LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑
Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:01 am
In my state, if every independent vote went to Trump
, he still wouldn't have taken the state. My vote truly did not matter, whether I went D or IND. Well, it may have padded the national popular vote. So yea?
Obviously votes mattered in other states. And everyone knew going in what those states were.
My feeling on people who admit they know nothing about politics or candidates, they are voting irresponsibly if they vote. Ignorance does not absolve them of their poor choice.
I'm not going to tell anyone they shouldn't vote but it is their duty and responsibility to cast an educated vote. If they do not, they'd do everyone a favor by staying home.
The party system is a bypass to education. You don't have to read up about candidates if all you need to do is check the D or R. Even better, because only the diehards vote in the primary system, only a tiny fraction of the US population needs to educate themselves on a candidate!
I'll jump in with a story about my Grandmother. I love my grandmother. I also know she is/was a racist. She grew up and lived in rural South Dakota her entire life. I wouldn't be surprised if she never met an African American, however Native Americans were not uncommon. Her racism was of the quiet, ignorant stereotyping type, if you never spent a considerable amount of time with her, you'd never see it. There were a few comments over the years that made it obvious, they were broad stereotypes that did not make sense, but were "known" to be true where she lived. Our family is non-confrontational, including myself to my shame. We don't contradict each other to each other faces. It's just not done.
In 2008 and 2012 it wasn't race that made her vote for the Republican. It was her Catholic priest who flat out told the congregation that Obama was going to allow abortions up until the 9th month. A couple of us grandkids did push back against that, it's obviously false except in the case of saving a life, but faith is powerful and religion takes advantage of that. You can't argue against god, even with a family connection.
She's never said anything about Trump that I know of, but I have a ranching/farming side of the family who were vocal supporters of him. They don't see themselves as ignorant. I know you were talking about people who vote despite admitting to knowing nothing, but those who mark R or D without thought my be just as dangerous. They know they are in the right. That is hard to contradict and harder when our current climate is right and wrong, black and white, binary.
Now for my aside. I know my grandmother is/was racist even if it's not the screaming type, it's there, I love her and I'm not going to stop. I also know she is a flawed, but good person. I am not a racist, but I know my grandmother is a better person than I am. Anyone can argue against that, but it's true. She is gentle. She is loving. She is supportive. She's spent 90 years helping, giving to others to her own detriment.
Now here's the part that made me reconsider my belief in a binary racist/not racist good/bad system. When my grandmother met my then girlfriend, now wife, a Native American, she came straight up to her and hugged her and said welcome to the family. It was sincere. My wife mentions it occasionally in shock. No one explicitly warned my grandmother that my wife was Native American, but it's not hard to figure out. Maybe my grandmother thought about it and trusted me to make the right decision. Maybe family outweighed a lifetime of exposure to prejudice.
I don't know. All I know is that afterward I never heard her or heard of her speaking badly about race. Did she change? I have no idea, we don't talk about it. I know she treats my wife like one of the family. The rancher side of my family are still idiots though. Geez.
It's not excusing, but I think if we want to change the country we have to do it one person at a time. We have to do it by not screaming at people, not mocking people, not labeling people. We have to go slow and steady, standing up as examples and challenging hateful beliefs in a calm, but persistent manner. It's not easy. It's not fast. Nor does it require accepting hateful beliefs especially in government and law. We can and should stand up for civil rights, but at some point it's not enough to protect civil rights (which we should hold strongly and firmly to though), we need to change beliefs. It is happening and it will continue slowly.
I'd like to believe my grandmother changed due to the example of her grandchildren and granddaughter-in-law. It took a long time, but it works.
Now for a second grandmother story! Because I'm on a roll and I have no idea if anyone is even reading this far. My other grandmother, also a rural person, though rural North
Dakota native, proudly and loudly voted for President Obama in 2008. She took delight in shocking the other (racist old biddies according to her) residents of the manor she lived in. Great delight. The descriptions the aide sent us described her as cackling and mocking the others for days. I loved my grandmother, but she was not a good person. She was awesome though.