New From Sid Meier - Beyond Earth

[RMC]

I don't have the issue some do with having to reset trade routes, since needs change and the number of routes per city is pretty limited.

Three per city, after six cities that is 18 trade routes and some need to be reset nearly every turn. It gets old late in the game when the planet has been sterilized of alien life and if you are not at war with anyone, the rest of your units are asleep (except for workers). At this point, I just want to keep advancing until the next significant event.

In my current game I have twelve cities and the constant resetting of the trade routes is getting really annoying.

Also, FYI, I'm running all internal routes, so it's an exchange of food and production, and holy smokes you can grow cities fast that way.

Yeah, in my current game everyone hates me, so I only have internal trade, but I have found that it is easy to start a city with high production and no food producing squares, and then pump up the food with internal trade routes. And once you get the tech that keeps the bugs away from your trade routes, I never lose them like I use to in Civ 5.

I am a horrible person, as I keep thinking about what the expansions(DLC) will add. This game has issues, but I will keep playing it as is.

[TiLT]

I'm a bit puzzled by the response to the resetting trade routes, as reviews made me think it was impossible to keep track of them. That's not the case, particularly since a previously used trade convoy or vessel will display the previous route when you're asked to select a new one, making it easy to repeat the ones you've used before. It hasn't been even close to being a problem in my game. In fact, it serves as a useful reminder to keep track of the constantly changing trade market, making me look for better trade routes once in a while.

[Sepiche]

Yeah, I've also found internal trade routes to be extremely powerful.

In my latest game, up until the mid game I had been keeping enough foreign trade routes running to make a profit, and the rest devoted to internal trade, but once I got solar satellites and a few other money making techs I've turned a lot of my trade over to internal. Just assigning trade routes from two large cities to a new one will result in the new cities rapid growth and it will be able to produce at a rate close to your more established cities.

RMC touched on this, but it's worth pointing out too: there is no actual tech to keep aliens from attacking your trade convoys. In order to do that you need to build an ultrasonic fence, and one of the options in the decision that generates is to protect your convoys.

I'm a little over halfway through my second game now... this one at epic speed and mostly focused on Harmony, and I'm definitely in the lead in this game (after a very close win in my previous game). I'd have to credit my doing better in large part to those internal trade routes. It's let me build up a number of large, powerful cities in a much faster pace than would otherwise be possible.

[Exodor]

There's a mod available in the workshop that lengthens the trade route duration to 80 turns. I'm going to try that with my next game.

Finished game one. The last 20 turns or so were nothing but my moving military units towards my gate thingy and mashing NEXT TURN. I was just anxious for it to be over.

I found my empire really prospered once I gave up on maintaining positive health. The penalties for going negative are so negligible that unchecked expansion is a viable strategy.

Because I used mods my game didn't appear in the Hall of Fame but there are a number of graphs available in OTHER, replays. Too bad you can't see those from the "game complete" screen.

[LordMortis]

Things I miss that would add absolutely nothing to the game:

Nerve Stapling
Spock Voice Overs

But I miss them anyway.

Exploding pink growth... um miasma spreads would be nice too, but for all I know they may happen. I haven't gotten far enough in the game to clean that much miasma off the board.

[tgb]

Nimoy only did narration for vanilla CIv IV. He hasn't been heard in a Civ game since, and he certainly didn't have anything to do with AC.

[LordMortis]

Nimoy only did narration for vanilla CIv IV. He hasn't been heard in a Civ game since, and he certainly didn't have anything to do with AC.

That's how long it's been since I played either game and a testament to my faulty memory filling in blanks. In my memory, I'm hearing Nimoy quoting famous sayings and seeing the monocolored etchings of SMAC technology.

[Exodor]

I started my second game last night and so far it's a lot more fun. I feel like I'm picking my way through the tech web instead of just picking randomly.

Next playthrough I think I'm going to try a policy of non-aggression toward the aliens but for now it's just too much fun to slaughter them for the free science.

[LordMortis]

Next playthrough I think I'm going to try a policy of non-aggression toward the aliens but for now it's just too much fun to slaughter them for the free science.

