X-Com 2 confirmed...trailer

[El Guapo]

Looks great, and I'm sure to be "in" as well, but none of it really makes sense. Even with just today's technology we could find an underground base that was spewing forth flying troop carriers, and with the amount of psych power demonstrated by the aliens in #1 they shouldn't have any trouble identifying trouble-makers entering a populated area. Also, it seemed out of place to have a convenient dark alley right smack in the middle of an otherwise well-lit, newly made, well-monitored city.

Just nit-picking, I'm glad they are making the game. I wonder why PC exclusive?

That was my thinking as well. If someone has complete control of space, there is no way a troop ship is flying around and isn't going to spotted and tracked back to base. And that flying base should be a sitting duck.

However, it is Science Fiction so you could come up with some handwavy stealth technology.

They probably just reversed the polarity.

[Semaj]

[tgb]

Looks great, and I'm sure to be "in" as well, but none of it really makes sense. Even with just today's technology we could find an underground base that was spewing forth flying troop carriers, and with the amount of psych power demonstrated by the aliens in #1 they shouldn't have any trouble identifying trouble-makers entering a populated area. Also, it seemed out of place to have a convenient dark alley right smack in the middle of an otherwise well-lit, newly made, well-monitored city.

Just nit-picking, I'm glad they are making the game. I wonder why PC exclusive?

That was my thinking as well. If someone has complete control of space, there is no way a troop ship is flying around and isn't going to spotted and tracked back to base. And that flying base should be a sitting duck.

However, it is Science Fiction so you could come up with some handwavy stealth technology.

They probably just reversed the polarity.

Perhaps they opened a socket.

[Daehawk]

As per Star Treks 3 words rule....its the stealth cloak projector that keeps them hidden.

[RMC]

The IGN article says yes. I'm not familiar with the guy's other work but his work on Enemy Unknown/Within was phenomenal, so I trust his work on the sequel without reservation.

Ah, who am I kidding, I'd buy it on release day at full price even if it was just a shitty underwater re-skin.

I wanted so bad to like that game when it came out, but the lobsterman hiding in a corner on the penultimate level finally did me in. Took me what seemed like hours to find him. I played the final level and then never went back. Terror from the Deep indeed.

Anyway, I still have to play the Enemy Within add-on... so I can wait for XCOM 2. I'm sure I'll jump onboard though, especially if Jake Solomon is leading the effort again. He seems to really care.

In Terror from the Deep there was ALWAYS a Lobsterman hiding in the corner. In. Every. Level. This is why I never finished the game.

So, we apparently lost the XCOM war and now the aliens have set up a false utopian New World Order. I have always thought that there needed to be a game where you played the "resistance" and used covert ops and mobility to fight a much larger power. So this looks like a Day One!

Isn't that the concept for one of the new games coming from Stardock? Fantasy instead of current/future tech.

[RMC]

Day 1 purchase for me to. Still find myself firing up Xcom when no other game appeals to me. Looking forward to it. I tried Long War a few times, but its way too long. I like the character class designs in em though.

Same here. I really want to play long war through, but man it is just way too long. I have 3 kids, so it is hard to just sit and play that long. And coming back to a combat is tough.

[JetFred]

Besides, I just started Skyrim so that'll keep me busy for a while.

(I bought it a couple years back on a Steam sale, played it through the escape from the execution/dragon and just never went back to it.)

Are you my long lost brother?

[Paingod]

Another trailer

Some thoughts on this...

• It looks technically good as a sequel
• I liked the character models
• I liked the turret hacking
• I thought the alien units looked awesome
• I didn't care for the movement distance for each soldier. It looks like you can move two screens in one sprint vs. one screen in XCOM
• I didn't care for the snakeman that reached out 70', grabbed a soldier, and instantly killed him. Not sure how you counter that

So it looks good - I'm sure I'll play it - but it looks like they're pushing for speed over tactics. I'm currently on Month 4 of a playthrough in XCOM and this is all very exciting for me - but I really don't want them to break a good formula by trying to make it something it shouldn't be. XCOM to me is a game of tactical pressure - not sloppy speed runs.

