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The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

Post by pr0ner »

El Guapo wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:07 pm
Jaymann wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:06 pm
Max Peck wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:39 am
Little Raven wrote: Wed Jan 13, 2021 2:58 pm
Max Peck wrote: Wed Jan 13, 2021 2:57 pm
Authorities seized 1,000 rounds of rifle ammunition, 2,000 rounds of shotgun ammo, 75 “military-style” combat knives, two hatchets and two swords from the home
Yes, but were they curved swords?
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Skinypupy wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:31 am I read somewhere else that it's helpful to think of these two new QAnon reps as what they actually are: actors.

They weren't elected to actually create policy (although their votes will push bad policy along) or do anything to legitimately help their constituents. Their primary function is to act as wind-up "OUTRAGE!" machines. Wind them up and point them at the nearest camera to say the lines and create soundbites of whatever batshit GOP talking point is top of mind that day.

I expect that they will continue to gain an outsized portion of the media spotlight (they're both exceedingly good at being attention whores) while the rest of the GOP will mostly just try to ignore them rather than actively speaking out against them. I doubt they necessarily gain any traction, but we'll always hear exactly what their monumentally stupid take is on any given topic for the next few years.
Again, why is it that we have to give these kooks the media coverage they are so desperately after? If the media could just relent from waiting with baited breath for the next outrageous thing done by Greene or Boebert, and if they could stop hanging on every word that comes out of their stupid mouths, we'd be so much better off.

Yes, it was important to cover the fact that the GOP now has two certified members of the lunatic fringe representing it in Congress. Yes some investigation was merited into how and why their constituents voted for these two loons. But now? What's the point. We all know they're there. We all know they are crazy. Is it really news that two crazy people are acting like crazy people? Stop reporting on all the crazy and starve them of oxygen, or at least minimize their exposure and harm.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Amen. They do it because it gets views and sells papers. But I wish they'd stop.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

Post by LawBeefaroni »

Max Peck wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:39 am
Little Raven wrote: Wed Jan 13, 2021 2:58 pm
Max Peck wrote: Wed Jan 13, 2021 2:57 pmWell, except for the ones who have been actively conspiring to commit acts of insurrection but didn't make it to DC on the 6th. :coffee:
I suspect that's a pretty small number.
Perhaps, but that doesn't mean the Feds aren't coming for them.

'Dead men can’t pass shit laws': Queens Proud Boy busted with ammo stockpile
A far-right extremist arrested for stockpiling thousands of rounds of ammo inside his Middle Village home encouraged the murder of U.S. Sen. Raphael Warnock and liberal politicians throughout “target-rich” New York, federal prosecutors said Wednesday.
He was arrested for being a felon in possession of [any amount of] ammo. Not for a "stockpile". When you go through 200+ rounds on any given range day and can save over 50% buying in bulk, 2000 rounds isn't a stockpile, it's smart shopping.

Unless, of course, you are legally barred from possession.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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LawBeefaroni wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 1:55 pmWhen you go through 200+ rounds on any given range day and can save over 50% buying in bulk, 2000 rounds isn't a stockpile, it's smart shopping.
Non-gun owners see a number over 50 and think "Holy Shit!" but you're entirely right. A fun day at the range can burn several boxes of 50 rounds. 2000 sounds like a lot in normal-speke.

It's more like comparing the guy who buys a liter of soda to someone who buys four 12-packs of soda when it's on sale.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Bah, the ammo was just for skirmishing until he could get in range and dual wield those curved swords.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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All of which is true, but I'm genuinely curious about the 75 combat knives.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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General Grievous would like to know your location.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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The real question, to me, is whether the FBI rolled up to his door because they were tipped off about his tiny-but-illegal cache of ammunition, or did they find the ammunition after rolling up to his door because he was on Parler talking sedition and murder? I'm inclined to believe the latter, but it doesn't seem to be spelled out in the reporting I've seen so far.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Kurth wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:55 pm If the media could just relent from waiting with baited breath for the next outrageous thing done by Greene or Boebert, and if they could stop hanging on every word that comes out of their stupid mouths, we'd be so much better off.

Yes, it was important to cover the fact that the GOP now has two certified members of the lunatic fringe representing it in Congress. Yes some investigation was merited into how and why their constituents voted for these two loons. But now? What's the point. We all know they're there. We all know they are crazy. Is it really news that two crazy people are acting like crazy people? Stop reporting on all the crazy and starve them of oxygen, or at least minimize their exposure and harm.
While I agree that we should largely just ignore the morons, they are going to get a megaphone piped directly to the ears of the derpers (via Newsmax, Fox News, and OANN) regardless of what any other media outlets choose to do.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Max Peck wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 3:05 pm The real question, to me, is whether the FBI rolled up to his door because they were tipped off about his tiny-but-illegal cache of ammunition, or did they find the ammunition after rolling up to his door because he was on Parler talking sedition and murder? I'm inclined to believe the latter, but it doesn't seem to be spelled out in the reporting I've seen so far.
I suspect his neighbors reported him when they saw him in his backyard slashing at practice dummies.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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McConnell says Capitol rioters were 'fed lies' and 'provoked by the president'
McConnell also acknowledged that the House has impeached Trump and that the Senate is waiting for the lower chamber to transmit the article so that a trial can begin.
Still doubt he'd do anything.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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You know what might convince Republicans to convict to prevent Trump from holding office again?