I'm not far enough along yet to know what they impact of my relationship to the environment is. I've never owned a troop (set) tough enough to kill a worm and as of yet there has been no repercussion for killing things or removing miasma. I suppose discovery is part of the fun.

Lots of room for "meaningful" expansion in this game. All kinds of Sci Fi things that could be done.

[Sepiche]

To be honest the "befriend the aliens" path doesn't seem too fleshed out yet. As near as I can tell beyond making them mad (which also might be a bit buggy currently) there doesn't seem to be a downside to killing them off. In fact if you go Harmony you need those bio pools, and they often have alien nests on them that need to be cleared before you can use it.

Once I finish up my current Harmony game I'll probably hold off on starting another until they put out a couple of balance patches, but on the whole I'm really enjoying the game and also can't wait to see what kind of cool stuff they add with expansions.

[$iljanus]

I leveled up enough in the Harmony path to generate some alien life form military units. Unfortunately, I'm kind of avoiding any hostilities with my neighbors since I'm putting all my efforts into building the Georgia O'Keffe Mind Flower for the Harmony win so I haven't been able to test out how effective they are in battle. I do like the fact that my units actually heal in the presence of some delicious miasma.

[Sepiche]

Unfortunately, I'm kind of avoiding any hostilities with my neighbors since I'm putting all my efforts into building the Georgia O'Keffe Mind Flower for the Harmony win so I haven't been able to test out how effective they are in battle.

The xeno swarms are pretty strong depending on when you get them. They have a base strength of 34 IIRC, but you can get them around the time you and everyone else are still using marines, so they are especially dangerous the earlier you can get them.

They are also the earliest unit I've found that can deal with siege worms... they can't fight them directly, but if you fortify your xeno swarms on hills and use ranged unit to weaken the worms and get them to attack you the swarms will usually win.

[tgb]

I'm seriously considering just quitting my current game and restarting due to the fact that I've been overly concerned about health, and my growth is very slow (200 turns in and I have all of 3 cities).

I may even wait for the first patch.

[RMC]

There is an alien unit that is called the Roctopus, or something like that. Alien Octopuses... Gotta love our overlords sense of humor...

[Jeff V]

In my current game, I'm trying to be bug-friendly. The aliens are more or less leaving me alone. They are not attacking my units on land, but the alien squids are taking out units crossing the seas. It didn't seem to bother them when I dispersed an unattended nest. FWIW, last game I obliterated all alien life forms on the planet and the very last one died still green. I have a tech now that allows my explorers to roam unmolested, so I am recalling all of my military units to my homeland. Less aggressive aliens means reconnaissance in force isn't really necessary.

[LordMortis]

Level 7 Harmony achieved last night! Now it's time piss off 11 computer players as I snag expedition sites in miasma from around the world. Mwahahahaha.

This weekend it going to hurt my back and vision. I totally get that one more turn going.

[Sepiche]

Now it's time piss off 11 computer players as I snag expedition sites in miasma from around the world.

It takes a little micromanagement, but expedition progress actually stays even if you move the explorer away, rest for a few turns, and then go back, so you can get those sites as soon as you find them.

[LordMortis]

Now it's time piss off 11 computer players as I snag expedition sites in miasma from around the world.

It takes a little micromanagement, but expedition progress actually stays even if you move the explorer away, rest for a few turns, and then go back, so you can get those sites as soon as you find them.

I had no idea it kept track of partial expeditions.

Where the hell were you 600 turns ago on Marathon?

I will not reset the game based on learning this fact
I will not reset the game based on learning this fact
I will not reset the game based on learning this fact
I will not reset the game based on learning this fact

I will not lose three days worth of playing just to play for little more edge. Nope. I won't. I won't. I won't.

[Sepiche]

Where the hell were you 600 turns ago on Marathon?

[Jeff V]

I will not lose three days worth of playing just to play for little more edge. Nope. I won't. I won't. I won't.

There's always the next game.

[tgb]

Now it's time piss off 11 computer players as I snag expedition sites in miasma from around the world.

It takes a little micromanagement, but expedition progress actually stays even if you move the explorer away, rest for a few turns, and then go back, so you can get those sites as soon as you find them.

