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MS Flight Simulator 2020

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gbasden
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by gbasden »

Isgrimnur wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 6:08 pm
jztemple2 wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:52 pm
Isgrimnur wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 2:43 pm
In the past, you just used the throttle as the cyclic. Reverse direction for power, of course.
Yeah, that's what I was using for all my two-decades-ago helo sims. I was hoping someone has made something more realistic, maybe with a collective lever that mounts on the side of a chair, something like that. I got my private pilot's license about a half-century ago :shock: and I've been thinking about talking my wife into letting me take helicopter lessons, there's a school at my local airport. Barring that unlikely possibility, I'd have to settle for a really realistic helo sim and controls setup.
https://komodosimulations.co.uk/
Whew. Over 3 large for controllers is steep. If I could find the proper software that would take advantage of them, though...

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

I thought the AIRACs were supposed to be up to date? Mine is at least a month old. I wonder if it's possible to override the data with Navigraph.

Speaking of Navigraph, has anyone got Simlink to work yet? I got it connected once I think, but after that it's always "could not connect to simulator" or whatever.
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

By the way, for any curious onlookers or fence-sitters: don't pay much attention to my criticisms. It's because I wanted a, you know, flight simulator and that's....not what we got.

But if you want nothing more than virtual tourism, this game delivers and then some. It's beautiful - almost indistinguishable from reality in many cases - and you're completely free to go wherever you want, on your own terms. And yes, you'll probably spot your house from the sky!

Most of my criticisms come from the perspective of a hardcore flight simmer and won't apply to the more casual experience.
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malchior
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by malchior »

Octavious wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:27 am
Also the number one rule is after you get in the plane. Look all around and let the game load. One day a flight sim won't have that issue. One day...

My only real annoying grip is the trees. There's wayyyyy too many of them and they are in silly places. I hope that gets tweaked in the future.

I tried a bunch of things today and I'm pretty blown away. I took off in some random airport in Bosnia with live weather. It was rainy and super foggy. I ended up getting totally disoriented and crashed into trees and it was amazing. :)

We flew over my wife's hometown in Germany and she was able to recognize a ton of stuff. She couldn't stand the extra trees everywhere though lol.
It's for the privacy of the occupants. I agree about the trees. My house looks like it is in a lush forest. Sandy and Isiasis took care of that.

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by malchior »

Something i just noticed - even though I specifically put the packages on a SSD the app still wants to put everything in your user profile on C:. I recommend walking through the General settings and at least move your Rolling Cache where you want it to be if not on C:. If you want a manual cache...same thing. It seems that the cultural love of the C: drive can not be extinguished in the Microsoft empire. :)

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

I'm starting to make my peace with the limitations of this game, but two things continue to annoy the piss out of me:

1. The autopilot. It's mental. About 80% of the time it works, but when it doesn't it just goes crazy. It makes long-haul IFR flying a real pain in the arse.

2. The ATC sound issue. If you can't hear ATC, you're forced to have the window open constantly which is obviously irritating as fuck.

Oh, and special mention for the bloody awful controller configuration. On my X52 the elevator trims are defaulted to a hat switch on my stick, and I really don't think it's working. I'd much rather assign it to the scroll wheel on the throttle, but I don't think the game even recognises the wheel. This is making the aircraft pretty hard to control.
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by jztemple2 »

Microsoft Flight Simulator's terrain glitches are excellent places to visit
We’ve seen how Microsoft Flight Simulator‘s autogeneration has turned the Queen’s abode into an office block. The data-driven city builder does a lovely job at crafting believable vistas, but it can also get a little bit confused, turning bridges into underwater roads and roads into eldritch horrors. It’s made the game slightly less realistic, but also a whole lot more interesting. Players are out there actively hunting down the glitches.
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Isgrimnur »

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malchior
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by malchior »

Paradroid wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 12:07 pm
I'm starting to make my peace with the limitations of this game, but two things continue to annoy the piss out of me:

