Unagi wrote: ↑Sun Sep 30, 2018 6:55 pmWhat on earth?
The 13th outlaws slavery and involuntary servitude except as punishment for crime, so I imagine the logic is that slavery still exists in the form of mass incarceration. There *is* a point there, but Ye is too addled to make it.
Also, this is the first I've heard that ending mass incarceration is part of the MAGA plan. I'm not sure the Deplorables will be on board for it.
Unagi wrote: ↑Sun Sep 30, 2018 6:55 pmWhat on earth?
The 13th outlaws slavery and involuntary servitude except as punishment for crime, so I imagine the logic is that slavery still exists in the form of mass incarceration. There *is* a point there, but Ye is too addled to make it.
And while the prison and justice system is certainly in need of an update, I don't think you do it by abolishing the 13th amendment.
YellowKing wrote: ↑Mon Oct 01, 2018 9:38 am
I'm still not convinced Kanye's stuff is not some grand Andy Kaufman-esque prank.
When I told my wife about his pro-Trump rambling on SNL and his Instagram post calling for the end of the 13th amendment, she just burst into laughter. So you could be on to something.
When you have an ego that's so large, it's frustrating to encounter anyone who denies or doesn't recognize this. That results in more frustration that then leads to larger and larger public demonstrations of why you should be worshiped/lauded/loved by all. It's what makes Trump bring out Spicer to deny claims that his inauguration wasn't the largest event in human history, or Kanye to refuse to admit he might have made a mistake at some point.
Colorado Amendment A, the Removal of Exception to Slavery Prohibition for Criminals Amendment is on the ballot in Colorado as a legislatively referred constitutional amendment on November 6, 2018.
A "yes" vote supports this proposal to remove part of the Colorado Constitution that says slavery and involuntary servitude are allowable for the punishment of a crime. A yes vote would ban slavery and involuntary servitude as punishment for a crime.
A "no" vote opposes this proposal, leaving the constitution unchanged. A no vote would allow slavery and involuntary servitude to be used as punishment for a crime.
I'm no Kanye apologist by any means, I think his talent is way over rated.
There is the theory that he's out of control because he is still mourning his mother and has never been able to properly privately deal with it. Plus he married into a family of insane idiots. Plus he won't stay on his meds.
It's kinda sad but my rule with crazy people is I'm fine with your crazy as long as it doesn't affect me. Not sure where I am with him as far as that...he might just need some sympathy.
Z-Corn wrote: ↑Mon Oct 01, 2018 6:01 pm
I'm no Kanye apologist by any means, I think his talent is way over rated.
There is the theory that he's out of control because he is still mourning his mother and has never been able to properly privately deal with it. Plus he married into a family of insane idiots. Plus he won't stay on his meds.
It's kinda sad but my rule with crazy people is I'm fine with your crazy as long as it doesn't affect me. Not sure where I am with him as far as that...he might just need some sympathy.
He's also a celebrity with an audience of millions.
If he needs sympathy, it will come from those actually close to him. If his use of his platform needs pushback and refusal, it should come from all of us.
Z-Corn wrote: ↑Mon Oct 01, 2018 6:01 pm
There is the theory that he's out of control because he is still mourning his mother and has never been able to properly privately deal with it. Plus he married into a family of insane idiots. Plus he won't stay on his meds.
Curious that a black man who supports Trump must be out of control, in mourning for his dead mother, or off his meds.
But it shouldn't have been hard to discern West's meaning, even if he expressed it in a confusing way. As he later clarified, he doesn't want to kill the whole 13th Amendment—just the passage that still allows involuntary servitude "as punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted."
"The world is suffering more today from the good people who want to mind other men's business than it is from the bad people who are willing to let everybody look after their own individual affairs." - Clarence Darrow
Z-Corn wrote: ↑Mon Oct 01, 2018 6:01 pm
Curious that a black man who supports Trump must be out of control, in mourning for his dead mother, or off his meds.
No one even mentioned race until you did. What does his race have to do with this?
Even better, anyone who supports Trump must be out of control, in mourning for his dead mother, or off his meds. Thanks for the clarification.
"The world is suffering more today from the good people who want to mind other men's business than it is from the bad people who are willing to let everybody look after their own individual affairs." - Clarence Darrow
Moliere wrote: ↑Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:32 pm
Curious that a black man who supports Trump must be out of control, in mourning for his dead mother, or off his meds.
Don't be ridiculous. He supports drumpf because he is those things (except the black man part), not the other way around. His struggles are heavily documented, and he has been hospitalized for bizarrely inappropriate behaviour that has nothing to do with drumpf at all.
To suggest that he's being unfairly maligned because of his politics is ignorant and a false narrative.
Moliere wrote: ↑Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:47 pm
Even better, anyone who supports Trump must be out of control, in mourning for his dead mother, or off his meds. Thanks for the clarification.
No, when a crazy man says crazy stuff he must be off his meds. The fact that it was crazy stuff about Trump just made it topical.
Moliere wrote: ↑Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:47 pm
Even better, anyone who supports Trump must be out of control, in mourning for his dead mother, or off his meds. Thanks for the clarification.
