Oddly Unfulfilled...

Post by **godhugh** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 1:40 pm

I just started a new job a month ago and I'm finding myself unfulfilled. I worked as a Helpdesk Supervisor at my old company and my new job is pretty much the same, but on steroids. More projects, more client interaction, more responsibility. Before I started, it really seemed like the job I'd been hoping to get for a long time.

So far though, while it's exactly as advertised, I just dont....well...like it. I'm starting to think the management, project manager route is just not for me.

Normally, I would just start looking for something else to do. However, it's not that easy. My wife and I are trying to get pregnant, we're looking to move into a house in the next few months, and we just got a new car. So I have to maintain the same salary level I have now (40k a year).

I'd like to do something in either the medical field or in politics, but I don't know where to start or whether I can make as much as I need too.

Any suggestions?

Dirt · Post by **Dirt** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 1:42 pm

Politics doesn't pay well.

Post by **godhugh** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 1:44 pm

Yeah, I figured as much. It's kind of a pipe dream, but hey, what are you gonna do

.

I'm really open to any kind of career change. I'm just more and more certain that management (especially in IT) just isn't what I want to do.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 1:45 pm

Dirt wrote:Politics doesn't pay well.

If you're corrupt, it does.....

Dirt · Post by **Dirt** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 1:48 pm

Do you have a degree in IS?

Tareeq · Post by **Tareeq** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 1:51 pm

Dirt wrote:Do you have a degree in IS?

That depends on what the meaning of IS is.

Dirt · Post by **Dirt** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 1:52 pm

Information Systems.

Debris · Post by **Debris** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 2:27 pm

Welcome to the wonderful world of "working at a job I don't really enjoy because it pays the bills."

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 2:31 pm

godhugh wrote:Normally, I would just start looking for something else to do. However, it's not that easy. My wife and I are trying to get pregnant, we're looking to move into a house in the next few months, and we just got a new car. So I have to maintain the same salary level I have now (40k a year).

That sound you heard was the doors of the prison cell clanging shut. Welcome to the club.

RMC · Post by **RMC** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 2:33 pm

This is kind of funny, becasue I just left my Job as a project manager for a software company and started at a hospital. Just to place where I am at I am in the Cleveland, Ohio area.

I work in the QI (Quality Improvement) department as a report writer / Hardware guy / Database Admin / Stats Guy/ All around nice guy to have around....

My position has been invented becasue of new changes to the health care industry involving what is called Core Measures.

Anywho, I make less than I did as a project manager(but still over the 40k you mentioned) but no longer have to travel and have better Health Insurance.

Now as for how I got this sweet gig, I knew someone. So the only advice I have is look in the want ads and put your resume in at the local hospitals. If you have to get a job in IT to start with and then find something else to apply for once you are in the hospital, becasue here at least they hire from internal candidates first...<shrug>

But I have to tell you that working for a hospital is totally different than the business world <shrug> not bad, just different...

Well I hope this ramble helps... Email me if you need any info about Apps I use and stuff they might ask you in an interview if you want.

Jag · Post by **Jag** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 2:55 pm

godhugh wrote: My wife and I are trying to get pregnant

I think this is your problem. You should focus on getting your wife pregnant first. Your own situation should improve drastically.

Seriously though, it sounds like you have a bunch of life altering changes coming (kids, car, house) so you should ideally have found something secure at least for the short term. It never hurts to look, check out the local ads, monster, etc to see what catches your eye. Don't let your attitude affect your work since you will need employment.

I lost a job about the same time we found out my wife was pregnant with our first kid 4 years ago. I then lost another job about 2 years ago after we found out she was pregnant with our second. I'm in a good position now and we're done having kids

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 3:40 pm

Tareeq wrote:
Dirt wrote:Do you have a degree in IS?
That depends on what the meaning of IS is.

Dirt wrote:Information Systems.

Woosh.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 4:50 pm

Your goal now is to try to figure out what level of work is the bare minimum possible to not get fired. As RunningMan said, you've now seen the bars of your prison. Let us help you get comfortable.

Get paid the most for doing the least and find your fulfillment elsewhere - home, family, wife - anything but dragging stones to the pyramid.

Crowley · Post by **Crowley** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 4:58 pm

Welcome my son
Welcome to the machine

Mookee · Post by **Mookee** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 5:05 pm

Smoove_B wrote:Your goal now is to try to figure out what level of work is the bare minimum possible to not get fired.