[NickAragua]

I understand that they doctored the gameplay a bit in that trailer to make things more cinematic.

I was cringing every time the player used sprint to move his guys into half-cover with bad guys around. jeez dude, do you want your guys to get their heads blown off?

[El Guapo]

Also, I am sure that the civilian population will be absolutely *thrilled* that they put civilians in a combat zone (and killed human security forces) over a statue. They are going to be falling over each other to sign up with the resistance now, no doubt.

Wouldn't it be a million times easier and better to attach a bomb to the statue in the middle of the night? They can't be guarding that thing 24/7.

[LordMortis]

I bought an expansion to Enemy Unknown. It added a few randomized events but ultimately got you to the same ending. That wasn't Enemy Within, was it? What made Enemy Within worth getting?

I am intrigued by the premise of this game but I think I want more game than what I got from Enemy Unknown for the $50 I paid for it. It was pretty and the mechanics were done well enough and everything but the play through just wasn't epic enough for me. The end wasn't really a climax to game play, even it was a so so climax to story telling.

I'd say 'I'll wait for reviews or a price drop' but the forum effect will get me, I'm sure. So it will likely be like a day 3 or 3 purchase for me.

[Paingod]

Wouldn't it be a million times easier and better to attach a bomb to the statue in the middle of the night? They can't be guarding that thing 24/7.

Possibly, but nothing says "F-You, you don't scare us" like attacking in broad daylight and getting massacred.

I bought an expansion to Enemy Unknown. It added a few randomized events but ultimately got you to the same ending. That wasn't Enemy Within, was it? What made Enemy Within worth getting?

There was Slingshot, which was pointless. It adds a single NPC and early access to the BFG Rocket as well as a couple special maps. That's it.

Then they heard the customers saying "Screw this! This is shitty nickle and dime DLC, not XCOM!" and changed their plan for the next DLC to make Enemy Within, which adds a new faction (humans), some new guns, a base defense mission, cybernetic soldiers (and foes), gene manipulation, and some new maps to cycle in the draw pile. I thought it was worth it.

[El Guapo]

Wouldn't it be a million times easier and better to attach a bomb to the statue in the middle of the night? They can't be guarding that thing 24/7.

Possibly, but nothing says "F-You, you don't scare us" like attacking in broad daylight and getting massacred.

That's also a really great way of causing people to become scared of the aliens, though, while also being a terrific F-You to the civilian population whose support you are trying to get.

[NickAragua]

Wouldn't it be a million times easier and better to attach a bomb to the statue in the middle of the night? They can't be guarding that thing 24/7.

Possibly, but nothing says "F-You, you don't scare us" like attacking in broad daylight and getting massacred.

That's also a really great way of causing people to become scared of the aliens, though, while also being a terrific F-You to the civilian population whose support you are trying to get.

X-Com was never really about "public relations", and it's unlikely that they're going to put out a press release later on saying "we're responsible for this bombing/massacre". My squads usually have complete disregard for public/private property and civilian lives and routinely use them as cover/alien bait (in X-Com Apocalypse, the civilians were so annoying, especially in turn-based mode, that I would hit them with stun gas just so they'd be out of the way). I don't really expect this to change. I imagine that when the aliens are exposed as people-eating monsters, the damage to their public relations will outweigh any minor civilian casualties along the way.

The best would be if there was a plot twist and the aliens were actually genuinely trying to help us out. "Yeah, thanks a lot, assholes, you blew up the immortality machine."

That being said, I'm not sure I'd be happy losing three dudes over a shitty statue.

[LordMortis]

I know I'm alone but Apocolypse was my favorite XCom game. It's worst problem was that defending a city felt like a step back from protection a planet. But the game play was the bestest. I loved the large load outs and the cults and the huge ships and building an entire platoon of mercenaries.

