Amazon has whacked our affiliate account. Hosting Donations/Commitments $2063 of $1920 (Sept 13/18). In Hand $1466 (Lump sum payments minus paypal graft). Paypal Donation Link Here

ISIS

For discussion of religion and politics

Moderators: LawBeefaroni, $iljanus

User avatar
Holman
Posts: 21032
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 8:00 pm
Location: Approximately Wissahickon

Re: ISIS

Post by Holman » Thu Nov 19, 2015 3:46 pm

Moliere wrote:If they have made enemies of the Russians (blowing up their plane) and the Chinese (killing their hostage) along with various other countries where are they getting supplies? It's not like they have an industrial base to build munitions. I know they were selling museum and other historical artifacts to make money, but that's a dead end road. If North Korea supports them then NK loses Chinese support. Maybe some African dictators?
There has never, ever in the history of warfare been a warzone lacking arms merchants.

Enlarge Image
Much prefer my Nazis Nuremberged.

Jeff V
Posts: 31333
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 7:17 pm
Location: Nowhere you want to be.

Re: ISIS

Post by Jeff V » Thu Nov 19, 2015 3:57 pm

Holman wrote:
Moliere wrote:If they have made enemies of the Russians (blowing up their plane) and the Chinese (killing their hostage) along with various other countries where are they getting supplies? It's not like they have an industrial base to build munitions. I know they were selling museum and other historical artifacts to make money, but that's a dead end road. If North Korea supports them then NK loses Chinese support. Maybe some African dictators?
There has never, ever in the history of warfare been a warzone lacking arms merchants.
But what of more mundane things, like food and medical supplies and Seinfeld reruns?

User avatar
Moliere
Posts: 12007
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 10:57 am
Location: Walking through a desert land

Re: ISIS

Post by Moliere » Thu Nov 19, 2015 4:59 pm

They need an economic infrastructure beyond looting museums.
"The world is suffering more today from the good people who want to mind other men's business than it is from the bad people who are willing to let everybody look after their own individual affairs." - Clarence Darrow

User avatar
Holman
Posts: 21032
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 8:00 pm
Location: Approximately Wissahickon

Re: ISIS

Post by Holman » Thu Nov 19, 2015 5:04 pm

They sell a ton of black market oil, and they've seized a good chunk of Iraq's best agricultural land. They're also investing in rudimentary social services and infrastructure because they believe they are commanded to be a nation, not just a band of fighters. A lot of people flocking there are going not because they want to strap bombs to their chests but because they want to live a life and raise children under the Caliphate.
Much prefer my Nazis Nuremberged.

User avatar
LawBeefaroni
Forum Moderator
Posts: 46123
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 3:08 pm
Location: Urbs in Horto, where we only use the old smilies

Re: ISIS

Post by LawBeefaroni » Thu Nov 19, 2015 5:20 pm

Holman wrote:They sell a ton of black market oil, and they've seized a good chunk of Iraq's best agricultural land. They're also investing in rudimentary social services and infrastructure because they believe they are commanded to be a nation, not just a band of fighters. A lot of people flocking there are going not because they want to strap bombs to their chests but because they want to live a life and raise children under the Caliphate.
They're investing in infrastructure because they can tax it and make a return on their investment. They're using several pages out of the organized crime playbook but they've taken some from the government one as well.
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General
"No scientific discovery is named after its original discoverer." -Stigler's Law of Eponymy, discovered by Robert K. Merton

MYT

User avatar
Moliere
Posts: 12007
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 10:57 am
Location: Walking through a desert land

Re: ISIS

Post by Moliere » Thu Nov 19, 2015 10:07 pm

7 Things I Learned Reading Every Issue Of ISIS's Magazine

#7. The Islamic State's Official Publication Is Pretty Slick
#6. They Are Very Honest About Some Things
#5. They Are Unbelievably Media-Savvy
#4. Violent Reprisals Are Exactly What They Want
#3. Here's What Scares ISIS
#2. They Consider The U.S. A Reliable Source Of Weapons
#1. We Don't Really Understand How ISIS Sees The World
"The world is suffering more today from the good people who want to mind other men's business than it is from the bad people who are willing to let everybody look after their own individual affairs." - Clarence Darrow

User avatar
Moliere
Posts: 12007
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 10:57 am
Location: Walking through a desert land

Re: ISIS

Post by Moliere » Thu Nov 19, 2015 11:57 pm

"The world is suffering more today from the good people who want to mind other men's business than it is from the bad people who are willing to let everybody look after their own individual affairs." - Clarence Darrow

User avatar
hepcat
Posts: 38096
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:02 pm
Location: Chicago, IL Home of the triple homicide!
hepcat’s avatar
Offline

