Smart phones for stupid people

Everything else!

Moderators: Bakhtosh, EvilHomer3k

Post Reply
User avatar
gbasden
Posts: 7664
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 1:57 am
Location: Sacramento, CA

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by gbasden »

zinckiwi wrote:
THREAD, ARISE.

A few minutes ago I finally submitted my first app (technically "apps" -- free and premium versions) to the Windows Phone Marketplace! Now to sit back and wait for tiny, tiny amounts of cash to trickle in.
Congratulations! What's the app?
zinckiwi
Posts: 1278
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2005 5:54 pm
Location: Chicagoland

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by zinckiwi »

gbasden wrote:
zinckiwi wrote:
THREAD, ARISE.

A few minutes ago I finally submitted my first app (technically "apps" -- free and premium versions) to the Windows Phone Marketplace! Now to sit back and wait for tiny, tiny amounts of cash to trickle in.
Congratulations! What's the app?
"Wayne Gould Sudoku". My father was the one who introduced it to newspapers. He's got his hands full working on a new Windows version of another logic puzzle like Sudoku, so I took the liberty of breaking into the mobile space :)
User avatar
Kraken
Posts: 43688
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
Location: The Hub of the Universe
Contact:

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Kraken »

I let the thread peter out because I lost interest in getting a smartphone. It remains something that I know my business ought to have, but I don't really want and can't afford it. That might change soon, though: My wife's corporate Verizon discount is increasing from 5% to 15% next month, and I think that is just about what the monthly dataplan costs.

Problem remains that if I get one for myself, she is going to insist on having one too, so everything costs double.
Matrix
Posts: 4187
Joined: Fri Feb 25, 2005 12:01 am

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Matrix »

I also need a new phone. But i dont want data plan, nor do i want to have access to emails on the go. I spend more then enough time connected as is. At the same time my phone is malfunctioning, aka problem with adding new contacts. But fine other wise. Still very annoying at times. I might have to get data plan, just because i need some decent looking phone due to image, but other then that i really would have settled for some light and sturdy phone.
User avatar
Creepy_Smell
Posts: 1844
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 5:30 pm
Location: Norman, OK
Contact:

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Creepy_Smell »

One thing I would do is play with the phones in the store but maybe buy online (amazone wireless or newegg). I'm on ATT and thinking of breaking my contract as I want to get on Verizon w/ unlimited data before they get rid of it (soon). I've been eyeing the incredible 2 and in store its 200 for newbies and online its been 80, 50, 20 even 2 depending on where and when I look (amazone has it for 80 and now 50 while newegg had it for 20 and then today for 2). Lots of their new and older phones often 100 less or more than in store.
User avatar
Kraken
Posts: 43688
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
Location: The Hub of the Universe
Contact:

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Kraken »

Creepy_Smell wrote:One thing I would do is play with the phones in the store but maybe buy online (amazone wireless or newegg).
I didn't realize you could do that. Don't they require you to use their crippled version of the OS and a lot of bloatware? Or would they just install that on your aftermarket phone?
User avatar
Creepy_Smell
Posts: 1844
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 5:30 pm
Location: Norman, OK
Contact:

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Creepy_Smell »

Kraken wrote:
Creepy_Smell wrote:One thing I would do is play with the phones in the store but maybe buy online (amazone wireless or newegg).
I didn't realize you could do that. Don't they require you to use their crippled version of the OS and a lot of bloatware? Or would they just install that on your aftermarket phone?
The ones with cheap discount are locked to a carrier so you still get their bloat. Just cheaper than buying in store. Not sure how much unlocked phones are vs noncontract in store.
User avatar
Chaz
Posts: 7381
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 7:37 am
Location: Southern NH

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Chaz »

Hey, good excuse to update my previous post. I've started using my phone as my primary GPS device, since I like how it lets you pick from multiple routes and automatic traffic reporting, neither of which my dedicated GPS device does. That said, using GPS really sucks the battery down. I have about a one hour commute each way from work, and using the phone for both just about kills the battery. I've started putting it on the charger at work, which takes care of the problem, but using GPS stuff really does suck that battery dry in a hurry.
I can't imagine, even at my most inebriated, hearing a bouncer offering me an hour with a stripper for only $1,400 and thinking That sounds like a reasonable idea.-Two Sheds
User avatar
gbasden
Posts: 7664
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 1:57 am
Location: Sacramento, CA

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by gbasden »

zinckiwi wrote:
gbasden wrote:
zinckiwi wrote:
THREAD, ARISE.

