Paul Haggis is the director of "Crash," producer of "Million Dollar Baby" and executive producer of "Letters From Iwo Jima".
Haggis wrote that he had for months tried without success to have the church publicly denounce its San Diego chapter for its support of Proposition 8, the legislation to ban gay marriage in California.
"The church's refusal to denounce the action of these bigots, hypocrites and homophobes is cowardly," Haggis wrote. "I can think of no other word. Silence is consent, Tommy. I refuse to consent."
Haggis also asserted that the church "ordered" his wife, actress Deborah Rennard, to "disconnect from her parents because of something absolutely trivial they supposedly did twenty-five years ago when they resigned from the church.
"Although it caused her terrible personal pain, my wife broke off all contact with them" for a year and a half, Haggis wrote. "I refused to do so. I've never been good at following orders, especially when I find them morally reprehensible."
...
Scientology spokesman Davis denied Haggis' claims that the church or its San Diego chapter had supported Proposition 8.
"Mr. Haggis had a disagreement with the church that went beyond having anything to do with the church," Davis told ABCNews.com. "He wanted the church to take an active stance on a political issue, which we don't do. We're prohibited from taking stances on political issues.
"The church of scientology in San Diego was put on a Web site supporting Proposition 8 falsely and I had our name taken off of it," Davis said. "That's how all this started. To the extent that anything prohibits or infringes on anyone's civil rights, we don't agree with it. We're a minority, we don't discriminate. We're for civil rights for all people."
Davis also denied Haggis' allegation that the church ordered Rennard to "disconnect from her parents."
"That's not true. The church doesn't do that," he said. "The church doesn't tell people who they should and shouldn't be connected with. It's the fundamental human right for someone to decide who they are and are not going to be in communication with."
Last edited by Isgrimnur on Fri Dec 02, 2016 1:17 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Yeah, the reason to bail from scientology is because of its stance (or lack there of) on homosexual marriage. Otherwise it makes perfect sense and spiritual enlightenment like cutting all ties with your parents.
GreenGoo wrote:Yeah, the reason to bail from scientology is because of its stance (or lack there of) on homosexual marriage. Otherwise it makes perfect sense and spiritual enlightenment like cutting all ties with your parents.
Often it will be a little thing that causes a break from a religion and then, once on the outside, the absurdities of the rest of it gradually become more and more obvious.
Ironrod wrote:I didn't think they allowed you to quit. Don't they ruin you financially and socially if you try to break free?
Not if you're famous enough. Celebrities are treated differently so the "Church" will continue to get good endorsements from Tom Cruise, who is completely not crazy.
To be fair, adolescent power fantasy tripe is way easier to write than absurd existential horror, and every community has got to start somewhere... right?
Unless one loses a precious thing, he will never know its true value. A little light finally scratches the darkness; it lets the exhausted one face his shattered dream and realize his path cannot be walked. Can man live happily without embracing his wounded heart?
Ironrod wrote:I didn't think they allowed you to quit. Don't they ruin you financially and socially if you try to break free?
Not if you're famous enough. Celebrities are treated differently so the "Church" will continue to get good endorsements from Tom Cruise, who is completely not crazy.
[/lurk]
Both things are true. They can't go demolishing the lives of public figures. But they will mess up everyone else. The last two leaders to leave Mike Rinder and Marty Rathbun went directly into hiding for months. Heber Jentsch who is still listed as the church President has not been seen in public for years. And that's how they treat their own royalty. The rank and file public scientologist is in deep shit if they try to leave after beginning their secret OT training. At least that's my understanding. Fuck these people.
[lurk]
kind of like a cloud I was up way up in the sky and I was feeling some feelings that I couldn't believe; sometimes I don't believe them myself but I decided I was never coming down
I just spent 2 evenings reading Bare-Faced Messiah, a biography of Hubbard. Summation: HOly SHIT. What an interesting, crazy, fucked-up asshole he was.
Highly recommended.
They're going to send you back to mother in a cardboard box...
hepcat wrote:I always wanted to give Scientology a try. I just couldn't decide on the right space helmet, though. They have so many darn good ones...
I know you are insane, but are you rich too?
"The world is suffering more today from the good people who want to mind other men's business than it is from the bad people who are willing to let everybody look after their own individual affairs." - Clarence Darrow
Oh my, the detractors are coming out of the woodwork now. Truthfully, I don't think I'm buying this one. Seems a little too timely in its release. However, I'd love to see the inner workings of this church. It's either fascinating...or extremely boring and we've all been misled (RM9 is ignoring my requests for a demo membership, that SOB).
