Stephen King's 'Dark Tower' Set For Film Trilogy, TV Series

TiLT · Post by **TiLT** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 1:32 am

Yeah, not a good fit for Roland. Could be quite interesting as the Man in Black though.

Pyperkub · Post by **Pyperkub** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 5:55 am

You guys are nuts - he could be a great Roland (though he's also looking at Flagg in the Stand??? That would be phenomenal, though I always pictured Flagg as black (was that in the book? I think so...).

msteelers · Post by **msteelers** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 7:39 am

He would be great as a bad guy in this series, but i don't see him as Roland at all.

Odin · Post by **Odin** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:39 am

Pyperkub wrote:You guys are nuts - he could be a great Roland (though he's also looking at Flagg in the Stand??? That would be phenomenal, though I always pictured Flagg as black (was that in the book? I think so...).

Randall Flagg from The Stand and Marten Broadcloak, as well as a boatload of other aliases, are the same guy.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:46 am

He'd have to put some meat on his bones to play Roland, but I think he could pull it off. He's a pretty phenomenal actor.

I'd rather see him as Marten though.

msteelers · Post by **msteelers** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 9:50 am

YellowKing wrote:He'd have to put some meat on his bones to play Roland, but I think he could pull it off. He's a pretty phenomenal actor.

I don't know. Physique wise he matches the image of Roland that I have in my mind.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 3:06 pm

Since Roland is based on Clint Eastwood, how cool would that be? Too old I guess. Lots of stunt doubles might make it work though.

"No actors have been officially attached for the movie, although, Daily Mail reported that 'No Country for Old Men' actor Javier Bardem, and 'Noah' star Russell Crowe are heavily speculated to be the interested in playing the role of Roland Deschain."

from: http://www.vcpost.com/articles/97576/20 ... tation.htm

Pyperkub · Post by **Pyperkub** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 7:12 pm

Odin wrote:
Pyperkub wrote:You guys are nuts - he could be a great Roland (though he's also looking at Flagg in the Stand??? That would be phenomenal, though I always pictured Flagg as black (was that in the book? I think so...).
Randall Flagg from The Stand and Marten Broadcloak, as well as a boatload of other aliases, are the same guy.

Yeah, but they said he would only be in 1.

Odin · Post by **Odin** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 11:10 pm

I actually misread your question. When you asked if Flagg was black in The Stand, I somehow read that as asking if Flagg from The Stand was also in The Dark Tower.

As to his skin color, I never pictured Flagg as black. However I had already seen the miniseries before I read the book, so I always picture Flagg looking like John Parr.

Kelric · Post by **Kelric** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 11:14 pm

This conversation is already 3 years old? Yikes... I would have guessed it was from last year.

Odin · Post by **Odin** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 11:19 pm

Yeah, it hasn't been smooth. Which isn't surprising, really. Not only is it a HUGE series, but some of the individual books (notably Wizard and Glass, though The Waste Lands could also qualify) could easily fill multiple films if somebody wanted to take a Jackson-esque approach. Making a multi-film series and tying it in with some sort of TV series that's running concurrently with the films is also unprecedented to my knowledge, so I'm sure that makes the whole thing even harder to get ones arms around. It's going to be hard to pull off and it's going to cost a fortune. That's got to make some people nervous. King movies also don't have a spectacular track record as a whole.

WarPig · Post by **WarPig** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 11:24 pm

Odin wrote:Making a multi-film series and tying it in with some sort of TV series that's running concurrently with the films is also unprecedented to my knowledge, so I'm sure that makes the whole thing even harder to get ones arms around.

Though it's not based on a book series, do you not think this has already happened with Marvel's Agents of SHIELD filling in gaps between movies?

Kelric · Post by **Kelric** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 11:26 pm

WarPig wrote:
Odin wrote:Making a multi-film series and tying it in with some sort of TV series that's running concurrently with the films is also unprecedented to my knowledge, so I'm sure that makes the whole thing even harder to get ones arms around.
Though it's not based on a book series, do you not think this has already happened with Marvel's Agents of SHIELD filling in gaps between movies?

I don't know how they would do it with Dark Tower, but one does not have to watch Agents of SHIELD to be able to follow the movies. It may help, but it is not necessary.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 12:03 am

Personally I think they should ditch the film idea and just do the TV series ala Game of Thrones.