A few minutes ago I finally submitted my first app (technically "apps" -- free and premium versions) to the Windows Phone Marketplace! Now to sit back and wait for tiny, tiny amounts of cash to trickle in.
Congratulations! What's the app?
"Wayne Gould Sudoku". My father was the one who introduced it to newspapers. He's got his hands full working on a new Windows version of another logic puzzle like Sudoku, so I took the liberty of breaking into the mobile space :)
I can't find it in the marketplace yet, but I'll grab it tomorrow.
zinckiwi
Posts: 1278
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2005 5:54 pm
Location: Chicagoland

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by zinckiwi »

gbasden wrote:
zinckiwi wrote:
gbasden wrote:
zinckiwi wrote:
THREAD, ARISE.

A few minutes ago I finally submitted my first app (technically "apps" -- free and premium versions) to the Windows Phone Marketplace! Now to sit back and wait for tiny, tiny amounts of cash to trickle in.
Congratulations! What's the app?
"Wayne Gould Sudoku". My father was the one who introduced it to newspapers. He's got his hands full working on a new Windows version of another logic puzzle like Sudoku, so I took the liberty of breaking into the mobile space :)
I can't find it in the marketplace yet, but I'll grab it tomorrow.
Cool, thanks :) Though I believe the approval takes an average of three days or so, so it may not be up until the weekend. (Assuming it passes! I'm pretty confident, but you never know. I'm the only person I know with a Windows Phone so it's been entirely self-tested, and that only gets you so far.)
User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 42239
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by GreenGoo »

Now port it to Android or iOS so that people will use it. :P

Congrats. And good luck!
zinckiwi
Posts: 1278
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2005 5:54 pm
Location: Chicagoland

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by zinckiwi »

GreenGoo wrote:Now port it to Android or iOS so that people will use it. :P

Congrats. And good luck!
Thanks! I've actually had some enquiries from people, while wearing my Sudoku support hat, about an iPad version. So a universal iOS app will be on the cards if the WP7 seems be to popular enough (to the scale of the install base, obviously) to justify it... but I have no background in Objective C, or the iOS api, so it would be a steeper learning curve than just picking up Silverlight.
User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 42239
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by GreenGoo »

I'm not surprised about the interest. I'm not a sudoku guy myself, but they seem very popular, and a mobile device seems the perfect platform for them. I see many people working on the newspaper's puzzle each day during my commute.
zinckiwi
Posts: 1278
Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2005 5:54 pm
Location: Chicagoland

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by zinckiwi »

Lite version is now available! They found an issue with the Pro version coming back from tombstoning which I fixed last night and resubmitted with, so that will trail a day or two.
User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 42239
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by GreenGoo »

I'm putting this here as this thread is where a fair bit of discussion on the new Windows 7 based mobile OS occured.

Something reminded me of the conversation in this thread so I went to check if any solid numbers have been released yet for Windows 7 mobile phone sales. The first two articles were not encouraging, although admittedly we're only just through Q1 and we'll have to wait a year or two to know for sure. In any case, here's one article.
Gartner Newsroom wrote: Windows Phone saw only modest sales that reached 1.6 million units in the first quarter of 2011, as devices launched at the end of 2010 failed to grow in consumer preference and CSPs continued to focus on Android. In the long term, Nokia's support will accelerate Windows Phone's momentum.
There's a chart if you follow the link comparing major players 2011 Q1 with 2010 Q1. For smartphones, MS actually dropped from 6.8% in Q1 2010 to 3.6% in Q1 2011. Still too early to say what will happen in the big picture, but it can be said that MS's new mobile OS has not taken the market by storm.

Another article.