Him trying to start his own party that would directly threaten them.

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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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:pray: :pray: :pray: :pray: :pray: :pray:
Ironically he could actually save the country he tried to destroy. He is enough of a megalomaniac to believe it would work. The more people advise against it, the more likely he is to do it.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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I would donate money for that.

Unless it's another grift.

Yeah, it's another grift. Never mind.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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I’d be motivated to vote in the primaries if it helped splinter the party.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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And it would put basturds like Cruz and Hawley between a rock and a hard place trying to capture the deplorables.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Jaymann wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:26 am And it would put basturds like Cruz and Hawley between a rock and a hard place trying to capture the deplorables.
Not knowing who's ass to properly kiss would present a massive dilemma for a slug like Cruz.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Kraken wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 12:11 am I would donate money for that.

Unless it's another grift.

Yeah, it's another grift. Never mind.
Its only a grift if you believe in what he claims. I'd be willing to donate because every person he grifts will not be voting for Republicans and thus giving us a better chance to survive as a nation.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Ok Biden is President. Lets impeach the orange hot air balloon that was in there and then forget about him.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Hopefully we (America) will never forget.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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TheMix wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 2:01 pm Hopefully we (America) will never forget.
Will serve as a constant reminder for the foreseeable future of why you don't vote for a demagogue just to "shake things up."
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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TheMix wrote: Wed Jan 20, 2021 2:01 pm Hopefully we (America) will never forget.
Much like admitting that you have a problem, remembering is worthless without subsequent action to address the damage.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Much prefer my Nazis Nuremberged.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Half the room won't stand up before hand and declare him innocent before it even starts and evidence is presented?
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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For better or worse delayed to Feb 9.
Last edited by Jaymann on Sat Jan 23, 2021 12:02 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Gotta get that Superbowl in.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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May not be so bad as more gruesome details of the attack on the Capitol come out. Wheels grinding slowly and exceedingly fine...
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

Post by Ralph-Wiggum »

And details like this keep coming out.

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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Hawley: You could tell he was an honorable man since he wore an everyman watch.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

Post by Isgrimnur »

Apparently running out the clock was a viable strategy:
The Supreme Court declined on Monday to hear a case concerning whether former President Donald Trump violated provisions of the Constitution that bar a president from profiting from a foreign government.

The court instructed the lower courts to wipe away previous lower court opinions that went against Trump because he is no longer in office. It leaves unresolved a novel question raised in the case because Trump, unlike other presidents, did not use a blind trust when he assumed the presidency, but instead continued to retain an interest in his businesses and let those businesses take money from foreign and domestic governments.

The order was issued without comment or dissent.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

Post by Smoove_B »

Absolutely amazing. Can't rule on it while there's a President potentially violating it. Now it's no longer a problem, so what's the big deal?

In other news, say hello to your new presiding official at the impeachment trial:
Sen. Patrick Leahy, D-Vt., will preside over former President Donald Trump's trial in the Senate, a Senate source tells NPR. Leahy, 80, is the president pro tempore of the Senate, a constitutional role given to the longest-serving lawmaker in the majority party. The president pro tempore is third in the line of presidential succession, after the vice president and House speaker.

"I have presided over hundreds of hours in my time in the Senate," Leahy told reporters. "I don't think anybody has ever suggested I was anything but impartial in those hundreds of hours."

Leahy added: "I'm not presenting the evidence. I am making sure that procedures are followed. I don't think there's any senator who over the 40-plus years I've been here that would say that I am anything but impartial in voting on procedure."
Prediction: Trump will be found guilty but the legitimacy of the finding and the structure of the trial will allow the GOP to claim it's not valid.

It's absolutely important to do this and I can understand that maybe they delayed this because of evidence being collected regarding 1/6. But JFC, the idea that they let him skate last year and the impacts it's had on America are still boggling my mind.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Florida Man - the gift that keeps on grifting.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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Isgrimnur wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 4:34 pm Apparently running out the clock was a viable strategy:
The Supreme Court declined on Monday to hear a case concerning whether former President Donald Trump violated provisions of the Constitution that bar a president from profiting from a foreign government.