Re: ISIS

Post by hepcat » Fri Nov 20, 2015 1:33 pm

Moliere wrote:7 Things I Learned Reading Every Issue Of ISIS's Magazine

#7. The Islamic State's Official Publication Is Pretty Slick
#6. They Are Very Honest About Some Things
#5. They Are Unbelievably Media-Savvy
#4. Violent Reprisals Are Exactly What They Want
#3. Here's What Scares ISIS
#2. They Consider The U.S. A Reliable Source Of Weapons
#1. We Don't Really Understand How ISIS Sees The World
Thanks. That may be one of the more fascinating things I've read in a while.
I beat a camel to death with a monkey. Can I do that?
-Mr Bismarck

You have to whack a few rabbits before you are ready to punch a camel.
-Coopasonic

User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 40570
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: ISIS

Post by GreenGoo » Fri Nov 20, 2015 2:02 pm

Good article. And it comes from Cracked.com.

The mindset of the man on the street was useful and interesting, but a lot of it was not new if you have actually been paying attention, which most of us have been, I think.

The news that they are at war with "infidel" muslims is not new, as their stated reason for being is to establish a "true muslim" nation. Given that the majority of people they murder are other muslims, no surprise there. People, especially politicians need to remember this when they lump all muslims together, as that muddles and confuses the issues and thus any possible solutions.

I'm glad to hear they are experiencing internal problems, including drug use and lack of infrastructure. Those are more likely to weaken them than any direct confrontation.

Jeff V
Posts: 31333
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 7:17 pm
Location: Nowhere you want to be.

Re: ISIS

Post by Jeff V » Fri Nov 20, 2015 2:38 pm

GreenGoo wrote: I'm glad to hear they are experiencing internal problems, including drug use and lack of infrastructure. Those are more likely to weaken them than any direct confrontation.
I've been saying this for awhile. There doesn't seem to be much of a future plan -- if the rest of the world is their enemy, they better damn well have themselves a self-sufficient country and Syria is no such thing. While we need to step up efforts to contain their activities outside the lands they occupy; it'll be a lot easier for us to eradicate them (or in terms of the article, bring them the apocalypse) after they implode from lack of food and other resources.

User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 40570
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: ISIS

Post by GreenGoo » Fri Nov 20, 2015 2:46 pm

Jeff V wrote:
GreenGoo wrote: I'm glad to hear they are experiencing internal problems, including drug use and lack of infrastructure. Those are more likely to weaken them than any direct confrontation.
I've been saying this for awhile. There doesn't seem to be much of a future plan -- if the rest of the world is their enemy, they better damn well have themselves a self-sufficient country and Syria is no such thing. While we need to step up efforts to contain their activities outside the lands they occupy; it'll be a lot easier for us to eradicate them (or in terms of the article, bring them the apocalypse) after they implode from lack of food and other resources.
They have a plan, it's just not working as well as they'd hoped. Make a "true believer" state, have true believer muslims migrate to it. It seems that well educated and skilled true believers aren't migrated as they had hoped.

They absolutely have long term planning in mind, but it's warped by their world view, not short sightedness. Their skill with social media and propaganda is significant, as mentioned in this article. It's not just technical skill. It's psychological skill too.

User avatar
Moliere
Posts: 12007
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 10:57 am
Location: Walking through a desert land

Re: ISIS

Post by Moliere » Fri Nov 20, 2015 9:35 pm

The Onion gives us Strategies To Defeat ISIS.

Can you spot the legitimate answer?
"The world is suffering more today from the good people who want to mind other men's business than it is from the bad people who are willing to let everybody look after their own individual affairs." - Clarence Darrow

User avatar
Moliere
Posts: 12007
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 10:57 am
Location: Walking through a desert land

Re: ISIS

Post by Moliere » Mon Nov 23, 2015 1:51 pm

ISIS Is The Wealthiest Terrorist Organization In History… How Exactly Did They Acquire This Wealth?
The already incredibly dangerous terrorist group, ISIS, led by Abu Bakr al-Baghdadi, is the wealthiest terrorist organization in the world, only increasing the risk they pose to the rest of the world. With an estimated $2 billion fortune, the group can afford to pay foreign fighters to join their ranks, and could potentially move outward to attack in the west. How have they been able to amass so much money?

Well, a lot of it is thanks to oil. The organization makes more than $1.5 million EVERY DAY in crude oil sales, but they get money other ways, too: income taxes of 20 percent over a population of 10 million people, 40 percent control of Iraq's wheat production, and nearly $46 million in kidnapping ransoms every year.
"The world is suffering more today from the good people who want to mind other men's business than it is from the bad people who are willing to let everybody look after their own individual affairs." - Clarence Darrow

Jeff V
Posts: 31333
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 7:17 pm
Location: Nowhere you want to be.

Re: ISIS

Post by Jeff V » Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:17 pm

Moliere wrote: Well, a lot of it is thanks to oil. The organization makes more than $1.5 million EVERY DAY in crude oil sales
Who are they selling to? I thought they hated everyone. And how are we (or Russia, or anyone else) not interdicting the transport of this oil?

