Octopus Overlords

Because Bears talk doesn't belong in the playoff thread.

Has your failed team jettisoned their coach yet? The Bears seem to be dragging it out, and it appears those that hoped Gruden would come to the rescue are SOL because reports are the Raiders snagged him.

my fear is that Elway retains Vance Joseph.

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Xmann wrote: ↑Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:17 am my fear is that Elway retains Vance Joseph.

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Perhaps The Bears are waiting for him to become available. After all, that's how we ended up with Fox.

For some reason, the players seem to be rallying around Fox. If they are successful we might wind up with yet another high draft pick in 2019!

If Gruden goes to the Raiders, I’m wondering how MNF survives. Realistically, I know it’s not going anywhere. The NFL isn’t going to let it die. But ESPN has been unwatchable for years, especially MNF. Gruden was the best part about it. If they don’t find the right person to fill his shoes, I could see ESPN moving on.

Caldwell is done in Detroit. I think he reeled the team after Schwartz set them on fire and couldn't control them but that's the extent of what he was able to accomplish. I didn't despise him like most but I do think he did as much as he could and was a bad in game manager. I hope Quinn find the right staff for this team.

LordMortis wrote: ↑Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:04 am Caldwell is done in Detroit. I think he reeled the team after Schwartz set them on fire and couldn't control them but that's the extent of what he was able to accomplish. I didn't despise him like most but I do think he did as much as he could and was a bad in game manager. I hope Quinn find the right staff for this team.

I was surprised but not shocked at this decision. I'm curious as whether they have anyone specific they are targeting, as there are not many better qualified candidates currently available. Still, this season, while somewhat of a bust, was also due in a major part to injuries. They only played their entire starting o-line in one game, the first. After that it was mix and match and hope for the best. It resulted in lack of protection for Stafford and a dismal running game. Our defense was pretty good this season but our offense had problems getting scoring early and played catch up pretty much every game. Caldwell seemed to have reached his peak with the Lions but I just don't see how a coaching change is going to change the real issues with this franchise. That's on the guy who puts together the roster. If we do not fix our offensive line issues in the off season, I don't care who you put in as head coach, this team will underperform.

msteelers wrote: ↑Mon Jan 01, 2018 9:27 am If Gruden goes to the Raiders, I’m wondering how MNF survives. Realistically, I know it’s not going anywhere. The NFL isn’t going to let it die. But ESPN has been unwatchable for years, especially MNF. Gruden was the best part about it. If they don’t find the right person to fill his shoes, I could see ESPN moving on.

If people watched when Kornheiser was in the booth (who I like but who was terrible on MNF), they'll watch whoever ESPN gets to succeed Gruden. The main issue with MNF is that the games often are terrible.

LordMortis wrote: ↑Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:04 am Caldwell is done in Detroit. I think he reeled the team after Schwartz set them on fire and couldn't control them but that's the extent of what he was able to accomplish. I didn't despise him like most but I do think he did as much as he could and was a bad in game manager. I hope Quinn find the right staff for this team.

All of this, exactly. Caldwell was a step in the right direction in terms of discipline and reducing the rain of yellow hankees. I'm not sure who's out there who can build on this step in the direction of improvement, but (and it's super weird for me to be thinking this,) I think that Lions ownership is leading things in the right direction.

I also expect that Caldwell will find another HC landing spot (possibly after a year of coordinating somewhere), if he so desires. Not sure his retirement situation though.

Xmann wrote: ↑Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:17 am my fear is that Elway retains Vance Joseph.

I've got some bad news for you man...

rshetts2 wrote: ↑Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:54 am

LordMortis wrote: ↑Mon Jan 01, 2018 11:04 am Caldwell is done in Detroit. I think he reeled the team after Schwartz set them on fire and couldn't control them but that's the extent of what he was able to accomplish. I didn't despise him like most but I do think he did as much as he could and was a bad in game manager. I hope Quinn find the right staff for this team.

I was surprised but not shocked at this decision. I'm curious as whether they have anyone specific they are targeting, as there are not many better qualified candidates currently available. Still, this season, while somewhat of a bust, was also due in a major part to injuries. They only played their entire starting o-line in one game, the first. After that it was mix and match and hope for the best. It resulted in lack of protection for Stafford and a dismal running game. Our defense was pretty good this season but our offense had problems getting scoring early and played catch up pretty much every game. Caldwell seemed to have reached his peak with the Lions but I just don't see how a coaching change is going to change the real issues with this franchise. That's on the guy who puts together the roster. If we do not fix our offensive line issues in the off season, I don't care who you put in as head coach, this team will underperform.

