Octopus Overlords

Everyone was falling all over themselves to anoint the Clippers as champions. The Lakers may have something to say about that: 103-101. Welcome back!

But the Clippers didn't have Lou Williams (in quarantine due to strip club...) or Montrez Harrell, who averages 18 pts and 7 rebounds a game, last night. So I think it's fair to say they were a bit shorthanded. That doesn't mean that they're necessarily better than the Lakers, but I wouldn't take last night as proof that they're not.

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:39 am But the Clippers didn't have Lou Williams (in quarantine due to strip club...) or Montrez Harrell, who averages 18 pts and 7 rebounds a game, last night. So I think it's fair to say they were a bit shorthanded. That doesn't mean that they're necessarily better than the Lakers, but I wouldn't take last night as proof that they're not.

No certainly not proof, but it is encouraging that in crunch time Caruso made the saving steal and LeBron actually hit a winning shot. And they had no answer for A D.

Watched part of the Den/MIA game this afternoon. The virtual fan thing is so weird.

Shame all three of the televised games were terrible. I had them on in the background today, and each one was a 20+ point blowout at one point. Clippers are up 34 over the Pelicans as I write this.

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:39 am But the Clippers didn't have Lou Williams (in quarantine due to strip club...) or Montrez Harrell, who averages 18 pts and 7 rebounds a game, last night. So I think it's fair to say they were a bit shorthanded. That doesn't mean that they're necessarily better than the Lakers, but I wouldn't take last night as proof that they're not.

Yeah and after the Lakers flop last night you very well could be right. We shall see, it'd serve the Lakers right to lose (meaningless) homefield in the playoffs.

Lorini wrote: ↑Sun Aug 02, 2020 1:22 pm

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Fri Jul 31, 2020 8:39 am But the Clippers didn't have Lou Williams (in quarantine due to strip club...) or Montrez Harrell, who averages 18 pts and 7 rebounds a game, last night. So I think it's fair to say they were a bit shorthanded. That doesn't mean that they're necessarily better than the Lakers, but I wouldn't take last night as proof that they're not.

Yeah and after the Lakers flop last night you very well could be right. We shall see, it'd serve the Lakers right to lose (meaningless) homefield in the playoffs.

Home field doesn't mean much (though they had some virtual fans cheering for Toronto) but seeding is paramount, and the Lakers won't come close to losing that.

There’s a big jump from Memphis to Dallas as the first round opponent. But I don’t think the Laker’s will lose first place; they’re too far ahead with too few games left.

You know what's cool about playoffs in the bubble? It's all about the skill. There's no crowd to support you, no buzz in the arena, it's just you, your team versus their team, just like in the gym. And as we saw yesterday, that didn't go too well for the top seeds. The Bucks never did show up, and the Lakers let the game get too far ahead of them. The first quarter was a disaster they never really recovered from.

I would have turned the game off had the Lakers not briefly taken the lead. What killed them was all those missed point blank layups. If they don't win on Thursday its time to stick a fork in them.

They shot 17% outside the restricted area. You do not win ball games with no outside shooting at all. They miss Bradley but the Blazers don't have Ariza so that's a wash in my opinion.

So the Clippers got thumped by the Mavericks last night - time for panic in Clippers Nation yet? I actually used to root for the Clippers back before Shaun Livingston blew up his leg. I was glad to see him make a meaningful comeback with the Warriors.

Yes Los Angeles NBA fans are a little concerned about both teams about now. Cool though a couple of the early rounds are competitive, always like watching great basketball.

I would be more concerned about the Lakers right now than the Clippers, but certainly both Portland and Dallas have the capability to win the series. But Dallas often struggles in close games, so I expect the Clippers to right the ship.

Portland, on the other hand, has been playing great since the bubble started. Talent-wise, I think they're closer to a 3 or 4 seed than an 8 seed (and it certainly helps that Nurkic is back). And the Lakers have been off since the beginning of the restart. If they don't turn things around quickly and start hitting some shots, I wouldn't be surprised to see Portland win the series. But sounds like Rondo is close to coming back; I think he'll be a big help on defense at least.

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Thu Aug 20, 2020 12:01 pm I would be more concerned about the Lakers right now than the Clippers, but certainly both Portland and Dallas have the capability to win the series. But Dallas often struggles in close games, so I expect the Clippers to right the ship.