User avatar
Isgrimnur
Posts: 60503
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:29 am
Location: Chookity pok
Contact:
Isgrimnur’s avatar
Offline

Re: ISIS

Post by Isgrimnur » Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:43 pm

Silver - 1k

Jeff V
Posts: 31333
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 7:17 pm
Location: Nowhere you want to be.

Re: ISIS

Post by Jeff V » Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:45 pm

Sounds like it's time to stop pretending Turkey is our ally and start arming the Kurds.

User avatar
Isgrimnur
Posts: 60503
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:29 am
Location: Chookity pok
Contact:
Isgrimnur’s avatar
Offline

Re: ISIS

Post by Isgrimnur » Mon Nov 23, 2015 2:48 pm

Given that they're a member of NATO and have been since '52, it's a little harder than taking them off the Christmas card list.
Silver - 1k

Jeff V
Posts: 31333
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 7:17 pm
Location: Nowhere you want to be.

Re: ISIS

Post by Jeff V » Mon Nov 23, 2015 3:24 pm

Isgrimnur wrote:Given that they're a member of NATO and have been since '52, it's a little harder than taking them off the Christmas card list.
You mean the one that plays that little ditty, "Santa got blown up by his reindeer!"

User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 32488
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: ISIS

Post by El Guapo » Mon Nov 23, 2015 4:00 pm

Jeff V wrote:Sounds like it's time to stop pretending Turkey is our ally and start arming the Kurds.
It's worth reading the article Isgrimnur linked to. It's not like ISIS has trade deals with Turkey and/or the Syrian government, which are both avowed enemies. The oil trade is with random shmoes with trucks, some of whom move the oil through/to Turkey or Syria, potentially (but not certainly) with some amount of official blessing, but maybe not.
MCEVERS: So walk us through this process. Let's start, say, in an oil field in northeastern Syria, you know - used to be owned by the Syrian government. It was part of the state-owned oil operation. How does it work now? How does oil get out of that field and onto the market?

SOLOMON: What ISIS has done is managed to corner control of the extraction process, which is smart because they can't get bombed there. It would cause a natural disaster. So they extract the oil, and then they immediately sell it to local traders - any average person who can buy a truck that they can fill with a tank of oil.

MCEVERS: So who are these traders?

SOLOMON: Anybody really. If you can imagine living in what is essentially a war zone, people are looking for ways to make money. And this is a very surefire way to have some profit.

MCEVERS: And so the oil gets refined, and then where does it go after that?

SOLOMON: Then it goes everywhere. What a lot of people think is it goes to, say, Turkey or to the Syrian regime; there are some sort of secret deals. That may happen, but what we found was that most of it is actually just normal people like you and me living in the parts of Syria and Iraq that either ISIS controls or even, strangely, its own enemies. So if you live in other parts of Syria that are controlled by the opposition fighting the Syrian President Bashar al-Assad, you actually have to buy oil from ISIS. Your hospitals, your tractors, everything that makes your life run is fueled by ISIS oil.

User avatar
Max Peck
Posts: 7599
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:09 pm
Location: Down the Rabbit-Hole

Re: ISIS

Post by Max Peck » Mon Nov 23, 2015 6:03 pm

I've seen recent coverage of air strikes targeting oil trucks, but I'm not sure whether it's a relatively new strategy or if I just haven't been paying close enough attention.

US air strike 'hits 238 IS oil trucks' in Syria
A US air strike has destroyed more than 238 fuel trucks controlled by Islamic State (IS) militants in north-east Syria, the US military has said. It is thought the pilots found the trucks parked up together, waiting to be loaded at an oil production point near al-Hasakah and Dayr Az Zawr. Warning shots were reportedly fired to scare away the civilian drivers, before the destruction of the trucks began. IS makes large amounts of money from oil it produces from seized facilities. The US Department of Defense says it will release video of the air raid, which took place over the weekend.

Last week another 116 tankers were destroyed in a previous air strike. "This was conducted in many ways identical to our last," Pentagon spokesman, Capt Jeff Davis, said on Monday. "It was proceeded with a leaflet drop to warn drivers out of their trucks as well as a show of force".
IS conflict: US-led air strikes 'destroy 116 IS oil trucks'
The US-led coalition destroyed 116 fuel trucks operated by so-called Islamic State (IS) in eastern Syria in one day, US defence officials say. A Pentagon spokesperson said the trucks were hit in a single air strike near the IS-held town of Albu Kamal, according to AFP news agency. The coalition has targeted fuel trucks before, but a coalition official said this was the most they had hit at once.

Black market trade in oil is one of IS' most important sources of funding. It is believed to make about $500m (£329m) a year from the oil industry in territory under its control.

