 2017 11:22 pm

That would help but isn't Jade Druid the real issue? How about changing Jade Idol so that if you shuffle three cards in the deck those cards can't be used to shuffle more cards in the deck? Seems like a fix that might solve many of the problems.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Lorini » Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:52 am

The real issue is both Jade and token Druid. Spreading Plague stops aggro dead. I haven't seen an aggro deck since the early days of KoT. And Innervate and Wild Growth makes those decks super effective.
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Ralph-Wiggum » Mon Sep 04, 2017 9:57 am

Spreading plague is pretty to deal with. Especially stacked with the minion that gives all taunts +2/2. But it seems that quick ramp up ability sort of defines the Druid class (at least since I've been playing), so taking that away seems drastic. It's just a matter of druids having quick ramp-up + great 5+ mana cards that currently makes them a bear, even without Jade Idol.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Lorini » Mon Sep 04, 2017 1:01 pm

Ralph-Wiggum wrote:Spreading plague is pretty to deal with. Especially stacked with the minion that gives all taunts +2/2. But it seems that quick ramp up ability sort of defines the Druid class (at least since I've been playing), so taking that away seems drastic. It's just a matter of druids having quick ramp-up + great 5+ mana cards that currently makes them a bear, even without Jade Idol.
The problem with Innervate especially is that from a design perspective it affects every druid card they design. They always have to worry about Innervate's effect on the card. The other thing is, by the way, is that over the weekend in the Hearthstone championships, every Druid deck was banned. Every single one. For those who don't follow the championships, each player is able to ban one deck from his/her opponent's set of decks. Clearly even if Blizzard thinks (thought) that Druid decks could be dealt with, it's certainly telling when the best players in the world think Druid decks are overpowered to the extent they don't have an answer to them.
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by El Guapo » Tue Sep 05, 2017 12:21 pm

Shouldn't they also just nerf Spreading Plague?

Seems like Innervate moving to wild is likely to happen, since it's constricting Druid card design in general.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Ralph-Wiggum » Tue Sep 05, 2017 2:25 pm

Nerfs have been announced:

Innervate now only gains 1 mana
Spreading Plague now costs 6 mana (not much of a nerf, IMO)
Fiery War Axe now costs 3 mana
Hex now costs 4 (was that an issue?)
Murloc Warleader now grants only +2 attack and no health to other murlocs.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Lorini » Tue Sep 05, 2017 4:08 pm

I got it a little wrong but I knew something would happen to Innervate. Spreading Plague at 6 let's your aggro deck aggro for a bit at least. The Hex change comes out of nowhere but I guess they feel Shaman is in a much better place than it was a couple of years ago. I'm VERY happy about the Fiery Axe change, hated that card.

There's a scheduled maintenance change on Wednesday, wonder if these changes will go live then?
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Sudy » Sun Oct 01, 2017 2:23 pm

Got another of them coveted 12-win arenas... though one win was a gimme due to my my opponent disconnecting before the start of the match. Who would have thought a druid deck with three Swipes, an Ultimate Infestation, and Prince Keleseth would be good? :P Despite this and the two now-gimped Innervates, I'm surprised the lack of early game didn't hurt me more though.


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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Sudy » Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:10 pm

Holy crap, back to back! Don't know if I've ever managed that before.... Was kind of funny, I lost a game due to a disconnect, I figure as some kind of karmic retribution for the last run. Anyway, this deck was over-the-top with solid early game, but again I didn't think it would do so well. Divine Favor really saved my bacon a few times, and the three Righteous Protectors and two Argent Protectors provided amazing support for Bolvar, Fireblood who seemed to make it into my hand almost every match.


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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Sudy » Mon Oct 02, 2017 7:00 pm

Really Blizzard? :roll:

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Ralph-Wiggum » Mon Oct 02, 2017 8:35 pm

I hope you had lots of secrets!