You know what is really frustrating? And trust me Smoove, RM9, et al..., I'm on your side on this one, but it's so goddamn hard to be in charge of someone with this mindset ESPECIALLY when you have that mindset yourself, but need/want the money that "being in charge" gives you.

Damn, counseling that person while you know you can't fire him, just makes the hypocrisy sign flash in front of my face. Because I know he's right and we're on the same team as far as that ideology goes, but it's my job to motivate him. Ugh!

Mr. Sparkle · Post by **Mr. Sparkle** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 5:16 pm

Am I the only one who enjoys their job?

JR · Post by JR » Tue Nov 09, 2004 5:30 pm

Probably.

Odin · Post by **Odin** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 5:40 pm

Geez godhugh, it's too bad you aren't enjoying your job - it's exactly the one I'm looking for.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 5:41 pm

Mookee wrote:
Smoove_B wrote:Your goal now is to try to figure out what level of work is the bare minimum possible to not get fired.
You know what is really frustrating? And trust me Smoove, RM9, et al..., I'm on your side on this one, but it's so goddamn hard to be in charge of someone with this mindset ESPECIALLY when you have that mindset yourself, but need/want the money that "being in charge" gives you.

I've been in the public sector for 8 years now. Actually went ahead and earned a Masters in Public Administration. I've tried to make office work-flow improvement suggestions to my boss and peers and they don't care. I've tried to make our workday a little better. Nothing.

When I started in my field, I had enthusiasm and interest in the job. Over time, I began to see that no matter how hard I worked or how far above and beyond I went in the name of "Public Service" my raise was EXACTLY the same as the person that sat next to me and did jack crap all day long. The same people that take a 15 minute cigarette break every hour. Are nasty to the public. Don't do a damn thing other than complain about their miserable lives and take it out on everyone else.

I would love to be in charge of someone like me - mostly because I'm not intimidated by someone that has half a brain and actually wants to do their job in a creative manner.

So instead of coming into work and getting frustrated at inefficiency and general ineptitude, I slip into apathy and count the days until I'm vested in the pension system.

And each and every year I lower the bar and continue to get the same level of praise for my "quality work" and "service".

It really is sad.

My boss has no management or leadership skills. Like you, she simply took the promotion to gain the extra money. And while her wallet is doing fantastic, our office suffers.

Mookee · Post by **Mookee** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 5:42 pm

Mr. Sparkle, what do you do?

Mookee · Post by **Mookee** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 5:54 pm

Smoove, hypothetically (or not, maybe it's the case), what if your boss feels the same way you do?

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:05 pm

Mookee wrote:Smoove, hypothetically (or not, maybe it's the case), what if your boss feels the same way you do?

She needs to find ways to make me happy or I'm out of there. Right now, my co-worker and I afford her the opportunity to get paid a lot of money and she has very little to worry about - because we keep the office running 90% of the time without any intervention from her.

I like to say I'm a victim of my own competence. While I hardly ever go out of my way to work "hard", I never take my attitude out on the customers. I do for them anything I can to rectify problems.

And that's why my boss can work 6 hour days and make 80K a year. She's able to graba a free ride on her past success. I'm nearly certain she doesn't give a rat's patootie about her job, or mine for that matter.

If performance reviews don't equate to some type of incentive at work, why work any more than you have to? If, as a boss, you cannot budget a merit raise, at least allow someone to creatively do their job.

Find out what motivates someone - it might not be money - and help them enjoy their job. Some people like titles. Others dig public praise. Some like private praise. Some people get enough satisfaction knowing they have the ability to tackle a problem from a number of different directions without having to check with their boss every 10 minutes.

Delegation can be a beautiful thing. Empower someone. That's my 2 minute advice.

The Meal · Post by **The Meal** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:17 pm

Were you not doing the kid/house/car/wife thing, advice would be simple: get appropriately trained (while you're young!) for a career you think you'd find fufilling. With other pressures at hand, however, you may be in the unenviable position of having to sit there and take it. If you think you can grin-and-bear-it while getting some stability in the important facets of your life, then I'd offer hope for you to eventually try to get retrained down the road. Or hope that your job gets outsourced overseas and let GW's initiatives pay you to get retrained (the folks my employer axed got a sweet two-year deal to go back to college or elsewhere and get reeducated on the taxpayers' dimes as their jobs were considered moved to Singapore).

If it's any consolation, get reeducated in a field you think you may enjoy is no guarantee for actually enjoying your future job in that field (or in the current economic climate, even finding a job in that field).

