Octopus Overlords

Huh - there are only 5 missions in the campaign.

So which is better - Freeplay or Sandbox?

Butterknife wrote: ↑Fri Apr 13, 2018 7:29 pm According to Steam I have 610 hours in this game. There's not really any other game like this one. The appeal is really building something, then realizing that you can build it better. Then you spend the next 600+ hours trying to make that even better.

Couldnt agree more. I am hovering around 500+ hours myself. It is one of those games that you play to death then put it aside for awhile then come back to it and start all over again. The ability to store and re-use blue prints from game to game is absolutely brilliant and works great, this way you truly don't "start" over completely, just improve existing sub-systems for the factory.

I do think the player vs environment aspect is a bit weak on the AI side, which is why I use the AI mod "Rampant" which allows you to tailor it to fit your gamestyle. Curious to hear what other mods people are generally using at this point?

About the price-tag: if you play single, $20 easy. If you play Coop: $30 easy. After launching a rocket with bob's-mods in ~230h we are on a bob's and angel's every other day. I'm positive that we will have a launch till Christmas.

Lorini wrote: ↑Thu Apr 12, 2018 7:20 pm I bought Oxygen Not Included for naednek to try to bribe him to be a Dodger fan. Didn't work though

And think about it. Your team has gone in a big slide since then.

Just a FYI, I'm interested in Battletech if you want to try again

Zitterbacke wrote:About the price-tag: if you play single, $20 easy. If you play Coop: $30 easy. After launching a rocket with bob's-mods in ~230h we are on a bob's and angel's every other day. I'm positive that we will have a launch till Christmas.

I almost reported this as a spambot.

stessier wrote: ↑Sat Apr 14, 2018 11:52 am Huh - there are only 5 missions in the campaign.

So which is better - Freeplay or Sandbox?

Freeplay is the actual game. Sandbox is... well... a sandbox. Technically that doesn't answer your question because the answer is going to be subjective. I'd play freeplay because sandbox is boring to me.

As Coop said, freeplay is the main game, but I think sandbox (creative) mode is helpful to try out things you may not want to "risk" in a normal game without save scumming. For example, it is often helpful to try out a new factorio subsystem in sandbox mode, and then make a blue print of it to bring into a "normal" game when you have tech/resources to build it.

So much to learn! I had no idea there was a sandbox mode.

I've had the game a week and have 34 hours played. Really that's only spread over 4 days. It's a wee bit addicting - I'm always on the verge of either doing something cool or finishing a "re-imagining" of my layout to make it more efficient.

I'm heaving invested in solar. I've only got 3 steam engines & 4 boilers, but have 135 solar panels and 125 accumulators. I'm trying to be very environmentally friendly.

Someone mentioned using radar to see how far your pollution has spread - how do you do that?

So Coop, I haven't managed to get any serious time with the game yet, but I have taken a couple of pokes at it. I believe I've made it through the first 3 tutorial missions. I'm still learning how all the pieces fit together, like how far can the inserter reach, whether a drill can feed directly into an oven without an inserter, things like that. Took me several tries to put a bend in my conveyors, for example.

There are some weird UI choices that aren't what I would call negatives, it's just sort of counter to the look and feel that the gaming community has come to expect when controlling a single dude in isometric view. For instance, if I right click on a resource and I'm too far away, nothing happens. I think I get a warning beep. Why wouldn't/shouldn't my guy move into range and then start mining? Like I said, not a criticism, just certain expectations based on years of gaming that are behaving differently. Perhaps there is a reason that I will stumble upon later. I would guess that when the screen gets crowded it would be pretty easy to pick up a machine by accident by right clicking on it, but having to move your character with wasd doesn't change that.

I'm left handed and I absolutely have to remap everything (not specific to Factorio, I have to do this with almost all games) but I haven't done it yet, so it feels awkward right now but I'm sure it will be better after I am more familiar with the hotkeys I need.

The game mechanics are interesting and I can see what people are fascinated by, but I haven't gotten deep enough into it yet for it to have its hooks in me.

Thanks again, looking forward to more time with it.

I love seeing other people's efficient designs, but don't want to copy/paste them and try to make my own. Mostly they end up a mess. Especially when it comes to Tier 3 and higher research goods. Ugh.

My Lazy Bastard/No Solar/No Lasers/No Logistics run right now is ponderously slow as I've spent the last two evenings trying to restructure now that I've got all the factories I need to produce all the science packs.