Game of Thrones costs $6 million an episode, which is insanely expensive for a series. But even if you say the Dark Tower would match that (which I don't think it would, since you're not dealing with armies and battle scenes), you're still looking at only $78 million for a 13-episode season. You know they're going to spend probably twice that on a 2-2 1/2 hour film adaptation and have to cut more story. And if it bombs at the box office, you're pretty much one and done.

I just don't see the upside of going theatrical first, particularly with such a niche genre film. I guess the potential pay-off is bigger when you consider the global box office and home video, so maybe that's the angle they're going for.

Odin · Post by **Odin** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 10:26 am

WarPig wrote:
Odin wrote:Making a multi-film series and tying it in with some sort of TV series that's running concurrently with the films is also unprecedented to my knowledge, so I'm sure that makes the whole thing even harder to get ones arms around.
Though it's not based on a book series, do you not think this has already happened with Marvel's Agents of SHIELD filling in gaps between movies?

Well, yes, I believe that what you describe has happened. Sort of. Kind of. Not really, no. The MCU movies tell their own individual stories, most of which tie into each other to some greater or lesser degree. The TV shows (AoS, Daredevil) allude to those movies, but only once in a while (Hydra, being the prime example) do they actually touch in any significant way.

Now I don't pretend to have a clear understanding of what they're planning to do with the DT movies and TV series. I don't think anyone does at this point. But the way I saw it described back when Ron Howard was going to be in charge was that since the series is too massive to fit into any realistic number of movies, they were going to supplement the movies with a TV series. In my mind, that doesn't mean one character from the movies (Coulson, to keep with your comparison) leading an entirely different group of characters through a set of minimally-related adventures taking place in a world that's somewhat influenced by the events of the movies. But who knows? Maybe that's exactly what they'll do. If it happens at all.

Odin · Post by **Odin** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 10:28 am

YellowKing wrote:Personally I think they should ditch the film idea and just do the TV series ala Game of Thrones.

I agree 100%. The Dark Tower series would work wonderfully as a GoT-style, adult-oriented TV show. It's literally too big for the big screen.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 10:58 am

Concur

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 11:22 am

Odin wrote:But the way I saw it described back when Ron Howard was going to be in charge was that since the series is too massive to fit into any realistic number of movies, they were going to supplement the movies with a TV series.

That's where I think they'd be making a huge mistake, if that's the route they go. Because at that point, why are you even making the movies? I don't get it.

WarPig · Post by **WarPig** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 11:34 am

Odin wrote:
WarPig wrote:
Odin wrote:Making a multi-film series and tying it in with some sort of TV series that's running concurrently with the films is also unprecedented to my knowledge, so I'm sure that makes the whole thing even harder to get ones arms around.
Though it's not based on a book series, do you not think this has already happened with Marvel's Agents of SHIELD filling in gaps between movies?
Well, yes, I believe that what you describe has happened. Sort of. Kind of. Not really, no. The MCU movies tell their own individual stories, most of which tie into each other to some greater or lesser degree. The TV shows (AoS, Daredevil) allude to those movies, but only once in a while (Hydra, being the prime example) do they actually touch in any significant way.

Now I don't pretend to have a clear understanding of what they're planning to do with the DT movies and TV series. I don't think anyone does at this point. But the way I saw it described back when Ron Howard was going to be in charge was that since the series is too massive to fit into any realistic number of movies, they were going to supplement the movies with a TV series. In my mind, that doesn't mean one character from the movies (Coulson, to keep with your comparison) leading an entirely different group of characters through a set of minimally-related adventures taking place in a world that's somewhat influenced by the events of the movies. But who knows? Maybe that's exactly what they'll do. If it happens at all.

Apologies, I do agree. Agents of SHIELD (and by extension Daredevil and the forthcoming Jessica Jones and Iron Fist) just uses the world and ties events from the movies into their own plots. The shows aren't necessary (yet) to furthering the story led by the Avengers films. I wonder if Civil War will change that.

In regards to DT, I'll echo the sentiment that it could be better served as a GoT-styled epic series. King's writing leaves lots of cliffhanger possibilities for the end of each episode, reeling watchers back in. Extra points if they can work in Anthony Hopkins' character (and actor) from Hearts in Atlantis.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 11:41 am

I know a TON of people who watch all the Marvel movies but don't watch Agents of SHIELD. And I know a few people who watch Agents of SHIELD but haven't seen all the Marvel movies. If you're going to split a saga across mediums, you've got to make the story self-contained on each format so that you're not completely alienating part of your audience. Which just seems like a colossal pain in the ass.

