Cops behaving badly

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Wed Sep 02, 2015 7:25 am

LawBeefaroni wrote:Just from watching the poor quality video, it looked like an accidental discharge judging by the way the other officer reacted.

If the video and reported events are accurate, then the police attempted to lie their way out by claiming he was armed and a threat after someone made a serious mistake.

Moliere · Post by **Moliere** » Wed Sep 02, 2015 11:44 am

Investigate a burglary by sneaking into the wrong house? What could go wrong besides shooting the resident and killing his dog.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Wed Sep 02, 2015 11:49 am

Moliere wrote:Investigate a burglary by sneaking into the wrong house? What could go wrong besides shooting the resident and killing his dog.

Sounds like keystone cops.

McKinley, 36, was shot in the leg, and his dog, a female boxer, was killed. One of the officers — identified Tuesday afternoon as Travis Jones — was shot in the hip by a colleague, the GBI said.

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Wed Sep 02, 2015 12:03 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote:
One of the officers — identified Tuesday afternoon as Travis Jones — was shot in the hip by a colleague, the GBI said.

article wrote:the fourth controversial police shooting in DeKalb County in less than two years — an incident in which, according to authorities, officers responding to a burglary call went to the wrong home, shot the unarmed homeowner, killed his dog and wounded one of their own.

Carpet_pissr · Post by **Carpet_pissr** » Wed Sep 02, 2015 2:32 pm

Paingod wrote:
Alefroth wrote:Can't see both his hands, but it sure looks like his hands were in the air when he was shot.
You can't see both hands, but it seems safe to assume he wouldn't have one hand in the air while brandishing a gun or knife in the other.

Apparently he did have a knife in one hand after all.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Wed Sep 02, 2015 2:46 pm

Even if so - if his hands were held up in the air -- was he going to flick it with his wrist? Still the I'm afraid justification is relatively flexible.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Fri Sep 04, 2015 2:45 pm

Dickbag:

MILLIS, Mass. — An officer fabricated a claim that a gunman fired at his cruiser before it crashed into a tree and caught on fire, police officials said Thursday.

Millis police Sgt. William Dwyer said the only ballistics evidence recovered at the scene of the crash Wednesday afternoon was from shots fired by the 27-year-old officer into his own cruiser.

After several interviews with the part-time officer and examining the evidence, police determined that his story that a man in a pickup truck had fired at his cruiser was untrue, Dwyer said at a news conference.

"The evidence indicates that shots were not fired by a suspect and there is no gunman at large in or around the town," Dwyer said.

After the shooting was reported, people were asked to remain inside for several hours as police, including SWAT team officers, scoured the wooded neighborhood along the Charles River for the reported gunman. Schools were closed Thursday as a precaution.

I mean there's real shit going down, if anyone should know how harmful making a story like that up is, it should be a cop. Although he sounds like a probationary part-timer who will never again have the job.

GreenGoo · Post by **GreenGoo** » Fri Sep 04, 2015 2:50 pm

Not to mention taxpayer cost. Cops aren't free.

Pyperkub · Post by **Pyperkub** » Wed Sep 09, 2015 6:48 pm

James Blake - tackled by 5 cops for standing while black:

Five white undercover cops slammed retired black tennis star James Blake to the ground outside his midtown hotel Wednesday in a violent case of mistaken identity....

...A police source said Blake was misidentified as a suspect wanted for buying a cellphone with a bogus credit card. A man who was standing near Blake was arrested in connection with the scam, police said.

Seems a bit heavy for credit card fraud.

Moliere · Post by **Moliere** » Wed Sep 09, 2015 6:56 pm

Pyperkub wrote:Seems a bit heavy for credit card fraud.

Sounds like a backhanded critique of police procedures.

Combustible Lemur · Post by **Combustible Lemur** » Wed Sep 09, 2015 10:26 pm

Moliere wrote:
Pyperkub wrote:Seems a bit heavy for credit card fraud.
Sounds like a backhanded critique of police procedures.

Why no love for James Blake?

Alefroth · Post by **Alefroth** » Wed Sep 09, 2015 11:15 pm

They're just there to protect and serve.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Wed Sep 09, 2015 11:45 pm

James Blake wasn't "standing while black." The police were given a mistaken identification by an eyewitness. A person involved in the scam was nearby. The officers got the wrong guy at the start, but it's not like most criminals are going to immediately admit that they're guilty.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 12:07 am

Zarathud wrote:James Blake wasn't "standing while black." The police were given a mistaken identification by an eyewitness. A person involved in the scam was nearby. The officers got the wrong guy at the start, but it's not like most criminals are going to immediately admit that they're guilty.

The problem is that no one is in a position to admit or deny much of anything when 5 men suddenly gang tackle them.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 7:59 am

That's what the headline says, but not the story. Only 1 officer tackled him. 5 were on the scene. They sorted it out after they took his id and figured out it was really another guy in the group.