Good to know, since I just started a new game and almost immediately found 3 dig sites - all of which are sitting on miasma

[tgb]

OK. In one turn this just went from "good but flawed" to shelved. At normally difficulty I was neck-and-neck with the Pan-Asian faction heading into the end game, although neither of us was approaching completing any of the victory conditions. We probably had 8 or 9 trade routes going between our cities, an alliance, a cooperation agreement, and open borders (I was more than happy to let their military do their bug-killing from my cities).

Then - without warning and for no reason - they declared war. There wasn't even a downgrade in relations first.

That sort of shit is enough to get me to uninstall.

[RMC]

Yeah, I have put it up for the next patch. I love the game, and there is a ton to do, but so many other games right now, and I really love how these games evolve with patches and DLC.

So holding off for a little bit myself.

[LordMortis]

I'm still totally digging on the on the game. It's really weird how much CivV did nothing for me at all but this game does. I refuse(d) to buy any expansions for CivV feeling like it was a further money bilk to make 'meh' game into something enjoyable whereas I'm already looking forward to BE being expanded, even if it doesn't need it.

I do really hate trade route management though.

[Vorret]

Uh... I usually buy new civ game on release but this one went completely over my head.
Reading the complaints make me feel better about it though

[RMC]

Uh... I usually buy new civ game on release but this one went completely over my head.
Reading the complaints make me feel better about it though

The game is good. And if you liked the Civ games, and enjoyed Alpha Centari then you will love this game as well.

It is basically Civ in space. You don't have to research roads, etc.. So the game basically starts you after all that kind of tech has been researched. You still need research, but it has been squashed down into more of a shrub and less of a tree. Which actually works, and is very fun as well.

If there were not a zillion new games out now I would be all over this game, but since there is I am waiting for a patch to help with some of the little things.

But again, if you like Civ games, then you will want this one.

[Vorret]

Oh I'll buy it for sure it looks amazing, it's going to be a nice game for my 3 weeks off at Christmas ... I always make marathon speed game so I need a boatload of time

[Jeff V]

In the regular Civ games, it's a little easier to grasp the tech tree, identify with the different unit types and tactics, and in general have a firm grasp of all of the game elements. While that might come in time with Beyond Earth, a lot of the game feels sterile and not conducive to long-term play (Steam says I have nearly 18000 hours with Civ V). I'm not sure what can be done to fix this...one reason Alpha Centauri succeeded is that Brian Reynolds borrowed heavily from several science fiction novels to create a rich back-story. I'm not getting that right now. It was a viable strategy to coddle mother fungus in SMAC, try hugging a siege worm in BE and it'll scarf your unit down in a heartbeat. I've tried several times to be friendly toward the life forms, ultimate they piss me off by eating my explorers, workers, and other passers-by. Or worse, they sit and camp on excavation sites.

My last game I won by leveraging trade. Whenever a city was building a wonder, I diverted all available trade routes to that city. Same for rush-building colonies. When there was no urgent need, I put them to trade routes for cash and science and with this tactic, I won by a large margin. I think rush-building trade centers and maxing out trade routes is one of the fundamental strategies in this game.

After my current game (which I am in no hurry to play), I'll probably drop back to Civ 5 and see what the next patch/expansion brings to BE.

[LordMortis]

My last game I won by leveraging trade. Whenever a city was building a wonder, I diverted all available trade routes to that city. Same for rush-building colonies. When there was no urgent need, I put them to trade routes for cash and science and with this tactic, I won by a large margin. I think rush-building trade centers and maxing out trade routes is one of the fundamental strategies in this game.

I'm so science greedy the possibility of feeding wonder growth passed me right by. That probably could have given me a wonder or two. Myopia noted for future games.

Also, I have no problems with the native life attacking my explorers and traders. The Fences upgrade and a Harmony advance take care of that. They might even protect terraformers as I've never seen one get eaten running between colonies, so all I have to do is protect colonists when I make a new colony.

[Blackadar]

The game is good. And if you liked the Civ games, and enjoyed Alpha Centari then you will love this game as well.

But again, if you like Civ games, then you will want this one.

Or maybe you won't. I've played every Civ since the original and think this is by far the worst one ever released. It's not a coaster but it's close and there's no reason to play this over, say, Endless Legend, Pandora, Fallen Enchantress, Civ V or a number of 4x games that do it better than this one.

