MLB 2019 Offseason Thread

Post by **ImLawBoy** » Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:25 pm

Lorini wrote: ↑Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:15 pm That change is obviously a response to the hour long inning during the Dodgers-Nationals playoff game where there were some incredible number of pitching changes. I think we can agree that this change will probably prevent that from happening again and maybe that's all they want.

Seems excessive to make such a major change to fix the potential of one outlier inning recurring.

Octavious · Post by **Octavious** » Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:26 pm

Pitch clock seems like a pretty harmless idea. I'd don't really have issues with the length of the game, but I generally don't just sit and watch a game. It's background noise while I'm doing something else. If I'm at the game I want it to go as long as possible.

I don't really see that mattering much to a casual fan though. Shrug...

Lorini · Post by **Lorini** » Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:20 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:19 pm If they shave 15 minutes off a game, how are we supposed to leave 15 minutes early to beat traffic? That 15 minutes is critical.

Leaving 15 minutes early is irrelevant at Dodger Stadium, you may as well stay. They'd have to shave off 2 innings to make a difference.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Thu Feb 13, 2020 8:03 pm

Slate

The players and owner Jim Crane held a team meeting on Wednesday to plan a course of action for the next day of camp. On Thursday, they severely underwhelmed. Astros hitters Jose Altuve and Alex Bregman provided roughly two minutes of insincere, vague remarks, while Crane issued a strange denial that the team’s cheating actually affected the outcome of the games.

Jeff V · Post by **Jeff V** » Thu Feb 13, 2020 10:06 pm

Lorini wrote: ↑Thu Feb 13, 2020 4:20 pm
LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:19 pm If they shave 15 minutes off a game, how are we supposed to leave 15 minutes early to beat traffic? That 15 minutes is critical.
Leaving 15 minutes early is irrelevant at Dodger Stadium, you may as well stay. They'd have to shave off 2 innings to make a difference.

When the likes of Fergie Jenkins or Mark Buehrle were pitching, 15 minutes was about 2 innings.

Lorini · Post by **Lorini** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:02 am

Those 'apologies' were terrible, and Manfred's response was nearly as bad. Well I think they are going to see the real responses when the Astros are on the road, when the Astros players need armor to stand at the plate and when the money drops because MLB has done a terrible job in handling this scandal (in my opinion of course).

And look, yes it was the Dodgers that were in that WS, but it was the Yankees that the Astros beat in the playoffs, it was Altuve with the AL MVP instead of Judge. There were plenty of both NL and AL teams that were affected by the cheating and the fans are going to let them know about it.

Lastly, yes I'm a Dodger fan, but dammit had this been the Dodgers cheating I'd be all over them. I'd be super mad that they took my money and cheated with it. That I spent money I saved for to watch a bunch of cheaters. Hell no. The sanctity of the game is paramount. So important to me. So I don't want noxiousdog to feel as if I'm piling onto him personally. The Astros are his team, just like if this was the Dodgers they'd still be my team, none of this is meant to be a criticism of his choice.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:29 am

I'd be a lot more critical if people actually cared about all cheating and not just specific teams cheating. Did you complain about Piazza doing PEDs?

Why aren't the Red Sox and Yankees getting the same treatment as the Astros? They did the exact same thing which is why Manfred reiterated the law and upgraded the punishment. I mean really.. Altuve stole the MVP from Aaron Judge ... who was also stealing signs?

The Astros are a scapegoat. People don't like them for a whole host of reasons; many of which are deserved. But the sign-stealing is ridiculous. It's an excuse. Nobody gave a rats ass about sign-stealing until this scandal. It wasn't even clear it was illegal until we went back and researched the rulings in the Boston/Yankees judgement a couple years back. The Cardinals front office committed federal felonies, but hardly a peep.

It is fun poking fun when people bending/breaking the rules get caught. I enjoyed deflate-gate and all the other things the Patriots did to bend the rules. I don't mind that. Feel free to call the Astros cheaters until the end of time. But save the righteous indignation, unless you were as vehement about the Dodger's 88 world series. If that's case, please carry on and I salute you.