~Neal

MHS · Post by **MHS** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:27 pm

Smoove_B wrote:If performance reviews don't equate to some type of incentive at work, why work any more than you have to? If, as a boss, you cannot budget a merit raise, at least allow someone to creatively do their job.

You'll be able to relate to this, Smoove. Like you, I work in the public sector... for the county to be specific. I don't work all that hard. I consider myself an average employee, but I am one of the few people who consistently gets really nice client feedback forms, and all the staff members here constantly tell my boss how much they love me- that I'm fast to respond and don't talk down to them when I explain how to do tech related things.

So, I just had my annual review, where I was required to evaluate myself and then my supervisor went over it with me. There were 25 items on which to rate myself, I marked average on 19, above average on 5, and exceptional on 1. The six items I marked above average were deleted by her when we reviewed them together. She told me that they absolutely are not allowed to turn in a performance review with any above averages... because then they'd have to give me a raise beyond what everyone else gets (2%, woo-hoo) and they can't afford to do that.

Yeah, so there's great incentive to do more than the bare minimum, eh?

gellar · Post by **gellar** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:33 pm

Mr. Sparkle wrote:Am I the only one who enjoys their job?

I dig my job 90% of the time. I enjoy going to work.

gellar

Eco-Logic · Post by **Eco-Logic** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 6:48 pm

gellar wrote:
Mr. Sparkle wrote:Am I the only one who enjoys their job?
I dig my job 90% of the time. I enjoy going to work.

gellar

What do you do gellar?

I also enjoy my job. However, I dislike my boss and am having issues at work as you can read in the thread on down the front page bit.

Dirt · Post by **Dirt** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:34 pm

I dislike my job and the lack of opportunities. But my boss is cool.

knob · Post by **knob** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:43 pm

Become a nurse. Lots of demand, pays just as well, if not better in some cases.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:12 pm

MHS wrote:
So, I just had my annual review, where I was required to evaluate myself and then my supervisor went over it with me. There were 25 items on which to rate myself, I marked average on 19, above average on 5, and exceptional on 1. The six items I marked above average were deleted by her when we reviewed them together. She told me that they absolutely are not allowed to turn in a performance review with any above averages... because then they'd have to give me a raise beyond what everyone else gets (2%, woo-hoo) and they can't afford to do that.

I don't know what's worse. I don't get a formal review at this job...but I have been in your position elsewhere and had a similar discussion with my boss at the time. I worked there...about 8 months. During my first review, he indicated that he couldn't score me any higher than "average" overall because the County Administrator indicated to all department heads that is all that would be tolerated.

There, your raise was tied to your review and some department heads were giving ALL employees excellent performance reviews while others were either intentionally keeping them low or actually doing them correctly. Soon, entire departments were getting 5%+ annual raises while others were getting 2% or so on average.

So now the review is formal procedure and everyone earns a 3% increase. Fantastic.

About 5 years ago I was at work and some random woman came to the counter to talk to our office. Apparently at our annual free cancer screening something came up during her examination that indicated she should go see her doctor immediately. She did and it turned out she had early stage breast cancer. Our free clinic probably saved her life. She came in to thank us all. Not once has ANYTHING I've done at work come close to that 5 minute visit from some random taxpayer.

And if I leave the public sector in 2 more years it'll be the one good memory I'll take with me.

Sunderer · Post by **Sunderer** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:30 pm

Although I'm not Richard Gere catering to Lauren Hutton, I enjoy my job. However, my thoughts on this dilemna are as follows:

- It's freakin November. You got two holidays coming up. Let's not make any major life decisions for 2 months.

- drink heavily this Friday night.

- Beginning in January, objectively explore your options. Gut check and figure out if this is what you want to do. Believe it or not, this should take no more than thirty minutes. Gut checking can be done ONLY on the toilet. If you think I am joking, think again.

- after you flush, make a decision, then a plan. This plan should include as much sex with your wife. Remember, she's trying to get you pregnant.

- Again, drink heavily this Friday night.

(Now for a slightly funny story to cheer you up. Some of you may know I'm a divorce lawyer. We have a client going through a divorce who also was on Vioxx for a LONG time. Now I'm not making any causal connection, but our client IS NOT in good health. He has had MAJOR health problems, but we only do what we do. Anyway, one of my legal assistants met with him. During a break today, she came to me and said "Mr Sunderer, Mr. Smith really doesn't look good. He looks emancipated." I laughed until i nearly pee'd myself).