The court instructed the lower courts to wipe away previous lower court opinions that went against Trump because he is no longer in office. It leaves unresolved a novel question raised in the case because Trump, unlike other presidents, did not use a blind trust when he assumed the presidency, but instead continued to retain an interest in his businesses and let those businesses take money from foreign and domestic governments.

The order was issued without comment or dissent.
:hawk:
The courts failed to hold the powerful accountable? What a surprise. This legal system might have saved us but it has pretty major problems that'll come home to roost eventually. Walter Shaub was quoted in this piece pointing out that this is a departure from past practice. Others pointed out that the idea that President's just have to run out the clock on constitutional issues or illegality is more than troublesome. This case started on DAY 1 of the Trump administration. 4 years later it hasn't been decided and dismissed? Come on.

Congress needs to either make the rules super clear or create an expedited process that cuts through all this legal bullshit. But who am I kidding - this nation was in freefall and only was temporarily arrested. We should only expect it to become dirtier and more corrupt over time in some future Presidency.
Walter Shaub resigned as director of the United States Office of Government Ethics after clashing with the then-president. A longtime critic of the twice-impeached Trump—who still faces a trial in the U.S. Senate for inciting a deadly insurrection at the U.S. Capitol—Shaub blasted the court's decision.

"That's insane. They're not moot," said Shaub. "He still has the money. When any other federal employee violates the emoluments clause they have to forfeit the money."

"If ever there were cases that fit the mootness exception these are they. The fact they arrived at the SCOTUS at the end of Trump's term demonstrate precisely why these actions can easily 'evade review.' As for 'capable of repetition,' Trump has stated his plan to run in [four years]," tweeted Sherrilyn Ifill, president of the NAACP Legal Defense and Educational Fund.

Ifill added that "had they held the cases to see if Trump is barred from holding office after Senate conviction, I could better understand. But even then, we need to know the contours of the emoluments clause for any president."

"The actual holding here isn't that the emolument cases are moot. It's that the president is above the law, because any attempt to bind the president through the courts will easily exceed the duration of the president's term in office, so don't bother," declared Will Stancil, a research fellow at the University of Minnesota Law School Institute on Metropolitan Opportunity.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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It's hard to understand how Trump still having the money from his businesses isn't by itself a complete defense to mootness. Totally baffling.

And that's to say nothing of Trump stonewalling subpoena enforcement during his presidency.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

Post by malchior »

El Guapo wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 10:43 pm It's hard to understand how Trump still having the money from his businesses isn't by itself a complete defense to mootness. Totally baffling.

And that's to say nothing of Trump stonewalling subpoena enforcement during his presidency.
The more upbeat are saying they'll just throw this into the corruption cases against Trump. Let's hope so. But I still think there won't be any.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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malchior wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 10:46 pm
El Guapo wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 10:43 pm It's hard to understand how Trump still having the money from his businesses isn't by itself a complete defense to mootness. Totally baffling.

And that's to say nothing of Trump stonewalling subpoena enforcement during his presidency.
The more upbeat are saying they'll just throw this into the corruption cases against Trump. Let's hope so. But I still think there won't be any.
There will 100% be corruption cases. The real question is how high up they'll go.
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

Post by malchior »

El Guapo wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 10:51 pm
malchior wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 10:46 pm
El Guapo wrote: Mon Jan 25, 2021 10:43 pm It's hard to understand how Trump still having the money from his businesses isn't by itself a complete defense to mootness. Totally baffling.

And that's to say nothing of Trump stonewalling subpoena enforcement during his presidency.
The more upbeat are saying they'll just throw this into the corruption cases against Trump. Let's hope so. But I still think there won't be any.
There will 100% be corruption cases. The real question is how high up they'll go.
High up meaning Trump? I agree there will be corruption cases. I just don't have any reason to think that the Federal justice system has the stomach to hold a President accountable. We'll obviously have to give the new AG and staff some time to come up to speed but the Cohen case should be a slam dunk from everything I've heard. He plead out already, was acting for Trump, and is willing to testify. So at a minimum I'd hope for that. We'll see and I'd *love* to be proven wrong. I do think something will happen at the state level though.

Edit: Welp. Hopefully this doesn't delay the case.

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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

Post by Moat_Man »

This is a 50 second explaination of why the Emoluments cases against Trump were dismissed.

Hold the line
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Re: The Trump Impeachment Thread

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I think this sort of misses the point. Some people might be upset about it because they don't understand the 'technical legal points'. Others aren't. Still I get that the legal types will scoff at the outrage but that is partly why the system is breaking down and why extremism is on the rise. This is more evidence that our system of 'justice' is deeply unfair to regular people and enfranchises the already powerful. When you compare that regular people get bullied into pleas while people like Trump spend our tax dollars to grind the system to a halt...well the absurdity of an outcome like this is a bitter pill to swallow. It is extremely corrosive. And it is driving people to want solutions that live outside our current system.
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