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Italians Yelling At Each Other

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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by Kraken » Fri Aug 03, 2012 1:05 pm

tgb wrote:
Kraken wrote:
McNutt wrote: What I still can't wrap my head around is the pride some people take in not having given what is widely considered the greatest American movie of all time a chance. Just blows my mind.
+1. I step outside of my genre preferences all the time to see movies that are reputed to be exceptional. Just last night I watched The Fighter despite a strong dislike for boxing movies. (Despite a well-acted and realistic depiction of Lowell lowlifes, it was a typical boxing movie...5/8 tentacles.)

I've seen The Godfather and appreciate it for what it is, although I don't like mob movies and feel no urge to see it again.
Somewhat o.t., but please tell me you've at least seen Raging Bull.
Yes, and Rocky too.

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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by tgb » Fri Aug 03, 2012 1:43 pm

Rocky is hardly in the same league, but that's a discussion for a different thread.
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by ImLawBoy » Fri Aug 03, 2012 1:48 pm

Smoove_B wrote:Goodfellas is a great film, though I don't feel particularly uplifted when it's over.
I don't think you're supposed to feel uplifted at the end of these movies.
Smoove_B wrote:Importance of family? What ruins it for me is that they have such a deep and structured code of honor, yet they're typically portrayed as being unrepentant misogynists. Everything from spousal infidelity to outright abuse. I can understand cutting up some guy up because he spoke to the police but when you stomp a pregnant stripper to death, I'm not really engaged in your story any more.
With the Godfather movies, I don't think they wanted you to empathize withe characters. These were some pretty horrible people with a few (not fully) redeeming qualities. You're supposed to dislike them when they do something particularly wicked.

With Goodfellas, on the other hand, I think the movie did want you to empathize/sympathize with Henry Hill. Since he's the narrator, it's hard to avoid that. He's also a scumbag, though, and this is why Goodfellas is a significant step below the (first two) Godfather movies for me. (Plus, Ray Liotta has always bugged me for some reason.) It's a very well made movie with some great performances, but I can't praise it like others do because I refuse to have any pity for Henry Hill.
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by MindToyGames » Fri Aug 03, 2012 2:15 pm

ImLawBoy wrote:
Smoove_B wrote:Goodfellas is a great film, though I don't feel particularly uplifted when it's over.
I don't think you're supposed to feel uplifted at the end of these movies.
Smoove_B wrote:Importance of family? What ruins it for me is that they have such a deep and structured code of honor, yet they're typically portrayed as being unrepentant misogynists. Everything from spousal infidelity to outright abuse. I can understand cutting up some guy up because he spoke to the police but when you stomp a pregnant stripper to death, I'm not really engaged in your story any more.
With the Godfather movies, I don't think they wanted you to empathize withe characters. These were some pretty horrible people with a few (not fully) redeeming qualities. You're supposed to dislike them when they do something particularly wicked.
That's why I liked Scarface really, despite the fact Pacino's character is a violent, greedy, nasty, emotionally damaged cokehead by the end, we feel a tiny bit of sympathy for him (or at least I did). Little is empathetic about Tony Montana, and that makes it more challenging to watch (and perform, I assume).

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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by Kraken » Fri Aug 03, 2012 2:55 pm

tgb wrote:Rocky is hardly in the same league, but that's a discussion for a different thread.
Yup, enough deraileur. My point was simply that I often watch movies in genres that I don't like if they have enough hype or critical acclaim, or if they appear to have qualities that raise them above the pack.

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Italians Shooting At Each Other

Post by Isgrimnur » Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:43 am

tgb wrote:
Thu Aug 02, 2012 12:09 pm
Gotti was a punk, and the other heads of the families hated him, not just because of the way he generated publicity (bad for business), but also because the hit on Paul Castellano wasn't authorized.

Note to Trent - Did I ever tell you about my father's connections to Henry Hill?
USA Today
New York City police on Thursday were investigating the bold, fatal shooting of alleged Gambino crime boss Francesco “Franky Boy” Cali outside his Staten Island home.