The trucks were parked in a loading area, being filled or about to depart, when they were hit, the coalition spokesman told AFP. The coalition began air strikes on IS-held oil infrastructure last year, and last month the US vowed to be "more aggressive" in targeting IS oil. The Pentagon spokesperson said Sunday's attack "was part of that strategy to start degrading their financial ability".
Time and tide melt the snowman.

There are worlds out there where the sky is burning, where the sea's asleep and the rivers dream, people made of smoke and cities made of song. Somewhere there's danger, somewhere there's injustice and somewhere else the tea is getting cold. Come on, Ace, we've got work to do.
-- The Doctor

User avatar
Moliere
Posts: 12007
Joined: Sun Sep 03, 2006 10:57 am
Location: Walking through a desert land

Re: ISIS

Post by Moliere » Mon Nov 23, 2015 6:19 pm

That worked in Red Storm Rising.
"The world is suffering more today from the good people who want to mind other men's business than it is from the bad people who are willing to let everybody look after their own individual affairs." - Clarence Darrow

User avatar
Defiant
Posts: 17836
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:09 pm
Location: Tongue in cheek

Re: ISIS

Post by Defiant » Tue Nov 24, 2015 12:06 am

“When we agreed we were going to do airpower and the military said, this is how it would work, he [Obama] said, ‘No, I do not want any civilian casualties,’” Keane explained. “And the response was, ‘But there’s always some civilian casualties. We have the best capability in the world to protect from civilians casualties.’”

However, Obama’s response was, “No, you don’t understand. I want no civilian casualties. Zero,’” Keane continued. “So that has driven our so-called rules of engagement to a degree we have never had in any previous air campaign from desert storm to the present.”
link

It seems to conflict with the reports of civilian casualties as a result of drone strikes, but if it's true, it's absurd. We want to minimize civilian casualties, but not to the extent that we can't achieve our military objectives.

User avatar
LawBeefaroni
Forum Moderator
Posts: 46123
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 3:08 pm
Location: Urbs in Horto, where we only use the old smilies

Re: ISIS

Post by LawBeefaroni » Tue Nov 24, 2015 10:34 am

Further complications:
Star Trib wrote:ANKARA, Turkey — Turkey shot down a Russian fighter plane Tuesday — a long-feared crisis in Syria's civil war and apparently the first time a NATO member has downed a Russian plane in a half-century.

Russian President Vladimir Putin called Turkey's action a "stab in the back by the terrorists' accomplices" and warned of "significant consequences." At Turkey's request, NATO's governing body called an emergency meeting.

And this just came across the newswire but not sure if it's the same incident or a different one. Sounds different.
"Deputy commander of a Turkmen brigade in Syria says his forces shot dead two pilots of downed Russian jet as they descended with parachutes."


No further info but here's a bit about the Turkmen:
Telegraph wrote:In Syria the Turkmen, who are linguistically and ethnically Turkish, live alongside Arabs and Kurds, but have mostly aligned with non-jihadist anti-Assad rebel groups.

They historically objected to the Arab nationalism of the Assad regime’s Baath party, which stressed assimilation to the Arab language and culture. In turn, the regime has frequently regarded them as a fifth column working in favour of Ankara.

Around a dozen Turkmen militias have formed, some directly supported by the Turkish government. It is one of these, Alwiya al-Ashar, that is reportedly holding one of Russia's downed pilots.
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General
"No scientific discovery is named after its original discoverer." -Stigler's Law of Eponymy, discovered by Robert K. Merton

MYT

User avatar
LawBeefaroni
Forum Moderator
Posts: 46123
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 3:08 pm
Location: Urbs in Horto, where we only use the old smilies

Re: ISIS

Post by LawBeefaroni » Tue Nov 24, 2015 10:43 am

The Turkish POV:

The Assad regime, supported by Hezbollah and Iranian forces and Russia by the air and sea, continues to attack the Bayirbucak region, close to Turkish border, inhabited by Turkmen.

The intensification of the attacks in the last period shows that Russia aims to give more power to President Bashar al-Assad before sitting at the negotiation table with the opposition forces, in accordance with the conclusion of the Vienna talks last week.

Russia has also been attacking the Bayirbucak Turkmen region since Sept. 30, when it began an air ‘counterterrorism’ campaign in Syria.

Russia, known for 'coordinating' fighting in the region between regime forces and Turkmen units, intervenes in the situation by attacking Turkmen Mountain with missiles from warships in the Mediterranean.

Regime forces, supported by Russia’s air campaign, are staging a ground operation in the region.

...

The head of Turkmen Parliament in Syria, Abdurrahman Mustafa, says that various motivations lay behind Russia’s rising attacks against Turkmen Mountain.

He said that in the short run, Russia’s aim is to give military superiority to the Assad regime, and to sit down as powerful as possible at the negotiation table.

“The Turkmen Mountain is a buffer zone in the coastal region,” Mustafa said, adding that it is a region that has remained between Antakya and “Latakia, which is Assad’s castle”.