Nice job in the arena. I still haven't cracked 9 wins yet. I always seem to do better with the decks I think are crap than the ones I think are great.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Ralph-Wiggum » Sun Oct 08, 2017 3:58 pm

Here are a couple of decks I've been using lately. The Evolve deck got me up to rank 4 last season. I just made the Warlock deck last week, but it got me to rank 10 with about a 70% win rate. It hasn't been doing so great since I got to rank 10 though.

Evolve deck:
### Evolve
# Class: Shaman
# Format: Standard
# Year of the Mammoth
#
# 2x (1) Evolve
# 2x (1) Fire Fly
# 1x (2) Devolve
# 1x (2) Flametongue Totem
# 2x (2) Jade Claws
# 1x (2) Maelstrom Portal
# 1x (2) Primalfin Totem
# 1x (3) Mana Tide Totem
# 1x (3) Stonehill Defender
# 1x (4) Hex
# 2x (4) Jade Lightning
# 2x (4) Jade Spirit
# 1x (4) Saronite Chain Gang
# 2x (5) Bloodlust
# 2x (5) Doppelgangster
# 1x (5) Thrall, Deathseer
# 1x (5) Volcano
# 1x (6) Aya Blackpaw
# 2x (6) Thing from Below
# 2x (7) Jade Chieftain
# 1x (8) The Lich King
#
AAECAaoIDIEE/gXwB6C2ApS9Ava9ApHBAsfBApvCApvLAsLOAuvPAgmTCfqqAvuqAua7Aoe8As+8AtG8Avm/AuvCAgA=
#
# To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone

The Warlock deck:

### Custom Warlock
# Class: Warlock
# Format: Standard
# Year of the Mammoth
#
# 1x (1) Flame Imp
# 1x (1) Mistress of Mixtures
# 1x (1) Mortal Coil
# 2x (1) Voidwalker
# 1x (2) Prince Keleseth
# 2x (3) Devilsaur Egg
# 1x (3) Shadow Bolt
# 1x (3) Vicious Fledgling
# 1x (4) Blastcrystal Potion
# 1x (4) Defender of Argus
# 1x (4) Hellfire
# 2x (4) Ravenous Pterrordax
# 1x (4) Saronite Chain Gang
# 1x (4) Shadowflame
# 2x (5) Despicable Dreadlord
# 1x (5) Doomguard
# 1x (6) Dread Infernal
# 1x (6) Felfire Potion
# 2x (6) Siphon Soul
# 2x (7) Abyssal Enforcer
# 1x (7) Bonemare
# 1x (8) The Lich King
# 1x (10) Bloodreaver Gul'dan
# 1x (12) Mountain Giant
#
AAECAf0GEpMB9wT7BZIHtgfhB/sHwgjECMW8Av2/Ap/CAt7EApvLAqbOAsLOApfTApziAgYwzAjdvALnwQKrwgL3zQIA
#
# To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Lorini » Sun Oct 08, 2017 8:43 pm

Thanks! Fortunately I have the cards for both of those decks.
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Ralph-Wiggum » Sun Oct 08, 2017 11:25 pm

With the omnipresence of Bonemare, the Evolve deck could probably use a second "devolve". Maybe to replace Stonehill Defender.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Lorini » Sun Oct 08, 2017 11:38 pm

Ralph-Wiggum wrote:With the omnipresence of Bonemare, the Evolve deck could probably use a second "devolve". Maybe to replace Stonehill Defender.
I gotta run the deck more times and then I'll decide. It's been 3-0 so far :)
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by gilraen » Sun Oct 08, 2017 11:44 pm

Nuked half my epics and legendaries to make a highlander priest deck (Raza/DK Anduin), since I got tired of losing to it over and over. Shouldn't have bothered, I lose with it to every aggro deck, DK mage or mirror matchup (because they manage to get the perfect draw and I can go the entire game and not draw Raza).
Last month I managed to get to rank 9 - this month I can't get past 16, it's getting frustrating enough where I'm probably going to stop playing for the rest of the month and wait for the next reset.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Lorini » Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:40 am

