[TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by El Guapo »

Rumpy wrote:

From that link:
Producers of the crowdfunded film argue they shouldn’t be left guessing about what they’ve infringed nor should they be required to sift through each movie and TV episode to determine the claims against them.”
Are they that daft? Seems pretty clear to me. They seem to really be grasping at straws.
IANA copyright lawyer, but I assume their underlying argument is that they have created (I think) all new characters, an all new ship design(s), set in a time not covered by existing movies / TV shows, etc. So I think they want to argue that the copyrights don't cover a general universe / setting, they cover the specifics.

I strongly suspect that that's a losing argument, and that it will be an uphill battle to convince a judge that an independent Star Trek film does not violate Star Trek copyrights, but again I'm not super familiar with the key specifics of copyright law.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by Jeff V »

Most likely, it would revolve around the use of the brand "Star Trek" as well as claim to ownership of any original creations appended to that brand, such as Klingons, Romulans and Vulcans.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by Rumpy »

El Guapo wrote: IANA copyright lawyer, but I assume their underlying argument is that they have created (I think) all new characters, an all new ship design(s), set in a time not covered by existing movies / TV shows, etc.

Except that from what I hear, they are using some already established characters such as Garth of Izar (His name changed maybe?), who appeared in TOS, which makes it a rather bold question for them to ask. I also know that they have a character from Enterprise returning (the Vulcan Soval), and a rumoured appearance by General Chang who appeared in Undiscovered Country. Interestingly, their character page on their website no longer works. So just based on those tree, it's likely enough for CBS to see infringement even if everything else about it is original.


Honestly, it might be in their best interest to just make it a Trek-like sci-fi and drop all the Trek references altogether. The other outcome in this could be CBS buying out the studio letting them produce movies for those who like more traditional Trek.

http://www.geek.com/news/legal-battle-o ... y-1648101/
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by El Guapo »

Rumpy wrote:
El Guapo wrote: IANA copyright lawyer, but I assume their underlying argument is that they have created (I think) all new characters, an all new ship design(s), set in a time not covered by existing movies / TV shows, etc.

Except that from what I hear, they are using some already established characters such as Garth of Izar (His name changed maybe?), who appeared in TOS, which makes it a rather bold question for them to ask. I also know that they have a character from Enterprise returning (the Vulcan Soval), and a rumoured appearance by General Chang who appeared in Undiscovered Country. Interestingly, their character page on their website no longer works. So just based on those tree, it's likely enough for CBS to see infringement even if everything else about it is original.


Honestly, it might be in their best interest to just make it a Trek-like sci-fi and drop all the Trek references altogether. The other outcome in this could be CBS buying out the studio letting them produce movies for those who like more traditional Trek.

http://www.geek.com/news/legal-battle-o ... y-1648101/
Yeah, I didn't know that. That makes it even harder - really hard to see how they win this, unless they have a reliance argument of some type.

They also apparently have the actor who played General Martok in DS9, which is awesome.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by Rumpy »

El Guapo wrote:
Rumpy wrote:
El Guapo wrote: IANA copyright lawyer, but I assume their underlying argument is that they have created (I think) all new characters, an all new ship design(s), set in a time not covered by existing movies / TV shows, etc.

Except that from what I hear, they are using some already established characters such as Garth of Izar (His name changed maybe?), who appeared in TOS, which makes it a rather bold question for them to ask. I also know that they have a character from Enterprise returning (the Vulcan Soval), and a rumoured appearance by General Chang who appeared in Undiscovered Country. Interestingly, their character page on their website no longer works. So just based on those tree, it's likely enough for CBS to see infringement even if everything else about it is original.


Honestly, it might be in their best interest to just make it a Trek-like sci-fi and drop all the Trek references altogether. The other outcome in this could be CBS buying out the studio letting them produce movies for those who like more traditional Trek.

http://www.geek.com/news/legal-battle-o ... y-1648101/
Yeah, I didn't know that. That makes it even harder - really hard to see how they win this, unless they have a reliance argument of some type.

