Concussion thread

[Isgrimnur]

The NFL and the class action lawsuit had agreed to a $765 million settlement. The NFL agreed to set aside $675 million to cover costs, claiming that the fund would be sufficient to cover 65 years of claims. The federal judge just threw a [citation needed] tag at them.

Judge Anita Brody expressed concern the amount wouldn’t be sufficient. The parties maintained the $675 million set aside to compensate retired players would last 65 years.

“I am primarily concerned that not all Retired NFL Football Players who ultimately receive a Qualifying Diagnosis or their related claimants will be paid,” Judge Brody wrote in the court filing.

The settlement, filed in U.S. District Court for the Eastern District of Pennsylvania last week, outlines a schedule of payments to retired players based on experience in the NFL along with the type and severity of cognitive impairment.

“It is difficult to see how the Monetary Award Fund would have the funds available over its lifespan to pay all claimants at these significant award levels,” Judge Brody wrote.

The judge asked the parties [to] file documentation used to conclude the amount will be adequate.

[Unagi]

a little more of a "and show your work" test instruction, than a citation needed

[stessier]

Either way, be interesting to see if she ultimately rejects it or if the NFL agrees to more money.

[LawBeefaroni]

Makes sense. With 4,800 in the class, let's say that's the number. It's probably more than that since any retired player with a qualifying diagnosis over the next 65 years will be eligible (assuming no future retired players though, since they are putting "safety precautions" in place now). But let's stick with 4,800. That's $140K per player. That's peanuts over the remainder of their lifetime suffering from PCD.

So I can see where the judge is coming from, I'd want to see some maths too. Seems like a low settlement amount. Is it actually fewer players? Are they counting on investment returns from the fund's principal?

[El Guapo]

a little more of a "and show your work" test instruction, than a citation needed

There's a pretty widespread belief that the settlement amount is peanuts compared to what a full remedy would look like, so unless the parties have more behind that number than people think it may be a prelude to a rejection.

[stessier]

a little more of a "and show your work" test instruction, than a citation needed

There's a pretty widespread belief that the settlement amount is peanuts compared to what a full remedy would look like, so unless the parties have more behind that number than people think it may be a prelude to a rejection.

Well, the other problem is that no one is really sure the players could prove the injuries in court. They could definitely prove they exist, but did they happen in Pop Warner, College or the Pros? And if it is a cumulative effect, rather than a one-hit deal, who would be responsible. So a full remedy doesn't seem like a fair compromise either.

[El Guapo]

a little more of a "and show your work" test instruction, than a citation needed

There's a pretty widespread belief that the settlement amount is peanuts compared to what a full remedy would look like, so unless the parties have more behind that number than people think it may be a prelude to a rejection.

Well, the other problem is that no one is really sure the players could prove the injuries in court. They could definitely prove they exist, but did they happen in Pop Warner, College or the Pros? And if it is a cumulative effect, rather than a one-hit deal, who would be responsible. So a full remedy doesn't seem like a fair compromise either.

That's true, but the settlement says (as I understand it) "we'll create this fund, and anyone who can document PTD in connection with NFL play can apply and get their medical care paid for." If they can't reasonably show that the fund will be able to pay for the care of that group, then the settlement remedy is in part a fiction.

[Jeff V]

I'm no lawyer, but I beat one in a game of something once. But if the settlement explicitily states that all valid claims will be paid, does that necessary imply that an initially-created fund will be the sole financing source for perpituity? Just because actual damages over a long period of time might be, say, $2 billion doesn't mean that the full amount of the claims will rise at once. If the NFL is bound by a clause that says they are responsible for all valid claims, would they not still be responsible in the absense of a fund? It would seem to me that setting up an initial fund to administer existing claims then augment it as it is drained ought to work just fine and not leave massive piles of cash waiting 20, 30 years or more to back claims that might never come.

Unless you think the NFL is going to be insolvent, but at this time, there is no basis for such a presumption.

[LawBeefaroni]

I'm no lawyer, but I beat one in a game of something once. But if the settlement explicitily states that all valid claims will be paid, does that necessary imply that an initially-created fund will be the sole financing source for perpituity? Just because actual damages over a long period of time might be, say, $2 billion doesn't mean that the full amount of the claims will rise at once. If the NFL is bound by a clause that says they are responsible for all valid claims, would they not still be responsible in the absense of a fund? It would seem to me that setting up an initial fund to administer existing claims then augment it as it is drained ought to work just fine and not leave massive piles of cash waiting 20, 30 years or more to back claims that might never come.