He said that in the case of the Assad regime taking control of Turkmen Mountain it could then pose a threat to Turkey.

Mustafa said that Assad aims to include the strategic region of Turkmen Mountain inside the borders of the Nusrayi state.

Mustafa, speaking also about a possible Kurdish zone, said that the “fall of the Turkmen Mountain will provide an opportunity for Kurds to come to the Mediterranean shore”.

Mustafa said that the protection of the Turkmen presence in Bayirbucak region would also be an obstacle for the Kurdish zone.
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General
"No scientific discovery is named after its original discoverer." -Stigler's Law of Eponymy, discovered by Robert K. Merton

MYT

User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 32488
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: ISIS

Post by El Guapo » Tue Nov 24, 2015 11:32 am

Defiant wrote:
“When we agreed we were going to do airpower and the military said, this is how it would work, he [Obama] said, ‘No, I do not want any civilian casualties,’” Keane explained. “And the response was, ‘But there’s always some civilian casualties. We have the best capability in the world to protect from civilians casualties.’”

However, Obama’s response was, “No, you don’t understand. I want no civilian casualties. Zero,’” Keane continued. “So that has driven our so-called rules of engagement to a degree we have never had in any previous air campaign from desert storm to the present.”
link

It seems to conflict with the reports of civilian casualties as a result of drone strikes, but if it's true, it's absurd. We want to minimize civilian casualties, but not to the extent that we can't achieve our military objectives.
Is there anything like this from a less partisan source? They do have Keane on the record, and it sounds like Keane is talking about personal experience, but I am a little leery of claims from FreeBeacon.com that's not sourced elsewhere.

User avatar
Isgrimnur
Posts: 60503
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:29 am
Location: Chookity pok
Contact:
Isgrimnur’s avatar
Offline

Re: ISIS

Post by Isgrimnur » Wed Dec 02, 2015 1:07 pm

Russia and Turkey spar over ISIS oil:
Russian military officials laid out Wednesday what they say is "hard evidence" that Turkey is involved in an oil trade with ISIS, offering more detail on earlier claims that Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan has flatly denied.

"We presented evidence how the illegal oil trade is carried out to finance the terrorist groups," Russian Deputy Defense Minister Anatoly Antonov said, as reported by state-run Sputnik news. "We know how much Erdogan's words are worth."

Officials presented photographs and videos that they said show links between Turkey and oil refineries in ISIS-controlled territory in Syria, estimating $3 million worth of oil per day was traversing this route before Russian airstrikes cut that roughly in half. Sergey Rudskoy, one of the military leaders, pointed to "three main routes (that) have been exposed for the transportation of oil to Turkey."

Antonov also credited Russian journalists for their reports claiming one of Erdogan's sons had a role in the scheme.

"If they think the evidence is fake, let them make these areas available to journalists," Antonov said.
...
The war of words and simmering tensions between the two countries have escalated. On Saturday, Erdogan said that he was "saddened" by the incident but refused to apologize. That same day, Russian President Vladimir Putin signed into law various measures aimed at hurting Turkey economically.

And on Monday, Putin raised the ante more by raising the accusation about the secret ISIS-Turkey oil trade.

Erdogan quickly took a slap back at Putin, saying he'll resign if Moscow's claims are proven true. "As soon as such a claim is proved, the nobility of our nation requires (me) to do this," Erdogan said.

But, he added, if the allegations are untrue, then Putin should resign.
Silver - 1k

User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 32488
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: ISIS

Post by El Guapo » Wed Dec 02, 2015 1:17 pm

Isgrimnur wrote:
Erdogan quickly took a slap back at Putin, saying he'll resign if Moscow's claims are proven true. "As soon as such a claim is proved, the nobility of our nation requires (me) to do this," Erdogan said.

But, he added, if the allegations are untrue, then Putin should resign.
[/quote]

Oh man please let them make this bet. The very definition of a win-win for the world.

User avatar
LawBeefaroni
Forum Moderator
Posts: 46123
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 3:08 pm
Location: Urbs in Horto, where we only use the old smilies

Re: ISIS

Post by LawBeefaroni » Wed Dec 02, 2015 2:18 pm

Isgrimnur wrote:Russia and Turkey spar over ISIS oil:
"We presented evidence..."
Where have I heard this claim before?
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General
"No scientific discovery is named after its original discoverer." -Stigler's Law of Eponymy, discovered by Robert K. Merton

MYT

User avatar
Max Peck
Posts: 7599
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:09 pm
Location: Down the Rabbit-Hole

Re: ISIS

Post by Max Peck » Sat Dec 05, 2015 10:30 am

It looks like the UK is interested in IS oil too, but they're taking a more direct approach than the Erdogan/Putin slapfight.
Enlarge Image
RAF jets have carried out their second set of air strikes in Syria since MPs backed military action against so-called Islamic State in the country. The Omar oil fields were targeted for the second time, using two Tornados and, for the first time, two Typhoons. Defence Secretary Michael Fallon, who is visiting the British base for the Syria mission in Cyprus, said: "Last night saw the full force of the RAF." Four Tornado jets launched the first UK air strikes in Syria on Thursday. Bombing began hours after MPs gave their backing for military action, with the oil fields, which are in eastern Syria, targeted.