They also apparently have the actor who played General Martok in DS9, which is awesome.
Yeah, I think that's who they'd have playing General Chang. They also have the actor who played Soval returning to reprise his role. So, not only do they have familiar characters returning, they also have the association of the original actors reprising their roles, which is IMO, pretty damning.

This article from The Wrap has a pretty good breakdown of the situation:
http://www.thewrap.com/why-star-trek-fa ... it-coming/

And from that article:
“If I use the copyrightable, expressive characteristics of a character — it doesn’t matter if I change the name — I have stolen a character that someone else created,” Bandlow adds.
The fact that they're even asking the question of what they've infringed upon while using those 3 established characters (and without blinking?) smacks of trying to waste CBS's time and trying to stall it. They're skating on thin ice.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Come on. Our show, starring the intrepid crew of the Starboat Enterprise: Captain Picord, Commander Horf and a man's man second-in-command nicknamed Letter B has nothing to do with Star Trek!
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by Isgrimnur »

Vagueness in legal threats is the hallmark of meritless thuggery.
It's up to Paramount to detail the infringement that they are alleging to have occurred so that the defendants can reply to it and the court can investigate and rule. Paramount doesn't get to yell, "Stop infringing on my stuff!" and get any traction.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by AWS260 »

Isgrimnur wrote:
Vagueness in legal threats is the hallmark of meritless thuggery.
It's up to Paramount to detail the infringement that they are alleging to have occurred so that the defendants can reply to it and the court can investigate and rule. Paramount doesn't get to yell, "Stop infringing on my stuff!" and get any traction.
The original complaint provides details about plenty of points of infringement -- specific characters, alien species, the uniforms, the design of the starship bridge, etc.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by Isgrimnur »

Timing rumors
I have heard some intriguing rumors about the new Star Trek TV show that will be coming to CBS All Access next year under the stewardship of Bryan Fuller: it won't be set in the JJ Abrams reboot universe. The new show will be set in the original, classic continuity.

But when? Will it be a prequel, like Enterprise? Or will it be the next generation for The Next Generation? Neither, I've heard. The show will be set some time after the events of Star Trek: The Undiscovered Country, so between the original series and The Next Generation.
...
I've also heard the show, which will be heavily serialized, will not be set on an Enterprise, although that feels like a no-brainer. One last rumble I heard, which I could not get second sourced at this time, so consider this a wild rumor: while the Khitomer Conference will have paved the way for Klingons and humans to find peace, Fuller has a plan as to how he can still feature villainous Klingons, something we haven't seen in decades!
...
UPDATE! A trusted source has chimed in and told me that it looks like the show will be a seasonal anthology, which means the first season will be set post-Undiscovered Country. After that the entire Star Trek universe is potentially open. So those of you hoping for a post-Dominion War show... don't give up hope. That could come some day.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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A seasonal anthology show sounds intriguing. Among other things, it would open up the possibility of A-list people popping in for a season, and could be a way to explore interesting settings (Romulan season!) for a little bit.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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El Guapo wrote:A seasonal anthology show sounds intriguing. Among other things, it would open up the possibility of A-list people popping in for a season, and could be a way to explore interesting settings (Romulan season!) for a little bit.
Indeed. It's a fantastic idea.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Yeah, good idea. It means that nothing is set in stone and they have a bit more freedom to tell stories from season to season.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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This is also a great vehicle for the Next Generation / Bat Mite crossover season that Hepcat has been writing.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by Jeff V »