Caveat, this article uses Gartner's data.
www.engadget.com wrote: Direct sales figures for Windows Phone 7 handsets have been remarkably difficult to come by since Microsoft's OS reboot at the end of last year, but here come the stat gurus at Gartner to provide us with their best estimate. 3.6 million of the world's smartphone sales in the past quarter were counted under the Microsoft mobile OS umbrella, of which 1.6 million featured the very latest WP7 software. That means Redmond partners sold more Windows Mobile devices in the first three months of 2011 than ones bearing the sparkling new operating system. Guess now we know what LG meant when it said the Windows Phone launch didn't meet expectations. Gartner sees these numbers as evidencing a failure "to grow in consumer preference" by WP7's launch devices, though it predicts better things ahead, with Nokia's participation helping to accelerate the platform's momentum.
Not sure if the bolded part was expected or not, but it seems a bad sign to me.
Matrix
Posts: 4187
Joined: Fri Feb 25, 2005 12:01 am

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Matrix »

Finally got around to stopping by Tmobile store and re upping for 2 years contract, after 3 years off the contract. Phone came out to about as much as i paid for my last phone, but last one i bought when i wasn't on a plan. Funny thing, i will be paying same amount i pay now, except now with data plus they were doing one day special, so now i am actually paying less by 10$. Whats more amazing, i had no idea how advanced phones are this days. I got really shitty unlimited data plan, since i want to avoid online as much as possible, and still its very fast. Plus the features and all other things, such as build in camera and all other things, are just amazing. I still not planing to use most of those features but just them being present is pretty interesting. My 3 main qualifications for a phone were in that order: batter life, size of the phone, and good camera. This phone fit into all 3 categories and it was no brainier. I am still amazed that its about the size of my last phone but has way more of everything.
User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 42239
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by GreenGoo »

What phone did you get Matrix?
Matrix
Posts: 4187
Joined: Fri Feb 25, 2005 12:01 am

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Matrix »

GreenGoo wrote:What phone did you get Matrix?
Motorola Defy, its on Android platform.

I am still in awe just how much features it has.
User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 42239
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by GreenGoo »

Matrix wrote:
GreenGoo wrote:What phone did you get Matrix?
Motorola Defy, its on Android platform.

I am still in awe just how much features it has.
Heh. I will agree, smart phones are basically sci fi devices these days.
User avatar
Xmann
Posts: 3458
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2005 8:36 pm

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Xmann »

Does anyone know anything about Cricket? We walked by a new Cricket store yesterday and was curious about their phones and service. Didn't know if it's a service to even consider. My wife's phone plan is up and her phone is seriously old school and needs a serious upgrade.
gf.me/u/zhnmhs
User avatar
gbasden
Posts: 7664
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 1:57 am
Location: Sacramento, CA

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by gbasden »

Looks like the WIndows Phone Marketplace just passed 25,000 apps.
The main point is that the WP7 ecosystem is growing, and faster than previously at that -- it took until the end of March to accrue 11,500 apps, a span of five months from its launch, whereas the last 13.5k have come in the brisker period of three months. Provided this acceleration continues, and there's no reason to expect it'll slow down with Mango on the horizon, Microsoft's mobile OS reboot promises to be in pretty competitive shape in time for its first anniversary -- a notable feat considering how far behind WinMo had fallen.
User avatar
Exodor
Posts: 17196
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:10 pm
Location: Portland, OR

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Exodor »

Today I can finally retire my iPhone 3GS

My shiny new Samsung Droid Charge arrived this morning! :wub:
User avatar
Kraken
Posts: 43688
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
Location: The Hub of the Universe
Contact:

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Kraken »

Rise again, old thread.

It looks like my wife has figured out how to pay the monthly cost of a new smart phone. I would like to buy her the device for xmas. We are locked into Verizon.

Verizon advertises lots of shiny sleek gadgets ranging from $100 up to $300 or so. I see most of the same gadgets on Amazon for $100 less, with 2-year activation required. How does that work if you're already a Verizon customer?

Also, my wife says that she has credit with Verizon toward a new phone. Does that mean I need to buy it directly from them to take advantage of that?

I'm probably going to just give her a gift card so that she can pick out her own gadget. I'm trying to determine how much a phone is really going to cost her, and whether I should get the card for Amazon or for the Verizon store.