1. The autopilot. It's mental. About 80% of the time it works, but when it doesn't it just goes crazy. It makes long-haul IFR flying a real pain in the arse.
Yup - the AP just suddenly stops working. I've found that saving out and re-loading makes it work but that's dumb. Same thing with controls just vanishing. I'm in the middle of clicking buttons and suddenly the mouse clicks go away. The QA on this is really sub-par.
2. The ATC sound issue. If you can't hear ATC, you're forced to have the window open constantly which is obviously irritating as fuck.
Yeah - I'm just leaving it open. It's really random.

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Apollo »

Any advice on how to trim the plane for level flight? I'm spending my entire flight bucking up and down, up and down. I've tried using the one and seven buttons to adjust trim but I haven't gotten it anywhere near straight and level. Any advice is very welcome!

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Paradroid
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

Apollo wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 1:20 pm
Any advice on how to trim the plane for level flight? I'm spending my entire flight bucking up and down, up and down. I've tried using the one and seven buttons to adjust trim but I haven't gotten it anywhere near straight and level. Any advice is very welcome!
Since my last post I've (finally) figured out how to assign a control to elevator trim, so this will be the next thing I investigate. If I'm satisfied it works, I'll let you know.

Edit: The bucking is ridiculous in this game. They've really overdone turbulence and wind shear and I hope it gets fixed soon. Honestly, the first patch can't arrive quickly enough.
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Octavious »

I didn't notice much of an issue with the turbulence. I can report that trackir works perfectly fine so far. So much better than using the hat switch.

I did the one landing challenge in the Alps. Holy crap I can't believe people actually land there. Got it in my first try but tons of room for improvement.
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

OK I did get the elevator trim working but I only tested it on the ground. I had it assigned to the wheel on my throttle lever, as I wanted. I tested it in the 747 by hovering the mouse cursor over the trim buttons on the yoke because it gives a trim readout. The good news is that the wheel worked, the bad news was that it was ridiculously insensitive, requiring around a dozen full rotations just to adjust trim by a few tenths of a degree. That's just not doable.

I reverted to the default setting which was to use the up and down positions of the secondary hat switch. This is not what I want at all, but it did work better - albeit still pretty insensitive. Also I noticed that the trim adjustments accelerated the longer I held the button down.

Anyway, as for general trim tips. The way I learned to do it way back in the day was to hold the stick in the desired position, and slowly adjust trim while at the same time easing back on the pressure on the stick. Watch where the nose is pointed (or the VS) as you smoothly adjust trim, and if you notice the nose start to wander, try to readjust to keep it all in line. Eventually you will naturally release the stick with the nose in the same place, and that's where you stop trimming.
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

malchior wrote:
Tue Aug 18, 2020 11:01 am
As an aside, Steam is throwing achievements at me that don't correspond to actual things I've done. For example, I got achieves for starting up the A320 Engines without assistance. I haven't even jumped into heavy metal yet.
I've figured this one out. The achievement is "by the book". On Steam it's for starting up the A320, but in the game it's for requesting takeoff clearance from ATC without assistance.
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by malchior »

Gotcha - sort of a testimony to the tight integration between MS and Steam that we've seen. :)

Just did a A320neo flight from KPHL to KORD. The ATC actually worked pretty well there. The autopilot did some really weird things but nothing I couldn't work through.

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

Nice one! Similarly, I just did EGKK-LFPG in a 747 without an issue. I did try to see how the autopilot handles landing, but predictably it couldn't stay on the glideslope (and it didn't do a very good job of capturing the localiser either) so I took over and landed fine. To my delight, when I parked at the indicated gate the jetway automatically came out to meet the aircraft! That's a nice touch.