During his visit to RAF Akrotiri in Cyprus, Mr Fallon thanked military personnel. He made no assurances about the length of the campaign, telling them only it was "not going to be short or simple". "We face a new kind of enemy that makes no demands, takes no hostages, doesn't want to negotiate," he said. "It's not what we do that they oppose, it's what we are. It's because of who we are in Britain and the West that we have this particular death cult. You go now into this full-bodied mission with your orders and with your training. But I want you to know also you go with the backing of the government and the people of Britain."
Time and tide melt the snowman.

There are worlds out there where the sky is burning, where the sea's asleep and the rivers dream, people made of smoke and cities made of song. Somewhere there's danger, somewhere there's injustice and somewhere else the tea is getting cold. Come on, Ace, we've got work to do.
-- The Doctor

User avatar
Smoove_B
Posts: 39505
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:58 am
Location: Kaer Morhen

Re: ISIS

Post by Smoove_B » Sat Dec 05, 2015 7:40 pm

USA! USA!
The U.S. Air Force has fired off more than 20,000 missiles and bombs since the U.S. bombing campaign against ISIS began 15 months ago, according to the Air Force, leading to depleted munitions stockpiles and calls to ramp up funding and weapons production.

As the U.S. ramps up its campaign against the Islamist terror group in Iraq and Syria, the Air Force is now "expending munitions faster than we can replenish them," Air Force chief of staff Gen. Mark Welsh said in a statement.
Dropping bombs and creating jobs. Thanks Obama!

User avatar
LawBeefaroni
Forum Moderator
Posts: 46123
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 3:08 pm
Location: Urbs in Horto, where we only use the old smilies

Re: ISIS

Post by LawBeefaroni » Mon Dec 14, 2015 5:57 pm

ABC wrote:A Maryland man charged with terror-related crimes told FBI agents before his arrest that not only should he not be in trouble, but he should be applauded and given a job for running what he claimed was a “scam” on ISIS.
...
“During the interview, which was recorded, Elshinawy sought to portray himself as someone who was simply trying to scam some money from ISIL [ISIS] members,” the affidavit says, after noting that Elshinawy received more than $8,000 from an individual in Egypt believed to be connected to the terror group. “He touted his success at having taken ISIL’s money and felt that his efforts should be applauded. He thought he should be offered a job to work with the FBI to identify ISIL’s money network.”

Elshinawy said that while he understood the money he received from ISIS was to be used in some type of domestic terrorist attack, he claimed that he actually only used the funds to pay off bills and buy furniture.

But the FBI didn’t buy it and described Elshinawy’s account as a “detailed cover story [used] in order to conceal the extent and true nature of the transactions he had with individuals he understood to be ISIL members and his true relationship with those individuals.”

“During his meetings with the FBI, Elshinawy made repeated false statements regarding the money transfers from ISIL; repeatedly insisted that he was telling the truth when, in fact, he was not revealing the true nature and extent of his contacts with ISIL operatives; and finally, appeared overeager to ingratiate himself with the FBI and be ‘a part of the team,’” the FBI affidavit says.
" Hey OP, listen to my advice alright." -Tha General
"No scientific discovery is named after its original discoverer." -Stigler's Law of Eponymy, discovered by Robert K. Merton

MYT

User avatar
Max Peck
Posts: 7599
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:09 pm
Location: Down the Rabbit-Hole

Re: ISIS

Post by Max Peck » Mon Dec 14, 2015 10:20 pm

Here's a heart-warming tale of derring-do.

Fight against Isis: SAS sniper kills five Daesh fighters with 3 bullets
A veteran SAS sniper killed five Islamic State (ISIS) fighters with just three shots to foil a suicide bomb attack in Iraq. The sniper, who has served with the SAS for a decade, decided to shoot after he spotted the five Daesh (IS) fighters leaving a bomb making factory whilst wearing heavy and warm clothing in the desert sun.

He fired three well-aimed shots from 800 metres away, killing five of the over-dressed jihadis near the IS-controlled Iraqi city of Mosul. In August this year, another British sniper saved the life of a Shiite man and his eight-year-old son, who were seconds from being executed by the extremists after soldiers spotted the pair surrounded by headless bodies.

Of the three rounds fired, the first shot hit a man in the chest, detonating his suicide vest, killing him and two other jihadis nearby. This was followed by a man shot in the head as he tried to get back into the bomb factory.