Portland, on the other hand, has been playing great since the bubble started. Talent-wise, I think they're closer to a 3 or 4 seed than an 8 seed (and it certainly helps that Nurkic is back). And the Lakers have been off since the beginning of the restart. If they don't turn things around quickly and start hitting some shots, I wouldn't be surprised to see Portland win the series. But sounds like Rondo is close to coming back; I think he'll be a big help on defense at least.

yeah, Portland is definitely the bigger threat to win their series. In addition to how well the Blazers have played in the bubble, the other thing to remember is that Portland was in the Western Conference Finals last year.

Dallas ain't no slouch, but the Clippers have a lot more options to mix/match to find the best matchups.

Order is restored in the West. 'Mello returns to form.

I'm calling it now. The NBA season is done.

All of pro sports may be done for the season.

Lorini wrote: ↑Wed Aug 26, 2020 11:14 pm All of pro sports may be done for the season.

I don't think so. The NFL, for instance, doesn't have guaranteed contracts, which seriously changes the equation. I'm not sure the NBA is done either. There is a lot of money in play - I could see the Board of Governors coming up with a plan to promote the cause while getting in the rest of the games. It's not like this is a problem that's going to be fixed in a week.

Lorini wrote: ↑Wed Aug 26, 2020 11:14 pm All of pro sports may be done for the season.

I do see the N.H.L. finishing out the currently-in-progress post-season. I don't have positive expectations for any of the other big four team pro sports leagues though. (I have no opinion on pro soccer.)

The Meal wrote: ↑Thu Aug 27, 2020 8:42 am

Lorini wrote: ↑Wed Aug 26, 2020 11:14 pm All of pro sports may be done for the season.

I do see the N.H.L. finishing out the currently-in-progress post-season. I don't have positive expectations for any of the other big four team pro sports leagues though. (I have no opinion on pro soccer.)

MLS had all its games but one postponed yesterday. They'll allegedly be rescheduled but it's hard to say win.

I do think MLS will try to keep their season going unless they run into some Covid roadblocks or issues with the Canadian teams getting their games in.

Otherwise, NHL will definitely keep going. MLB, maybe but likely. NFL, too much money involved not to. NBA? Yeah, I really continue to think they're done.

You would think though that's there's a ton of money in the NBA as well. And while I absolutely support the thought, we all know that there's really nothing that a boycott will do about police killing Black people. The NBA could disappear entirely and you'd still see these shootings because they are reflecting in my opinion the system in the US. At the end of the day, there's probably a million non pro basketball player who would love to take their place at half their pay. So they have to be careful. They have to realize that the less they play, the smaller their voice becomes. They only have a large voice because they play pro basketball.

Chris Paul seems to be a sensible person who hopefully can bring more than emotion to the table as they discuss what they want to do. The latest that I heard is that while the Lakers and Clippers are willing to leave the bubble, the rest of the teams are not, so I don't know what's going to happen there. Both the players and the owners are meeting this morning to figure out how to go forward.

Very interesting that Adam Silver made no statement yesterday, I thought we'd hear from him at least some kind of explanation or support or no support or something. But he was silent.

Silver may just be as stunned as the rest of us. The bubble was working, but now what?

Lorini wrote: ↑Wed Aug 26, 2020 11:14 pm All of pro sports may be done for the season.

Sadly, for some this will likely be more motivating for supporting cultural/societal change than anything else happening right now.

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Thu Aug 27, 2020 11:09 am

Lorini wrote: ↑Wed Aug 26, 2020 11:14 pm All of pro sports may be done for the season.

Sadly, for some this will likely be more motivating for supporting cultural/societal change than anything else happening right now.

Yep and they know that too. The problem is, as mentioned, that the owners can simply replace the players with players who don't care, especially in the NFL. So I hope they can manage these unchartered waters carefully so that they can make the greatest impact on what's going on in the US today.

Seems like a big question is whether there's any plausible deal that would satisfy the players and/or that they could claim as a victory. Leading up to the strike I recall there was some discussion about the players calling the WI AG; not sure if that has happened, but regardless all the Wisconsin AG could do (even if he responds favorably) is to promise to fully investigate - he can't promise a prosecution of the officers who shot Jacob Blake. I suspect Silver would be open to making some sort of public display on behalf of the NBA, but I doubt that that would be enough to make a difference for the players.

I guess I'm not sure who the players could pressure that could do anything material.

It's not a strike, y'all, it's a boycott. A strike is against the owners. This isn't against the owners. The players aren't asking for anything specific that the owners are to do.

Oops, forgot El Guapo is an attorney. Well maybe in legal terms it's a strike, but I have not read that narrative from any side involved.