I don't think of the decision as a bust. It was a let down after the first three games and specifically after Rodgers went down, reshaping the division, but I heard of no-one predicting better than 9-7 coming in to the season and most picking considerably worst, thinking a step backward year was going to drive them under .500 They won the games they were supposed to win even after re-calibration of expectations and lost the games they were supposed to lose. I think Quinn has done so so at "fixing" the O Line to date, though I am disappointed that he not addressed the half back situation and if his reported strength was at building depth our "depth" did nothing for the OLine in question, which has been plaguing the organization since Harrinington, at least.

At the same time, they weren't enough to make me watch on Sundays, even with Stafford being one year removed from my "run him out of town chants" and with me not hating Caldwell. Maybe next year, there will the spark again. We'll see.

The Meal wrote: ↑Mon Jan 01, 2018 1:23 pm I also expect that Caldwell will find another HC landing spot (possibly after a year of coordinating somewhere), if he so desires. Not sure his retirement situation though.

We'll see. Local radio was pretty brutal with him in the last two years, even more brutal than they've been with Ausmus. Every week, they've focused more on his in game management than on performance on the field. That may have colored my glasses, as I only half paid attention while gaming or doing errands.

I'm a little sad to see Caldwell go myself. While he seemed less than ideal in a few ways, he seemed to get more out of the Lions than any of their recent coaches, probably since Wayne Fontes.

In regards to the division, The Lions performed well, finishing 5-1 vs division opponents. I thought that this fact, along with the o-line injuries might have bought Caldwell some leniency. But I do believe his in game mismanagement issues played a major part in his release. Clearly the Lions believe they can improve with this roster under a different head coach. I will admit that I dont believe that the season was a bust as it were. A few friends and I make a bet annually to predict the Lions season record and my prediction was 9-7 and out of the playoffs. But I think expectations, locally were that the Lions needed to make the playoffs this season for Caldwell to be retained. That's why I said that the season was somewhat of a bust. I appreciate what Caldwell did after inheriting the hot mess left by Schwartz but I can not disagree with the reasons that led to his dismissal. He made too many game decision mistakes to completely overlook and in the end that was his undoing.

My prediction for the next head coach? Since its Quinn making the final decision, I would not be surprised to see Matt Patricia, the Patriots current DC end up with the position. Teryl Austin is also a possibility if the Lions want to retain him. If not, he is probably gone as well. They have already scheduled a Tuesday interview with Austin.

pretty much expected it when they didn't announce firing him last night.


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Cleveland Parade

Chris McNeil, a Cleveland Browns fan (and Miami RedHawks fan, according to his Twitter account, as well as Miami University graduate, according to LinkedIn) says he has permission from the City of Cleveland to hold a parade if the team becomes the second in NFL history to finish a season 0-16.

I was kinda sad to see Jack Del Rio get fired. But the team took a step backward this year, and the offense, the strength of the team just didn't look very good, with mostly the same weapons. I imagine letting Murray go and bringing in Lynch was Davis's doing but for much of the year Lynch was useless. Del Rio fired the DC early in the season and I think the OC was underperforming, so I guess Del Rio was next in line.

You do have to wonder why Gruden hasn't actually signed on yet though.

With the Raiders and Broncos in decline, I am hopeful the Chargers just need to add a kicker to challenge the Chiefs for the division.

Scuzz wrote:You do have to wonder why Gruden hasn't actually signed on yet though.

Word is they are waiting until he calls the playoff game this weekend for ESPN.

Jaymann wrote:With the Raiders and Broncos in decline, I am hopeful the Chargers just need to add a kicker to challenge the Chiefs for the division.

I don't think the Raiders are in decline yet. Their core is still young and mostly intact. It's why Gruden is probably taking the job (plus the rumored ownership share).

I'm sad to see Rick Smith's (GM Texans) wife has cancer, but not that he's taking a leave of absence. While he hasn't been terrible, he hasn't been well above average either through two coaching groups. It wouldn't surprise me that many of his failures could be ownership as McNair is locally blamed for Osweiler and Ed Reed, but I think he bears blame for losing Bouye, paying a mediocre tight end big money, and rarely, if ever, having quality NFL safeties along with terrible special teams to go with a .500 record. I think he deserves another shot in a different organization, but he showed he couldn't stand up to the McNairs.