Of course, it remains behind a added paywall, so a second season very much depends on how many people pony up $$$ for CBS-only content. If subscriptions are anemic, I wonder if they would allow other means to watch or simply let this show go down with the ship?
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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El Guapo wrote:This is also a great vehicle for the Next Generation / Bat Mite crossover season that Hepcat has been writing.
Only if he brings along The Ventriloquist and Scarface.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Jeff V wrote:Of course, it remains behind a added paywall, so a second season very much depends on how many people pony up $$$ for CBS-only content. If subscriptions are anemic, I wonder if they would allow other means to watch or simply let this show go down with the ship?
Im sure once the initial run is going CBS will want to sell rights to other streaming sources or at the very least release it in a purchasable format like bluray. They wont want to leave that money on the table.
Well do you ever get the feeling that the story's too damn real and in the present tense?
Or that everybody's on the stage and it seems like you're the only person sitting in the audience?
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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rshetts2 wrote:
Jeff V wrote:Of course, it remains behind a added paywall, so a second season very much depends on how many people pony up $$$ for CBS-only content. If subscriptions are anemic, I wonder if they would allow other means to watch or simply let this show go down with the ship?
Im sure once the initial run is going CBS will want to sell rights to other streaming sources or at the very least release it in a purchasable format like bluray. They wont want to leave that money on the table.
That doesn't necessarily mean secondary revenue sources will keep the show afloat. Studio execs are hardwired to give extreme bias towards first-run numbers.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Isgrimnur wrote:
El Guapo wrote:This is also a great vehicle for the Next Generation / Bat Mite crossover season that Hepcat has been writing.
Only if he brings along The Ventriloquist and Scarface.
And let's not forget Paste Pot Pete.

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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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This possibility has, once again, piqued my interest in the show.

Just not in another service.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Blackhawk wrote:This possibility has, once again, piqued my interest in the show.
It should! He's a guy named Pete...and he carries a pot full of paste!
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Jeff V wrote:
rshetts2 wrote:
Jeff V wrote:Of course, it remains behind a added paywall, so a second season very much depends on how many people pony up $$$ for CBS-only content. If subscriptions are anemic, I wonder if they would allow other means to watch or simply let this show go down with the ship?
Im sure once the initial run is going CBS will want to sell rights to other streaming sources or at the very least release it in a purchasable format like bluray. They wont want to leave that money on the table.
That doesn't necessarily mean secondary revenue sources will keep the show afloat. Studio execs are hardwired to give extreme bias towards first-run numbers.
I regret that I'll have to miss its initial run and hope I can catch up to it on netflix dvds or on cable.

One can imagine a series in which each season has a different cast and story with some callbacks to the one that came before. It's worked brilliantly for Fargo. If they could pull off something of that caliber set in the Trek universe I would seriously consider upgrading my TV so that I could watch it.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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hepcat wrote:
Isgrimnur wrote:
El Guapo wrote:This is also a great vehicle for the Next Generation / Bat Mite crossover season that Hepcat has been writing.
Only if he brings along The Ventriloquist and Scarface.
And let's not forget Paste Pot Pete.

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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Teaser

Thanks to the teaser, we now officially know that this show will take place...
Spoiler:
...in space!
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[TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by RunningMn9 »

Is that actually coming to CBS or just online?

I ask because it mentions both CBS and CBS interactive at the end.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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RunningMn9 wrote:Is that actually coming to CBS or just online?

I ask because it mentions both CBS and CBS interactive at the end.
It's both. The pilot will premiere on the CBS network, then all future episodes will be on CBS Interactive.

Personally, I'm banking on it showing up on Netflix some day, because I'm sure as hell not paying for yet another streaming service.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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In the U.S., a special premiere episode will air on the CBS Television Network and all subsequent first-run episodes will be available exclusively on CBS All Access. The series will also be available on television stations and platforms in other countries around the world.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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I mean, there's effectively zero chance of this succeeding on CBS's platform, right? So I expect it to crop up elsewhere, perhaps a season in.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Zaxxon wrote:I mean, there's effectively zero chance of this succeeding on CBS's platform, right? So I expect it to crop up elsewhere, perhaps a season in.
That's the way I see it. I mean, there are guys at CBS putting their careers on the line that I'm wrong, and they have a lot more data at their fingertips than I do, but I still don't buy it.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Odin wrote:
Zaxxon wrote:I mean, there's effectively zero chance of this succeeding on CBS's platform, right? So I expect it to crop up elsewhere, perhaps a season in.
That's the way I see it. I mean, there are guys at CBS putting their careers on the line that I'm wrong, and they have a lot more data at their fingertips than I do, but I still don't buy it.
I have no qualms about waiting a year after it originally "airs." I can wait for the DVDs or broadcast release or whatever.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Odin wrote: That's the way I see it. I mean, there are guys at CBS putting their careers on the line that I'm wrong, and they have a lot more data at their fingertips than I do, but I still don't buy it.
Or they have a boss's boss that has ordered them to compete with Netflix without any data whatsoever.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by El Guapo »