My hunch says to go to the Verizon store this week, ask them about her upgrade credit, then buy a gift card for an appropriate amount there. Is that the best way to proceed? Time for comparison shopping is running short, especially given that I don't know exactly what I'm buying anyway. I need to take care of this on Monday or Tuesday.
jorgea
Posts: 6
Joined: Sun Dec 18, 2011 2:47 pm

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by jorgea »

I would consider the Droid Incredible phone option. You'll get what you really need which is a good working phone.
User avatar
Odin
Posts: 20732
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:29 pm
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Odin »

jorgea wrote:I would consider the Droid Incredible phone option. You'll get what you really need which is a good working phone.
Or a carrier pigeon! Those are pretty good too, and their cooing really soothes you after a stressful day at the office. If you're a magician, you can learn to hide them up your sleeve, too.
User avatar
Isgrimnur
Posts: 82093
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:29 am
Location: Chookity pok
Contact:

Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Isgrimnur »

Quit post padding after the probable spammer. :P
It's almost as if people are the problem.
User avatar
Odin
Posts: 20732
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:29 pm
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Odin »

Isgrimnur wrote:Quit post padding after the probable spammer. :P
Hey there, bub - I'm not the one who's one a mission to improve my OO post ranking. :wink: I hadn't checked mine in years until I saw you had me in your sights and got curious.

For the record, I'm just having fun on an otherwise boring Sunday afternoon posting humorous responses to the probable spammer.
User avatar
Isgrimnur
Posts: 82093
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:29 am
Location: Chookity pok
Contact:

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Isgrimnur »

Kraken wrote:I'm probably going to just give her a gift card so that she can pick out her own gadget. I'm trying to determine how much a phone is really going to cost her, and whether I should get the card for Amazon or for the Verizon store.

My hunch says to go to the Verizon store this week, ask them about her upgrade credit, then buy a gift card for an appropriate amount there. Is that the best way to proceed? Time for comparison shopping is running short, especially given that I don't know exactly what I'm buying anyway. I need to take care of this on Monday or Tuesday.
That's certainly an acceptable choice. They do have gift cards listed on the site in $25 increments to $100, $50 increments after that to $250. Don't forget about accessories such as extra chargers, a case, etc. to round things out, not to mention if you want to carry insurance coverage for loss/theft/damage.
It's almost as if people are the problem.
User avatar
Zarathud
Posts: 16435
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 10:29 pm
Location: Chicago, Illinois

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Zarathud »

My wife is happy with an Incredible 2. She mostly wanted to be able to use the google integrated stuff for contacts.
"If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein
"I don't stand by anything." - Trump
“Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing.” - John Stuart Mill, Inaugural Address Delivered to the University of St Andrews, 2/1/1867
“It is the impractical things in this tumultuous hell-scape of a world that matter most. A book, a name, chicken soup. They help us remember that, even in our darkest hour, life is still to be savored.” - Poe, Altered Carbon
User avatar
Kraken
Posts: 43688
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
Location: The Hub of the Universe
Contact:

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Kraken »

As much as I'd like to give her the actual gadget rather than a gift card, I'm not knowledgeable enough to pick one out. I don't even know if she'll want a slide-out keyboard or if she's ready to ditch that feature.

Guess I'll be visiting the verizon store tomorrow. Fortunately I can access one that's not in a mall.
User avatar
Kraken
Posts: 43688
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
Location: The Hub of the Universe
Contact:

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Kraken »

My wife took her $200 gift card to the Verizon store today to buy the phone that I had picked out for her (a 4G Samsung with a slide-out keyboard for $150 before $50 rebate, plus tax) and some basic accessories. They were sold out. The kid behind the counter didn't know if or when they would get any more or seem the least bit interested in selling her a different phone.

So she went to Best Buy, where the same phone was $0 (plus tax on its nominal $600 price), and she bought the case and car charger from Amazon for a fraction of what Verizon wanted (the charger was $7, vs $29.99 at Verizon).