I'm not sold on O'Brien but I don't mind him getting another year. The players love him and he showed he's got offensive talent once he got a quarterback that can run his system. He still makes bad tactical decisions occasionally, but all coaches except Belichick do.

Marvin Lewis signed a 2 year extension yesterday. I thought he was already gone. Amazing.

Pyperkub wrote: ↑Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:43 pm

Jaymann wrote:With the Raiders and Broncos in decline, I am hopeful the Chargers just need to add a kicker to challenge the Chiefs for the division.

I don't think the Raiders are in decline yet. Their core is still young and mostly intact. It's why Gruden is probably taking the job (plus the rumored ownership share).

Gruden supposedly loves Carr. And the Raiders are a young team that with a fresh spark could easily get back to 10 wins. They really played terribly this year.

stessier wrote: ↑Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:14 pm Marvin Lewis signed a 2 year extension yesterday. I thought he was already gone. Amazing.

This is a surprise. Maybe he is cheap as far as head coaches go and the Bengals are known for being cheap.

Scuzz wrote: ↑Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:22 pm

Pyperkub wrote: ↑Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:43 pm

Jaymann wrote:With the Raiders and Broncos in decline, I am hopeful the Chargers just need to add a kicker to challenge the Chiefs for the division.

I don't think the Raiders are in decline yet. Their core is still young and mostly intact. It's why Gruden is probably taking the job (plus the rumored ownership share).

Gruden supposedly loves Carr. And the Raiders are a young team that with a fresh spark could easily get back to 10 wins. They really played terribly this year.

Carr also had those broken bones in his back. That had to be effecting him to some extent and an offseason to heal should help him a bit.

noxiousdog wrote:
I'm not sold on O'Brien but I don't mind him getting another year. The players love him and he showed he's got offensive talent once he got a quarterback that can run his system. He still makes bad tactical decisions occasionally, but all coaches except Belichick do.

The most damning fact about Bill O’Brien is that he somehow thought Tom Savage was a better QB than Watson at the start of the season. How that’s even possible, I have no idea.

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:44 pm

noxiousdog wrote:
I'm not sold on O'Brien but I don't mind him getting another year. The players love him and he showed he's got offensive talent once he got a quarterback that can run his system. He still makes bad tactical decisions occasionally, but all coaches except Belichick do.

The most damning fact about Bill O’Brien is that he somehow thought Tom Savage was a better QB than Watson at the start of the season. How that’s even possible, I have no idea.

I think at the start of the season O'Brien probably thought the Texans defense could carry the team and that he just needed Savage to not make mistakes. Also, very few rookie QB's open up the season as starters. But when Watt went down and the defense faltered they needed more offense and so Watson got the chance.

Local rumor is that O'Brien wanted to start Watson, but Rick Smith talked him out of it. This would have been leaked from O'Brien's people. The evidence fits that narrative as he changed immediately.

The organization runs where the head coach runs Operations and the GM runs personnel. Major decisions are done by consensus with McNair breaking the ties.

Scuzz wrote: ↑Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:22 pm

Pyperkub wrote: ↑Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:43 pm

Jaymann wrote:With the Raiders and Broncos in decline, I am hopeful the Chargers just need to add a kicker to challenge the Chiefs for the division.

I don't think the Raiders are in decline yet. Their core is still young and mostly intact. It's why Gruden is probably taking the job (plus the rumored ownership share).

Gruden supposedly loves Carr. And the Raiders are a young team that with a fresh spark could easily get back to 10 wins. They really played terribly this year.

Yup. Losing their Offensive Coordinator really hurt, and there's a reason why Carroll never promoted Norton Jr beyond LB coach. Del Rio's not a bad Head Coach, but he's not good enough to make up for poor Coordinator choices (like most Head Coaches). A healthy Carr under Gruden's tutelage will be impressive, if they can keep the OL together and get an RB. The defense also has talent, and they could easily win the AFC West again next year.

Pyperkub wrote: ↑Wed Jan 03, 2018 6:51 pm

Scuzz wrote: ↑Wed Jan 03, 2018 2:22 pm

Pyperkub wrote: ↑Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:43 pm

Jaymann wrote:With the Raiders and Broncos in decline, I am hopeful the Chargers just need to add a kicker to challenge the Chiefs for the division.

I don't think the Raiders are in decline yet. Their core is still young and mostly intact. It's why Gruden is probably taking the job (plus the rumored ownership share).