[IceBear]

Wouldn't it be a million times easier and better to attach a bomb to the statue in the middle of the night? They can't be guarding that thing 24/7.

Possibly, but nothing says "F-You, you don't scare us" like attacking in broad daylight and getting massacred.

That's also a really great way of causing people to become scared of the aliens, though, while also being a terrific F-You to the civilian population whose support you are trying to get.

X-Com was never really about "public relations", and it's unlikely that they're going to put out a press release later on saying "we're responsible for this bombing/massacre". My squads usually have complete disregard for public/private property and civilian lives and routinely use them as cover/alien bait (in X-Com Apocalypse, the civilians were so annoying, especially in turn-based mode, that I would hit them with stun gas just so they'd be out of the way). I don't really expect this to change. I imagine that when the aliens are exposed as people-eating monsters, the damage to their public relations will outweigh any minor civilian casualties along the way.

The best would be if there was a plot twist and the aliens were actually genuinely trying to help us out. "Yeah, thanks a lot, assholes, you blew up the immortality machine."

That being said, I'm not sure I'd be happy losing three dudes over a shitty statue.

With all the scripting I get the impression that this is the equivalent of the first mission in Enemy Unknown where all your squad dies except for 1

[NickAragua]

I know I'm alone but Apocolypse was my favorite XCom game. It's worst problem was that defending a city felt like a step back from protection a planet. But the game play was the bestest. I loved the large load outs and the cults and the huge ships and building an entire platoon of mercenaries.

I enjoyed the game for all its quirks. The fact that they put in gravity for tactical battles meant that you could actually collapse a structure completely (and I did so repeatedly with several of the slum buildings - I couldn't find the last couple of aliens, so I just had my guys blow out the supports, and the whole thing came down!), and I had a reasonably fun time with the city scape (although the buildings were made out of cardboard and the road vehicles were all useless). Having friendly cop cars and corporate interceptors try to help out during UFO interceptions was also pretty cool.

Also, I liked that instead of starting off with (essentially) a bunch of guys in their underwear, you had access to good armor, weapons and psionics right off the bat. The later stuff was of course superior, but still.

Now, the half-baked diplomacy system was awful/useless, and once you got loaded up with at least Toxin Type B for your toxiguns, the tactical battles became throwaway trivial (unless you were fighting humans). Still, good times.

[TheMix]

I know I'm alone but Apocolypse was my favorite XCom game. It's worst problem was that defending a city felt like a step back from protection a planet. But the game play was the bestest. I loved the large load outs and the cults and the huge ships and building an entire platoon of mercenaries.

I liked it. Though it was the first of them that I played, so I don't have the same nostalgia.

[GreenGoo]

I didn't see any water in that trailer.

I call shenanigans.

[Grifman]

Also, I am sure that the civilian population will be absolutely *thrilled* that they put civilians in a combat zone (and killed human security forces) over a statue. They are going to be falling over each other to sign up with the resistance now, no doubt.

It all depends on what the stance of the human population is. Are they actively supporting the Advent administration already? Then probably not, and the Resistance is doomed anyway because a guerrilla force can only survive with the support of the people. But if they are a sullen, occupied population, seeking hope that there is a chance for liberation, then yes, symbolic attacks will carry great weight. You can bet Advent will be embarrassed.

Example, the Allied air campaign to isolate the Normandy beach head involved attacks on the French transportation system - roads, bridges, railways, airfields, etc. for several months. The campaign cost lives of about 40,000 French, yet the Free French govt supported it, and the French people cheered as the same Allies that bombed them entered Paris and other French cities to liberate them.

As far as killing human "security" forces, again, if they are seen as tools of the oppressor, then few will mind seeing them killed. After all, the Resistance attacked the French police when necessary and a number of French collaborators were put on trial after the war. Their "Frenchness" didn't matter much then.

So things aren't as simplistic as you make them out to be.

[ydejin]

Wouldn't it be a million times easier and better to attach a bomb to the statue in the middle of the night? They can't be guarding that thing 24/7.

