NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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Ralph-Wiggum
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NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Ralph-Wiggum »

A handful of college assistant coaches along with some representatives at Adidas and other places just got busted by the FBI for fraud. Mostly sounds like they've been (surprise, surprise) taking bribes and paying players and recruits.
Four assistant basketball coaches from Arizona, Auburn, Oklahoma State and the University of Southern California were among those arrested on federal corruption charges Tuesday after they were caught taking thousands of dollars in bribes to steer NBA-destined college stars toward certain sports agents and financial advisers, authorities said.

The coaches named in court documents are Auburn's Chuck Person, Oklahoma State's Lamont Evans, Arizona's Emanuel "Book" Richardson and USC's Tony Bland. It was not immediately clear who would represent them at initial court appearances.

Other people named in the documents include:

James Gatto, director of global sports marketing at Adidas;

Merl Code, who recently left Nike for Adidas;

Christian Dawkins, an NBA agent who was fired in May from ASM Sports for charging approximately $42,000 in Uber charges on a player's credit card;

Jonathan Brad Augustine, president of The League Initiative and program director of the Adidas-sponsored 1 Family AAU program;

Munish Sood, a financial adviser;

Rashan Michel, a former NBA official who founded Thompson Bespoke Clothing, a custom clothier for athletes.

The FBI complaint against Gatto and others also includes a reference to a "public research university located in Kentucky," and sources told ESPN that it's the University of Louisville. The complaint says the school has an enrollment of approximately 22,640, which matches Louisville's during the 2016-17 academic year, and that the school offers approximately 21 varsity sports teams, which is the number the Cardinals offer, according to the athletics department's website.

The allegations against the unnamed school in Kentucky, which is identified as "University-6" in the complaint, include payments of $100,000 from a sports apparel company to the family of an unnamed player, identified as "Player 10," to ensure him signing with the school.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Lassr »

I wonder how far this will stretch through out NCAA BB. I have some hope that maybe it will clean it up. One thing to do stuff that the NCAA frowns upon, you get caught and you get the program in trouble. Another thing to face criminal charges from the feds.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by ImLawBoy »

Pat Forde is arguing that if the allegations are true, Louisville should get the death penalty. Seems like this is likely to be the tip of the iceberg. If Adidas is paying for players, it's hard to imagine that they're alone.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Pyperkub »

A good interview on the topic:
My initial thought was that it’s great because writers have been trying for so long to tell the story of the transactional nature of college basketball, the way players are procured, but fans don’t care unless it directly affects their team.

“The NCAA says there are a few bad apples but the system isn’t broken. Well, this is the full scope of what’s been going on. The transactional world of the sport has come to light. A paid B to benefit C to funnel the money to D. It lays it all out: the agents, the schools, the college coaches, the AAU coaches, the shoe companies. There are so many profiteers in the game...

...Hotline: How are sitting head coaches reacting to the news?

Dohrmann: “Every head coach or assistant coach who has ever funneled money or had knowledge of money being funneled is thinking, ‘Now we have to worry about the feds?’

“If all they had to worry about what the NCAA, the risk was worth it. Louisville was running a prostitution ring and the head coach didn’t get fired. The message is that any penalties are so soft — if you get busted, you can get back into coaching the next year.

“There were no real consequences to breaking NCAA rules. But with the FBI involved, those (four assistants) won’t work again. This is a real deterrent.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Skinypupy »

I never thought I'd see "college basketball scandal" and "up to 80 years in prison" in the same sentence, yet here we are. The
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Pyperkub »

Note that the coach from Miami wasn't arrested/named yet. Probably more 'shoes' to drop here, especially as USC and Arizona are Nike schools, not Adidas, and Auburn is an Under Armour school.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Lorini »

So what exactly is Pitino good at? It certainly isn't managing a basketball team.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by ImLawBoy »

Well, his teams do win a lot of games (until they get vacated), and he is the only coach to win NCAA titles at two schools (or was, until the Louisville one was vacated (P.S. The block was clean.)).
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Ralph-Wiggum »

Rumors are the Pitino will be fired today. I guess he's had one scandal too many. I wouldn't be surprised if some smaller schools tries to nab him in a year or two.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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I wouldn't be surprised if Pitino is done for good. I'm guessing he'll end up with a "show cause".
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Lorini »

Part of being paid the big money is to work on being aware of what's happening in your program, something Pitino didn't seem to do much of. Some school may hire him, but it better be a small program as he's proven himself incapable of managing a large one.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by ImLawBoy »

I think your mistake is in thinking that Pitino wasn't aware of and likely condoned all of this. He's not new to this - he knows what it takes to get the 5 star players.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Lorini »