Gruden supposedly loves Carr. And the Raiders are a young team that with a fresh spark could easily get back to 10 wins. They really played terribly this year.

Yup. Losing their Offensive Coordinator really hurt, and there's a reason why Carroll never promoted Norton Jr beyond LB coach. Del Rio's not a bad Head Coach, but he's not good enough to make up for poor Coordinator choices (like most Head Coaches). A healthy Carr under Gruden's tutelage will be impressive, if they can keep the OL together and get an RB. The defense also has talent, and they could easily win the AFC West again next year.

Don't kid yourself, this is the Raiders we're talking about. They always find a way to screw up. Their motto should be, "There's always next year"

Drat - previously posted in wrong thread.

The Raiders are giving Gruden a 10 years deal!

@AdamSchefter
1m1 minute ago
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Raiders are giving new head coach Jon Gruden a 10-year contract, the longest coaching deal in NFL history, sources tell ESPN. The deal is likely to be worth about $100 million.

Ian Rapoport confirms and says his coaching staff is getting 4 year deals - 2 in Oakland, 2 in Vegas. Wow.

The move to Vegas is probably going to be a real money maker for Davis, and it looks like he is already spending some of that. But 10 years?

Scuzz wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2018 3:21 pm The move to Vegas is probably going to be a real money maker for Davis, and it looks like he is already spending some of that. But 10 years?

It is a long time, but Gruden probably wanted a solid commitment from the team in order to give up his media work. The Raiders are letting him and the fans know they're serious about the direction they want to move the team.

Strange that cricket is ranked next boring after football - I thought they lived for that shit.

Biyobi wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2018 5:48 pm The Raiders are letting him and the fans know they're serious about the direction they want to move the team.

El Guapo wrote: ↑Wed Jan 10, 2018 5:08 pm

Biyobi wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2018 5:48 pm The Raiders are letting him and the fans know they're serious about the direction they want to move the team.

Well, yeah. Raider tradition and all.

While I disagree, I can't say as I blame them. It take the 3.5 hours to play an hour long game and most of that hour is spent in huddles and calling a play at the line. I think I ready somewhere a ball is typically in play for 10 to 12 minutes over the course of a game.

Biyobi wrote: ↑Wed Jan 10, 2018 5:26 pm

El Guapo wrote: ↑Wed Jan 10, 2018 5:08 pm

Biyobi wrote: ↑Fri Jan 05, 2018 5:48 pm The Raiders are letting him and the fans know they're serious about the direction they want to move the team.

Well, yeah. Raider tradition and all.

Gruden said he is still irritated by the Tuck Rule being correctly interpreted and applied (not a direct quote). Makes me a little giddy.

LordMortis wrote: ↑Wed Jan 10, 2018 5:35 pm While I disagree, I can't say as I blame them. It take the 3.5 hours to play an hour long game and most of that hour is spent in huddles and calling a play at the line. I think I ready somewhere a ball is typically in play for 10 to 12 minutes over the course of a game.

The NFL Game Access can show a condensed game in about 30 minutes. It's a few seconds before the snap and an occassional replay.

LordMortis wrote: ↑Wed Jan 10, 2018 5:35 pm While I disagree, I can't say as I blame them. It take the 3.5 hours to play an hour long game and most of that hour is spent in huddles and calling a play at the line. I think I ready somewhere a ball is typically in play for 10 to 12 minutes over the course of a game.

I think there are a few issues in play.

1) It's not like we've treated them to an exceptional version of the product. They mostly get trash games.

2) Logistically, the London game is a nightmare for teams, and so it's also wildly unpredictable how teams will perform.

3) There's no "home team" atmosphere. My son is a Steelers fan and for his 16th birthday I got us a pair of tickets for the Sunday Night game against the Packers this past Thanksgiving weekend. Being in that stadium when Antonio Brown had one of the most ridiculous sideline catches I've ever seen, on the game winning drive in the closing moments of the 4th quarter is one of the greatest sporting moments I've ever experienced. You absolutely need a home crowd for that.

4) You have to understand the strategic nature of the game. If you are a casual fan that doesn't really know the sport, you are missing 80+% of what's happening. I liken it to when I go to NHL games. I lack a sufficient understanding of the sport to truly enjoy it. I still enjoy it because of the pace, which the NFL lacks.

In short, I think I understand why they have that opinion, it's just wrong.