[RMC]

The game is good. And if you liked the Civ games, and enjoyed Alpha Centari then you will love this game as well.

But again, if you like Civ games, then you will want this one.

Or maybe you won't. I've played every Civ since the original and think this is by far the worst one ever released. It's not a coaster but it's close and there's no reason to play this over, say, Endless Legend, Pandora, Fallen Enchantress, Civ V or a number of 4x games that do it better than this one.

Yeah, I own all those other games, and I like this one better than Pandora hands down. Pandora has no soul.

Endless Legend and Fallen Enchantress are Fantasy 4X and are excellent games, but I like the Sci Fi element that this game provides. Both are excellent games, and if I had to rank them, I would most likely put them above Beyond Earth, but they are a different experience in my opinion. And both of these games have grown with expansions and patches.

But everyone has their own taste on these games, and I think all of them are good games, and I am willing to give Beyond Earth time to grow just like the games you mentioned above. Except Pandora, I even bought the last expansion, and it still has no soul, I really dislike Pandora.

[tgb]

I was a beta tester on Pandora and it never held my interest for more than an hour. As noted above, it's generic and soulless, and BE, for all it's flaws, is better in just about every way.

That said, I can't imagine anything coming out between now and January that will dethrone Endless Legend as my GOTY.

[LordMortis]

I was a beta tester on Pandora and it never held my interest for more than an hour. As noted above, it's generic and soulless, and BE, for all it's flaws, is better in just about every way.

That said, I can't imagine anything coming out between now and January that will dethrone Endless Legend as my GOTY.

I've been tempted to get Endless Legend but have been to this point turned off by the price point and my reaction the Endless Space. Which I paid full early access purchase price for I went though once and put away as an interesting 4x experiment that failed. It's hard to reward having paid $50 for a failed experiment by paying $35 for the next game. Maybe at $20 price point if I still remember the game.

It makes me wonder how the OO effect got me pick up CivBE after my reaction to CivV.

[RMC]

I am pretty much a sucker for anything 4X, and will by it. I almost did not buy Endless space because of the semi real time combat. But I actually started to really enjoy the combat, and had a ton of fun with that game.

Warlock 2, now that game I bought with high hopes and I just hate the way that it is set-up. The entire fractured worlds, and fighting over the gates, etc.. Blah, as a mode maybe I would like that but as the main way to play I hate it.

It was like they took all the things I liked about Warlock 1 and took them out and replaced them with things I hated. <sigh> Still bought it, but I have not bought any of the DLC for it.

[LordMortis]

I also refused to buy Warlock 2 because I thought Warlock was much less of a game than advertised. I also have a think about refusing to buy a sequel when they abandon working show stoppers out of the an earlier game. Too many crashes for buffers they just had to go in and up for me to consider buying 2.

[Blackadar]

The game is good. And if you liked the Civ games, and enjoyed Alpha Centari then you will love this game as well.

But again, if you like Civ games, then you will want this one.

Or maybe you won't. I've played every Civ since the original and think this is by far the worst one ever released. It's not a coaster but it's close and there's no reason to play this over, say, Endless Legend, Pandora, Fallen Enchantress, Civ V or a number of 4x games that do it better than this one.

Yeah, I own all those other games, and I like this one better than Pandora hands down. Pandora has no soul.

Endless Legend and Fallen Enchantress are Fantasy 4X and are excellent games, but I like the Sci Fi element that this game provides. Both are excellent games, and if I had to rank them, I would most likely put them above Beyond Earth, but they are a different experience in my opinion. And both of these games have grown with expansions and patches.

But everyone has their own taste on these games, and I think all of them are good games, and I am willing to give Beyond Earth time to grow just like the games you mentioned above. Except Pandora, I even bought the last expansion, and it still has no soul, I really dislike Pandora.

All I'm saying is that your assertion that "And if you liked the Civ games, and enjoyed Alpha Centari then you will love this game as well" is not necessarily correct.

Of the games I mentioned, I agree that Pandora is by far the worst. It is a little soulless in the same way Endless Space is soulless. I also find BE to also be quite soulless given the lack of any personality of the factions, the static world, lack of natural wonders, incredibly bad diplomacy and AI, etc. I think Pandora is a better game right now because at least it is technically competent whereas BE has some severe balance issues. However, I can see where someone may prefer BE. Neither is an exceptional 4x game, so please accept my retraction of Pandora from that list.