It's about the publicity, letting people know there is a Resistance. They're up against a totalitarian government who controls the media. If they blow it up in the middle of the night, the next day there's some news cast about how some hapless construction worker working the night shift fell asleep at the wheel of their bulldozer and accidentally took out the statue and no one is the wiser.

[El Guapo]

Also, I am sure that the civilian population will be absolutely *thrilled* that they put civilians in a combat zone (and killed human security forces) over a statue. They are going to be falling over each other to sign up with the resistance now, no doubt.

It all depends on what the stance of the human population is. Are they actively supporting the Advent administration already? Then probably not, and the Resistance is doomed anyway because a guerrilla force can only survive with the support of the people. But if they are a sullen, occupied population, seeking hope that there is a chance for liberation, then yes, symbolic attacks will carry great weight. You can bet Advent will be embarrassed.

Example, the Allied air campaign to isolate the Normandy beach head involved attacks on the French transportation system - roads, bridges, railways, airfields, etc. for several months. The campaign cost lives of about 40,000 French, yet the Free French govt supported it, and the French people cheered as the same Allies that bombed them entered Paris and other French cities to liberate them.

As far as killing human "security" forces, again, if they are seen as tools of the oppressor, then few will mind seeing them killed. After all, the Resistance attacked the French police when necessary and a number of French collaborators were put on trial after the war. Their "Frenchness" didn't matter much then.

So things aren't as simplistic as you make them out to be.

I mean, I know that they have to endanger and cause the deaths of civilians to some degree in order to wage an insurgency. It's just that that comes with a cost (because people don't like to be put in danger and/or killed), and I think there have to be better targets more directly involved with oppressing the people or whatnot.

I'm just saying that I am going to vote for the other guy as insurgency leader.

[Grifman]

The strategic part of the game has expanded greatly and looks really cool:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=768&v=lj42i7f1nj0

Far more to do in your ship/base, and far more things to do on the Geoscape - you just don't assign missions anymore. They've put a lot of thought into this and it looks great.

[TheMix]

The strategic part of the game has expanded greatly and looks really cool:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?t=768&v=lj42i7f1nj0

Far more to do in your ship/base, and far more things to do on the Geoscape - you just don't assign missions anymore. They've put a lot of thought into this and it looks great.

/drool

[Paingod]

Sounds like they really took the commercial failure of Slingshot to heart. The video keeps saying "more of everything" - which is awesome. I'm loving my play through of XCOM right now and really look forward to this.

Procedural maps, way more soldier customization, actual weapon customization, AI randomly improves itself, etc... I'm thinking pre-order of the "Collector's Edition" for me.

[RMC]

Sounds like they really took the commercial failure of Slingshot to heart. The video keeps saying "more of everything" - which is awesome. I'm loving my play through of XCOM right now and really look forward to this.

Procedural maps, way more soldier customization, actual weapon customization, AI randomly improves itself, etc... I'm thinking pre-order of the "Collector's Edition" for me.

Yup I agree. I think they might have also taken a look at the success of the 'Long War Mod' and taken some input from that.

These look like all the changes that I wanted in the base game.

[ColdSteel]

This really does seem like the perfect game. If it's as re-playable as it sounds like it is in that video, you may never want to put it down. This is looking more and more like it may be a rare day one purchase for me.

[Paingod]

This really does seem like the perfect game. If it's as re-playable as it sounds like it is in that video, you may never want to put it down. This is looking more and more like it may be a rare day one purchase for me.

As I play through the original, I asked myself what made me stop last time - and I remembered ... My wife poked fun at me for not putting it down as I was working on my third straight play through. She wanted to know when she'd see something else on my screen.

It's rare for me to actually stick with a game and finish it. It's unheard of for me to turn around and play through a second time. It's Shakespear's Monkey Manuscript rare for me to start a third game after finishing twice. Normally I go a year or more between runs on a game. Never ever back to back.