Unless you think the NFL is going to be insolvent, but at this time, there is no basis for such a presumption.

I haven't looked in to this that much and IANAFL, but generally settlements funds are created and administred solely for the purpose of paying out victims/plaintiffs, often administred by a 3rd party. Such funds ensure that obligations are met despite whatever unforeseen developments happen down the road. It's not about whether the NFL will be insolvent or not, it's about whether the plaintiffs should have to fight through unnecessary red tape to get their money.

Let's say the Monetary Award Fund runs out in 30 years. How is the NFL going to pay victims? Petty cash? Operating budget? What if teams oppose payments? What if there are 5 teams in Europe and 2 in South America? Even if they are perfectly willing to do so, it would be a bureaucratic and tax nightmare.

Ensuring a fully funded fund (or even mostly funded) ensures that awards are paid out properly and future unforseen events do not hamper payment.

[Isgrimnur]

NFL agrees to remove financial cap:

The NFL agreed Wednesday to remove a $675 million cap on damages from thousands of concussion-related claims after a federal judge questioned whether there would be enough money to cover as many as 20,000 retired players.

A revised settlement agreement filed in federal court in Philadelphia also eliminates a provision that barred anyone who gets concussion damages from the NFL from suing the NCAA or other amateur football leagues.

In January, U.S. District Judge Anita Brody had denied preliminary approval of the deal because she worried the money could run out sooner than expected. The settlement, negotiated over several months, is designed to last at least 65 years and cover retired players who develop Lou Gehrig's disease, dementia or other neurological problems believed to be caused by concussions suffered during their pro careers.
...
The revised settlement eliminates the cap on overall damage claims but retains the payout formula for individual retirees. A young retiree with amyotrophic lateral sclerosis, or Lou Gehrig's disease, would receive $5 million, a 50-year-old with Alzheimer's disease would get $1.6 million, and an 80-year-old with early dementia would get $25,000.

Even with the cap removed, both sides said they believe the NFL will spend no more than about $675 million to ex-players.

Brody will decide later whether to accept the new settlement terms.
...
The proposal does not include an admission from the NFL that it hid information from players about head injuries.

[Jeff V]

20,000? How many living ex-NFL players are there? That sounds like nearly all of them.

[El Guapo]

20,000? How many living ex-NFL players are there? That sounds like nearly all of them.

I would imagine that many (most?) are ones who played for a year or two.

[Jeff V]

20,000? How many living ex-NFL players are there? That sounds like nearly all of them.

I would imagine that many (most?) are ones who played for a year or two.

Ah, so it was concussion, not their own suckiness, that led to their early "retirement."

[stessier]

20,000? How many living ex-NFL players are there? That sounds like nearly all of them.

I would imagine that many (most?) are ones who played for a year or two.

Ah, so it was concussion, not their own suckiness, that led to their early "retirement."

Why does it matter?

[Jeff V]

Are they going medically verify every claim before paying? If so, then it doesn't matter. If they are making claims simply because they were lazy, lousy players and it couldn't possibly be their fault because everyone had been telling them they were the shit since Pop Warner, then maybe it does matter.

[stessier]

Are they going medically verify every claim before paying?

Of course they are. But they aren't verifying a concussion happened, they are verifying the diminished mental capacity. Getting money out of this pool is not a good thing in the bigger picture.

[Jeff V]

Are they going medically verify every claim before paying?

Of course they are. But they aren't verifying a concussion happened, they are verifying the diminished mental capacity. Getting money out of this pool is not a good thing in the bigger picture.

How do you determine "diminished mental capacity" from someone who would aspire to be a Neanderthal without any brain trauma whatsoever?

[Isgrimnur]

Player objections:

Seven of the former NFL players covered by the league's proposed concussion settlement have filed an objection in federal court, saying attorneys on both sides have failed to justify the new agreement, reports The New York Times' Ken Belson.
...
“The Revised Settlement is a great deal — for the NFL and Class Counsel,” the filing said. “It is a lousy deal for the retired players, whose rights have been bargained away without adequate or independent representation.”