Tip: Enable the "taxi ribbon" in the realism setting. Normally I'd balk at this, but so far I'd say that around 80% of the taxiways I've seen are just wrong, so there's no point trying to use a real chart to navigate around the airport.
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by gameoverman »

I've watched a few videos of this. One thing I noticed is a lot of pop in. For those of you who have this, is there a setting you can adjust so you get no pop in even if you have to set other things to low in order to keep framerate up? Or is pop in unavoidable? What if I was to mostly fly over one area, such southern California, would I be able to create a permanent cache of that data on my SSD so that the graphics could load as fast as possible and eliminate pop in?

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by RunningMn9 »

Paradroid wrote:I'm starting to make my peace with the limitations of this game, but two things continue to annoy the piss out of me:

1. The autopilot. It's mental. About 80% of the time it works, but when it doesn't it just goes crazy. It makes long-haul IFR flying a real pain in the arse.

2. The ATC sound issue. If you can't hear ATC, you're forced to have the window open constantly which is obviously irritating as fuck.

Oh, and special mention for the bloody awful controller configuration. On my X52 the elevator trims are defaulted to a hat switch on my stick, and I really don't think it's working. I'd much rather assign it to the scroll wheel on the throttle, but I don't think the game even recognises the wheel. This is making the aircraft pretty hard to control.
I still can’t get it to recognize anything about my X52. It’s there, but it doesn’t know what it is. I have to set every single control by hand, and the names of the controls in the game do not match the names of the controls in the configuration software. And it doesn’t seem to recognize the control presses when I try to set them. It makes me the sads.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

gameoverman wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 5:30 pm
I've watched a few videos of this. One thing I noticed is a lot of pop in. For those of you who have this, is there a setting you can adjust so you get no pop in even if you have to set other things to low in order to keep framerate up? Or is pop in unavoidable? What if I was to mostly fly over one area, such southern California, would I be able to create a permanent cache of that data on my SSD so that the graphics could load as fast as possible and eliminate pop in?
I haven't noticed pop-in honestly. It may be there at big airports (god knows my framerate tanks, it was down to 12fps when I was just coming in to land at KLAX) but I'm concentrating on landing so I wouldn't notice it. I definitely haven't noticed it in the general scenery, which of course I have spent a lot of time looking at. I suspect pop-in in this game is a function of connection speed and cache size.

The game maintains a cache whose size you can dictate, so yeah, if you were to routinely fly in the same area it should all be cached and ready to go.
RunningMn9 wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 5:56 pm
I still can’t get it to recognize anything about my X52. It’s there, but it doesn’t know what it is. I have to set every single control by hand, and the names of the controls in the game do not match the names of the controls in the configuration software. And it doesn’t seem to recognize the control presses when I try to set them. It makes me the sads.
This makes me sads too mate. If you're willing to let go of the Logitech software, you could always try completely removing it. I've never installed it, and I've never had a problem with either this or XP11 recognising it.
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Smoove_B »

Treat yo' self and just upgrade.

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EDIT: Looks like it's out of stock everywhere. Consider it then for upgrade inspiration...

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MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by RunningMn9 »

Paradroid wrote:This makes me sads too mate. If you're willing to let go of the Logitech software, you could always try completely removing it. I've never installed it, and I've never had a problem with either this or XP11 recognising it.
I don’t give a crap about the Logitech software. I only installed it because FS2020 didn’t recognize it without it. Of course it doesn’t recognize it with it either.

I don’t know if it screwed up something during the initial install when it was setting up the experience because I didn’t have it connected? But reinstalling the game didn’t re-run that initial selection process again.

I just want it to work.

