Space Pirates and Zombies 2 (SPAZ 2)

[Unagi]

Thought I would start up a thread for the sequel that came out today in Early Release on Steam.

SPAZ 2.

My kid (now 9) just LOVED SPAZ, and I always liked it for it's slightly less complicated 'intro' into the 4x world.

He's been waiting for this sequel to come out since it was announced LONG ago, and I'm actually really excited for him, as this is like his first "I can't WAIT to get home and start playing this game" moment.

Apparently, one of the main things he is looking forward to is; building his own base, as you couldn't do that in SPAZ.

[Daehawk]

Love SPAZ SO much. Its my favorite space game since Master of Orion. I break it out and play every few months. Ive never completed it but that doesn't matter. Its made just the way I want for a space game.

SPAZ II is a must buy when I get some cash. It looks wonderful. It seems a bit different though and Ill have to see how that plays out.

[wonderpug]

I loved the first one but I've got early access burnout. I'll hold off on a purchase until the full release or until the mildest positive impression about the beta peer pressures me into buying it now anyway.

[Sepiche]

Holy crap... this is pretty good.

I liked, but didn't love SPAZ, but I really like what they've done here. It's basically Mount and Blade, but with spaceships.

You've got your customizable flagship that you can re-design and re-configure section by section into different shapes, plus you can buy strike craft of many different types to accompany you.

There is a main map divided into regions each controllable by building star base at a particular point. There are other factions that build their own stations and raid and fight each other as well as pirates who spawn and attack everyone. Within each region are resource nodes you can interact with to get different resources, but you are rewarded with more if you let them slowly replenish to full as opposed to taking resources before they are full recharged.

When you run into enemy ships you spawn into a small battle map where you, your fighters, and any allies maneuver and fight the enemy ships and then return to the main map once complete.

I only got to play an hour or so with it before bed last night, but it really blew me away how well polished it feels and how many improvements they've made to the formula they started with Spaz.

[Daehawk]

You've got your customizable flagship that you can re-design and re-configure section by section into different shapes, plus you can buy strike craft of many different types to accompany you.

That instantly brought Star Control II to mind.

[Sepiche]

You've got your customizable flagship that you can re-design and re-configure section by section into different shapes, plus you can buy strike craft of many different types to accompany you.

That instantly brought Star Control II to mind.

Yeah, similar in idea and even a little more flexible than SC2.

Here you have different components that lock together in whatever ways you want: structural, engines, weapons, nose, and at any time on the main map you can go into an Assemble mode to rearrange and upgrade them by clicking and dragging sections.

[Daehawk]

Sounds a lot like not SPAZ now...like a totally different game...hmmmmm.

Watching videos is not explaining this. Are there still blueprints to find and get new fighters? Are there fighters at all?...What about minerals and mining? these are some of the most SPAZ things to me.

[killbot737]

I watched some of that intro video too, reminded me more of Rebel Galaxy lite than SPAZ.

This one.

[Sepiche]

I watched some of that intro video too, reminded me more of Rebel Galaxy lite than SPAZ.

Granted I didn't play a ton of SPAZ, but I think a lot of the difference is just the camera angle... if you hit C it switches to a top down view that looks and plays like SPAZ's combat to my eyes.

[ColdSteel]

I liked SPAZ well enough until I hit the zombie systems, after that it just became a grind/slog and I stopped having fun and dropped it. As long as they fix that aspect I will certainly give the sequel a try at some point.

[Sepiche]

Judging from some of the opinions I'm reading from other sites, it sounds like a lot of people who really, really loved SPAZ are a little put off by the changes, but people like me who weren't that enamored with SPAZ are enjoying it a lot.

I'd encourage anyone who tries it to do so with an open mind, as it seems like a lot of fun to me so far, but I'd recommend trying it first if you were a SPAZ fan to see if you like the changes, rather than just picking it up for love of SPAZ.

[Hrdina]

I loved the first one but I've got early access burnout. I'll hold off on a purchase until the full release or until the mildest positive impression about the beta peer pressures me into buying it now anyway.

This, almost exactly.

That said, I really enjoyed SPAZ, and I really enjoyed what I saw of SPAZ 2 on the Space Game Junkie YT stream, so this is an almost-guaranteed day 1 purchase for me.

[Paingod]

This looks better than I thought it would be, and I was already interested before.

SPAZ consumed a lot of time (like a couple hundred hours) so it turned out to be a great investment for me. This looks like it could be a good time sink too.

I like the concepts of emergent responses from AI (they see you doing bad, they get nagative - and they see good, they like you). I like the ship customization. I like the combat look & feel. I like the randomized item stats/abilities.

[baelthazar]

For now, I requested a refund on SPAZ 2. Not sure why, but the game just failed to "hit me." The majority of your time is spent on a fairly dull overworld map, where mining and collecting occur simply through clicking on a node and selecting a method of collection. You drop out of the overworld map to fight, but that is largely it (at least in my limited play time). Battles were more reflex based in that you put your targeting reticle on a ship and hold down fire (you do have auto firing weapons as well) - more like rebel galaxy than the more arcade style of SPAZ. That was sort of a turn off - I loved combat in SPAZ because it reminded me of games like Escape Velocity (this is more like Rebel Galaxy).