Lorini · Post by **Lorini** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:45 am

I just started watching baseball when my mom died in 2006 and I was looking for something to engage my mind so I wasn't there for the steroid era.

Sign stealing as we all know is legal if done from in game. We also know that MLB has specifically spelled out that sign stealing using electronic means is illegal and is considered cheating. As you mention, they upgraded the penalties after the other incidents. The thing that upsets me and many others is that the Astros specifically ignored the MLB and specifically didn't seem to care, and at the end of the day, if all the team really got was a $5M fine vs the ~$60M they got from winning through attendance and other ways the sign stealing may have appeared to be a bargain.The attitude of the team toward all of this, especially the owner is craven again in my opinion. The owner apparently doesn't appear to think what the Astros did was even cheating, he certainly won't mention the word.

Had they actually appeared to be truly contrite and acted as if they actually cheated and were truly sorry then I don't think there'd be as much of a dustup. But their whole attitude appears to be 'we won' and who cares about the rest.

And you know noxious dog that the steroid era was a big deal to people. A huge deal There are players who are implicated in the steroid era, including Barry Bonds who may have been considered to be the best power hitter ever who will not be in the Hall of Fame because of it.

I'm an NL fan and the Astros left the NL awhile ago, so I certainly don't have any opinion about them either way. Just like Astro fans probably don't care much about the Dodgers, or maybe even any NL team. Apparently some consider the NL the junior varsity league anyway.

This cheating on top of the ridiculous treatment of the female journalist regarding the Astro's acquisition of a player punished for domestic violence just makes them seem like a bunch of jerks. They probably aren't a bunch of jerks and the treatment by them of the journalist certainly didn't involve the whole team. But honestly they need to take a step back and figure out how they want to present themselves as upstanding members of a profession that a lot of people care a lot about.

Note: The investigation of the Red Sox will be done by the end of this month according to Manfred. So maybe the Sox will get the same treatment. I wouldn't be surprised if Cora was banned from the MLB for life frankly.

Post by **ImLawBoy** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:01 am

noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:29 am The Cardinals front office committed federal felonies, but hardly a peep.

I'm not as bothered by the current scandal as some, but this is a huge overstatement. While it's certainly not capturing the public eye to the same level as the sign stealing situation (likely because it didn't happen in game and is just a less sexy scandal overall), there was plenty of ink, both real and virtual, spilled over that situation at the time, and it still frequently comes up in online discussions when someone wants to shut down a Cardinals fan.

Octavious · Post by **Octavious** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:22 am

noxiousdog wrote:I'd be a lot more critical if people actually cared about all cheating and not just specific teams cheating. Did you complain about Piazza doing PEDs?

Why aren't the Red Sox and Yankees getting the same treatment as the Astros? They did the exact same thing which is why Manfred reiterated the law and upgraded the punishment. I mean really.. Altuve stole the MVP from Aaron Judge ... who was also stealing signs?

The Astros are a scapegoat. People don't like them for a whole host of reasons; many of which are deserved. But the sign-stealing is ridiculous. It's an excuse. Nobody gave a rats ass about sign-stealing until this scandal. It wasn't even clear it was illegal until we went back and researched the rulings in the Boston/Yankees judgement a couple years back. The Cardinals front office committed federal felonies, but hardly a peep.

It is fun poking fun when people bending/breaking the rules get caught. I enjoyed deflate-gate and all the other things the Patriots did to bend the rules. I don't mind that. Feel free to call the Astros cheaters until the end of time. But save the righteous indignation, unless you were as vehement about the Dodger's 88 world series. If that's case, please carry on and I salute you.

Piazza was never tied to peds. Sure rumors but what player doesn't have them. He was huge from the day he hit the pros.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:32 am

Octavious wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:22 am
noxiousdog wrote:I'd be a lot more critical if people actually cared about all cheating and not just specific teams cheating. Did you complain about Piazza doing PEDs?