No, when a crazy man says crazy stuff he's probablymust be off his meds. The fact that it was crazy stuff about Trump just made it topical.
Moliere wrote: ↑Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:47 pm
Even better, anyone who supports Trump must be out of control, in mourning for his dead mother, or off his meds. Thanks for the clarification.
Nah, many of them are simply deplorable assholes of various stripes. And some, I assume, are good people.
(((Narrator: In actual fact, he assumed no such thing.)))
"What? What?What?" -- The 14th Doctor
It's not enough to be a good player... you also have to play well. -- Siegbert Tarrasch
I do a fair amount of things on the female side of the list and some things that are not.
For instance, always know where the fire exit is. Plus, I'm always on the look out for pick pockets in touristy areas.
I also hate answering the door to strangers. But that has more to do with unwanted Christmas Carolers & third party natural gas vendors than criminals and sexual predators.
Archinerd wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 8:23 amI also hate answering the door to strangers. But that has more to do with unwanted Christmas Carolers & third party natural gas vendors than criminals and sexual predators.
Our local sheriff has warned against so called "Distraction Burglars". Someone knocks on your front door and gets your attention while their partner sneaks into the back of your house.
The only thing I do on that list is leave the outside lights on during the night. But even that is just at our front door. We turn our backyard lights off.
Women aren't the only victims of violence, but they are as a group more likely to be victimized.
The list is hyperbole to emphasize that point.
I just let it go because the sentiment is true even if the details are wildly generalized.
Some things aren't worth arguing over, although if a woman said that I never have to worry about violence to my face, I'd laugh at how completely ludicrous that suggestion would be.
Men don't randomly pick fights with women in bars, as one example of violence men have to be aware of that women typically don't.
Of course women need to be concerned about what happens when they reject random advances in a similar bar setting.
When a woman rejected a man's advances in daylight on the street in Paris, he punched her in the face, right in front of many witnesses.
Things like that are what the hyperbole is designed to emphasize.
Archinerd wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 8:23 amI also hate answering the door to strangers. But that has more to do with unwanted Christmas Carolers & third party natural gas vendors than criminals and sexual predators.
Our local sheriff has warned against so called "Distraction Burglars". Someone knocks on your front door and gets your attention while their partner sneaks into the back of your house.
I've heard of that happening in my neighborhood sometimes too - but I think our dog is a pretty good deterrent.
What is the original context of that list? I had presumed it was sexual assault/rape given that is the one type of crime that men generally "don't think about" in terms of their own personal safety, rather than violent crime in general.
"What? What?What?" -- The 14th Doctor
It's not enough to be a good player... you also have to play well. -- Siegbert Tarrasch
Archinerd wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 8:23 amI also hate answering the door to strangers. But that has more to do with unwanted Christmas Carolers & third party natural gas vendors than criminals and sexual predators.
Our local sheriff has warned against so called "Distraction Burglars". Someone knocks on your front door and gets your attention while their partner sneaks into the back of your house.
I've heard of that happening in my neighborhood sometimes too - but I think our dog is a pretty good deterrent.
My wife and I are looking into the Ring video doorbell. Not because we're worried about distraction burglars, but because we just don't like answering the door in general.
What is the original context of that list? I had presumed it was sexual assault/rape given that is the one type of crime that men generally "don't think about" in terms of their own personal safety, rather than violent crime in general.
"I draw a line down the middle of a chalkboard, sketching a male symbol on one side and a female symbol on the other.
Then I ask just the men: What steps do you guys take, on a daily basis, to prevent yourselves from being sexually assaulted? At first there is a kind of awkward silence as the men try to figure out if they've been asked a trick question. The silence gives way to a smattering of nervous laughter. Occasionally, a young a guy will raise his hand and say, 'I stay out of prison.' This is typically followed by another moment of laughter, before someone finally raises his hand and soberly states, 'Nothing. I don't think about it.'
Then I ask the women the same question. What steps do you take on a daily basis to prevent yourselves from being sexually assaulted? Women throughout the audience immediately start raising their hands. As the men sit in stunned silence, the women recount safety precautions they take as part of their daily routine.
Hold my keys as a potential weapon. Look in the back seat of the car before getting in. Carry a cell phone. Don't go jogging at night. Lock all the windows when I sleep, even on hot summer nights. Be careful not to drink too much. Don't put my drink down and come back to it; make sure I see it being poured. Own a big dog. Carry Mace or pepper spray. Have an unlisted phone number. Have a man's voice on my answering machine. Park in well-lit areas. Don't use parking garages. Don't get on elevators with only one man, or with a group of men. Vary my route home from work. Watch what I wear. Don't use highway rest areas. Use a home alarm system. Don't wear headphones when jogging. Avoid forests or wooded areas, even in the daytime. Don't take a first-floor apartment. Go out in groups. Own a firearm. Meet men on first dates in public places. Make sure to have a car or cab fare. Don't make eye contact with men on the street. Make assertive eye contact with men on the street.”