Odin · Post by **Odin** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 1:54 pm

YellowKing wrote:I know a TON of people who watch all the Marvel movies but don't watch Agents of SHIELD. And I know a few people who watch Agents of SHIELD but haven't seen all the Marvel movies. If you're going to split a saga across mediums, you've got to make the story self-contained on each format so that you're not completely alienating part of your audience. Which just seems like a colossal pain in the ass.

Agreed. The only way I could really see it working is if they really split them in some way. For instance. the DT movies tell the main storyline of Roland going from Gilead out into the desert, chasing the Man in Black, meeting up with his Ka-tet, traveling through space and time, and eventually reaching the Dark Tower. The TV series, meanwhile, covers all of the backstory and flashback stuff. Young Roland fighting Cort to win his guns and defend his father's honor from Marten. Young Roland being sent out to Mejis. Etc. Basically the bulk of Wizard and Glass.

Or, better yet, do it the other way around. Make a movie or two out of Wizard and Glass (the Gilead and Mejis parts when Roland is a teen) and let the story of the adults be told in a TV series. That would rock, and you really wouldn't need to see one to appreciate the other.

TiLT · Post by **TiLT** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 4:05 pm

Odin wrote:
YellowKing wrote:I know a TON of people who watch all the Marvel movies but don't watch Agents of SHIELD. And I know a few people who watch Agents of SHIELD but haven't seen all the Marvel movies. If you're going to split a saga across mediums, you've got to make the story self-contained on each format so that you're not completely alienating part of your audience. Which just seems like a colossal pain in the ass.
Agreed. The only way I could really see it working is if they really split them in some way. For instance. the DT movies tell the main storyline of Roland going from Gilead out into the desert, chasing the Man in Black, meeting up with his Ka-tet, traveling through space and time, and eventually reaching the Dark Tower. The TV series, meanwhile, covers all of the backstory and flashback stuff. Young Roland fighting Cort to win his guns and defend his father's honor from Marten. Young Roland being sent out to Mejis. Etc. Basically the bulk of Wizard and Glass.

Or, better yet, do it the other way around. Make a movie or two out of Wizard and Glass (the Gilead and Mejis parts when Roland is a teen) and let the story of the adults be told in a TV series. That would rock, and you really wouldn't need to see one to appreciate the other.

One of those options is probably exactly what they'll do. It's the big challenge with making a TV series out of Dark Tower. Do you let most of your main cast sit out entire seasons dedicated to backstory? That's not a good idea, so they'll try to avoid it, and that can be done by telling parts of the story through movies.

Brian · Post by **Brian** » Fri Dec 11, 2015 7:29 pm

Idris Elba to play Roland.

Wait, what?

Idris Elba might play Roland Deschain in the Dark Tower adaptation

Hunh.

JCC · Post by **JCC** » Fri Dec 11, 2015 8:10 pm

I love Idris and am totally fine with this.

However it will be sad when Detta can't yell "honky mahfas" at Eddie and
Roland. I guess I will have to settle for "honky mafah" at Eddie.

rshetts2 · Post by **rshetts2** » Fri Dec 11, 2015 8:27 pm

Idris is a fantastic actor but this move totally changes so much of the dynamics of the group and thus totally changes the story.

TiLT · Post by **TiLT** » Sat Dec 12, 2015 4:44 am

I don't get the current fascination with putting Idris Elba in everything, as if it was a competition to see who can do the craziest casting with him. I mean, I love the guy's acting, but this is just a strange choice. Roland is constantly (and I do mean constantly) described in the books as having the classic Western-style hero looks, specifically those of Clint Eastwood. His character is to a large degree defined by this.

And as mentioned above, it undermines one of the main characters' central storylines.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Sat Dec 12, 2015 8:52 am

I don't like the choice at all. AT ALL.

As TiLT pointed out, Roland is described in the books over and over again. Readers have a picture in their mind of what he looks like. He's been depicted in the artwork of both the novels and the comic books. To cast an African-American fellow is to completely violate the source material that we've already pictured in our minds.

Because it's not like King doesn't have strong black characters in the books. Susannah Dean is one of the best characters he's ever created.

And no, this isn't about racism. It's about simple casting for beloved source material. When Peter Jackson cast Frodo, he picked an actor that looked like a hobbit already. Not a 60-year old Asian woman. When they cast Harry Potter, they picked a kid that looked like Harry Potter, not a 30-year old overweight red-headed guy.