Why aren't the Red Sox and Yankees getting the same treatment as the Astros? They did the exact same thing which is why Manfred reiterated the law and upgraded the punishment. I mean really.. Altuve stole the MVP from Aaron Judge ... who was also stealing signs?

The Astros are a scapegoat. People don't like them for a whole host of reasons; many of which are deserved. But the sign-stealing is ridiculous. It's an excuse. Nobody gave a rats ass about sign-stealing until this scandal. It wasn't even clear it was illegal until we went back and researched the rulings in the Boston/Yankees judgement a couple years back. The Cardinals front office committed federal felonies, but hardly a peep.

It is fun poking fun when people bending/breaking the rules get caught. I enjoyed deflate-gate and all the other things the Patriots did to bend the rules. I don't mind that. Feel free to call the Astros cheaters until the end of time. But save the righteous indignation, unless you were as vehement about the Dodger's 88 world series. If that's case, please carry on and I salute you.
Piazza was never tied to peds. Sure rumors but what player doesn't have them. He was huge from the day he hit the pros.

He admitted it.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:55 am

ImLawBoy wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:01 am
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:29 am The Cardinals front office committed federal felonies, but hardly a peep.
I'm not as bothered by the current scandal as some, but this is a huge overstatement. While it's certainly not capturing the public eye to the same level as the sign stealing situation (likely because it didn't happen in game and is just a less sexy scandal overall), there was plenty of ink, both real and virtual, spilled over that situation at the time, and it still frequently comes up in online discussions when someone wants to shut down a Cardinals fan.

It merited a whole 10 posts on OO, and half of that was debating whether it was hacking.

Post by **ImLawBoy** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:57 am

noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:55 am
ImLawBoy wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:01 am
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:29 am The Cardinals front office committed federal felonies, but hardly a peep.
I'm not as bothered by the current scandal as some, but this is a huge overstatement. While it's certainly not capturing the public eye to the same level as the sign stealing situation (likely because it didn't happen in game and is just a less sexy scandal overall), there was plenty of ink, both real and virtual, spilled over that situation at the time, and it still frequently comes up in online discussions when someone wants to shut down a Cardinals fan.
It merited a whole 10 posts on OO, and half of that was debating whether it was hacking.

OO is not the world.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:01 pm

noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:29 am I'd be a lot more critical if people actually cared about all cheating and not just specific teams cheating. Did you complain about Piazza doing PEDs?

I did. Can I complain about the Astros? Or does 1919 mean I can't?

Jaymann · Post by **Jaymann** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:23 pm

ImLawBoy wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:57 am
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:55 am
ImLawBoy wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:01 am
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:29 am The Cardinals front office committed federal felonies, but hardly a peep.
I'm not as bothered by the current scandal as some, but this is a huge overstatement. While it's certainly not capturing the public eye to the same level as the sign stealing situation (likely because it didn't happen in game and is just a less sexy scandal overall), there was plenty of ink, both real and virtual, spilled over that situation at the time, and it still frequently comes up in online discussions when someone wants to shut down a Cardinals fan.
It merited a whole 10 posts on OO, and half of that was debating whether it was hacking.
OO is not the world.

Wait a minute...

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:56 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:01 pm
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:29 am I'd be a lot more critical if people actually cared about all cheating and not just specific teams cheating. Did you complain about Piazza doing PEDs?

I did. Can I complain about the Astros? Or does 1919 mean I can't?

I don't mind the complaining. They cheated. They deserve it.

It's the stuff about Altuve giving his MVP to Judge who was also stealing signs electronically that makes me angry.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 1:06 pm

noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:56 pm
LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:01 pm
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:29 am I'd be a lot more critical if people actually cared about all cheating and not just specific teams cheating. Did you complain about Piazza doing PEDs?

I did. Can I complain about the Astros? Or does 1919 mean I can't?