ImLawBoy wrote:I think your mistake is in thinking that Pitino wasn't aware of and likely condoned all of this. He's not new to this - he knows what it takes to get the 5 star players.
You guys are probably more knowledgeable about the process than I am. So then he'll get off because they can't prove he knew anything?
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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Lorini wrote:
ImLawBoy wrote:I think your mistake is in thinking that Pitino wasn't aware of and likely condoned all of this. He's not new to this - he knows what it takes to get the 5 star players.
You guys are probably more knowledgeable about the process than I am. So then he'll get off because they can't prove he knew anything?
No, I think he'll get a "show cause" order, which basically means he won't be able to coach again for x years (not sure, but it probably varies). During that period, a school could theoretically hire him, but they'd have to "show cause" why Pitino should be able to coach again and get permission from the NCAA, and sanctions applicable to him would likely follow him to the new school. It's the same thing that effectively ended Jim Tressel's coaching career at Ohio State. If Pitino got a 5 year show cause (which Tressel got), he'd be 70 when it expired.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Lorini »

He just got fired.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Skinypupy »

Lorini wrote:He just got fired.
Good.

There are few people in sports that I dislike more than Pitino.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Lorini »

The Adidas global marketing director just got arrested so one would assume he's fired as well. That's so so stupid for companies to get involved in crap like this. Also the investigation is spreading to the NBA apparently.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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Lorini wrote:The Adidas global marketing director just got arrested so one would assume he's fired as well. That's so so stupid for companies to get involved in crap like this. Also the investigation is spreading to the NBA apparently.
Well, this is some reasoning for Adidas to do it:
According to The NPD Group's most recent data, Adidas’ retail sales shares for athletic footwear grew to 13 percent in the month of August — more than 50 percent from its previous level.

This is monumental growth for the brand, but it’s also been in the works for a while. Thanks to a slew of impressive celebrity endorsement deals — most notably their partnership with Kanye West — and a forward-thinking approach to new product, Adidas’ presence in the United States has been steadily increasing over the years
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Lorini »

Apparently their 'forward thinking' approach included criminal acts. Maybe next time make sure your 'forward thinking approach' is legal.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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Lorini wrote:Apparently their 'forward thinking' approach included criminal acts. Maybe next time make sure your 'forward thinking approach' is legal.
I'm pretty sure they were operating (as do a lot of other companies) under the principle of it ain't illegal if you don't get caught.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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Ralph-Wiggum wrote:Rumors are the Pitino will be fired today. I guess he's had one scandal too many. I wouldn't be surprised if some smaller schools tries to nab him in a year or two.
I would bet Pitino is done as a college coach. His program at Louisville had a title vacated and was already under investigation for a prostitutes for players little problem before this hit. This will make him unhirable.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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Lorini wrote:The Adidas global marketing director just got arrested so one would assume he's fired as well. That's so so stupid for companies to get involved in crap like this. Also the investigation is spreading to the NBA apparently.
As someone who doesn't buy name athletic shoes it is hard for me to understand this, but apparently the shoe business is massive in today's world. They pay millions to players for the use of their name on products, and shoes are the big thing.

Why do you think Lavar Ball is trying to go it alone with his son.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by LawBeefaroni »

Pyperkub wrote:
Lorini wrote:Apparently their 'forward thinking' approach included criminal acts. Maybe next time make sure your 'forward thinking approach' is legal.
I'm pretty sure they were operating (as do a lot of other companies) under the principle of it ain't illegal if you don't get caught.
Or if you get caught, it will be by the NCAA and they can't do shit. This is a whole new level.

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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Lorini »

Publicly traded companies are not generally willing to risk getting caught breaking the law by bribery. It pisses off the shareholders and wrecks the brand. Adidas is in a very competitive and lucrative market and won't be so competitive after this. Sure they'll eventually recover but now they have to file risk disclosures in their quarterlies and companies don't like to do that. Assuming that Nike/Under Armor are not involved in this (they might be as you generally have to do what the competition does) they'll hammer home that they are the 'ethical' brand.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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Lorini wrote:Publicly traded companies are not generally willing to risk getting caught breaking the law by bribery. It pisses off the shareholders and wrecks the brand. Adidas is in a very competitive and lucrative market and won't be so competitive after this. Sure they'll eventually recover but now they have to file risk disclosures in their quarterlies and companies don't like to do that. Assuming that Nike/Under Armor are not involved in this (they might be as you generally have to do what the competition does) they'll hammer home that they are the 'ethical' brand.
That's the point. NCAA can't touch them. The feds can. It's not getting caught, it's execs facing jail time. They'll happily risk a run-in with the SEC (not the conference) since that usually just means fines and a wrist slap. But taking this to the next level is a real deterrent.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Lorini »

The case may not be so clear cut. The laws the feds are using to arrest these people are not clear and are in flux.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Skinypupy »

They've had a whole bunch of former Utah and BYU basketball players on sports radio talking about this. The general consensus was that these sort of bribes and violations absolutely happen all the time, they've been happening for years, and they are probably far more widespread than everyone thinks.