If Roland's appearance had not been defined so clearly in multiple references, I'd have zero problem with this, because I think Elba is a bad-ass. But NOPE. Not right for this at all. I am hoping Elba is the new James Bond though.

rshetts2 · Post by **rshetts2** » Sat Dec 12, 2015 11:25 am

The thing is, it is about racism, because the source material absolutely embraced those issues and it was in part a driving force in the story line. This is like casting a black man as Police Chief Bill Gillespie, in the movie In The Heat of the Night. It destroys a critical dynamic.

Casting Elba as Bond doesnt bring the same issues. The character of James Bond has no ties to race. I think he would make an awesome Bond. I just dont like the casting concept of Elba as Roland. It just doesnt work.

Post by **ImLawBoy** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 3:33 am

YellowKing wrote:To cast an African-American fellow is to completely violate the source material that we've already pictured in our minds.

For the record, Idris Elba is not African-American. He's got half of that equation, though.

That said, my objection to this potential casting is how it impacts the story and relationships among the characters. James Bond being white isn't a critical element of the overall Bond storyline. Roland being white (and Odetta being black) plays an important role in the Gunslinger storyline.

King tweeted something to the effect that the race of Roland isn't important. Perhaps that means that they've eliminated the racial elements of the story for the adaptation. If they've successfully done this, then it could turn out to be fine. It'll be a different telling of the tale than the books, but I've come to expect that from film adaptations.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 8:05 am

ImLawBoy wrote:For the record, Idris Elba is not African-American.

Haha, good catch.

JCC · Post by **JCC** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 10:22 am

(Shrugs). As I get older I have learned to be less precious about tv/movie adaptations adhering exactly to books. What makes for a great story on the printed page does not always work in a movie or show.

On the other hand the ending of The Stand sucks in both formats.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 11:47 am

Stephen King added his thoughts via Twitter:

To me, the color of the gunslinger doesn't matter. What I care about is how fast he can draw...and that he takes care of the ka-tet.

I'm not against it, it just seems off - mainly because of what Yellowking said. So much has gone into describing Roland and the world, it's hard to just shake off the mental image I've had for 30 years.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 2:14 pm

I wouldn't say it was a driving force in the storyline, but it would strike me odd as well.

rshetts2 · Post by **rshetts2** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 2:39 pm

Carpet_pissr wrote:I wouldn't say it was a driving force in the storyline, but it would strike me odd as well.

I said it was IN PART a driving force. It absolutely affected the group's dynamic and their relationships and we were constantly reminded of it in both actions and dialog. Overcoming the prejudices they had was a big part of their story-line and essential to the development of the ka-tet. Making Roland black removes that entire dynamic and completely changes the group. I guess its a matter of opinion as far as how important that is but in my opinion it is a major change. Can they still tell the story without the underlying racial issues? Of course they can but then it become a different story. This change makes me believe it wont be as true to the books as I had originally hoped. That doesnt mean the portrayal wont be good, hell the Jason Bourne movies threw out about 90% of the books plot and they were still entertaining movies.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 3:47 pm

Also, just given the scope of the books and the sheer volume of content, they won't be able to include all the nuances unless they plan on a Band of Brothers type mini-series (which I would love).

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Sun Dec 13, 2015 6:05 pm

As far as Stephen King giving his "blessing," I think he's proven by now he doesn't really give much of a damn what other people do with his work. He's always treated his books as the only things that really count, and any adaptations are just gravy. Thick, delicious, money-colored gravy.

Even if he did care, it's not like he could come out on Twitter and say, "I don't really want a black guy to be Roland." He'd be vilified in the press and made to issue public apologies for being such a horrible racist.

silverjon · Post by **silverjon** » Tue Dec 22, 2015 5:03 pm

Re-reading through this thread for context unearthed this exchange.

Odin wrote:
Jaddison wrote:weird as it may sound Laurence Fishburne
It'd be a little strange for Suzannah to refer to Laurence Fishburne as a "honkey ma-fa" for most of The Drawing of the Three.

And now, Idris Elba.

Here's a blog post on the subject, voicing the same general ideas that casting Roland as a black man changes the character dynamics.

http://geekdad.com/2015/12/idris-elba-r ... ark-tower/

ImLawBoy wrote:King tweeted something to the effect that the race of Roland isn't important. Perhaps that means that they've eliminated the racial elements of the story for the adaptation. If they've successfully done this, then it could turn out to be fine. It'll be a different telling of the tale than the books, but I've come to expect that from film adaptations.