I don't mind going out in my Tank to clear hostiles periodically and conserve ammo (and thus metal). I don't mind using mountains of coal to power my base with Steam. I don't mind having to produce everything I need in a factory. But having to create beltways to deliver everything everywhere is driving me nuts.

We get a Tank at some point!?! Cool!

I just got Level 3 research up and running (the blue flasks). I have a severe iron plate shortage problem that I spent an hour trying to figure out. I think I'm getting close to a solution...maybe.

stessier wrote: ↑Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:51 pmSomeone mentioned using radar to see how far your pollution has spread - how do you do that?

Build a radar from your build menu; it's under the military tab...radar needs electricity btw.

Tampa_Gamer wrote: ↑Sat Apr 14, 2018 2:10 pmIt is one of those games that you play to death then put it aside for awhile then come back to it and start all over again. The ability to store and re-use blue prints from game to game is absolutely brilliant and works great, this way you truly don't "start" over completely, just improve existing sub-systems for the factory.

Speaking of, I have recently resumed playing having taken at least 8 months or more off. I wanted to make sure I didn't burn out.

Since so much time has passed since last playing, new game mechanics have been introduced: my biggest hangup at the moment is how to put the blueprint currently being used back in its book. I have an early game blueprint book, and opened it to get a specific design from within. Used the blueprint, but can't get it back in the book....it stays in my inventory or on my toolbelt; something the blueprint book was designed to eliminate.

So please tell me how to resolve this.

persself wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:11 pm

stessier wrote: ↑Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:51 pmSomeone mentioned using radar to see how far your pollution has spread - how do you do that?

Build a radar from your build menu; it's under the military tab...radar needs electricity btw.

I did that - how do I see pollution though? What does it look like on the map?

stessier wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:25 pm

persself wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:11 pm

stessier wrote: ↑Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:51 pmSomeone mentioned using radar to see how far your pollution has spread - how do you do that?

Build a radar from your build menu; it's under the military tab...radar needs electricity btw.

I did that - how do I see pollution though? What does it look like on the map?

Radar will scan a small block at a time; pollution is a reddish cloudy color...can't miss it. If you built near a lot of trees, those trees will greatly diminish the pollution, however.

persself wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 3:33 pm

stessier wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:25 pm

persself wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:11 pm

stessier wrote: ↑Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:51 pmSomeone mentioned using radar to see how far your pollution has spread - how do you do that?

Build a radar from your build menu; it's under the military tab...radar needs electricity btw.

I did that - how do I see pollution though? What does it look like on the map?

Radar will scan a small block at a time; pollution is a reddish cloudy color...can't miss it. If you built near a lot of trees, those trees will greatly diminish the pollution, however.

Ah, thanks! I'll have to double check tonight - I don't remember seeing anything like that.

Does multiple radars speed up the process? I was planing on having four in a square pattern at the limits of my base and then add more as I expand out.

stessier wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 3:47 pm Does multiple radars speed up the process? I was planing on having four in a square pattern at the limits of my base and then add more as I expand out.

Yup, although I don't think placement of the radar matters... they just contribute to clearing hidden blocks on the edge of your mapped area.

And early on you won't be putting out a ton of pollution, so you might not be seeing it on the map, but once you get solidly in the mid-game, you should see pinkish clouds that are your pollution.

Excellent - thanks!

My memory was yes but this seems to a much better explanation than my memory

https://wiki.factorio.com/Radar

Updated on March 18th according to the footer.

Sepiche wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 3:49 pm And early on you won't be putting out a ton of pollution, so you might not be seeing it on the map, but once you get solidly in the mid-game, you should see pinkish clouds that are your pollution.

I was going to say, either you're making tons or nothing. Check and see how clustered your burners are and how much your boiler is running.

persself wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:22 pm
Since so much time has passed since last playing, new game mechanics have been introduced: my biggest hangup at the moment is how to put the blueprint currently being used back in its book. I have an early game blueprint book, and opened it to get a specific design from within. Used the blueprint, but can't get it back in the book....it stays in my inventory or on my toolbelt; something the blueprint book was designed to eliminate.

So please tell me how to resolve this.