PC Gamer article on the expense of Hearthstone. They are claiming it costs $550 a year to play??? I buy the $50 pre-pack, do everything possible to get and complete the best quests and I've been fine. I do note that I don't play Warrior or Rogue and not a lot of Hunter, so I dust all the epics and legendaries I get from those classes. But I'm able to be competitive with my card collection. When I see Magic players spending $400 a month on cards for Standard, I think we are getting a pretty decent deal. I looked at getting back into Magic a couple a months ago and a meta Standard deck would have cost me $270. And that's for ONE DECK. I think the author is overstating things by quite a bit, what do you guys think?
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by gilraen » Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:51 am

The guy contradicts himself, first he says, "the cost of maintaining a full collection has increased gradually from around $550 per year to almost $1,000 per year" - then he adds, "collectible card games are not designed with full collections in mind: you don't need anything close to a full collection to play the game competitively". Well...yeah.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by El Guapo » Tue Oct 10, 2017 10:04 am

Well, that's not really contradictory. The 'cost' to play Hearthstone depends on your metric / framework, as the required cost is obviously zero. The cost for buying a full collection is another metric (the maximum possible cost per year), but the author appropriately caveats that by noting that you don't have to buy a full collection. But he also looks at a rising number of legendaries / epics, a rising number of class-specific legendaries / epics, the elimination of cards from 'adventure' expansions, etc.

Anyway, the cost is mainly tied to one's desire to be competitive in ranked play, as that's what you need to have the legendaries du jour for. Personally I haven't spent a dime on Hearthstone since they added Tavern Brawls (and only paid a little before that), as adding another way to play give me a way to complete quests, and the gold from quests has been enough to pay for my main interest in the game (Arena), along with the occasional ranked play run (but I've never been lower than I think 14 in ranked, so you can see how seriously I take it).

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Sudy » Tue Oct 10, 2017 10:23 pm

No, this is ridiculous. This kind of thinking only holds true if you insist upon running new meta decks the day they become popular. (Though conserve dust, and even this is sometimes possible.) If you're buying packs to accumulate enough dust to craft a specific legendary, yeah; that's obscenely expensive.

To date, going back to beta, I've still only spent $50 or $60 on the game I think. Within a month of the launch of a new set, I can usually build 80% of the top meta decks, and the rest I can usually come close with sensible substitutions. It's usually only extremely legendary-heavy decks that give me trouble, like recent Paladin and Priest.

Of course, I've also played almost daily since beta, rarely missing a daily quest. Would it suck to be a new player who hasn't had the opportunity to snowball gold and dust gains? Most definitely. But that's not what the article is talking about.

I actually think Hearthstone is horribly monetized. For such a popular game, I think they could extract much more cash from people, while simultaneously boosting the inferred value and fairness of purchases. For the amount of time I spend playing, I'd gladly pay more. But I'm not doing it for blind packs.

The lack of interesting game modes is embarrassing this long after launch considering the game's popularity and Blizzard's resources. For me, chasing ladder isn't fun after a point--never mind the cost. So what's the point? I'll continue playing arena for free, grinding out gold in constructed when necessary. I don't dislike the game... I love it. It's accessible and fun. But it could be so much more.
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Ralph-Wiggum » Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:11 am

I wish Blizzard would add something like a tournament mode. Possibly like the arena where you pay X amount of gold and then are placed into a tournament with 5? 10? other players, each with a certain number of pre-determined decks that they've created to use in tournaments. The logistics of putting a mode like that together might be difficult, but I thought I read somewhere that something similar might be coming in China?