If it's everything they say, I may not play another game for a long time after buying it.

[Grifman]

More on the strategic portion of game:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ehiiza6Yao

[Paingod]

I like the new rooms. Sounds like a lot of the old stuff, and including a Training Room to choose what kind of soldier a Rookie becomes and the Weapons Lab to experiment and get a random new ammo, armor, or explosive.

I like the randomized alien researching. It'll add a LOT of replay-ability to the game - I already love to replay the original, so this isn't a fail. The black market is interesting as a concept, and "Supply Raids" is the new name of shooting down an alien craft and pulling it apart for components

Sounds like it's going to be a lot of choices of this or that, risk and reward.

[Paingod]

The developers of this game have said they consider "Impossible Ironman" to be the way the game is meant to be played. I'm doing regular Impossible and find it very frustrating - who in their right mind thinks the Ironman mode is the correct method? It's a slaughter at the beginning. If I wasn't constantly saving and loading, I'd always lose the game because all I could afford would be new Rookie soldiers every month. I know how to play, where to move, how to flank, and keep everyone in heavy cover ... and I still get massacred - Thin Men with 6 health are bullshit.

I've been reading guides for Impossible Ironman and already see that I would have failed it - I didn't jump right to Beam weapons, and I've already lost a country in Africa. I also don't know how they research anything in 8 days - every tech I can choose from takes 24 days in Month 1. One smart guy said "Buck the trend, Scientists as your first reward!" and it makes good sense. I'm usually hot and heavy for Engineers, but my research doesn't keep up and I find myself in Norway with basic weapons and a boatload of Chrysalids chasing my Support Sprinter back to the exit. I fear this mission in Impossible difficulty and only barely got through it intact on Classic since I knew exactly where all the event triggers are.

Of course, I have little stomach for Ironman anything and just can't do it as it drives me bonkers. I try to refrain from being a Save/Load junkie and largely did that in Classic, but am finding I have to load almost every other turn in Impossible because "Oh, look, I peeked a corner and triggered 6 Sectoids" or "Hey, I missed all my shots and they one-shotted a soldier, sending everyone else into a panic. Oh, perfect, Jenkins killed his squad-mate in terror. Great."

All that said, I hope they don't automatically ramp the difficulty because of the popularity of Long War. I really like all the choices and being able to customize my experience in the game.

[Delraich]

Yeah, I have never understood the appeal of ironman (or impossible mode for that matter). I do not want to ditch a campaign that I have played for 10+ hours because of single mistake (or bug...). I have enough discipline to live with most, but not all consequences of my failures (to appease the RNG).

But looking forward to XCOM2. It seems as if they are making all the right design choices, especially the changes to the strategic portion.

[tgb]

I played the first in a sort of "modified ironman" mode. I saved at the start of a mission, and I saved when I returned to base, and when quitting. That was it. That way I was protected from crashes, at the same times having to live with my decisions. I'll probably play II the same way.

It does take a little self-discipline, however.

[NickAragua]

I'll play self-imposed ironman, right up until the point when the guy I've had from the beginning of the game gets killed by a random bullshit cheap shot critical from a sectoid.

[GreenGoo]

I'll play self-imposed ironman, right up until the point when the guy I've had from the beginning of the game gets killed by a random bullshit cheap shot critical from a sectoid.

Lol. So if nothing bad happens "I'm playing ironman!" but if something bad happens "I'm sorta playing Ironman except when something bad happens then I reload!".

[TheMix]

I'll play self-imposed ironman, right up until the point when the guy I've had from the beginning of the game gets killed by a random bullshit cheap shot critical from a sectoid.

Lol. So if nothing bad happens "I'm playing ironman!" but if something bad happens "I'm sorta playing Ironman except when something bad happens then I reload!".

I think what he meant was "I'll play self-imposed ironman, right up until my game mysteriously shuts down (what? no, I would never ALT+F4!) and I'm forced to reload the mission...).

[coopasonic]

Yeah, I have never understood the appeal of ironman (or impossible mode for that matter).