Officers responding to a 911 call Wednesday night found Cali, 53, who was shot multiple times, police said in a statement. Emergency medical team rushed him to Staten Island University Hospital North, where Cali was pronounced dead.
...
Federal prosecutors have described Cali as a top leader of New York’s notorious Gambino crime family. His murder marked the most notable killing of a Gambino boss since 1985, when Paul Castellano was shot dead in front of the Sparks Steak House in Manhattan. Cali lived less than a half-mile away from Castellano’s Staten Island mansion.
...
Cali was a native of Sicily, and his wife is the niece of Gambino capo John Gambino.
...
Iconic Gambino leader John Gotti died in federal prison in 2002. Gotti's brother, Gene, 71, was released from prison last year after serving almost 30 years for dealing heroin.

Another former leader of the group, Carmine John "The Snake" Persico Jr., died last week while serving a 139-year prison sentence. He was 85.
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by LawBeefaroni » Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:39 pm

Witnesses told the New York Post and other local media the gunman fled the scene in a blue pickup.
Would not want to be driving a blue pickup in NY/NJ right now.
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by McNutt » Thu Mar 14, 2019 1:03 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote:
Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:39 pm
Witnesses told the New York Post and other local media the gunman fled the scene in a blue pickup.
Would not want to be driving a blue pickup in NY/NJ right now.
Looking all Italiany.

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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by Isgrimnur » Thu Mar 14, 2019 1:14 pm

Has the Air Force changed from the old blue pickups that they used to drive?

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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by Rumpy » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:11 pm

So on the topic of the Godfather movies, I did finally see them about 3 years ago. I honestly felt they were not that great. Interesting, yes, but I felt I had seen better movies about the mob. And I have to say, Pacino was much better the older he got. Here though, and maybe it was the intention, he was blank and stony faced and I felt rather underwhelmed by it.
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by Jaymann » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:23 pm

Ya, Pacino went from stone faced to dynamic to caricature.
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by McNutt » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:32 pm

Rumpy wrote:
Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:11 pm
So on the topic of the Godfather movies, I did finally see them about 3 years ago. I honestly felt they were not that great. Interesting, yes, but I felt I had seen better movies about the mob.
<spit take> What? <takes another sip>
And I have to say, Pacino was much better the older he got. Here though, and maybe it was the intention, he was blank and stony faced and I felt rather underwhelmed by it.
<second spit take> What???

Let's break this down:
Better mob movies - I will give you a pass if you are talking about Goodfellas. This is the only mob movie that is anywhere near as good as The Godfather I & II. Which ones are you ranking above them?

Pacino getting better as he got older - Al Pacino (whom I love as an actor) played himself more often than not. With older Pacino I wasn't looking at some creative take on a character. Instead I was seeing Al Pacino giving the same performance in most of his movies. But in the Godfather, that's not Pacino. That's Michael Corleone and his transformation from likeable good guy to terrifying evil guy was slow and deliberate. It's one of the best characters and best performances I can think of. Pacino was at his best when he was young and came out of nowhere to blow everyone away with that performance.

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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by ImLawBoy » Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:41 pm

McNutt wrote:
Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:32 pm

Better mob movies - I will give you a pass if you are talking about Goodfellas. This is the only mob movie that is anywhere near as good as The Godfather I & II. Which ones are you ranking above them
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by hepcat » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:20 pm

I gotta agree. Godfather I and II are fantastic (III was never made, I tell folks). And Pacino became a walking caricature of an actor as he got older. Give me Godfather and Dog Day Afternoon Pacino over anything else.
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by McNutt » Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:32 pm

Godfather III wasn't a bad movie, it was just an okay movie capping off what should have stopped at II. The ending of II was perfect and showed what had become of this man.

Two decades later we get Ricky Roma instead of someone who resembles Michael Corleone in any way. That was not the same character. Not at all.