I don't mind the complaining. They cheated. They deserve it.

It's the stuff about Altuve giving his MVP to Judge who was also stealing signs electronically that makes me angry.

Yankees fans can get in line. Jason Giambi still needs to give his 2000 AL MVP to Frank Thomas.

pr0ner · Post by **pr0ner** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 1:58 pm

Yu Darvish, throwing shade.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 2:03 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 1:06 pm
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:56 pm
LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 12:01 pm
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:29 am I'd be a lot more critical if people actually cared about all cheating and not just specific teams cheating. Did you complain about Piazza doing PEDs?

I did. Can I complain about the Astros? Or does 1919 mean I can't?

I don't mind the complaining. They cheated. They deserve it.

It's the stuff about Altuve giving his MVP to Judge who was also stealing signs electronically that makes me angry.
Yankees fans can get in line. Jason Giambi still needs to give his 2000 AL MVP to Frank Thomas.

It was the Dodgers Cody Bellinger.

edit: Those two different takes are where my line is. Darvish's seems reasonable. It's funny. It gets the point across. Bellinger's is ridiculous.

Lorini · Post by **Lorini** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 3:30 pm

The Yankees were among other teams to be referenced as using technology illegally in the past five years. Now, the gripe against the Yankees is the equivalent of a traffic ticket – the only facts are that they illegally used dugout phones to check with their replay official on whether or not certain pitches were strikes or balls. Although the team was also accused of using a camera to steal signs, like the Astros and Red Sox, Major League Baseball did not find these claims credible.

https://www.pinstripealley.com/2020/1/9 ... uspensions

I have no clue what you are talking about noxious dog. The Yankees sign stealing wasn't done during the 2017 season that MLB could find any evidence for. Now if you want to just go full conspiracy theory then say so. So it is viable if not reasonable to say that Altuve had an advantage that Judge didn't. Just like Ryan Braun got the NL MVP and afterwards was found to have used steroids and deprived Matt Kemp of his MVP. You can't cheat and then say that somehow the award was deserved.

From a presumably less biased source https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/mlb- ... oth-teams/

And Piazza used an over the counter drug, not a full on steroid such as what Bonds used. But there doesn't seem to be any kind of degree of gray for you, it's all black and white. I'm sorry but using a dugout phone for replay information is simply not the same as using a friggin' trash can to relay signs, it's just not. So to somehow conclude that Judge cheated because his dugout used information to get a scoop on replay is the same as Altuve knowing what pitches were coming is simply ridiculous. So in your mind do you really think that Judge committed the same digression at the same level as Altuve??? You can't.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:18 pm

Talk about arbitrary. This tech is ok. That tech is not. This PED is ok, but this PED is not.

In addition, the Yankees probably used cameras too.

It has also been reported by The Athletic (though paywalled, it's easy enough to find secondary sources).

Oh yeah, Carlos Beltran was there too.

Also, ephedra is not an over the counter drugs, and androstenedione is classified as an “anabolic steroid” by the U.S. government, per the “Anabolic Steroid Control Act of 2004.”

Altuve's 2017 home/road splits:
Home: .311/.371/.463
Road: .381/.449/.633

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:31 pm

noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:18 pm ephedra is not an over the counter drug

May, 2003

New York Mets catcher Mike Piazza said he stopped taking an ephedra-based supplement following the death of Baltimore Orioles pitcher Steve Bechler in spring training.

Piazza said he didn't use the supplement on a regular basis and quit completely after Bechler's death, believed to be related to the pitcher's use of an ephedra-based diet pill.

Harvard Health

In December 2003, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration announced it was banning the sale of products containing ephedra. This announcement heralded the first time the agency has banned an herbal supplement.
...
As a result, because ephedra is an herb, U.S. law permitted over-the-counter sales of the supplement until the FDA could prove a clear danger to public health.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:35 pm

Fair enough. They are still PEDs.