Sorry, this may not be entirely accurate, but doing this off memory. I think it is somewhat context sensitive, but you first select the blue print you will want within the book by shift + mousewheeling up and down. Once selected and left clicked you should have a ghost of it, use it as many times as you want. I have my keys remapped, but when you are done you want to use whatever key you have mapped to "clear cursor" (mine is Q) - this is important because if you try and get rid of it by using a mouse click I think that is when you create a copy in your inventory. Definetely not the most intuitive UI aspect.

stessier wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 3:47 pm

persself wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 3:33 pm

stessier wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:25 pm

persself wrote: ↑Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:11 pm

stessier wrote: ↑Sun Apr 15, 2018 6:51 pmSomeone mentioned using radar to see how far your pollution has spread - how do you do that?

Build a radar from your build menu; it's under the military tab...radar needs electricity btw.

I did that - how do I see pollution though? What does it look like on the map?

Radar will scan a small block at a time; pollution is a reddish cloudy color...can't miss it. If you built near a lot of trees, those trees will greatly diminish the pollution, however.

Ah, thanks! I'll have to double check tonight - I don't remember seeing anything like that.

I figured out my issue! There is a button you have to click to overlay the pollution on the map. Can also overlay Turret ranges and power infrastructure and the like. Here I thought I was being so clean and yet I'm swimming in pollution!

Fun fact about pollution.

Trees and other tiles can mitigate it, but creature spawners consume it to generate waves of enemies. If you look at your map, the tiles around spawners are generally cleaner.

I am truly addicted. I really want to play tonight even though I am alone with the kids and go to bed when they do. I hate being a grownup!

After several evenings of trying to restructure my base to produce each kind of research material without Logistics, I've finished. Taking advantage of the huge tract of land I walled in with machinegun turrets was essential. Now I need more resources - iron and copper. My resources almost dry up before they get to the blue microchips and I need to bring in more metals and inject it just before that.

I created a nice modular metalworks blueprint that I can easily deploy anywhere and look forward to testing it. It has a Booster in the middle for speed, then a ring of 10 electric furnaces grabbing resources from the outside edge and dumping the finished product into a track in the middle.

I still haven't made it very far. I'm having a bit of a frustrating time as I get used to the UI, proper spacing and such.

I figured no one wants to hear about my difficulties, as I am still getting used to how things work and it's too soon to have real impressions. I did remap some of the important hotkeys, which has helped.

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 9:26 amI figured no one wants to hear about my difficulties

Bring it on. Some things may not be readily apparent and a little venting may result in someone shedding light

Besides, other people's difficulties brighten our day!

coopasonic wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 10:26 am Besides, other people's difficulties brighten our day!

I didn't want to be seen as being negative about the game, although in fairness to myself, things that take away from your experiences with a game are the first things most people notice.

If I have something specific that people can actually help with, I'll mention it. Right now it's more like "why is this interface element like that?" "This injector looks like it's in the right place, but it's not picking up stuff, why is that?"

As I mentioned, I couldn't place a power line pole to the left of a steam engine, and I needed to reach a copper source in that direction, but I couldn't find a single space that was valid for the pole. It annoyed me because a) I'm very clearly supposed to get power over there and b) there was no indication of what the problem was. I'm guessing the terrain was blocked by some feature that wasn't readily identifiable by me. Either it was too rough, or had underbrush, or something, and I don't know how or even if you can correct this.

None of this is a road block. Just first impressions. I know what I'm supposed to do, but doing it has proven more difficult than expected, based on the UI alone. Not designing the base or whatever, I'm not far enough along to call it anything but a couple of machines sitting in the wilderness, but placing elements at the "correct" distance for them to start working on their own has been a challenge that I fully understand will get easier with experience.

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:08 am As I mentioned, I couldn't place a power line pole to the left of a steam engine, and I needed to reach a copper source in that direction, but I couldn't find a single space that was valid for the pole. It annoyed me because a) I'm very clearly supposed to get power over there and b) there was no indication of what the problem was. I'm guessing the terrain was blocked by some feature that wasn't readily identifiable by me. Either it was too rough, or had underbrush, or something, and I don't know how or even if you can correct this.

This "feature" drove me batty early on. Almost always it is because I am not close enough to place the object where I want. Your guy has a limited radius he can place objects in. The outline of the object is green if you can place it and yellow if you are extending too far. It is purple if you are blocked from placing it in a location by something else. Took me a loooong time to figure this out.

The only objects I've found that prevent you from placing are rocks or trees - scrub brush has never been an issue.

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:08 am
I didn't want to be seen as being negative about the game, although in fairness to myself, things that take away from your experiences with a game are the first things most people notice.