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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by Rumpy » Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:03 pm

McNutt wrote:
Fri Mar 15, 2019 2:32 pm
Let's break this down:
Better mob movies - I will give you a pass if you are talking about Goodfellas. This is the only mob movie that is anywhere near as good as The Godfather I & II. Which ones are you ranking above them?
Yeah, Goodfellas is certainly one of them. I'll also add The Untouchables in there. There are a few others that are escaping me.

I'll grant that they were very well put together, but it almost caught me offguard at how languid they are in contrast to their subject material, and was rather disappointed at how little Brando was in it for all the fuss there is about it.
Pacino getting better as he got older - Al Pacino (whom I love as an actor) played himself more often than not. With older Pacino I wasn't looking at some creative take on a character. Instead I was seeing Al Pacino giving the same performance in most of his movies. But in the Godfather, that's not Pacino. That's Michael Corleone and his transformation from likeable good guy to terrifying evil guy was slow and deliberate. It's one of the best characters and best performances I can think of. Pacino was at his best when he was young and came out of nowhere to blow everyone away with that performance.
See, and this may be purely subjective, but I felt that he got more dynamic as he got older. That said, when he returned for the 3rd movie, I felt his performance there was more dynamic (from collected experience) than earlier on where to me he didn't look all that expressive. Then again, in a way, I feel time hasn't been too kind of these movies, and I fully respect that they were accomplishments for their time.
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by McNutt » Fri Mar 15, 2019 4:14 pm

I wouldn't say he was more expressive in Godfather III. He just wasn't subtle.

In The Godfather II there is a scene at his mother's funeral where Fredo (speaking of great performances) hugs Michael because he believes Michael has forgiven him. An expressionless Michael looks at Al Neri and his hitman understands what he is signaling. It's one of the most cold blooded scenes in movie history and Pacino does it without saying a damn word.

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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by Rumpy » Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:44 pm

Yeah, admittedly that scene was very good. Perhaps even more striking now than it was when it was first released. And yeah, the 3rd movie on the whole was rather unnecessary and the tone between it and the first two was decidedly different. Felt like a third leg.
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by LawBeefaroni » Sun Mar 17, 2019 9:48 am

The brazen killing was the first slaying in more than 30 years of a New York City crime boss.

While the motive for the killing remains unclear, preliminary information suggests it might not be related to organized crime, according to The New York Times. The report, however, noted that an official cautioned that determination, saying it was still early in the investigation.

...
Shea said there was “extensive video footage” recovered from the house where the shooting occurred.

According to The New York Times, at about 9:15 p.m. on Wednesday, Comello backed his pickup truck into Cali’s parked Cadillac Escalade, then walked up to the door of his home and rang the doorbell, showing himself on video cameras.

“We have an individual come up; there is an altercation with the vehicle in front. We still do not know whether that was a ploy or whether that was an accident,” Shea said.

Shortly after, Comello fired on Cali, hitting him 10 times.
Man, if he got killed in a parking-rage incident....
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by Hipolito » Sun Mar 17, 2019 11:05 pm

I just saw Green Book. Pretty high IYAEO quotient.
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by xwraith » Mon Mar 18, 2019 10:59 am

Random comment:

I always saw the Godfather as a tragedy -- the man who could have left it all behind, but chose the life.
I forgot to call it "a box of pure malevolent evil, a purveyor of
insidious insanity, an eldritch manifestation that would make Bill
Gates let out a low whistle of admiration," but it's all those, too.
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by A nonny mouse » Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:18 am

hepcat wrote:
Fri Mar 15, 2019 3:20 pm
I gotta agree. Godfather I and II are fantastic (III was never made, I tell folks). And Pacino became a walking caricature of an actor as he got older. Give me Godfather and Dog Day Afternoon Pacino over anything else.
You forgot Serpico.

and agreed on all caracature fronts. A shame, really.
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Re: Italians Yelling At Each Other

Post by hepcat » Mon Mar 18, 2019 11:28 am

Oh yeah, can't forget Serpico!
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