Kraken wrote:
Odin wrote:
Zaxxon wrote:I mean, there's effectively zero chance of this succeeding on CBS's platform, right? So I expect it to crop up elsewhere, perhaps a season in.
That's the way I see it. I mean, there are guys at CBS putting their careers on the line that I'm wrong, and they have a lot more data at their fingertips than I do, but I still don't buy it.
I have no qualms about waiting a year after it originally "airs." I can wait for the DVDs or broadcast release or whatever.
Couldn't you just wait until the whole season airs, then sign up for a week / month of the CBS interactive service, watch the season, and then cancel?

Unless they try to sell it as a yearly service a la Amazon Prime (in which case it would tank super hard), it's hard to see this as a major obstacle to access.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by Blackhawk »

In a world where tech-savvy nerdy viewers have made Game of Thrones the single most pirated show in history, I don't think they're going to have much luck using this to sell subscriptions. Every episode will be online for pirates within hours of being released.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by Kraken »

El Guapo wrote:
Kraken wrote:
Odin wrote:
Zaxxon wrote:I mean, there's effectively zero chance of this succeeding on CBS's platform, right? So I expect it to crop up elsewhere, perhaps a season in.
That's the way I see it. I mean, there are guys at CBS putting their careers on the line that I'm wrong, and they have a lot more data at their fingertips than I do, but I still don't buy it.
I have no qualms about waiting a year after it originally "airs." I can wait for the DVDs or broadcast release or whatever.
Couldn't you just wait until the whole season airs, then sign up for a week / month of the CBS interactive service, watch the season, and then cancel?
My TV doesn't get the internet.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by gilraen »

Official teaser trailer is out. It's about as (un)informative as a teaser can get, when not a single frame of actual footage has been shot yet...basically just a 50-second exercise in computer graphics.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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You're going to need to get up pretty early to beat the Star Trek nerds around here when posting new information. :wink:
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

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Rumpy wrote:

From that link:
Producers of the crowdfunded film argue they shouldn’t be left guessing about what they’ve infringed nor should they be required to sift through each movie and TV episode to determine the claims against them.”
Are they that daft? Seems pretty clear to me. They seem to really be grasping at straws.
No, it's actually the way it works. You can't just say "you're infringing on all our copyrights." You have to tell them what they are infringing on. Then they can challenge whether or not that is actually something that is subject to copyright. Check out the post on Popehat about trying to copyright the Klingon language.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by Isgrimnur »

RE: binge and bolt, the release schedule is going to be GoT-like rather than Netflix drops. So if you want to B&B, you'll need to wait until the season is over. Of course, I doubt the new show will be nearly the water cooler conversation topic that GoT is, so it may not be as much of an issue for many.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by Rumpy »

stessier wrote:
Rumpy wrote:

From that link:
Producers of the crowdfunded film argue they shouldn’t be left guessing about what they’ve infringed nor should they be required to sift through each movie and TV episode to determine the claims against them.”
Are they that daft? Seems pretty clear to me. They seem to really be grasping at straws.
No, it's actually the way it works. You can't just say "you're infringing on all our copyrights." You have to tell them what they are infringing on. Then they can challenge whether or not that is actually something that is subject to copyright. Check out the post on Popehat about trying to copyright the Klingon language.

I get that. But with the franchise having several decades of material, it just seems to me like a pointless question given they very well knew what they infringed on. Their attitude have verged on entitlement. It's like a Bull in a china shop destroying a bunch of china and then asking what it broke: the answer would be china.
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Re: [TV] New Star Trek Show in Development?

Post by stessier »

Rumpy wrote:I get that. But with the franchise having several decades of material, it just seems to me like a pointless question given they very well knew what they infringed on.
I disagree as the Popehat post shows - Paramount believes they own Klingon while reasonable people disagree.

Another example, can I make a movie where I send someone on a task and he ends up dead?
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