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Sudy » Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:38 pm

I'd love that. I imagine their main objection is not wanting to cannibalize the Arena pool. But no reason not to program it like a Poker Sit'n'Go. Hex does it....
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by El Guapo » Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:13 pm

Really, the mode that I've been looking for from an online CCG is the ability to have an online draft tournament with friends. Draft competitions in Magic are a ton of fun, but for the most part it's not super easy these days to get a big enough group in person (especially when they're scattered across cities). If there were a way to do one online with friends, that would be amazing. Magic Online does drafts, but there's no way to set one up with specific people.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Lorini » Thu Oct 12, 2017 11:22 am

I'm going to the new Blizzard Arena in LA for the weekend (Friday, Saturday, Sunday) to watch the HCT Summer Championships, even though it's autumn now :). Hopefully I'll learn something, I have a lot to learn in this game :)
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by gilraen » Fri Nov 03, 2017 2:50 pm

New expac "Kobolds & Catacombs" announced at Blizzcon. Starting Monday, you get the new legendary card "Marin the Fox" for free when you login.

http://www.hearthpwn.com/news/3464-kobo ... earthstone

Lots of solo content...I like it :)

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Lorini » Sun Dec 10, 2017 12:46 pm

The free Dungeon runs are awesome!!! I'm really enjoying it. Quite challenging as well.
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Baroquen » Sun Dec 10, 2017 1:35 pm

I found the dungeon runs fun too. I was logging in just to get the free stuff, and ended up playing something like 6 or 7 matches. More than I'd played in months.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Tao » Sun Dec 10, 2017 3:26 pm

Was bored last night and re-installed Hearthstone to check out the "Dungeon Runs'". A bit confused on the mechanics, it does not appear you can customize a deck, you just pick a class and the decks are pre-set? Reason I ask is came across the dungeon boss A.F. Kay, and I don't see how I could possibly beat her with the pre-made deck;
Spoiler:
She came up on round 4 for me, had 40 HP's and you need to basically kill her before round 6 when she suddenly puts 6-8 8/8 monsters on the board, and continues to do so for subsequent rounds.
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Ralph-Wiggum » Sun Dec 10, 2017 5:22 pm

You don’t get to chose the starting deck, but after every boss you get to choose four cards to add to your deck.

The bosses themselves are random, though. I haven’t faced the one you refer to, but I think (?) that’s one of the rarer ones to face.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Lorini » Sun Dec 10, 2017 10:42 pm

I ran into AFK but I beat her before she got to 6. I've only seen her once though
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by El Guapo » Mon Dec 11, 2017 11:36 am

Yeah, I ran into A.F. Kay too. Beat her on round 6 (fortunately none of the 8/8s had taunt). Worked out well because I had just cast the "Doom Bots" treasure card spell (get 7 1/1 Dr. Doom bots) and one of the 8/8s was the five cost druid hydra that hits its controller with three points of damage any time that the hydra is damaged). So I just had all the doombots attack it.

The dungeon runs are fun. Hard and RNG dependent, but fun. So far I've done successful Paladin and Rogue runs (though the final boss with Rogue I beat with 1 hp left).

The craziest bosses I have run into so far are one (a 'toxic fungus' boss) whose hero power is to summon (for 2 mana) a 1/1 creature that's poisonous to heroes (so, any damage is fatal). That was a problem for my warrior, so...game over round 2.

The trapped room is the other boss that I haven't been able to beat yet. Starts with 5 secrets, casts more, and any time a secret goes off it spawns a 3/3 creature for it.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Tao » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:19 pm

I've only tried the Shaman so far. I really cannot conceive of how I can beat a boss in 5 turns with the Shaman deck without a great deal of luck via RNG, but then again I am not a Hearthstone expert, haven't touched the game in 2 years.

There is an upgrade you can get that reduces all minion costs to 0 for one turn, so you would need to be offered that specific upgrade and then hopefully choose it out of the 3 options and then draw that particular card and several high value, high damage creatures all early enough in the match to be able to beat her down before turn 6. I am guessing other heroes may have a better mechanic for dealing with that particular boss.

When I faced A.F. Kay the first time I was expecting some big play after she did nothing for a few turns. I actually survived her initial onslaught by sacrificing all my minions and expending all my DD cards. Thought I had dodged a bullet and figured worse case if I could stall I could win as she was out of cards and getting mana burned. On turn 7 she duplicated her play and re-filled the board with 8/8 creatures and I just conceded.