The appeal of Ironman for me is that it prevents me from constantly reloading for the perfect outcome. I don't have the self-discipline tgb refers to so I use Ironman as a crutch. I play on a lower difficulty (Normal, I think) as a result and if I do get screwed by a bug or mistake, I can Alt-F4 to go back one move.

[Paingod]

I've been through XCOM a lot now (pushing close to 230 hours as of this post) and my feelings on difficulty settings are...

Normal: Too Easy - I did this when I got the game, and it wasn't challenging enough. I did it again when I got back into it without remembering I preferred Classic. I could probably do this in Ironman without sweating too much.

Classic: Just right - hard but not painful. I prefer to play this way, and do the same "Save at the beginning and end" of missions scheme mentioned above. After I get Titan Armor I find I don't even save when a mission starts anymore, and end up rolling back to the last time I saved - sometimes two missions prior - because I get lazy, but can't stand to see my prized, expensive units killed because of a series of bullshit RNG rolls*. Maimed, brutalized, that's fine. Captains and lower getting killed, no problem... but not a Colonel that I break out for critical missions and intended to keep alive for the last mission.

Impossible: Aliens come in numbers and skill that make your untrained and unequipped Rookies piss themselves in terror too easily. Casualties are the norm, not exception. 6HP Thin Men are the devil when you've got 4HP soldiers using basic Assault Rifles and Grenades with no Carapace armor. I have no qualms with saving and loading frequently, but did not turn on "Save Scum" - so I have to diversify tactics and try new methods, not just keep taking the same shot over and over until it hits.

I'm currently trying to get all the Steam achievements for this game - and have three left to get. Classic Ironman, all 5 Starts, and Impossible. I'm currently working on Impossible, and will do Classic Ironman next. If I don't achieve all 5 starts with that conclusion, I've been tracking what I have done now and will only have 1 place left to start.

*Bullshit RNG Roll, from two days ago: COL Sniper using Damn Good Ground (+10 Def), Low Profile (+20 Def) at low wall (+20 Def) with high ground advantage, Ghost Armor (+20 Def) and covered by Dense Smoke (+40 Def), MEC Defense Aura (+10 Def) for an effective defense bonus of 120 Defense is critical hit twice in one round by a Sectopod in the last mission, killing him. I super-loaded defense and sent him to try and take one out before anyone else got involved with it. It has 90 aim in Classic and should have been completely unable to hit my Sniper. It's like I rolled the Defense stat over and it went back to zero.

[NickAragua]

I'll play self-imposed ironman, right up until the point when the guy I've had from the beginning of the game gets killed by a random bullshit cheap shot critical from a sectoid.

Lol. So if nothing bad happens "I'm playing ironman!" but if something bad happens "I'm sorta playing Ironman except when something bad happens then I reload!".

I think what he meant was "I'll play self-imposed ironman, right up until my game mysteriously shuts down (what? no, I would never ALT+F4!) and I'm forced to reload the mission...).

Yeah, it's kind of weird, my computer has this instability linked to the random generator. Probably 'cause of those mods I put on the game ("Persistent Corpses", "Revenge of the Sleeves" and "Adjusted Squaddie Odds" or whatever it was - the one that makes you more likely to get classes which you're low on)

On a serious note, in UFO Defense (and I've probably said this a hundred times), it was a lot easier to swallow, because replacement rookies weren't an order of magnitude worse than veterans and losing a couple of guys didn't drop your firepower by 50% in mid-mission. You could even absorb a total mission loss or two. No way to recover from a total mission loss in X-Com though, especially later on in the game.

[Zurai]

No way to recover from a total mission loss in X-Com though, especially later on in the game.

There absolutely is. Beaglerush plays Impossible (I think Ironman Impossible but I'm not 100% positive) on Twitch and he's had a few missions where he's lost almost everyone and I believe at least one actual TPK. He still keeps on trucking. Of course he's very, very good at the game, but it's still quite possible.