Moliere · Post by **Moliere** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:06 am

Combustible Lemur wrote:
Moliere wrote:
Pyperkub wrote:Seems a bit heavy for credit card fraud.
Sounds like a backhanded critique of police procedures.
Why no love for James Blake?

Because he had the advantage.

GreenGoo · Post by **GreenGoo** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:16 am

Zarathud wrote:That's what the headline says, but not the story. Only 1 officer tackled him. 5 were on the scene. They sorted it out after they took his id and figured out it was really another guy in the group.

That's weird. Either he was potentially a threat and needed to be taken down forcefully, in which case you don't send your guys in one at a time, or he wasn't, in which case you don't send anyone in at all.

Was it just on the job training for the one cop?

In any case, they didn't shoot him, so there's that.

Moliere · Post by **Moliere** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:17 am

A former Cook County Sheriff's Department officer has pleaded guilty to robbing drug dealers and re-selling their drugs to make a profit

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:23 am

Zarathud wrote:That's what the headline says, but not the story. Only 1 officer tackled him. 5 were on the scene. They sorted it out after they took his id and figured out it was really another guy in the group.

Ok, one tackles him and 4 are standing by. You still have zero warning and no time to confirm or deny guilt. And while sure, "it's not like most criminals are going to immediately admit that they're guilty" the tackling officer didn't have a badge and apparently didn't identify himself until after he slammed Blake to the ground. I think the last thing going through Blake's mind is, "don't worry, this is just a cop and it's just a case of mistaken identity."

I have no problem with overwhelming force for the safety of officers. But they need to use it cautiously and not on vague tips.

GreenGoo · Post by **GreenGoo** » Thu Sep 10, 2015 10:25 am

Moliere wrote:A former Cook County Sheriff's Department officer has pleaded guilty to robbing drug dealers and re-selling their drugs to make a profit

Standard corruption. I'm surprised and horrified less by this than I am at some of the less serious power abuses by seemingly otherwise honest cops.

The above is just a criminal who became a cop, or a cop that became a criminal. I understand that and society does too. Internal Affairs is a term that is understood by most people.

It's the "I'm locking you up for 3 days and then you accidentally die because you disrespected me" by a cop with 10 years service and numerous commendations that is a somewhat new and scary revelation for me.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 6:02 pm

GreenGoo wrote:
Zarathud wrote:That's what the headline says, but not the story. Only 1 officer tackled him. 5 were on the scene. They sorted it out after they took his id and figured out it was really another guy in the group.

That's weird. Either he was potentially a threat and needed to be taken down forcefully, in which case you don't send your guys in one at a time, or he wasn't, in which case you don't send anyone in at all.

Was it just on the job training for the one cop?

In any case, they didn't shoot him, so there's that.

Here's the video of the takedown.

Wish there was sound as well.

Moliere · Post by **Moliere** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 6:18 pm

Why does a suspect wanted for buying a cellphone with a bogus credit card need to be tackled to the ground?

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Fri Sep 11, 2015 11:01 pm

That ultimately is my issue. Let's say he was the actual suspect...does credit card fraud represent such a great threat to the public that we need to put them in physical harm's way? The PBA predictably defends the action sayin that sometimes suspects flee. So basically all suspects must be tackled the e some may flee. That sounds like bad policy to me:

Raises the risk of injuries to suspect, police, and bystanders.

Increased risk of civil lawsuits.

Damage to public reputation of the police force.

Also to defend the officer this is pretty arbitrary too. The police act this way due to culture. Maybe busting individuals helps to reshape culture but cynically the lesson might end up with a lot of officers shrugging it off as bad luck.

stessier · Post by **stessier** » Sat Sep 12, 2015 4:23 am

Would love to have seen what the PBA would have said if Blake had won the fight.

Combustible Lemur · Post by **Combustible Lemur** » Sat Sep 12, 2015 8:43 am

Zarathud wrote:James Blake wasn't "standing while black." The police were given a mistaken identification by an eyewitness. A person involved in the scam was nearby. The officers got the wrong guy at the start, but it's not like most criminals are going to immediately admit that they're guilty.

Zarathud wrote:That's what the headline says, but not the story. Only 1 officer tackled him. 5 were on the scene. They sorted it out after they took his id and figured out it was really another guy in the group.

It won't let me quote it, but the police commissioner seems to think that the incident described was completely out of order, one officer is already off the street (presumably the tackler) and an investigation is under way. There is nothing in the article about a witness doing the misidentification.
And by sorted it out, you mean never apologized and didn't arrest him.

Jaymann · Post by **Jaymann** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 10:27 am

Moliere wrote:
Combustible Lemur wrote:
Moliere wrote:
Pyperkub wrote:Seems a bit heavy for credit card fraud.
Sounds like a backhanded critique of police procedures.
Why no love for James Blake?
Because he had the advantage.

