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Field of Glory: Empires

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dbemont
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Field of Glory: Empires

Post by dbemont » Mon May 13, 2019 11:10 am

Field of Glory: Empires will be out in the next month or so. Don't let the name fool you, this is quite a different animal than Field of Glory 2.

https://store.steampowered.com/app/1011 ... y_Empires/

This is grand strategy with lots of attention to trade and the domestic tribulations of an expanding empire, with a new "decadence" mechanic that acts as a serious brake on map painting. Culture will sway the populace to identify with the nation, but at the cost of diverting resources away from the war effort, while also hastening decadence. Something like 400 building options, with some interesting randomization of the options open to you at any given time.

The game is published by Slitherine, but developed by AGEOD, using a whole new game engine. Military conflict looks interesting, with raiding, troop variety, frontage concerns, and generals... but your impact on the battle is strategic, not tactical. Once the battle begins, it is hands off... Unless, that is, you opt to export a particular battle to Field of Glory 2, which will apparently be a thing for those who own both games.

Like Imperator, this game begins shortly after the death of Alexander and encompasses a similar swath of Europe, Africa and western Asia. Lots of playable nations.

Dev Diaries: https://steamcommunity.com/app/1011390/ ... 356099618/

DasTactic showing off the military side of the game: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X8YRiu7 ... ex=2&t=65s

A Gamer_1745 showing off the domestic side of the game: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vkjtgwepvwc
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Re: Field of Glory: Empires

Post by Sepiche » Mon May 13, 2019 11:13 am


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Re: Field of Glory: Empires

Post by dbemont » Mon May 13, 2019 11:51 am

Oops, sorry. Can this thread be closed or deleted?
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Re: Field of Glory: Empires

Post by Isgrimnur » Mon May 13, 2019 12:20 pm

Nope. It shall live on as a monument to your actions. :P
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Re: Field of Glory: Empires

Post by jztemple2 » Mon May 13, 2019 3:54 pm

Well, no matter which thread wins, I'm still mildly excited, perhaps a bit more now that I've found Imperator: Rome to be a bit of a bust. I'm really more excited about the new Fields of Glory II: Wolves at the Gate expansion.

Also, Empires is turned based with two year turns, so it isn't really designed to be a campaign sim. So while it is cool that you can play out battles with FoGII, I don't think you'll be seeing a lot of detail occurring at an operational level.
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Re: Field of Glory: Empires

Post by dbemont » Mon May 13, 2019 7:13 pm

From what I have seen, each turn is one year. But that makes no sense, given the distance that an army travels in one turn. And the turn is labeled with a particular weather condition, which is silly if it refers to a year. I'm thinking the date will quickly become meaningless, you are just on turn 10 or 50 or whatever.

But as to battles, you have no control at all, according to the DasTactic video. You assign a general, who makes quite a difference. You have options as to unit types, and they make a difference. Frontage and terrain matter. (If you lack the troops to fill the frontage and your opponent can flank you, you are doomed.) Lots of variables and an interesting looking system, but unless you export to FOG 2, it's hands off once the battle occurs.

Really, this game seems to focus instead on how to adapt to expansion internally. Really, it looks a lot more promising to me than Imperator.
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Re: Field of Glory: Empires

Post by jztemple2 » Mon May 20, 2019 6:06 pm

With apologies to Sepiche, who posted the first FoGE thread, I'm going to post further updates here since this thread has more activity.

I've been posting some stuff over in the FoGII thread that really pertains to this game, so I'll post it here as well so folks can find it. It is one of the developer threads as mentioned above in the first post, but I wanted to post it here in full because it is an issue that some folks (well, me) have been wondering about.
Hey, I found the mother lode of how FoG:E battles will be fought in FoG:II, Dev Diary #9 Addendum - Playing Empires Battles in FOG2
Playing Empires Battles in Fog2
by Richard Bodley Scott

From an early stage in development it was planned that, in addition to the in-game battle resolution system, Empires would also have the option to fight out battles in FOG2 if the player so chooses.
The main objectives were:

1) That Empires battles fought out in FOG2 should be varied and fun. (Number one priority!)
2) That the armies of each nation should be represented by the correct FOG2 units for their nation.
3) That general skill and traits, unit experience, unit effectiveness, hit points etc. from Empires should carry over into the FOG2 battles.
4) That terrain should be representative of the terrain in the region where the battle takes place.
5) That there should be no adjustments to make the battles more “even”, and no adjustments to take into account the FOG2 difficulty setting. The situation should be as per the campaign situation.
6) That the export/import process and switching between the games should be as automated a process as possible.

How does the game decide which FOG2 unit type to convert an Empires unit to?
Empires has a database specifying which FOG2 unit type each Empires unit type maps to, with a quality adjustment for some. The mapping is different depending on the national archetype. This information is passed in the export file, along with various other factors affecting the conversion.
The Empires system potentially gives "Heavy Foot, Warriors, Mercenary Foot, Urban Militia etc." to every nation. The FOG2 conversion system attempts to convert each nation's forces to FOG2 units that are appropriate to their historical prototype. So for example "Warriors" in a Gallic Army will translate to FOG2 Warbands, but those in an Italian army will translate to FOG2 Italian Foot. This means that Empires "Heavy Foot", for example, may translate to FOG2 Medium Foot for some nations, if the nation never actually had any troops that FOG2 would rate as Heavy Foot.
Also some units translate to a mixture of FOG2 units, because this leads to more historically realistic armies. Pre-Marian Roman legionary units translate to a mixture of hastati/principes and triarii units, in approximately a 2:1 ratio. Horse archer units, if present in large numbers, translate to a mixture of Light Horse and Cavalry.