Tareeq · Post by **Tareeq** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:34 pm

Sunderer wrote:"Mr Sunderer, Mr. Smith really doesn't look good. He looks emancipated."

It really bothers them when one of us gets free, doesn't it?

Dirt · Post by **Dirt** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:42 pm

Stand up. Go to your window, open it and scream as loud as you can, "TAKE THIS JOB AND SHOVE IT!"

gellar · Post by **gellar** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:43 pm

Eco-Logic wrote:What do you do gellar?

I work as a Business Operations Analyst/Solutions Engineer for a mid sized email security firm.

I spend half my day reporting to the VP of Sales Operations and help run our worldwide sales team and the other half of the day as a subject matter expert for email security, hygeine, and archiving.

I've been with the firm for nearly 3 years now and know it in and out. Fun place to work.

gellar

Dirt · Post by **Dirt** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:45 pm

Sounds like everyone here is either in the tech field or a lawyer. Geeks and scumbags.

gellar · Post by **gellar** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:52 pm

Dirt wrote:Sounds like everyone here is either in the tech field or a lawyer. Geeks and scumbags.

While I'm not a lawyer, I very much am both a geek and a scumbag.

gellar

The Meal · Post by **The Meal** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 8:59 pm

I'm just coming off a stretch where I wasn't enjoying going into work. Fortunately that issue seems to be behind me and I'm (back) onto doing some firefighting again. Happy is the engineer empowered to make important changes to his design.

~Neal

Mr. Sparkle · Post by **Mr. Sparkle** » Tue Nov 09, 2004 11:20 pm

Mookee wrote:Mr. Sparkle, what do you do?

I work in a cardiovascular research lab... I'm the Biomedical Engineer... which means, that I make sure the equipment works, handle all the mathy/programming stuff and the more complicated analysis... my fellow lab members generally have somewhat poor math backgrounds... the nature of medical research is such that the "hot" new things are very heavy math, but the true math geeks that understand the shit, can't talk to normal people anymore. So while, I don't completely understand what the math PhD's are saying, I can at least act like a translator.

So in essence, with only a BS, I get to be a big fish in a small pond... while we exist in a hospital environment, we are pretty much a self-contained unit... the only person I report/answer to is the guy who runs the lab (PhD)... even with Post-Docs, it's very egalitarian... and a small working unit. Most labs aren't like that however, and are pretty hierarchical... but my boss is really cool.

The thing I love the most, is that my boss treats me like a Post-Doc... I get to do my own projects... coming up with the idea (almost always collaborative), helping to design the study, collect the data, be primarily responsible for analysis, and then write up the paper as first author. Nothing feels better than taking a project from start to finish, and seeing that abstract, with your name first, on PubMed.

There is a lot of turnover, which is the nature of research... but its not a bad thing... people move on to do different things... keeps it fresh, with new personalities and new ideas.

The pay is not great (I make 40k now, but started in the mid to low 30s)... for an engineer anyway... and I can't really "move up" without getting a more advanced degree... but I find it so fulfilling that such achievements as a promotion, mean very little to me.

I like what I do.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:35 am

I think I'm done looking for fulfillment in jobs. They start out full of promise, then degenerate into an inevitable bad end. This time around I'm looking for big bucks, or low involvement, or both.

Dirt · Post by **Dirt** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 12:13 pm

Big BUCKS! Big BUCKS! No WHAMMIES!

is_dead · Post by **is_dead** » Wed Nov 10, 2004 1:17 pm

I have a theory that quality of work has very little to do with quality of WORK, but the people you work with. Sure, the actual tasks can help you with the whole sense of accomplishment aspect, but enjoyment comes down to who you're working with. If there's a field you like, then maybe some of the people will have more in common with you and you'll like them. I honestly believe that picking rocks in a farmers field with a friend, when you spend the whole time joking and telling stories, is a better job than managing a department at a fortune 500 where everyone hates everyone and people are all competing for the same promotion.

Anyway, before you give up on a job, put an effort into the people there. Invite them out or over to your house, go for a drink. Try to organize a friday lunchtime gathering where you bring in some food and drinks (alcoholic or not depending on the company), don't cut it short at 1 o'clock. Ask people their opinion on urban sprawl or traffic congestion or tell them about the black boxes in cars. Join the company sports team or organize one, just to rent a field and play soccer among yourselves.

If you go through the effort at that place, and you get a poor response, everyone is busy or too tired or everyone thinks the friday gathering was dumb, then you'll feel a lot better about looking for work elsewhere.

Octopus Overlords

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