If I have something specific that people can actually help with, I'll mention it. Right now it's more like "why is this interface element like that?" "This injector looks like it's in the right place, but it's not picking up stuff, why is that?"

As I mentioned, I couldn't place a power line pole to the left of a steam engine, and I needed to reach a copper source in that direction, but I couldn't find a single space that was valid for the pole. It annoyed me because a) I'm very clearly supposed to get power over there and b) there was no indication of what the problem was. I'm guessing the terrain was blocked by some feature that wasn't readily identifiable by me. Either it was too rough, or had underbrush, or something, and I don't know how or even if you can correct this.

None of this is a road block. Just first impressions. I know what I'm supposed to do, but doing it has proven more difficult than expected, based on the UI alone. Not designing the base or whatever, I'm not far enough along to call it anything but a couple of machines sitting in the wilderness, but placing elements at the "correct" distance for them to start working on their own has been a challenge that I fully understand will get easier with experience.

Have you tried moving your character closer to the spot where you want to build? Sounds like you're out of range...

stessier wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:57 am This "feature" drove me batty early on. Almost always it is because I am not close enough to place the object where I want.

This is almost certainly what it was. I'm still expecting my guy to move to wherever I asked him to perform his tasks. In this case, I think I was close enough to make it look in range, but just far enough away that I couldn't place the pole.

Obviously that's on me.

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:01 pm

stessier wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:57 am This "feature" drove me batty early on. Almost always it is because I am not close enough to place the object where I want.

This is almost certainly what it was. I'm still expecting my guy to move to wherever I asked him to perform his tasks. In this case, I think I was close enough to make it look in range, but just far enough away that I couldn't place the pole.

Obviously that's on me.

As I said, drove me nuts for quite some time. It's not obvious what is wrong.

Another fun one, when you get to trains - the engines have a front and back. They work fine in manual mode (with you driving) no matter what orientation the engine is in. If you put it in automatic, though, the engines have to be facing in the direction you want them to move. The only error message you get if you have them flipped is "No Path" (even though you've clearly built the tracks to the locations you want to go!!!). And it is really, really easy to put them on the tracks the wrong way (or at least it is for me).

They work fine in manual mode (with you driving) no matter what orientation the engine is in.

They do? I wonder if that has always been the case, cause whoa boy did planning and replanning tracks with not ability to be back up become a PITA in my last play though when I first started trains. I don't even remember being able to drive trains... Though I also don't remember every trying. I remember wanting to try and ride the train buy being afraid I'd get run over and then game over.

LordMortis wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:19 pm

They work fine in manual mode (with you driving) no matter what orientation the engine is in.

They do? I wonder if that has always been the case, cause whoa boy did planning and replanning tracks with not ability to be back up become a PITA in my last play though when I first started trains. I don't even remember being able to drive trains... Though I also don't remember every trying. I remember wanting to try and ride the train buy being afraid I'd get run over and then game over.

I haven't tested it extensively, but I got in a train pointing the wrong way and was able to move it. It might be that the keys were backwards (so I used "S" to go forward rather than "W"), but it worked. That's what made troubleshooting so annoying - I was driving around in it and it was fine, but flip it to automatic and it had a "No Path" pop up. I only had 1 engine wrong, though, so it worked one way but not the other. Frustrating!!

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:01 pm

stessier wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:57 am This "feature" drove me batty early on. Almost always it is because I am not close enough to place the object where I want.

This is almost certainly what it was. I'm still expecting my guy to move to wherever I asked him to perform his tasks. In this case, I think I was close enough to make it look in range, but just far enough away that I couldn't place the pole.

Obviously that's on me.

I had the same issue. Couldn't figure out why my power poles wouldn't build.

I will say that after many hours many moons ago, I still had problems with the way the UI handled laying power poles. From figuring out where I needed to stand place a pole around those huge steam engines/boilers to running a long line with the auto lay feature that sometimes just stopped laying, this aspect of the UI felt ill conceived. It's a trivial complaint but a complaint nonetheless.

stessier wrote: ↑Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:14 pm As I said, drove me nuts for quite some time. It's not obvious what is wrong.

Turns out that is what the problem was.

I get lazy with power poles now and a lot of my bases look like they were birthed in the dark corners of an Indian city.

I used to be all about those steel poles, and then the substations... but I'm over it. As long as there's power, I'm happy.