The objection, raised by players including former New York Jets offensive lineman Alan Faneca, argues that the new agreement will not cover those who played in NFL Europe, and does not do enough for those suffering from chronic traumatic encephalopathy, which can be brought on by repeated concussions. The filing also claims the settlement has not been properly vetted by the players individual attorneys.

[Isgrimnur]

Brandi Chastain

She may have retired from soccer, but Brandi Chastain has never stopped looking for ways to contribute to sports. Recently, that's meant collaborating with Chris Nowinski, executive director of the Concussion Legacy Foundation.

Chastain, a member of the 1999 World Cup-winning U.S. women's national soccer team and a prolific header of the ball, has decided to donate her brain to the foundation after her death, where it can be examined for signs of trauma.
...
However, women have historically participated in contact sports less than men, so Chastain's donation is intended to raise awareness of female concussion risks, even in technically non-contact sports such as soccer, hockey and basketball. It's in those sports where women are more likely than male athletes to sustain a concussion.
...
Research shows women and girls are more easily concussed than their male counterparts. However, scientists don't yet understand the long-term effects these injuries have on the female brain. Only seven of the 307 brains donated to the VA-BU-CLF Brain Bank -- which is overseen by McKee -- have been women's, and none were found to have CTE.
...
Chastain also wants to spark a conversation about whether girls and boys should be learning to head the ball before a certain age.

Chastain said it's impossible to ask children at age 8 to 9 to self-report symptoms they may not understand. These children are getting faster and stronger and better at soccer, but adults still need to insulate them from the potential for long-term damage from head injuries.

[Isgrimnur]

ESPN

The NFL omitted concussion cases when it downplayed the effects of head injuries on players based on studies conducted from 1996 through 2001, according to a report by The New York Times.

More than 100 diagnosed concussions were left out of the studies, based on confidential documents The Times obtained. Star quarterbacks such as Steve Young and Troy Aikman were among the players who suffered concussions that were not counted, and zero concussions involving Dallas Cowboys players were documented in NFL research during that period.

The research, published in 13 peer-reviewed articles beginning in October 2003, was supposed to be based on a full account of all diagnosed concussions team doctors had reported between 1996 and 2001, but the missing concussions accounted for about 10 percent of the total number of cases, according to The Times.
...
The NFL responded to the Times on Thursday in a statement, saying the report was "contradicted by clear facts that refute both the thesis of the story and each of its allegations."

"The studies that are the focus of the Times' story used data collected between 1996-2001," the NFL said. "They were necessarily preliminary and acknowledged that much more research was needed. Since that time, the NFL has been on the forefront of promoting and funding independent research on these complex issues."

The league also sent a memo to its teams regarding the report, saying The Times' story offered "very little that is new concerning this long-ago research and reflects little more than the pre-determined views of its authors."
...
The NFL has proposed a $1 billion plan to settle concussion claims with former players. The settlement is being appealed by players concerned that it excludes future cases of CTE, which they consider "the signature disease of football.''

One member of the concussion committee, Dr. Joseph Waeckerle, said he was unaware of the missing data.

"If somebody made a human error or somebody assumed the data was absolutely correct and didn't question it, well, we screwed up," Waeckerle told The Times. "If we found it wasn't accurate and still used it, that's not a screw-up; that's a lie."

[Moliere]

Biker Sherlock's Family: "Brain Injuries Took Him From Away Us"

Michael “Biker” Sherlock, a noted downhill skateboarder and street luger who won multiple medals at the X Games and Gravity Games, sustained many head injuries during his career. On December 3, 2015, he committed suicide in San Diego, California.
...
With Michael’s type of fun and at the level he competed came risk and injury. In the spirit of this article, Michael had his first brain injury at the age of seven. He rode his bicycle down a hill with no hands, the bike stammered over rocks, and Michael went down, resulting in a fractured skull. In his professional action-sports life, he sustained many concussions—all the while wearing the best in protection in helmets.

The world is coming to know more every day of the life altering and sometimes tragic loss of life due to the effects of brain injury. While Michael was not officially diagnosed with CTE, no other conclusion can be drawn—his last act demonstrated this.

[stessier]

A must read from GQ - but good luck getting through it.