But I do have to say that I'm going to use the phrase “the Tom Cruise arrival preparation drill" in every day conversations from now on.
p.s. The Superficial.com writer made me chuckle again with his assessment of the article:
I'm going to assume Tom Cruise wanted the matter handled by others because there's really nothing more embarrassing than threatening to punch someone in the face only to turn around and ask for a ladder. Kind of ruins the moment. "I will fuck your Thetans up, son! Right after I put on this jetpack. Just hold still for a minute. Don't move. -- Alright, who didn't adjust my straps? Goddammit, you guys."
hepcat wrote:Oh my, the detractors are coming out of the woodwork now. Truthfully, I don't think I'm buying this one. Seems a little too timely in its release. However, I'd love to see the inner workings of this church. It's either fascinating...or extremely boring and we've all been misled (RM9 is ignoring my requests for a demo membership, that SOB).
But I do have to say that I'm going to use the phrase “the Tom Cruise arrival preparation drill" in every day conversations from now on.
p.s. The Superficial.com writer made me chuckle again with his assessment of the article:
I'm going to assume Tom Cruise wanted the matter handled by others because there's really nothing more embarrassing than threatening to punch someone in the face only to turn around and ask for a ladder. Kind of ruins the moment. "I will fuck your Thetans up, son! Right after I put on this jetpack. Just hold still for a minute. Don't move. -- Alright, who didn't adjust my straps? Goddammit, you guys."
Why would he even need to beat anyone up? I thought he got Telekenisis and a bunch of other super powers when he became an Operating Thetan Super Saiyan?
Lengthy New Yorker story (is there any other kind of New Yorker story?) on Paul Haggis and Scientology. Plenty of creepy details about the church, for those who enjoy reading that sort of thing.
Miscavige’s official title is chairman of the board of the Religious Technology Center, but he dominates the entire organization. His word is absolute, and he imposes his will even on some of the people closest to him. According to Rinder and Brousseau, in June, 2006, while Miscavige was away from the Gold Base, his wife, Shelly, filled several job vacancies without her husband’s permission. Soon afterward, she disappeared. Her current status is unknown. Tommy Davis told me, “I definitely know where she is,” but he won’t disclose where that is.
I read that piece and while I still believe that scientology fits the description of "cult" as I understand it and a dangerous one at that, I also have some nagging suspicion that Haggis is pursuing a vendetta at this point and may be stretching the truth in some of his interviews. I find this disconcerting because this could lead to folks siding with scientology if it turns out Haggis is doing just that.
Wikipedia has banned the Church of Scientology from editing any articles. It’s a punishment for repeated and deceptive editing of articles related to the controversial religion. The landmark ruling comes from the inner circle of a site that prides itself on being open and inclusive.
In a 10-1 ruling Thursday, the site’s arbitration council voted to ban users coming from all IP addresses owned by the Church of Scientology and its associates, and further banned a number of editors by name.
In my days as a bookseller, Scientologists would occasionally descend on bookstores to buy up copies of Dianetics in order to keep it on the bestseller list. The chain I worked for (B Dalton) countered by banning it from the list.
Often times there were Sea Org members working for celebrities in their homes, personally working for them. I know of one celeb who had a sea org member working in their home and sea org members were averaging $25/week. The labor laws don't apply to any church therefor they were made to work ungodly hours, forced into interrogations if making human mistakes around the celebrity.
"The world is suffering more today from the good people who want to mind other men's business than it is from the bad people who are willing to let everybody look after their own individual affairs." - Clarence Darrow
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
On the topic, I'm a big fan of the Oh No, Ross and Carrie! podcast, and they did a number of episodes on Scientology a bit back. They basically investigate and join into various fads, cults, and religions and talk about their experiences... everything from Mormanism, to Scientology, to Raelianism, to Christian Science, to Isolation tanks, etc.
"The world is suffering more today from the good people who want to mind other men's business than it is from the bad people who are willing to let everybody look after their own individual affairs." - Clarence Darrow
I watched that, Leah Remini kicks some serious ass. I found it interesting that one of her major beefs was that the Scientologists were not living up to their own canon.
President Donald Trump believes the Church of Scientology should have its tax exemption revoked, a longtime family aide and current top official at the Department of Housing and Urban Development told an actress and producer in May.
In an unsolicited Twitter message, Lynne Patton, who has worked for the Trump family since 2009, told actress Leah Remini of Trump’s position and said she would interface with the IRS directly to seek more information in an effort to initiate revocation. Remini sent HuffPost copies of Patton’s messages and has declined to comment further.
"The world is suffering more today from the good people who want to mind other men's business than it is from the bad people who are willing to let everybody look after their own individual affairs." - Clarence Darrow
Idiots. The Scientologists have beaten the IRS a few times in court.
"If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein "I don't stand by anything." - Trump “Bad men need nothing more to compass their ends, than that good men should look on and do nothing.” - John Stuart Mill, Inaugural Address Delivered to the University of St Andrews, 2/1/1867 “It is the impractical things in this tumultuous hell-scape of a world that matter most. A book, a name, chicken soup. They help us remember that, even in our darkest hour, life is still to be savored.” - Poe, Altered Carbon