At least I can use the unwanted gift card toward the phone bill, so her xmas present actually turns out to be 7 months of "free" data plan. She still ended up with a new phone and a data plan, so she's pleased even though it didn't work out like I expected. The moral of the story being that there is no reason to pay top dollar for anything in a Verizon store.
User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 42239
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by GreenGoo »

GreenGoo wrote:I'm looking forward to seeing how the market develops over the next year.
I did a quick google search and Gartner had this to say about 3rd quarter 2011.

edit: Trying to get this table even remotely readable was a nightmare. I'm giving up for now. If someone wants to quote my post and rearrange the table correctly that would be great. Otherwise, just follow the link above. I can't seem to add spacing or borders. Typical html tags don't seem to work.

edit2: I have no idea what this huge gap is from. Could use some help if anyone has a suggestion.
edit3: Thanks to Coop and Stessier for the explanation and Stessier again for doing all the work for me!
Operating System3Q11 Units3Q11 Market Share (%)3Q10 Units3Q10 Market Share (%)
Android60,490.452.520,544.025.3
Symbian19,500.116.929,480.136.3
iOS17,295.315.013,484.416.6
Research In Motion12,701.111.012,508.315.4
Bada2,478.52.2920.61.1
Microsoft1,701.91.52,203.92.7
Others1,018.10.91,991.32.5
Total115,185.410081,132.6100
Things are not looking good for the Windows phone. They've lost almost all of the little bit of market share they had, and sales are experiencing negative growth. I haven't been following any of the market for months, so maybe MS has given up on the phone or other news that I'm not aware of. Android is clearly dominating the market, although Apple is still doing well.
Last edited by GreenGoo on Sat Mar 03, 2012 11:27 am, edited 2 times in total.
User avatar
Zaxxon
Forum Moderator
Posts: 28118
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:11 am
Location: Surrounded by Mountains

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by Zaxxon »

GreenGoo wrote: Android is clearly dominating the market, although Apple is still doing well.
Gotta be careful with statements like this. On a unit sales basis it's true, but Apple has more profits than the rest of the market combined. From a profit standpoint, Google is decidedly 'meh' with Android, while Apple is the most valuable company in the world.

And I'm an Android guy.
User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 42239
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by GreenGoo »

Zaxxon wrote:
GreenGoo wrote: Android is clearly dominating the market, although Apple is still doing well.
Gotta be careful with statements like this. On a unit sales basis it's true, but Apple has more profits than the rest of the market combined. From a profit standpoint, Google is decidedly 'meh' with Android, while Apple is the most valuable company in the world.

And I'm an Android guy.
Android is essentially open source, is it not? A quick google search shows that it is, mostly, kinda.

No one is arguing that Google is worth more than Apple, or that Android is bringing in more money than Apple.

But there is no arguing against the fact that there are more than 3 times the number of hands holding androids than are holding iPhones.

Cost is obviously a factor, but the cost of top end Android phones are in the same price range as iPhones, yet they still sell well enough comparatively.

I don't feel I was misleading with my post, or dismissive of Apple. *shrug*.

The real point was my revisiting the cellphone market numbers almost a year later to see how my predictions turned out. While I was confident of them at the time, I am fully aware that things can change on a dime.

Seeing the phone numbers, I should probably take a look at the tablet numbers. Android started more in the hole in this market than they did in the phone market. I would like to know how it is doing now, and a year from now. Apple revitalized the tablet market, no question. I'm interested to see what it looks like now and in the future.
User avatar
RunningMn9
Posts: 24461
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:55 pm
Location: The Sword Coast
Contact:

Smart phones for stupid people

Post by RunningMn9 »

GreenGoo wrote:Android is clearly dominating the market, although Apple is still doing well.
The data is from Q3 2011, before the introduction of the iPhone 4S, which was kind of important to their numbers. The numbers also represent a clear distortion, aggregating all Android devices under one umbrella.

Apple is doing better than any other technology company on Earth. It's a bit more than "doing well". They've captured 75% of *all* profit generated by the entire mobile phone market (including non-smart phones). And even looking at the Q4 data wont't show how much movement Apple is poised to make, as they didn't start selling into China until January.