Kinda of a "well, duh", but it's fascinating to hear some of these guys tell their stories. Most of these guys aren't even blue chip athletes (although Rick Majerus did have some studs at Utah back in the day), and nearly all of them have stories about getting $500 put in their pocket by a booster, getting paid $1,000 to "work" at a booster's car wash, getting free stuff from shoe/gear manufacturers, etc.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Ralph-Wiggum »

I have no doubt that payments of $500/$1000 happen all the time. But, and maybe I'm naive, I seriously doubt payments of $100K, as is alleged in this case, are common.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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A lot of Michigan folks are spraining their shoulders patting themselves on their backs for having John Beilein as head coach. (Please ignore the 1990s at Michigan, thankyouverymuch.) He's notoriously clean cut and doesn't go in for recruiting shenanigans, yet he's been quite successful without pulling in the five stars. If it turns out that he was in any way involved in it (Michigan was an Adidas school until a few years ago), then just blow up the whole damn thing. Either eliminate college sports or give up on the charade of amateurism.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Lorini »

The question the WSJ article is discussing is if it's honest fraud if the schools involved weren't actually hurt by the behavior.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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If this article is accurate, Pitino is toast and done coaching forever. He supposedly knew of and helped direct the $100K payment to Brian Bowen's family.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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ImLawBoy wrote:If this article is accurate, Pitino is toast and done coaching forever. He supposedly knew of and helped direct the $100K payment to Brian Bowen's family.
Whoops!!
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Ralph-Wiggum »

Apparently Jay Williams mentioned on ESPN yesterday that when he was part of a sports agency, they paid $250K to Kevin Love's AAU coach in order to get access to Love. So maybe this is more common that I thought...
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by stessier »

ImLawBoy wrote:give up on the charade of amateurism.
This. And it should have happened a long time ago.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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Lorini wrote:The case may not be so clear cut. The laws the feds are using to arrest these people are not clear and are in flux.
Is there a non-paywalled version of the story, or can you post highlights?

Thanks!
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Skinypupy »

Ralph-Wiggum wrote:Apparently Jay Williams mentioned on ESPN yesterday that when he was part of a sports agency, they paid $250K to Kevin Love's AAU coach in order to get access to Love. So maybe this is more common that I thought...
I'm sure many former players will be cringing over the coming days/weeks as stories come out about how widespread this stuff actually is.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

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Ralph-Wiggum wrote:Apparently Jay Williams mentioned on ESPN yesterday that when he was part of a sports agency, they paid $250K to Kevin Love's AAU coach in order to get access to Love. So maybe this is more common that I thought...
He said that this was "after" Love was done at UCLA, not before/during, FWIW.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Ralph-Wiggum »

According to this article, it sounds like the shenanigans were going on during the season.
Williams said on Wednesday’s Outside The Lines:

“There were a lot of dealings that were being made that people didn’t know about. There was a lot of money being exchanged. I know for a fact — there was a reported story from Yahoo! Sports back in 2009 — I know that we gave an AAU coach for a guy named Kevin Love who plays for the Cleveland Cavaliers. We gave him over $250,000. Now, at the time, we were also giving other players money because you were allowed to give players money through their AAU programs.”

The Yahoo! story that Williams referenced in the video described a meeting between Love, Barrett and Williams after a UCLA game. The article no longer lives on Yahoo! Sports‘ site, but here is an excerpt.

Kevin Love said he would’ve preferred hitting In-N-Out Burger with his family after another UCLA victory last winter. Yet, there was Pat Barrett, head of one of the top AAU basketball programs in the country, waiting outside the Pauley Pavilion locker room and pleading for Love to come with him instead.

Love had known Barrett since he was in fifth grade, played two years for Barrett’s traveling team and, as a result, said he felt obligated to go. What Love apparently didn’t know was a New York sports agency had donated $250,000 to Barrett’s team under the premise Barrett could deliver players such as Kevin Love – to dinner first, then as a client.

When Love arrived at Mr. Chow, the famed Chinese restaurant in Beverly Hills, the waiting group included Jay Williams, former national player of the year at Duke and 2002 NBA lottery pick.

Williams was there on business, as the chief recruiter for Ceruzzi Sports and Entertainment, the very agency that staked Barrett with a quarter-million dollars.
Emphasis mine.
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Re: NCAA basketball 2017 - 2018

Post by Lorini »

Pyperkub wrote:
Lorini wrote:The case may not be so clear cut. The laws the feds are using to arrest these people are not clear and are in flux.
Is there a non-paywalled version of the story, or can you post highlights?

Thanks!
Not sure :) For some reason I could read it without a sub. I'll have to figure out how I did it, I got the link from somewhere. Sorry I thought since I could read it you guys could too. I'll try to find the link again and summarize for you.
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