Those were some of my thoughts as well, that racial tension may just be something they're not interested in dealing with in the films.

King himself has a really poor track record for remembering what he himself made important in his characterizations though. Eddie was the first white man Susannah had ever slept with and this was a huge big deal for her, until a later book when there was a flashback about her sleeping with a white guy during her activist days. Oopsie, Steve forgot the details again.

(And you can say that Susannah and Odetta aren't the same person, but then Eddie would be her first lover, period, and his race wouldn't matter at all.)

I agree with King that it's utterly irrelevant to Roland's character in a self-contained way whether he's black or white or green, and whatever physical description of Roland that King has put in the books is really just scene-setting. Who Roland is inside matters, but his blue eyes don't make him that person.

But it undeniably changes or negates a big part of the Dark Tower's relationships and character development arcs. That's all.

I will say, the more a story is condensed for the screen, usually character development is one of the elements that gets cut most, for good or for ill. If it's done badly enough, the audience's emotional investment in the characters may even suffer for it.

I also want to compare the current hoo-hah about the casting of a black actress as Hermione for this new Harry Potter stage production. In that case, while the frothing naysayers have managed to dredge up various examples of Hermione's whiteness (besides the film casting of Emma Watson), race is in no way integral to Hermione's character. Aspects of her looks that she is self-conscious about can be applied to pretty much any girl, and so can the inner qualities that make her who she is. Her peers never interact with her in any way that draws attention to ethnicity, except for her being Muggle-born.

On the other hand, Harry Potter's eyes are referenced up-thread as an example of films tossing out appearance descriptions. Now, Daniel Radcliffe having blue eyes instead of green really isn't important. Whatever. *But*, the fact that Harry has eyes just like his mother is made much of, over and over again, so casting a girl with deep brown eyes to play her as a child, that's the kind of detail that does matter to the narrative.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sat Feb 20, 2016 12:02 pm

I'm not the greatest with names, but when they announce someone has been cast as a character for a series of books I've read at least four times...and I have no idea who they are talking about, that's not a good sign:

More casting on Sony and Media Rights Capital’s eagerly awaited adaptation of Stephen King’s The Dark Tower, which Nikolaj Arcel will direct. Abbey Lee, who is coming off Mad Max: Fury Road and who stars in Gods of Egypt, is negotiating to star in the female lead role of Tirana. She will star opposite Idris Elba, who’ll play good guy gunslinger Roland Deschain, and Matthew McConaughey, who’ll play the villainous Man in Black.

Oh...she's a Regulator...that is in Book 7. I can totally see why she would be cast in this role for a movie covering the first book. Totally makes sense now.

It won't surprise me to learn that they have completely removed Susannah as a character because her character arc no longer makes sense. Oh, and that Oy will be played by Danny DeVito. Not his voice, but the actual role.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Sat Feb 20, 2016 7:18 pm

This is going to be a big steaming heaping pile of shit in regards to being an accurate representation of the books.

Whether or not it can stand alone as a decent film/show on its own merits remains to be seen. Part of me just hopes it fails miserably and in some small way teaches King a lesson about fucking over his readers by giving his blessing to every dumbass decision studios make when adapting his work.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Mon Feb 22, 2016 1:55 pm

Smoove_B wrote:I'm not the greatest with names, but when they announce someone has been cast as a character for a series of books I've read at least four times...and I have no idea who they are talking about, that's not a good sign:

More casting on Sony and Media Rights Capital’s eagerly awaited adaptation of Stephen King’s The Dark Tower, which Nikolaj Arcel will direct. Abbey Lee, who is coming off Mad Max: Fury Road and who stars in Gods of Egypt, is negotiating to star in the female lead role of Tirana. She will star opposite Idris Elba, who’ll play good guy gunslinger Roland Deschain, and Matthew McConaughey, who’ll play the villainous Man in Black.
Oh...she's a Regulator...that is in Book 7. I can totally see why she would be cast in this role for a movie covering the first book. Totally makes sense now.

What the hell? I hope they will be somewhat faithful in at least one of the two versions (TV or movie), but "female lead role" = "Tirana" does not bode well.

Is this for the movie or the series?

I just finished reading the whole thing a couple of months ago and I don't remember any Tirana. Sounds like a George Lucas name.