The most glaring contradiction to "Android is clearly dominating the market" is the fact that the best-selling smartphone in Q4 was the iPhone 4S. The second best-selling smartphone in Q4 was the year-old+ iPhone 4. The third best-selling smartphone in Q4 was the venerable iPhone 3GS. It's hard to imagine that Apple could be any more successful in this space. Although I'm sure we'll find out when the 4G iPhone 5 is released. ;)
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
User avatar
coopasonic
Posts: 20969
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2005 11:43 pm
Location: Dallas-ish

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by coopasonic »

GreenGoo wrote: edit2: I have no idea what this huge gap is from. Could use some help if anyone has a suggestion.
Remove all carriage returns from your table to eliminate the huge gap. Yes, really.
-Coop
Black Lives Matter
User avatar
RunningMn9
Posts: 24461
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:55 pm
Location: The Sword Coast
Contact:

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by RunningMn9 »

This notion that Apple is competing with "Android" is Google's invention because it serves their business model. Apple isn't competing against "Android". They are competing against Samsung, LG, HTC, RIM, etc. And it's hard to argue that they aren't beating the ever loving crap out of the lot of them. Samsung usually sells more handsets (I think that has the potential to change with the iPhone going into China), but the difference between Apple and the rest is that Apple actually makes money. Piles and piles of money.

Which is sort of the point of selling smartphones. Any benchmark that shows Apple behind is contrived and neglects to take into account the only point of making and selling smartphones.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
User avatar
stessier
Posts: 29816
Joined: Tue Dec 21, 2004 12:30 pm
Location: SC

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by stessier »

GreenGoo wrote: edit2: I have no idea what this huge gap is from. Could use some help if anyone has a suggestion.
Operating System3Q11 Units3Q11 Market Share (%)3Q10 Units3Q10 Market Share (%)
Android60,490.452.520,544.025.3
Symbian19,500.116.929,480.136.3
iOS17,295.315.013,484.416.6
Research In Motion12,701.111.012,508.315.4
Bada2,478.52.2920.61.1
Microsoft1,701.91.52,203.92.7
Others1,018.10.91,991.32.5
Total115,185.410081,132.6100
You have to take out all the CR at the end of each line and make the table one giant block of text. It's annoying, but I found the best way is set up the table so you can read it, then go back and destroy it. :) I edited this one, so you can copy and paste.

Edited - :doh:, Coop beat me to it.
I require a reminder as to why raining arcane destruction is not an appropriate response to all of life's indignities. - Vaarsuvius
Global Steam Wishmaslist Tracking
Running____2014: 1300.55 miles____2015: 2036.13 miles____2016: 1012.75 miles____2017: 1105.82 miles____2018: 1318.91 miles__2019: 2000.00 miles
User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 42239
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by GreenGoo »

RunningMn9 wrote:
GreenGoo wrote:Android is clearly dominating the market, although Apple is still doing well.
The data is from Q3 2011, before the introduction of the iPhone 4S, which was kind of important to their numbers. The numbers also represent a clear distortion, aggregating all Android devices under one umbrella.

Apple is doing better than any other technology company on Earth. It's a bit more than "doing well". They've captured 75% of *all* profit generated by the entire mobile phone market (including non-smart phones). And even looking at the Q4 data wont't show how much movement Apple is poised to make, as they didn't start selling into China until January.

The most glaring contradiction to "Android is clearly dominating the market" is the fact that the best-selling smartphone in Q4 was the iPhone 4S. The second best-selling smartphone in Q4 was the year-old+ iPhone 4. The third best-selling smartphone in Q4 was the venerable iPhone 3GS. It's hard to imagine that Apple could be any more successful in this space. Although I'm sure we'll find out when the 4G iPhone 5 is released. ;)
Sigh.

The numbers are not a distortion. The apple numbers include all versions of the iPhone. But even if that weren't true, so what? Android is available on a host of platforms at a range of prices. Why should that be held against them? People who chose a low end android did not choose an iOS device. People who chose a high end android also did not choose an iOS device. Just because Apple chooses not to compete in a certain market segment does not mean that that segment is automatically irrelevant.

What's amusing me the most about this defense of Apple (where none was needed in my opinion) is that the numbers were posted to show Windows Phone penetration into the market, which has actually decreased since this discussion occurred (last March was it?). They are clearly floundering and perhaps have given up, I don't know. I have no idea how much more money MS poured into its marketing, but the initial half a billion doesn't seem to have paid any dividends.