Not sure if the problem I’m having is because I have the Saitek version of the controller, before Logitech bought them.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by RunningMn9 »

I think I got it sorted now. It still doesn’t recognize the control and create suitable defaults, but I did program it to do the things I want it to do.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by malchior »

Paradroid wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 5:05 pm
Nice one! Similarly, I just did EGKK-LFPG in a 747 without an issue. I did try to see how the autopilot handles landing, but predictably it couldn't stay on the glideslope (and it didn't do a very good job of capturing the localiser either) so I took over and landed fine. To my delight, when I parked at the indicated gate the jetway automatically came out to meet the aircraft! That's a nice touch.
The autopilot approach was...not great. I took over last minute and landed....far...far...down the runway. But it was fine. ;)

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by malchior »

Some of these bugs are unbelievable. Losing the ability to click in the virtual cockpit? Really? It's happened to me 3 times. You can sometimes save/reload the flight but it blows away the flight plan. Other times loading that flight crashes to desktop. This is really, really shoddy QA at work.

Edit: Was browsing some threads elsewhere looking to see if anyone else reporting these issues. The answer is a strong yes. This launch is a complete mess. I did pick up a helpful tip or two - apparently the ATC voice is coming from Azure...so it's likely overloaded. There apparently is an option to switch to Windows Offline voice and people are saying it helps. Also found a potential workaround for the 'unclickable' cockpit. Some people say that resizing ATC windows seems to fix it. I tried changing cameras, resetting cameras, binding buttons, etc. Opening the ATC window and re-sizing it never occurred to me. :lol:

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Blackhawk »

Thanks to a benefactor, I was pleasantly surprised with a copy of this. Earlier I dug out my stick, throttle, and rudder pedals, only to realize that I don't have enough USB ports to plug them all in. Looks like I'm finally going to have to get a hub.
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

Of course, resize the ATC window. Why didn't we think of that? :roll:

Yeah it's an immensely frustrating launch. Thankfully it's also a tremendously high profile launch, so I doubt Asobo will rest on their laurels. I'm looking forward to the first patch...

Welcome aboard Blackhawk! Yes hurry up and get the hub!

If anyone sees a Citation or 747 flying around with the callsign POO42, that's me. :D
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Gateguard »

Simple questions with not so simple answers?

1) Is a Microsoft account required to purchase and/or download MSFS 2020 through Steam?

2) Must you be logged on to your computer using a Microsoft account to actually "play" MSFS 2020?

If "YES" to either question then I just wasted money building a new computer to run MSFS 2020 as I have no intent to give MS any more of my data than whatever they're siphoning off my computer now. :x

Not a total loss, I'll just wait a couple of months and play Cyberpunk 2077...

TIA,

JC

malchior
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by malchior »

Yes - you need a MS account. Even single player.

Though you are missing an experience. There is nothing like listening to ATC yelling at all the real world flights for not following the MS ATC's AI dictates! "UPS2508 you are 21000 feet above your assigned altitude of 10000 feet. Descend and maintain 10000 ft." "United 363 you are 19000 feet above your...."

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Gateguard »

malchior wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 6:26 pm
Yes - you need a MS account. Even single player.

Though you are missing an experience. There is nothing like listening to ATC yelling at all the real world flights for not following the MS ATC's AI dictates! "UPS2508 you are 21000 feet above your assigned altitude of 10000 feet. Descend and maintain 10000 ft." "United 363 you are 19000 feet above your...."
Thank you, Malchior. Maybe I'll change my mind at some point...but I doubt it.

Follow-up question: Why has this not caused a kerfuffle like the current "Facebook account necessary to use your Oculus VR headset" ? (I'm not buying one of those either. )

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

Possibly because you already need to be logged into a Microsoft account just to use Windows 10?
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by gameoverman »

Paradroid wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 6:30 pm
gameoverman wrote:
Wed Aug 19, 2020 5:30 pm
I've watched a few videos of this. One thing I noticed is a lot of pop in. For those of you who have this, is there a setting you can adjust so you get no pop in even if you have to set other things to low in order to keep framerate up? Or is pop in unavoidable? What if I was to mostly fly over one area, such southern California, would I be able to create a permanent cache of that data on my SSD so that the graphics could load as fast as possible and eliminate pop in?
I haven't noticed pop-in honestly. It may be there at big airports (god knows my framerate tanks, it was down to 12fps when I was just coming in to land at KLAX) but I'm concentrating on landing so I wouldn't notice it. I definitely haven't noticed it in the general scenery, which of course I have spent a lot of time looking at. I suspect pop-in in this game is a function of connection speed and cache size.