How does the game decide how many FOG2 units each Empires unit maps to?
The Empires : FOG2 unit conversion ratio depends on the unit type, because it is points based. This is because the difference in effectiveness between various Empires units is often significantly greater than the difference between the effectiveness of their FOG2 equivalents. To get the same relative effectiveness as in Empires-resolved battles, the more expensive (and more effective) Empires units translate to more FOG2 units than the cheaper ones. Some of the cheaper Empires units may only map to 1 FOG2 unit, but some of the more expensive ones could potentially map to as many as 4 or 5 (cheap) FOG2 units in armies of nations that historically did not possess powerful units like Pike phalanxes or legions. Most units will have a conversion ratio somewhere between these two extremes.

For example, because Italian Foot in FOG2 are cheaper (and less effective) than Warbands, the unit conversion ratio for Empires Warriors > FOG2 Italian Foot will be higher than the unit conversion rate for Empires Warriors > FOG2 Warbands. Also, where different Empires unit types convert to the same FOG2 unit type, the quality of the FOG2 units may be adjusted depending on which Empires unit type they come from. (Thus, for example, Urban Militia in some national archetypes may be extremely low quality versions of the standard units. They will also have a lower unit conversion ratio as they are much lower rated in Empires points).
Because the points value ratios do not match up to an exact number of FOG2 units, there is a random element. For example, if the points system means that an Empires unit is equivalent to 1.37 FOG2 units, the system will generate at least one FOG2 unit, with a 37% chance of another one. So usually it will generate 1 unit, but 37% of the time it will generate 2.
A damping system on the chances of selecting subsequent "partial" units is used to ensure that the overall strength of the army does not vary excessively (about 3% in tests), and a unique random number generator seed number for each exported battle ensures that if you play the same battle (from the same export file) in FOG2 multiple times, the OOBs (and map) will be the same each time. (Unless you go back to the pre-battle Empires save and re-export it, in which case there will be a different seed number each time).

How does the conversion take into account Empires general skill and traits, unit experience, effectiveness and hit points etc.?
Unit Experience and Effectiveness affect FOG2 unit Experience and Elan respectively. FOG2 unit Quality is the average of those ratings.
Empires Hit Points represent current strength compared with full paper strength, so affects the unit conversion ratio.
Generals use their Empires skill rating for attack or defence depending on which side counts as attacking in Empires. General traits applicable in the regional terrain add their modifiers to those skill ratings. If there is an overall difference between the skill ratings of the opposing generals, then usually an adjustment is made to the quality of the opposing units, representing the effects on morale, physical condition and state of preparedness of the troops resulting from the better general's more skilful pre-battle manoeuvres. Sometimes, instead of a quality adjustment, the lower skilled general will have some of his troops arrive late at the battle.
Unit traits are not explicitly taken into account in the conversion process, because FOG2 already takes into account the different effectiveness of different troop types in different terrain.

Frontage
Empires units convert to an average of 2 to 3 FOG2 units, some more, some less.
We decided not to artificially constrain the frontage in FOG2 battles because it would severely restrict the tactical options – which would rather defeat the point of playing the battle in FOG2. We did not think it would be fun.
Also, as FOG2 battles take some time to play out, we wanted a decisive result, so wanted all of the troops present to be able to take part.

Therefore, the normal FOG2 map generation is used, based on the prevailing terrain in the Empires province. Hence a mountainous, forest or swamp province will result in a mountainous, forested or marshy map, which may result in choke points, but isn’t guaranteed to do so.
This does mean that playing Empires with FOG2 battles will have strategic implications, meaning that the game will play out somewhat differently depending on whether you play all the battles in Empires or not. Personally, I resolve very one-sided battles in Empires and play the rest in FOG2.
Siege assaults are left to the Empires system and cannot be exported to FOG2
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Re: Field of Glory: Empires

Post by dbt1949 » Mon May 20, 2019 8:48 pm

Is this for single player, multiplayer, or both?
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Re: Field of Glory: Empires

Post by Sepiche » Tue May 21, 2019 10:20 am

Thanks for the details jz. Glad they went the route they are going instead of trying to force us into buying all those DLC.

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Re: Field of Glory: Empires

Post by jztemple2 » Tue May 21, 2019 12:12 pm

dbt1949 wrote:
Mon May 20, 2019 8:48 pm
Is this for single player, multiplayer, or both?
This is the answer I got:
Originally posted by jztemple:
Does this crossover between FOGE and FOGII also work in multiplayer?

Response:
Not currently. Whether we will add this in the future remains to be seen, but there are not only technical difficulties, but also it might slow down the campaign too much having to wait for two of the players to fight out each battle.
So just single player for now.
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