He also took greenies or Dextroamphetamine which is a schedule II drug. IE not over the counter.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:46 pm

noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:18 pm

Altuve's 2017 home/road splits:
Home: .311/.371/.463
Road: .381/.449/.633

Similar to 2016. His home avg and obp improved slightly though. Home slg decreased

But more importantly, what was his home lid bang count during the 2017 regular season. Also, what were his 2017 post season splits?

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 5:11 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:46 pm
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:18 pm

Altuve's 2017 home/road splits:
Home: .311/.371/.463
Road: .381/.449/.633
Similar to 2016. His home avg and obp improved slightly though. Home slg decreased

But more importantly, what was his home lid bang count during the 2017 regular season. Also, what were his 2017 post season splits?

Lots and lots of lid bangs as I remember, and exceedingly small sample size but .142/.268/.228 vs .472/.512/.972.

edit: I remembered wrong. http://signstealingscandal.com/players/

edit2: MVP is a regular season award.

Lorini · Post by **Lorini** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 9:56 pm

All cheating is the exact same. Calling the ref in the dugout is exactly like using a fairly sophisticated system of electronic sign stealing, who knew.

It was amazing but Piazza was not the MVP of the '88 series.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:07 pm

noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 5:11 pm
LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:46 pm
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:18 pm

Altuve's 2017 home/road splits:
Home: .311/.371/.463
Road: .381/.449/.633
Similar to 2016. His home avg and obp improved slightly though. Home slg decreased

But more importantly, what was his home lid bang count during the 2017 regular season. Also, what were his 2017 post season splits?
Lots and lots of lid bangs as I remember, and exceedingly small sample size but .142/.268/.228 vs .472/.512/.972.

edit: I remembered wrong. http://signstealingscandal.com/players/

edit2: MVP is a regular season award.

So 24 of 866? Doesn't seem like he did it much during the regular season. Which means the splits don't tell us much.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Tue Feb 18, 2020 12:07 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:07 pm
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 5:11 pm
LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:46 pm
noxiousdog wrote: ↑Mon Feb 17, 2020 4:18 pm

Altuve's 2017 home/road splits:
Home: .311/.371/.463
Road: .381/.449/.633
Similar to 2016. His home avg and obp improved slightly though. Home slg decreased

But more importantly, what was his home lid bang count during the 2017 regular season. Also, what were his 2017 post season splits?
Lots and lots of lid bangs as I remember, and exceedingly small sample size but .142/.268/.228 vs .472/.512/.972.

edit: I remembered wrong. http://signstealingscandal.com/players/

edit2: MVP is a regular season award.
So 24 of 866? Doesn't seem like he did it much during the regular season. Which means the splits don't tell us much.

It means that he didn't benefit (much? at all?) from the Astros cheating strategy with regard to his MVP.

Lorini · Post by **Lorini** » Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:13 pm

Ahhhh spring training. Can't wait for the real deal! We open against the horrible Giants. Here's sayin' Dodgers 2 out of 3 in that series!!!

naednek · Post by **naednek** » Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:52 pm

Lorini wrote: ↑Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:13 pm Ahhhh spring training. Can't wait for the real deal! We open against the horrible Giants. Here's sayin' Dodgers 2 out of 3 in that series!!!

we'll see...

Lorini · Post by **Lorini** » Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:58 pm

naednek wrote: ↑Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:52 pm
Lorini wrote: ↑Thu Feb 20, 2020 2:13 pm Ahhhh spring training. Can't wait for the real deal! We open against the horrible Giants. Here's sayin' Dodgers 2 out of 3 in that series!!!
we'll see...

Had a great time talking with some *moron*

walking around in a Posey jersey at the local board game convention I went to last weekend. He doesn't want Puig either, who by the way has not been signed even though 'sources' say there's a lot of interest He'll bring in the fans and that's why I think there's interest, as my Posey (kind of) friend said, Puig is an average hitter.