The game maintains a cache whose size you can dictate, so yeah, if you were to routinely fly in the same area it should all be cached and ready to go.
Thanks. I'm guessing then that maybe it's a settings thing and the people who made the videos had lower distance set. It's impossible not to notice buildings and/or trees and such suddenly appear. I'm glad to hear you can save certain areas as I'm someone who'd fly over the same areas over and over again.

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Gateguard »

Paradroid wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:03 pm
Possibly because you already need to be logged into a Microsoft account just to use Windows 10?
Nope. Two different computers running W10 and neither has an MS account... Just using a local account on both.

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

I was answering your question about the lack of outcry. You may be using a local account but my guess is most people are using a Microsoft account. Also, if you're running Windows 10 then all your data belong to Microsoft. Creating an account is just for their benefit, not yours.
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Gateguard »

Paradroid wrote:
Thu Aug 20, 2020 7:46 pm
I was answering your question about the lack of outcry. You may be using a local account but my guess is most people are using a Microsoft account. Also, if you're running Windows 10 then all your data belong to Microsoft. Creating an account is just for their benefit, not yours.
Fair enough. I'm sure MS as well as hackers around the world know more about me than I do, but I'm getting old and am tired of having to jump through more and more hoops just to play games. Sure hope installing and playing Cyberpunk 2077 isn't like MSFS 2020... (Now where is that bottle of aspirin? :grund:

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

I flew an Airbus for the first time last night and I have to say, I definitely prefer Boeing airliners. The A320 may have those slick buttons on the overhead panel, but it also has a horrible MCP. Knobs that you slew up and down as well as rotate - yuck! Everything's separated and clearly laid out on the Boeing aircraft.

Anyway I repeated the route in XP11 and just enjoyed myself so much more. It's nice having actual control over the FMC, for example. I think I might concentrate on VFR flying in MSFS and stick to XP11 for IFR flights until some decent payware airliners come out for MSFS.
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by malchior »

Inversely I just tried a Boeing and I'm completely lost in the MFC. I'll have to watch some videos. :)

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

I'm getting a bit pissed off with the lack of navigation functionality in this game. I think the devs just expect people to follow their flight plans without changing them, and if you go VFR sightseeing you're completely on your own. I've been drifting back to X-Plane more and more over the last 24 hours.

According to Steam only 1.8% of players have flown an ILS landing!
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by RunningMn9 »

I tried to learn how to use trim. I’m too dumb to get it I guess.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range

malchior
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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by malchior »

Paradroid wrote:
Fri Aug 21, 2020 12:49 pm
According to Steam only 1.8% of players have flown an ILS landing!
Changing a flight plan is *painful*. Sometimes the ATC menu doesn't even show the option even if you program it to request the change.

What's weird about all this is people in the beta are saying things aren't working that were working. So some sort of regression happened or they had too much load and had to scale back Azure. It's a bit of a mystery and hopefully it'll settle down over the next few weeks.

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Re: MS Flight Simulator 2020

Post by Paradroid »

RunningMn9 wrote:
Fri Aug 21, 2020 12:51 pm
I tried to learn how to use trim. I’m too dumb to get it I guess.
Do what I did. While still on the ground hover the mouse cursor over the trim button/wheel such that the tooltip tells you what the level of trim is. Then start adjusting it while you watch the readout. That way you'll get a feel for how strong it is.

Then when you put it in practice, the trick is not to fly with trim. Set the plane up exactly as you want it, whether to maintain level flight or a specific desired climb or fall, and then trim as you gradually relieve pressure on the stick. As soon as you can let go of the stick - that's when you stop trimming.
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