― Jackson Katz, The Macho Paradox: Why Some Men Hurt Women and How All Men Can Help
(The first man to minor in women's studies at the University of Massachusetts-Amherst, holds a master's degree from the Harvard Graduate School of Education, and a Ph.D. in cultural studies and education from UCLA.)
When darkness veils the world, four Warriors of Light shall come.
Max Peck wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 9:21 am
What is the original context of that list? I had presumed it was sexual assault/rape given that is the one type of crime that men generally "don't think about" in terms of their own personal safety, rather than violent crime in general.
I think it's safe to assume it's both, with an emphasis on sexual assault because that's not something men typically have to worry about. Violent crime is violent crime though, so many of the things that women think about are also things that men think about. That they think about them for slightly different reasons doesn't negate that.
It's like asking what steps do women take to stay out of fist fights and comparing it to what men do.
It's a loaded question designed to emphasize the differences, but it doesn't negate the similarities.
Moliere wrote: ↑Mon Oct 01, 2018 10:47 pm
Even better, anyone who supports Trump must be out of control, in mourning for his dead mother, or off his meds. Thanks for the clarification.
Nah, many of them are simply deplorable assholes of various stripes. And some, I assume, are good people.
So much this. Except the last part. At this point, if you still support Trump, you are not Good People.
If the sentence had indicated Trump voters instead of Trump supporters (today), I would be ok with assuming some are good people.
I do at least half of the "female" items. Always. Maybe not for the same reasons, and I guess that's the point, but I still do them.
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General "No scientific discovery is named after its original discoverer." -Stigler's Law of Eponymy, discovered by Robert K. Merton MYT
Max Peck wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 9:21 am
What is the original context of that list? I had presumed it was sexual assault/rape given that is the one type of crime that men generally "don't think about" in terms of their own personal safety, rather than violent crime in general.
I think it's safe to assume it's both, with an emphasis on sexual assault because that's not something men typically have to worry about. Violent crime is violent crime though, so many of the things that women think about are also things that men think about. That they think about them for slightly different reasons doesn't negate that.
It's like asking what steps do women take to stay out of fist fights and comparing it to what men do.
It's a loaded question designed to emphasize the differences, but it doesn't negate the similarities.
Still, if you start asking your all your friends how many have been sexually assaulted and how many have been physically assaulted, I imagine you're going to see gender differences that do begin to negate the similarities.
I'd be -very- surprised to learn that as many men are victims of physical assault as women are victims of sexual assault.
In fact I wouldn't be surprised to learn that women outnumber men as victims of non-sexual assault as well.
Max Peck wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 9:21 am
What is the original context of that list? I had presumed it was sexual assault/rape given that is the one type of crime that men generally "don't think about" in terms of their own personal safety, rather than violent crime in general.
I think it's safe to assume it's both, with an emphasis on sexual assault because that's not something men typically have to worry about.
Holman wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 10:17 am
Still, if you start asking your all your friends how many have been sexually assaulted and how many have been physically assaulted, I imagine you're going to see gender differences that do begin to negate the similarities.
I'd be -very- surprised to learn that as many men are victims of physical assault as women are victims of sexual assault.
In fact I wouldn't be surprised to learn that women outnumber men as victims of non-sexual assault as well.
Geezus.
This part of the conversation started because a male pointed out that some of the column on the right applied to them as well.
One of the first things I said was that the column of actions is designed to emphasize the differences between males and females, and that the point is still valid even if it is not technically accurate for all males at all times. That some of the right hand column applies to men too in certain situations doesn't devalue or refute that.
It has also been established after the fact that the graphic is specifically regarding sexual assault, making it even more valid as illustrative of the differences between men and women in that context.
Absolutely no one is claiming (or even implying) that women aren't assaulted more often than men, either sexually or otherwise.
Max Peck wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 11:05 amApparently it isn't safe to assume that.
What steps do you guys take, on a daily basis, to prevent yourselves from being sexually assaulted?
Yawn.
Safe to assume doesn't mean 100% accuracy otherwise it wouldn't be an assumption. Finding out after the fact (I was typing my response when more details were given) doesn't change anything, or require specific refutation.
In any case, many of the right column are anti-assault techniques/tactics/thoughts that women have answered to a sexual assault question. Many of those clearly apply to many males as well, for avoiding assault.
Does anyone really need to be reminded that women are regularly victims of sexual assault whereas men are not? Perhaps some people do, but many (most?) of us don't.
That doesn't mean I'm opposed to getting the message out. Somehow communicating with the target demographic would obviously be incredibly difficult, as you'd need to understand what people think beforehand. A full on broadcast to everyone everywhere is the best way to reach those people. That the rest of us aren't shocked or informed by the graphic is not a problem. I believe the first time I saw the graphic it was because some men were "offended" by it and pushed back, so the poster (tweeter?) decided to be even more forceful about the message.
GreenGoo wrote: ↑Tue Oct 02, 2018 8:45 am
I just let it go because the sentiment is true even if the details are wildly generalized.
...
Some things aren't worth arguing over...