I may yet buy it again, but I wanted to think about it more first. I suppose, for the low price of admission, it was silly to get a refund on an EA game, but the first 30-40 minutes did not grab me (and I have a ton of gaming backlog to work through). I think playing the original SPAZ, or Drox Operative, 3030 Deathwar, or Space Rangers 2 HD would be a better use of time.

[Paingod]

I think playing ... Space Rangers 2 HD would be a better use of time.

I got back into this one a week ago, but for some reason it had gotten far easier than I remember, even with enemy strength on the hardest setting. I had an old save game where I had 3 million dollars and a fully kitted ship after ~20 years of play. This time, though, I was on top of the pile in 8 years and able to take down Pirate and Dominator regions solo. I didn't even have the best gear - but I was able to find stuff early on that simplified combat by giving me +3 attack and +2 defense permanently without spending experience or relying on stims to get it... then I found a ship that gave me +3 Charisma and suddenly mission payouts were huge, too. On the plus side, there are some new Dominator RTS missions that proved to be a nice challenge.

I don't know how I feel about the resource changes in SPAZ 2 - mining in the original was always a little dull, but oddly fun to just hang out and try to collect as much as you could before the stations grabbed it. Collecting Goons is less fun, trying to find a hotel to park on and have people spit pods out at you. Breaking it down to a click will save time and focus the game on strategy and combat instead of wasting time.

The only thing I'm a little put off by in the demo video I watched was that the command ship only ever seemed to get longer. There seemed to be no option for varying arrangement of central nodes. If that's not in there, it's a shame - they could have done more linking strategies between component segments or something instead of making you build a purely linear ship.

[baelthazar]

The only thing I'm a little put off by in the demo video I watched was that the command ship only ever seemed to get longer. There seemed to be no option for varying arrangement of central nodes. If that's not in there, it's a shame - they could have done more linking strategies between component segments or something instead of making you build a purely linear ship.

The inclusion of Captain Forever style ship building leaves me a bit ambivalent. While I think the customization is neat, I prefer the style of Space Rangers, where you equip things to slots. Nothing quite beats being in a battle with the Dominators when you suddenly grab a new component that turns out to be some amazing missile weapon or an ultra-efficient drive that completely turns the tables.

[Paingod]

Even the original SPAZ had a good system for customization... you didn't turn the tide of a battle, but how you slotted your ship and the weapons you chose went a long way to how useful the ship was. I suppose it lead to (for me, at least) there being a single "best" build for each hull type, but at least it felt like that choice was mine to make.

This is still early release, so maybe they can change it around a little. Maybe say something like any 'wasted' connections (linking sections in shapes other than a straight line) leads to reinforcing the strength of any adjacent components - or they might add components that only function on the 'top layer' and act as armor, anti-missile systems, fighter bays, etc - strengthened greatly if they're surrounded by a series of cores bolstering them. It'd be pretty sweet to see different shapes and sizes in there - like large circular component with five or six points of connection and a single massive turret mount on top?

Then you could have a heavily armored ship with fewer guns, or a different configuration maybe that puts emphasis on mobility or shields... not just the long ship bristling with guns on either side.

I haven't bought into it, so I don't have a voice in their discussions - but it looks like they're taking player feedback seriously in the Steam discussions - and weighing it strongly if you've got a lot of time in the game.

[Daehawk]

Ive seen pics where other mother ships are wide like a big wing and stuff so I think if they are in game then you can make yours something other than long.

[Paingod]

I picked this up on sale and tried it out last night - I'm sadly underwhelmed. It's a lot like playing Rogue Galaxy, only with a ship made out of bricks.

I really liked the style, control, and challenge of the original. Your choices on boosters mattered. Your gun selection mattered. Your tech level sure as hell mattered. Where you aimed really mattered. You had to plan a little ahead to not die in a lot of fights.

Things I like so far:

• Factions are a touch easier to grasp and work with - and there are benefits to bolstering one or hurting another.
• The galactic map is good and not too big (the original tended to be) with a lot of activity.
• You decide where to go, what to interact with, and have pretty good info on what you're about to get into.
• I've been enjoying the fighter drones for this as they get in a few hits and then come back to refuel - letting me stay well away from the bristling array of guns my enemies sport.

Things I'm ambivalent about:

• Design seem choices come down to building a bulky core to accommodate buffed weapons or building a longer core to accommodate more weapons.
• Levels are there to give you very general bonuses, not let you specialize in a certain pathway.
• Fighting seems to come down to kiting the enemy wingmen until he has none left to deploy (they get a LOT of them in reserve), and then dealing with the mothership as indirectly as possible.
• Weapon arcs play a big role in determining if a component i worth using, but this stat is not readily displayed in any way I can find.

Things I don't care for:

• I'm basically hands-off fighting and let the ship do it all for me, and my job is to try and avoid getting hit too much.
• Tech level doesn't exist, and instead you just buy pieces with different abilities and jam them onto your core.
• AI wingmen have been stripped down to bare essentials and I tend to not even bother deploying them since they die so quickly, cost money to rebuild, and you can only hold a few in reserve. This might change when I can deploy bigger ones.

[Daehawk]

Any more opinions on SPAZ2 from old SPAZ1 players? Still considering it for next months game. It just looks so different Im not sure Id like it.

[Daehawk]

Im giving this game a good solid go at it but Im having trouble both understanding it and having fun in it. I seem to just fly around and gather resources so far. I loved the first game so much but this one is making me scratch my head.