Android has over 300% more market share than Apple. No one is refuting that Apple is making a shitload of money. As an open source proponent, and someone who understands Apple's appeal as well as Apple's failings, I'm not surprised. But when people talk about dominating the market, they are talking about market share. You might be able to find market share as a percentage of money being pulled from the market, but that is not a usual metric.

My apologies if my comment about Apple doing well wasn't strong enough for you. "Doing well" can only be described as a criticism in bizarro world though. Unfortunately Apple proponents often seem to live in bizarro world. Apple has (had) a 6th of the cellphone market. Android has (had) over 1/2 of it. I looked quickly for more recent data but nothing came up as quickly as the gartner report and quite frankly the Q3 numbers were "good enough" to show that windows phone was moving backward in market penetration. It was my mistake to even mention Apple, because they aren't any more relevant than the other category or blackberry or android, except to add them together to get the market as a whole for comparison to windows phone. I mentioned Android because I like Android. *shrug*.

So, great. In an off handed post about cellphone marketshare, Apple is worth eleventy billion dollars. Thanks for sharing. :wink:
User avatar
RunningMn9
Posts: 24461
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:55 pm
Location: The Sword Coast
Contact:

Re: Smart phones for stupid people

Post by RunningMn9 »

GreenGoo wrote:The numbers are not a distortion. The apple numbers include all versions of the iPhone.
Except the iPhone 4S, which is the best-selling smartphone ever. Or the free iPhone 3GS. Or the $100 iPhone 4. The numbers are a distortion because they are a snap shot in time (Q3 2011), where demand for one of the brands you are pulling data for had a depressed demand in anticipation of a new model and a price drop on all the older models.

GreenGoo wrote:Android is available on a host of platforms at a range of prices. Why should that be held against them?
It's a distortion because Apple doesn't offer iOS as a product that is competing with Android as a product. "Android" isn't a product. Samsung phones are products. HTC phones are different products.

Treating "Android" as a monolithic "product" makes no sense because the mobile operating systems aren't competing with each other. Handsets are competing with each other. Aggregating by mobile OS is a false comparison because *none* of the players involved are competing on mobile OS.
GreenGoo wrote:What's amusing me the most about this defense of Apple (where none was needed in my opinion) is that the numbers were posted to show Windows Phone penetration into the market, which has actually decreased since this discussion occurred (last March was it?). They are clearly floundering and perhaps have given up, I don't know.
That's why popping out a snapshot in time, without acknowledging the context (in the data shown, there was an artificially depressed demand for Apple while waiting for the 4S), while a similar wait-and-see was going on with Microsoft with respect to Nokia betting the farm on Redmond's OS.
GreenGoo wrote:Android has over 300% more market share than Apple.
No, they don't. Right now, Android is losing market share (they dipped below 48%), while Apple is gaining market share (up to about 28%). And that situation is fluid with the release of a flood of Android handsets, and with the expansion of the iPhone into the Asian market.
GreenGoo wrote:But when people talk about dominating the market, they are talking about market share.
And when people are talking about market share of smartphone manufacturers, it makes sense to look at the market share of smartphone manufacturers. What OS the devices run isn't relevant (outside of the marketing decision on where to target app development, but even then market share is secondary to expected revenue generation, which favors Apple and always has). So if you want to talk market share of smartphone manufacturers, let's look at the numbers for Apple, Samsung, HTC, LG, etc. And let's look at numbers that aren't stale by almost two quarters.
GreenGoo wrote:My apologies if my comment about Apple doing well wasn't strong enough for you. "Doing well" can only be described as a criticism in bizarro world though. Unfortunately Apple proponents often seem to live in bizarro world.
I'm not an Apple proponent. I've owned both, and appreciate that both are out there. I'm an "accuracy" proponent. Right now, Apple is the number one manufacturer of smartphones in the world. Both in terms of physical units sold (only Samsung is close), and in terms of money generated.

With all of that said - I suppose if we are talking mobile OS penetration - that's fine. But that really is only relevant to Microsoft and Google, as they are mobile OS developers where the OS is the product. In terms of Apple, iOS isn't the product. The iPhone is the product. For Samsung, the Android OS isn't the product. Their wide array of handset options are the products.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
Post Reply