Lorini · Post by **Lorini** » Wed Feb 26, 2020 11:53 am

So bro love continues as it appears that Roberts will make Kershaw the starting pitcher, even though Buehler is clearly better than Kershaw at this point in Kershaw's career. Sigh. I hope Buehler doesn't take it too hard, he's an excellent pitcher that I and many other fans have full confidence in.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:16 pm

I don't think #1 v #2 in the rotation matters that much. The opening day start is mostly honorific and Kershaw has earned that for the Dodgers. Buehler is certainly getting his due.

Octavious · Post by **Octavious** » Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:17 pm

I'm at a loss as to what to expect this season from the Mutts. We still have an amazing rotation, but I feel like there wasn't enough done in the winter to fills gaps compared to everyone in the division. Positional player wise I think we're okay in most spots. 1B Pete is as good as it gets... 2B Cano is still decent... SS Rosario had a really good season and people seem to forget he was a top prospect. His fielding is a bit dicey, but he cleaned that up a ton as the season went on. 3B will likely be MCNeil who is Daniel Murphy 2.0. I just wish he would stop swinging for the fences. Ramos isn't the best catcher in the world, but he can hit. So no complaints about him. Our OF is certainly not the best though. J.D. Davis can hit, but his fielding is mehhh. Cespedes could be a game changer as he has a TON of incentive to go nuts this year, but well Cespedes is Cespedes so who knows. CF Nimmo isn't that great of an option IMHO, but there aren't a ton of good CFs out there anyway. RF Conforto is decent and always feels like he could have a breakout season.

So really I think it comes down to what happened last year with the bullpen. If Diaz and Familia can get their shit together it could be a fun season.

Lorini · Post by **Lorini** » Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:22 pm

Who is the Mets manager? Do you think he'll be any good?

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:25 pm

I plan to spend this season mainly sending sarcastic e-mails to the Red Sox organization.

Octavious · Post by **Octavious** » Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:32 pm

He's been a minor league manager for the Mets for like the last 13 years and also has done some other roles. Seems like he's well respected by the players that came through the system so we'll see. Honestly this seems better than Beltran who had exactly zero experience. And that's ignoring the whole cheating crap.

I really thought Mickey would be good, but he seemed overwelmed by NYC coverage.

If the bullpen wasn't such a shit show last year they easily would have made the playoffs and he would still have a job.

Lorini · Post by **Lorini** » Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:36 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:16 pm I don't think #1 v #2 in the rotation matters that much. The opening day start is mostly honorific and Kershaw has earned that for the Dodgers. Buehler is certainly getting his due.

But Buehler is the future, and I think he deserves a nod. Kershaw has had plenty of accolades along the way, he can move over for the youngster.

Octavious · Post by **Octavious** » Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:44 pm

Octavious wrote:He's been a minor league manager for the Mets for like the last 13 years and also has done some other roles. Seems like he's well respected by the players that came through the system so we'll see. Honestly this seems better than Beltran who had exactly zero experience. And that's ignoring the whole cheating crap. I really thought Mickey would be good, but he seemed overwelmed by NYC coverage.

If the bullpen wasn't such a shit show last year they easily would have made the playoffs and he would still have a job.

Apparently Moises Alou is his brother. I really think that whole cheating stuff was a blessing for the Mets but we'll see. The Mets are good at being the Mets. Hell we can't even mange to sell the team properly.

Post by **ImLawBoy** » Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:48 pm

Lorini wrote: ↑Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:36 pm
LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Wed Feb 26, 2020 12:16 pm I don't think #1 v #2 in the rotation matters that much. The opening day start is mostly honorific and Kershaw has earned that for the Dodgers. Buehler is certainly getting his due.
But Buehler is the future, and I think he deserves a nod. Kershaw has had plenty of accolades along the way, he can move over for the youngster.

He'll get his eventually. I think most pitchers probably (hopefully) don't get too bent out of shape about someone with the stature of Kershaw getting the opening day start. If it does mess him up that much, you might have to wonder about his mental makeup.