The Concussion Diaries

[Captain Caveman]

Holy Moly. A study out today in JAMA (one of the top medical journals) shows that 110 of the 111 brains donated by former NFL players have CTE. Link to NY Times story.

There's obviously a selection bias here-- brains that are donated are ones families suspected had CTE-- but still these numbers are astounding.

[stessier]

Given the selection bias, why? Couldn't it just mean that family members are really good at telling when their loved one's have a problem?

I'm not saying CTE isn't real or concussions aren't a problem. It's just kind of the expected result in my mind.

[RunningMn9]

Yeah, I didn't know what to make of the study given the obvious selection bias. Of course, that immediately got converted into bullshit clickbait headlines like "99% of Ex-NFL players diagnosed with CTE".

[Ralph-Wiggum]

Yeah, I didn't know what to make of the study given the obvious selection bias.

I also wish these studies diagnosed brains blind to whether the person played football or not. Every brain they received was from a football player; why not also have an equal number of brains from non-athletes and see how many of those get diagnosed with CTE?

[Captain Caveman]

Yeah, I didn't know what to make of the study given the obvious selection bias.

I also wish these studies diagnosed brains blind to whether the person played football or not. Every brain they received was from a football player; why not also have an equal number of brains from non-athletes and see how many of those get diagnosed with CTE?

Because those brains aren't being donated to look for CTE? I mean, I guess you could start asking for some, but it's hard to see many families sending off their loved ones heads to be in a control group.

[McNutt]

This report should not be a big headline because this study means so little thanks to the very specific pool of donor brains.

[LawBeefaroni]

This report should not be a big headline because this study means so little thanks to the very specific pool of donor brains.

5-10 years ago the contention was that CTE didn't exist. 4 years ago it was that there is no evidence that it causes cognitive impairment. Now it's that there isn't a proper control group?

The study may not tell us anything about the distribution of CTE among NFL players but it certainly tells us that is exists and is a problem.

[Ralph-Wiggum]

Yeah, I didn't know what to make of the study given the obvious selection bias.

I also wish these studies diagnosed brains blind to whether the person played football or not. Every brain they received was from a football player; why not also have an equal number of brains from non-athletes and see how many of those get diagnosed with CTE?

Because those brains aren't being donated to look for CTE? I mean, I guess you could start asking for some, but it's hard to see many families sending off their loved ones heads to be in a control group.

Hospitals get bodies donated for science all the time, don't they? Usually they are used for med school, but can't some brains be used for these type of studies?

[RunningMn9]

The study may not tell us anything about the distribution of CTE among NFL players but it certainly tells us that is exists and is a problem.

It tells us that the incidence of CTE among NFL players is significantly higher than the background population. But we knew that.

Ramming your head into things thousands of times has consequences.

[Daehawk]

In 20 years that amount like be like $10 in todays money

[Ralph-Wiggum]

The study may not tell us anything about the distribution of CTE among NFL players but it certainly tells us that is exists and is a problem.

It tells us that the incidence of CTE among NFL players is significantly higher than the background population. But we knew that.

I have no doubt that's true, but I'm not sure this study tells us that. It shows that football players with symptoms severe enough in life that loved ones donate their brains likely have CTE. It doesn't really tell us anything about its incidence in the general populace nor even the incidence across all football players. Unfortunately, I'm not sure we'll be able to figure those things out until a non-invasive method to diagnosis CTE is developed.

[RunningMn9]

I have no doubt that's true, but I'm not sure this study tells us that. It shows that football players with symptoms severe enough in life that loved ones donate their brains likely have CTE. It doesn't really tell us anything about its incidence in the general populace nor even the incidence across all football players. Unfortunately, I'm not sure we'll be able to figure those things out until a non-invasive method to diagnosis CTE is developed.

I believe that the study does tell us that. I believe that over the course of time that those brains were donated, the study noted that approximately 1200 former NFL players died. If none of those untested NFL players had CTE, that would mean that about 9% of the former NFL population that died over that time span had CTE.

I believe the study notes it (but I don't recall), but I think that it's safe to say that over the same time period, the incidence of CTE in the general population was A LOT lower than 9%.

[Moliere]

Could Football Ever End?