I also came across Ixld the fungal lord last night who one-shotted me... from full health... on turn 2... with a 1/1 creature. :grund: To be fair I did not fully comprehend the mechanic, I saw it had the poison attribute, which I had come across before when fighting Candle Beard so did not think it would affect my hero.

The dungeon runs are an interesting twist on the game but apparently not my cup of tea. I don't mind the "Puzzle" aspect as that's been around in MTG type games for awhile, this is just too random for me.
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by El Guapo » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:23 pm

The fungal guy was super annoying for me too. I had hoped that armor might prevent the poison from working...but no dice.

There are some bosses that are tough for certain classes. That's one thing that's kind of annoying on dungeon runs...the wrong boss / wrong combo at the wrong time and the run's over.

But generally I think they're a fun addition to the game.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Ralph-Wiggum » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:24 pm

I've beaten the Dungeon Run twice, once with Hunter and once with Shaman. In both cases, I got the "Double your starting HP" twice. So in the final round I think my hero had 200 HP. Makes things quite easy. 8-)

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Lorini » Mon Dec 11, 2017 12:32 pm

I watched Brian Kibler, the big Hearthstone star play the Runs all day yesterday. He finished three Dungeons in like 8 tries, so even the big guys are challenged. I don't care if I win or not, I just like seeing what happens and analyzing if/how I could have done better.
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Re: Hearthstone

Post by gilraen » Mon Dec 11, 2017 1:12 pm

I think I beat 4 bosses with mage and 5 bosses with priest. So far can't get past the 6th boss, but I haven't had time to play much, and there's definitely an element of luck involved. I do love the "double the starting HP" bonus but even with that, my priest died to fatigue.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by Ralph-Wiggum » Tue Dec 12, 2017 1:17 am

I’m having a lot of fun with this Big Spell Mage deck....

Image

So far I’m 4/4 with it, but I read it’s weakness is against Hunter, which I haven’t played yet.

I copied this deck from Hearthpwn AAECAf0EBKG3At/EApbHApvTAg1NigHJA+wH+wyjtgKwvALKwwLb0wLV4QLX4QKW5ALX6wIA

I needed to craft a good bit of the newer cards, but didn’t get everything so made some slight modifications.

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by El Guapo » Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:04 pm

Beat runs with Druid and Shaman as well, now. The "captured flag" (+1/+1 on all your minions) is amazing, and on my Druid one I got that and the "your minions can't cost more than (5) to cast" passive, and had a deck that was a mix of Jade Golem stuff and big legendary minions.

With Shaman I had the captured flag and the extra mana crystal. Built a mostly Jade and swarming deck (those mechs that are 3/2 windfury for (2) are incredible with the captured flag --> 4/3 windfury for (2), which I could cast on turn 1 with the extra mana crystal.

Amusingly for the first time I came across "treasure room" as a boss. Basically it starts with seven 0/10 treasure chests, which put a dungeon run treasure in your deck for each one you destroy. On turn 5 the "doors close" and the boss basically kills himself. I managed to destroy 5 or 6 treasure chests, so wound up with a bunch of extra treasures for the final boss (which was the beholder boss).

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Re: Hearthstone

Post by El Guapo » Fri Dec 15, 2017 10:59 am

I had an amusing moment with the Dungeon Run boss (the upgraded 'wax' kobold) who has the hero power of copying a minion for 3 mana. On the first turn I cast the "Portable Ice Wall" treasure minion (3/15, can't attack, freezes anyone it damages). He immediately started copying it, and a few turns later he had a board full of 7 Portable Ice Walls. Couldn't summon anything else, so I (as the Hunter) wound up just pinging him to death with my hero power.

Of course, the next boss was the upgraded pirate, who automatically gives all his minions charge for free. I still haven't even come close to beating that boss. I guess you'd need to happen to have a very quick deck full of taunt.

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