The final shot detonated an explosive vest worn by another IS fighter - killing him instantly. The operation was said to have saved "hundreds of lives".

"This was a classic SAS mission," said a British Army source to the Express. "About three weeks ago the intelligence guys got information that a bomb factory had been set up in a nearby village. With just three well-aimed shots, that single team has probably saved the lives of hundreds of innocent people. The unit was sent in to see if they could identify the house and the bombers," the source explained.

"There were too many civilian homes nearby and children were often around so an airstrike was out of the question. Instead, the SAS commander in Iraq decided to use a sniper team and the operation was a complete success."

Mosul is located in the north of the country and fell to Daesh after much of the Iraqi army dropped their weapons and fled. Having seized Mosul, IS took control of Tikrit and parts of Baiji.
Time and tide melt the snowman.

There are worlds out there where the sky is burning, where the sea's asleep and the rivers dream, people made of smoke and cities made of song. Somewhere there's danger, somewhere there's injustice and somewhere else the tea is getting cold. Come on, Ace, we've got work to do.
-- The Doctor

User avatar
Max Peck
Posts: 7599
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:09 pm
Location: Down the Rabbit-Hole

Re: ISIS

Post by Max Peck » Sat Dec 19, 2015 11:34 am

The enemy of my enemy is my enemy...

Why Taliban special forces are fighting Islamic State
The Afghan Taliban say they have unleashed "special forces" in an increasingly bloody battle with fighters from the rival, so-called Islamic State (IS) group. The Taliban's dominance and monopoly on insurgency in a region home to numerous local and foreign militant groups is being challenged by IS, which has been gaining some support. Who's winning the war of the militants?

According to Taliban sources, the special task force, part of the Taliban's special forces command, was set up in early October and has more than 1,000 fighters - better equipped and trained than regular Taliban and with the sole aim of crushing IS. Special ops teams are handpicked for their fighting skills and experience and are active in all provinces where IS has a current or potential presence - including Nangarhar, Farah, Helmand and Zabul. But Taliban special forces will deploy anywhere against IS, leaving other Taliban to fight Afghan and foreign troops.

When IS planned its expansion into Afghanistan, the Taliban quietly ordered their commanders to confront the group by "all means possible". Since April, the Taliban and IS have attacked each other many times as they try to hold or take territory. IS cells, mostly led by disgruntled ex-Afghan Taliban commanders - as well as some militants from Pakistan and Uzbekistan - have been targeted. Nangarhar, Helmand, Farah and Zabul provinces have seen most of the fighting, with hundreds of insurgents from both sides killed. Exact figures are not available but Taliban special ops units are thought to have killed dozens of IS fighters since October. For their part, IS has also killed dozens of Taliban, mainly in Nangarhar. They seek out Taliban whenever they can and have ambushed them many times. IS beheaded 10 Taliban fighters earlier this year in Nangarhar. In June, the Taliban shadow governor for the province, Mawlawi Mir Ahmad Gul, was assassinated in Peshawar. It was believed that IS was behind the attack.

For the time being, it seems that IS has been largely eliminated in the south and west of the country. But its small groups of fighters are active in eastern Afghanistan, especially Nangarhar and Kunar provinces. IS is also focusing on northern Afghanistan where it wants to establish pockets to link up with other Uzbek, Tajik, Chechen and Uighur militants and cross international borders with ease.
Time and tide melt the snowman.

There are worlds out there where the sky is burning, where the sea's asleep and the rivers dream, people made of smoke and cities made of song. Somewhere there's danger, somewhere there's injustice and somewhere else the tea is getting cold. Come on, Ace, we've got work to do.
-- The Doctor

User avatar
Kraken
Posts: 33937
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
Location: The Hub of the Universe
Contact:
Kraken’s avatar
Offline

Re: ISIS

Post by Kraken » Sat Dec 19, 2015 3:17 pm

I saw an estimate in today's paper of 1,000-3,000 ISIS fighters in Afghanistan, with Taliban defections becoming a serious problem for them. Apparently allegiance to the caliphate trumps nativism for many.

User avatar
Max Peck
Posts: 7599
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:09 pm
Location: Down the Rabbit-Hole

Re: ISIS

Post by Max Peck » Fri Dec 25, 2015 1:36 am

Remember that organ donor bit from Monty Python's Meaning of Life? Apparently IS is down with all that...
Islamic State has sanctioned the harvesting of human organs in a previously undisclosed ruling by the group’s Islamic scholars, raising concerns that the violent extremist group may be trafficking in body parts.

The ruling, contained in a January 31, 2015 document reviewed by Reuters, says taking organs from a living captive to save a Muslim's life, even if it is fatal for the captive, is permissible.

For a U.S. government translation of the document, click here

Reuters couldn’t independently confirm the authenticity of the document. U.S. officials say it was among a trove of data and other information obtained by U.S. special forces in a raid in eastern Syria in May.