The study was reportedly a factor in the sudden decision last week of Baltimore Ravens offensive lineman John Urschel—currently pursuing a doctorate in mathematics at MIT—to retire early from game. Urschel did not mention the JAMA report publicly, but the Baltimore Sun cited team sources as saying the study was involved in Urschel’s choice to walk away.

He’s not the first premature exit. A year ago, there was the Buffalo linebacker A.J. Tarpley, leaving at 23 after a pair of concussions. “I am walking away from the game I love to preserve my future health,” Tarpley said at the time. In 2015 there was San Francisco rookie standout Chris Borland, relinquishing millions after a single year in the NFL. “If there was no possibility of brain damage, I’d still be playing,” Borland told ESPN.

On and on the quiet drumbeat of early exits goes, attracting far less media attention than, say, a quarterback controversy or locker room dust-up. Widows and children of dead players give heartbreaking interviews, and after a somber wave of respect, they fade from the conversation. Same with the NFL’s nearly billion-dollar settlement with former players. It’s a lot easier to argue about Colin Kaepernick’s job odyssey, or Rob Gronkowski’s latest goof, than it is to confront an existential threat to the game.

At this point playing football—even watching football—requires a sharp dissonance between one’s enjoyment of it and the growing evidence. Make no mistake: I’m right there with the shameless compartmentalizers. I love football, write about it, often celebrate it in print like a face-painted fan in the parking lot. Come September, I’ll be back with my pom-poms. Count on it.

[RunningMn9]

We are still at a stage where there are a lot more people that want to play football than there are that want to quit playing.

I think that what might happen over time is that the people that would quit at the NFL level will probably start quitting at earlier stages and we won't ever hear about them.

There still won't be a shortage of people willing to roll the dice.

[Isgrimnur]

NYT

If Ed Cunningham had not already seen enough, he would be back in a broadcast booth on Saturday afternoon, serving as the color analyst for another top college football game televised on ABC or ESPN. It is the work he has done each fall for nearly 20 years.

But Cunningham, 48, resigned from one of the top jobs in sports broadcasting because of his growing discomfort with the damage being inflicted on the players he was watching each week. The hits kept coming, right in front of him, until Cunningham said he could not, in good conscience, continue his supporting role in football’s multibillion-dollar apparatus.

“I take full ownership of my alignment with the sport,” he said. “I can just no longer be in that cheerleader’s spot.”
...
Football has dominated Cunningham’s life, he said, since he began playing as a freshman in high school. He was captain of the University of Washington’s 1991 national championship team and a third-round draft choice in the N.F.L., where he was an offensive lineman for five seasons. He has been a broadcaster since, paired for most of the last decade with the play-by-play announcer Mike Patrick for Saturday afternoon games televised on ABC and ESPN.

As a color analyst, primarily providing commentary between plays, Cunningham built a reputation among college football fans, and even coaches, for his pointed criticism toward what he thought were reckless hits and irresponsible coaching decisions that endangered the health of athletes. His strong opinions often got him denounced on fan message boards and earned him angry calls from coaches and administrators.

[Holman]

We are still at a stage where there are a lot more people that want to play football than there are that want to quit playing.

I think that what might happen over time is that the people that would quit at the NFL level will probably start quitting at earlier stages and we won't ever hear about them.

There still won't be a shortage of people willing to roll the dice.

Maybe pro football becomes a young man's game where you play 3-4 years and then go home with your $2-3 million.

[RunningMn9]

I mean, maybe. I don't think so, but it wouldn't be the first time I was wrong.

[Kelric]

We are still at a stage where there are a lot more people that want to play football than there are that want to quit playing.

I think that what might happen over time is that the people that would quit at the NFL level will probably start quitting at earlier stages and we won't ever hear about them.

There still won't be a shortage of people willing to roll the dice.

Maybe pro football becomes a young man's game where you play 3-4 years and then go home with your $2-3 million.

Turning down that next $7-8M a year contract would be tough. And if you make it to your third contract and you're a QB or an excellent player in a league ruled by youngsters, that next $10-$30M a year contract would be hard to say no to....

We might see some more players from affluent backgrounds walk away before the pros or early in their pro career, but as long as we're looking at 32 teams with $167M to spend each (that is over $5.3 BILLION a year on player contracts if everyone spends to the cap), there will be young men (and maybe someday, women) willing to chase that money.