But the cop held serve.

Unagi · Post by **Unagi** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 12:29 pm

Jaymann wrote:
Moliere wrote:
Combustible Lemur wrote:
Moliere wrote:
Pyperkub wrote:Seems a bit heavy for credit card fraud.
Sounds like a backhanded critique of police procedures.
Why no love for James Blake?
Because he had the advantage.
But the cop held serve.

You are not going to fault them for that, are you? Give em a break. I think they were likely just trying to set an example, it's not like they are obligated to love all.

Freyland · Post by **Freyland** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 1:46 pm

Unagi wrote:
Jaymann wrote:
Moliere wrote:
Combustible Lemur wrote:
Moliere wrote:
Pyperkub wrote:Seems a bit heavy for credit card fraud.
Sounds like a backhanded critique of police procedures.
Why no love for James Blake?
Because he had the advantage.
But the cop held serve.
You are not going to fault them for that, are you? Give em a break. I think they were likely just trying to set an example, it's not like they are obligated to love all.

The crime was credit card fraud. I think they were just trying to make a statement.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Sun Sep 13, 2015 11:36 pm

stessier wrote:
GreenGoo wrote:
Zarathud wrote:That's what the headline says, but not the story. Only 1 officer tackled him. 5 were on the scene. They sorted it out after they took his id and figured out it was really another guy in the group.

That's weird. Either he was potentially a threat and needed to be taken down forcefully, in which case you don't send your guys in one at a time, or he wasn't, in which case you don't send anyone in at all.

Was it just on the job training for the one cop?

In any case, they didn't shoot him, so there's that.
Here's the video of the takedown.

Wish there was sound as well.

See, someone does that to me and I'm thinking I'm getting mugged. I'd get my ass kicked but I'd fight back.

Best part? That guy coming out the revolving door who is just like, "Fuck this, I'm going back inside." He's probably the guy selling stolen cell phones.

I see no reason they they couldn't approach him with 2 or 3 officers with the rest strategically placed, identify themselves, and do the arrest. It would also probably be safer than a 1 on 1 takedown.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 12:25 am

Eh. I'm not that troubled about the takedown video. James Blake gets pushed back, then pulled and spun to the ground. The officer could have done it differently, sure. I don't have any information about the manpower available or the tip given to the officer.

Aside from the wrongful id of a celebrity, the force used doesn't even appear excessive.

Jaymann · Post by **Jaymann** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 12:41 am

What's with the lady in the pink cap pointing at them as if to say, "give him one for me, officer!"

RuperT · Post by **RuperT** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 1:12 am

Zarathud wrote:Eh. I'm not that troubled about the takedown video. James Blake gets pushed back, then pulled and spun to the ground. The officer could have done it differently, sure. I don't have any information about the manpower available or the tip given to the officer.

Aside from the wrongful id of a celebrity, the force used doesn't even appear excessive.

"Other than that, Mrs. Lincoln, how did you like the play?"

Reemul · Post by **Reemul** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 6:34 am

Rip wrote:Apples and Oranges.

True but who wants to be an Oramge when you can be an Apple eh.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 8:23 am

Call me when Lincoln sexually gets shot.

Combustible Lemur · Post by **Combustible Lemur** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 9:49 am

Zarathud wrote:Call me when Lincoln sexually gets shot.

You mean like a money shot?

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 11:18 am

i was a little too tired this morning to catch the typo. I would hesitate to do a google search....

RuperT · Post by **RuperT** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 2:16 pm

Well, do please take another shot at the snark, because I have no inkling what you intended to say.
I don't exactly live on the mean streets, but I don't feel that cops should begin their investigations with battery, whether the perp looks like he can run fast or not.
Like I say, though, maybe the subways are that bad. "Abandon all dignity, ye who enter."

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 2:24 pm

RuperT wrote:Well, do please take another shot at the snark, because I have no inkling what you intended to say.
I don't exactly live on the mean streets, but I don't feel that cops should begin their investigations with battery, whether the perp looks like he can run fast or not.
Like I say, though, maybe the subways are that bad. "Abandon all dignity, ye who enter."

It's not even the subway. He's standing at the entrance to the Grand Hyatt in Manhattan, waiting for a private car. I promise you if the tip was for "a rich-looking guy in a suit," they wouldn't just tackle the first guy vaguely fitting the description.

RuperT · Post by **RuperT** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 2:50 pm

Like I say, though, maybe the subways cities are that bad. "Abandon all dignity, ye who enter."

Thanks for the correction. I've actually avoided this story a bit. I don't want to resent cops.

Moliere · Post by **Moliere** » Mon Sep 14, 2015 4:08 pm

Last Week Tonight with John Oliver: Public Defenders
Between the bail episode and this one it makes me more motivated to avoid cops and trying not to break any laws.