Lorini wrote: ↑Thu Aug 27, 2020 11:27 am It's not a strike, y'all, it's a boycott. A strike is against the owners. This isn't against the owners. The players aren't asking for anything specific that the owners are to do.

Oops, forgot El Guapo is an attorney. Well maybe in legal terms it's a strike, but I have not read that narrative from any side involved.

I have seen it generally described as a strike. Their grievance isn't ultimately against the owners (at least not directly), but it is employees collectively refusing to perform the job that they are contractually bound to perform, which is generally the definition of a strike.

And I imagine that the players are likely to wind up making demands of the owners. To the extent that the players can accomplish something concrete here, it's likely to put pressure on the rich and powerful NBA owners to use their wealth and influence to support pro-social justice changes.

I see, thanks for the explanation. I do think the players have been careful not to describe it as a strike even though it certainly meets the strict definition. The players association and the owners have had an awesome relationship since Silver took over and made it a priority to keep the peace with the players. I hope that the potential of endangering that relationship is on the table for both sides, as the fans absolutely hate strikes, at least over money.

The other thing is that there is a belief that the Black community is 100% behind this and I wonder about that. Many many Black people love NBA basketball, Black fans are their largest fan base, and to stop playing over something I'm sure many Black people see as inevitable could seem like the worst kind of privilege. We'll see what the actual reaction is 'on the street' so to speak as this moves on.

Thankfully I was wrong.

Good. I hope they got some concessions from the NBA owners. All of the pro sports owners need to go to Congress and let Congress know that they want a solution to the problem of police killing Black people. And that if that problem continues to happen that there could be a lot of money (not just sports money) left on the table. Keep in mind that while I'm sure the companies that bought ads for those games will be refunded, a refund is not what AT&T wanted, they wanted their ad to air. And speaking of AT&T, they support police foundations. Why not have the NBA tell them that if they continue to support police foundations, they can air their ads somewhere else? I think there are a lot of creative ways this can be helped/solved if Big Money gets involved.

El Guapo wrote: ↑Thu Aug 27, 2020 11:19 am Seems like a big question is whether there's any plausible deal that would satisfy the players and/or that they could claim as a victory. Leading up to the strike I recall there was some discussion about the players calling the WI AG; not sure if that has happened, but regardless all the Wisconsin AG could do (even if he responds favorably) is to promise to fully investigate - he can't promise a prosecution of the officers who shot Jacob Blake. I suspect Silver would be open to making some sort of public display on behalf of the NBA, but I doubt that that would be enough to make a difference for the players.

I guess I'm not sure who the players could pressure that could do anything material.

All the MIL players called the WI AG last night right around the time they decided not to play. He told them to continue to put pressure on all levels of government to get something done. The WI AG and governor are Democrats. The legislature is Republican. There has been a police reform bill on their desk from the governor since June that they haven't acted on. I can't remember if it was the House or Senate that formed a task force to look into the issues. One's politics likely inform how one views that response.

NBA and NBAPA just put out this statement. Actionable, reasonable, and timely. I like it.

So Silver spoke after a plan was put together. I applaud the action and the plan.

Yes me as well. I know Dodger stadium will be used as a voting location in Los Angeles, why not Staple Center?

Well, beyond the Staples Center, you can see America.

Great article on why the NBA players needed to continue the season.

Outside the bubble, the players’ collective voice and presence would be diluted. They could march in the streets – or not, as the Boston Celtics’ Jaylen Brown pointed out – but they would not have millions of TV viewers and dozens of interviews with captive media in Orlando, Florida. Irving is a perfect example of how little attention even star players get outside the bubble: After the injured Nets guard said the season should be canceled to keep the focus on social justice, Irving’s activism and charitable deeds have received less coverage than, for example, the strip-club chicken wings named after LA Clippers guard Lou Williams.

Without the cameras and without them playing basketball, no one cares what they are doing and their impact is minimal. Glad someone recognized that so that they could get back in front of the camera and continue the pressure.

The end of the Heat-Bucks game featured some really horrible calls.

For sure. The foul on Middleton was questionable but I guess I can see it. The foul on Butler was nothing. Even worse, the ref who called it wasn't in a great position to see the play.

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Thu Sep 03, 2020 9:09 am For sure. The foul on Middleton was questionable but I guess I can see it. The foul on Butler was nothing. Even worse, the ref who called it wasn't in a great position to see the play.

Agreed on both counts. And the Butler whistle was very late. Giannis did a great job of getting out of the way, I thought. The ref who called it only saw his back, though. Unfortunate.