Now that doesn't mean there's no hope for BE. With some patches, the game can be balanced so that the pieces work better together. For instance, decisions in the affinity tree won't be first and foremost dictated on your empire's health. You won't have to wait until close to the endgame to invade someone across the map because your units don't get automatically killed by sea monsters anymore. Things like that will greatly improve the game. The inevitable DLC may add in some much-needed personality to the factions or improve the game mechanics so it plays like something more than a badly-done Civ V mod. I fully expect BE to end up as a competent, if not good, 4x game. Currently it's not IMO and this is coming from someone who has almost 500 fun hours invested in Civ V.

IMO, Endless Legend (and note what I said above about Endless Space) is the best 4x game out of the box since Civ II. Civ IV is the very best IMO, but it took patches and two expansions to become the best. EL was seriously great fun right at release. YMMV.

[RMC]

The game is good. And if you liked the Civ games, and enjoyed Alpha Centari then you will love this game as well.

But again, if you like Civ games, then you will want this one.

Or maybe you won't. I've played every Civ since the original and think this is by far the worst one ever released. It's not a coaster but it's close and there's no reason to play this over, say, Endless Legend, Pandora, Fallen Enchantress, Civ V or a number of 4x games that do it better than this one.

Yeah, I own all those other games, and I like this one better than Pandora hands down. Pandora has no soul.

Endless Legend and Fallen Enchantress are Fantasy 4X and are excellent games, but I like the Sci Fi element that this game provides. Both are excellent games, and if I had to rank them, I would most likely put them above Beyond Earth, but they are a different experience in my opinion. And both of these games have grown with expansions and patches.

But everyone has their own taste on these games, and I think all of them are good games, and I am willing to give Beyond Earth time to grow just like the games you mentioned above. Except Pandora, I even bought the last expansion, and it still has no soul, I really dislike Pandora.

All I'm saying is that your assertion that "And if you liked the Civ games, and enjoyed Alpha Centari then you will love this game as well" is not necessarily correct.

Of the games I mentioned, I agree that Pandora is by far the worst. It is a little soulless in the same way Endless Space is soulless. I also find BE to also be quite soulless given the lack of any personality of the factions, the static world, lack of natural wonders, incredibly bad diplomacy and AI, etc. I think Pandora is a better game right now because at least it is technically competent whereas BE has some severe balance issues. However, I can see where someone may prefer BE. Neither is an exceptional 4x game, so please accept my retraction of Pandora from that list.

Now that doesn't mean there's no hope for BE. With some patches, the game can be balanced so that the pieces work better together. For instance, decisions in the affinity tree won't be first and foremost dictated on your empire's health. You won't have to wait until close to the endgame to invade someone across the map because your units don't get automatically killed by sea monsters anymore. Things like that will greatly improve the game. The inevitable DLC may add in some much-needed personality to the factions or improve the game mechanics so it plays like something more than a badly-done Civ V mod. I fully expect BE to end up as a competent, if not good, 4x game. Currently it's not IMO and this is coming from someone who has almost 500 fun hours invested in Civ V.

IMO, Endless Legend (and note what I said above about Endless Space) is the best 4x game out of the box since Civ II. Civ IV is the very best IMO, but it took patches and two expansions to become the best. EL was seriously great fun right at release. YMMV.

I agree with everything you said especially that Endless Legend is the current best in the 4X genre. I also like Age of Wonders 3, but it has it's issues as well.

[Lorini]

I like Distant Worlds better but that's because of the greater complexity. I like Endless Legends as well.

[Blackadar]

I like Distant Worlds better but that's because of the greater complexity. I like Endless Legends as well.

I agree that both games are excellent and have spent quite a bit of time in both. I probably prefer EL a bit more because it's more of a relaxed experience (turn based) versus the more complex, real time aspect of DW.

[tgb]

DW is almost in a class by itself. Not only would I not compare it to Endless Legend, I'm not even sure I'd compare it to others in the same (SF 4X) genre like GalCiv or MOO II.