"The apostate's life and organs don't have to be respected and may be taken with impunity," says the document, which is in the form of a fatwa, or religious ruling, from the Islamic State’s Research and Fatwa Committee.

"Organs that end the captive's life if removed: The removal of that type is also not prohibited," Fatwa Number 68 says, according to a U.S. government translation.

The document does not offer any proof that Islamic State actually engages in organ harvesting or organ trafficking. But it does provide religious sanction for doing so under the group's harsh interpretation of Islam - which is rejected by most Muslims. Previously, Iraq has accused Islamic State of harvesting human organs and trafficking them for profit.

The document does not define “apostate,” though the Islamic State has killed or imprisoned non-Muslims, such as Christians, and Shiite Muslims, as well as Sunni Muslims who don't follow its extremist views.
Time and tide melt the snowman.

There are worlds out there where the sky is burning, where the sea's asleep and the rivers dream, people made of smoke and cities made of song. Somewhere there's danger, somewhere there's injustice and somewhere else the tea is getting cold. Come on, Ace, we've got work to do.
-- The Doctor

User avatar
Rip
Posts: 26884
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 9:34 pm
Location: Cajun Country!
Contact:
Rip’s avatar
Loading…

Re: ISIS

Post by Rip » Sat Dec 26, 2015 9:12 pm

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sH9oB1YChHs
Oil trucks are crossing Syrian-Turkish bordeline
:coffee:

User avatar
Max Peck
Posts: 7599
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:09 pm
Location: Down the Rabbit-Hole

Re: ISIS

Post by Max Peck » Sat Dec 26, 2015 10:03 pm

Rip wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sH9oB1YChHs
Oil trucks are crossing Syrian-Turkish bordeline
:coffee:
You'd think the Russian Ministry of Defense (Минобороны России) could take the time to proofread their postings. Not that the Russians are big on "proof" though. :coffee:
Time and tide melt the snowman.

There are worlds out there where the sky is burning, where the sea's asleep and the rivers dream, people made of smoke and cities made of song. Somewhere there's danger, somewhere there's injustice and somewhere else the tea is getting cold. Come on, Ace, we've got work to do.
-- The Doctor

User avatar
hepcat
Posts: 38096
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 3:02 pm
Location: Chicago, IL Home of the triple homicide!
hepcat’s avatar
Offline

Re: ISIS

Post by hepcat » Mon Dec 28, 2015 10:06 am

Rip wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sH9oB1YChHs
Oil trucks are crossing Syrian-Turkish bordeline
:coffee:
Is coffee emote the new ninja?
I beat a camel to death with a monkey. Can I do that?
-Mr Bismarck

You have to whack a few rabbits before you are ready to punch a camel.
-Coopasonic

User avatar
Max Peck
Posts: 7599
Joined: Fri Aug 05, 2005 8:09 pm
Location: Down the Rabbit-Hole

Re: ISIS

Post by Max Peck » Mon Dec 28, 2015 11:21 am

hepcat wrote:
Rip wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sH9oB1YChHs
Oil trucks are crossing Syrian-Turkish bordeline
:coffee:
Is coffee emote the new ninja?
Only in the sense that orange is the new black (or emoji is the new metaphor?).
:ninja: ⇒ (shifty, subversive,tricksy,...); :coffee: ⇒ (pretension of (disdain, indifference, being unimpressed,...))

In other IS news, Iraqi forces claim victory in Ramadi (without relying on Shia militias) and a key member of the Raqqa is Being Slaughtered Silently citizen-journalist group is assassinated in Turkey.
Time and tide melt the snowman.

There are worlds out there where the sky is burning, where the sea's asleep and the rivers dream, people made of smoke and cities made of song. Somewhere there's danger, somewhere there's injustice and somewhere else the tea is getting cold. Come on, Ace, we've got work to do.
-- The Doctor

User avatar
LordMortis
Posts: 60665
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:26 pm

Re: ISIS

Post by LordMortis » Mon Dec 28, 2015 1:09 pm

I'm very sad. I saw this posted on FB by a real friend.

Image

And it was a repost from a Trump support page.

My friend lives here and he's propagating that shit, which gives a sort of legitimacy to it.

Here is another pick from the same rally, which sort of shows those flags and what the rally was all about

Image

Then I made the mistake of reading the comments section behind original pic and it would be funny if Trump weren't so far out ahead. It's full of shit about how Dearborn is under Sharia law and how the government needs to send the Marines in to take over.

I live in a country where the voice of political lies are the loudest being broadcast behind the guise of finally being the voice of honesty.

I think it's hitting me even harder after Christmas and hearing the pro Trump ignorance coming from members of my own family and rather than standing up, I continue roll my eyes quietly and leave.

I did point my friend to the real rally and he still lumped Dearborn in to the "them" who we are against.

:cry:

Post Reply