RunningMn9 wrote:Isn't the "national security issue" the fact that Russia is conducting this sort of espionage? That doesn't sound like falling into a trap. That sounds like someone spinning to make it sound like they fell into a trap, as a way to avoid admitting that their nominee just encouraged a foreign government to take action against us.
Krauthammer's no fan of Trump, so that seems highly unlikely.
And other than the typical partisans, no one in their right mind would interpret Trump's flippant remark as a solemn encouragement for a hostile foreign government to take action against us.
"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." — P. J. O'Rourke
Anonymous Bosch wrote:no one in their right mind would interpret Trump's flippant remark as a solemn encouragement for a hostile foreign government to take action against us.
I'm torn. On the one hand, I can see that it's clearly just a joke. On the other hand, I also know that he has no idea what's wrong with the comment. No idea at all.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
cheeba wrote:I should also note I'm still not convinced that Trump actually wants to be President. Is it shitty that Russia's trying to influence our politics? Of course. But that's also nothing new.
Pyperkub wrote:What "shit" are you saying the Democrats started?
The whole rigging an election to support the establishment candidate and screw the better candidate thing.
Well if Kasich is to be believed, he wants to have the title, but doesn't want to do any of the work.
I did enjoy your usage of the term "better candidate" though. That's funny.
Anonymous Bosch wrote:no one in their right mind would interpret Trump's flippant remark as a solemn encouragement for a hostile foreign government to take action against us.
I'm torn. On the one hand, I can see that it's clearly just a joke. On the other hand, I also know that he has no idea what's wrong with the comment. No idea at all.
It's a joke, but if his joke came to be real, he'd be all over it, so as you say, he has no idea why the comments are a problem.
Anonymous Bosch wrote:no one in their right mind would interpret Trump's flippant remark as a solemn encouragement for a hostile foreign government to take action against us.
I'm torn. On the one hand, I can see that it's clearly just a joke. On the other hand, I also know that he has no idea what's wrong with the comment. No idea at all.
It can't be a joke...he has no sense of humor (at least none that normal humans can recognize as such). Anything that he says can and should be construed as his actual opinion...
Blackhawk wrote:You don't find it at all bothersome that Russia is trying to determine who will be President next?
No. It's Russia. They can barely get their own athletes into the Olympics let alone influence a US election in any significant way whatsoever.
What.
The.
Fuck.
They seemed to have no problem expanding their real estate despite the rest of the world's objections. Or assassinating people.
And a country that is about to put Trump in charge is hardly in a position to be dismissive of others.
They can militarily take over a peninsula owned by the Ukraine. While there they accidentally shot down a passenger jet. They are very good at assassinating their citizens who dare have a different opinion, I admit. Other than that, they're an incompetent state of soccer hooligans and a tattered economy desperately wishing to be relevant to the world. If Hill-dog cannot beat Donald Fricking Trump then she is equally incompetent and it's her own damn fault and not the Russians'.
And of course we can be dismissive of others, we're still the hegemon.
Blackhawk wrote:You don't find it at all bothersome that Russia is trying to determine who will be President next?
No. It's Russia. They can barely get their own athletes into the Olympics let alone influence a US election in any significant way whatsoever.
What.
The.
Fuck.
They seemed to have no problem expanding their real estate despite the rest of the world's objections. Or assassinating people.
And a country that is about to put Trump in charge is hardly in a position to be dismissive of others.
They can militarily take over a peninsula owned by the Ukraine. While there they accidentally shot down a passenger jet. They are very good at assassinating their citizens who dare have a different opinion, I admit. Other than that, they're an incompetent state of soccer hooligans and a tattered economy desperately wishing to be relevant to the world. If Hill-dog cannot beat Donald Fricking Trump then she is equally incompetent and it's her own damn fault and not the Russians'.
And of course we can be dismissive of others, we're still the hegemon.
Actually Ukraine separatists shot down the plane.
They are assassinating people in other countries. While so far they've chosen their own citizens, it's not like they are doing it in their backyard.
Your opinion of Russia not withstanding, the rest of the world is "concerned".
Blackhawk wrote:You don't find it at all bothersome that Russia is trying to determine who will be President next?
No. It's Russia. They can barely get their own athletes into the Olympics let alone influence a US election in any significant way whatsoever.
What.
The.
Fuck.
They seemed to have no problem expanding their real estate despite the rest of the world's objections. Or assassinating people.
And a country that is about to put Trump in charge is hardly in a position to be dismissive of others.
Or stealing our classified documents, to which we reply, "Aw, shucks!" You know, the response they got to the rest of those things you mentioned.
You're standing up missiles in the vicinity in support of allies. That's not aw, shucks. From what Trump says, he'd just pull out, so I guess that'll be good.
As for assassinations, it's hard to do much when they are killing their own in other peoples' countries.
You're not at war with Russia. You're not even in cold war with Russia. That said, dismissing Russia while Putin consolidates power and is taking an unhealthy interest in real estate around him is remarkably blind. So blind in fact that I assume cheeba is simply saying these things for effect, not because he believes them.
We're still waiting on the NSA to comment on who hacked those documents. Right now it's speculation, and probably accurate speculation, but I like to believe that the west tries to have their ducks in a row before shooting it's mouth off. Of course Trump is likely to change that. It'll be fun watching Trump and Putin bluster and fume ineffectually at each other for 4 years.
Russia’s apparent election tampering — and Trump’s call for the Russians to expose Clinton’s deleted e-mails — shows that the insecurity of America’s data networks could undermine our ability to hold free and fair elections. But if the Russian president would go this far to pick our next president, why not take the direct approach? Why not tamper with the computers that manage the nation’s voting systems?
Maybe that has already happened. Those voting systems are certainly vulnerable.
GreenGoo wrote:Your opinion of Russia not withstanding, the rest of the world is "concerned".
One of the greatest traits of Americans is how few fucks we give about the concern of the rest of the world.
That's because the average citizen is remarkably ignorant of how the rest of the world works. Particularly in the age of globalization.
Your ability to not give a fuck consequence free is dissolving. Whether you give a fuck about your ability to not give a fuck is up to you.
Trump's got your back though. A little isolationism, a dash of trade barriers and suddenly America is an island in a world that has moved on without it. You'll be able to not give a fuck what the rest of the world thinks right there along with North Korea.
The problem in thinking of strictly of your own self interests is that it ultimately fails long term. Trump says he will tear up the Iran nuclear agreement. Well, the EU can make a lot of money selling to Iran. How will Trump get the to re-impose sanctions if he is seen as no longer supporting NATO? Why should they care? They would ask Trump, "What have you done for us lately?" His transactional view of foreign affairs is unrealistic and self defeating in the long run.
Tolerance is the virtue of the man without convictions. – G.K. Chesterton
FBI Director James B. Comey on Wednesday rejected the idea that the bureau would reopen its investigation into Hillary Clinton’s use of a private email server while she was secretary of state — laying to rest a long-shot hope of Republican legislators who have questioned the government’s handling of the case.
At a hearing of the House Judiciary Committee, Republican congressmen again peppered Comey with questions about how he came to the conclusion that Clinton should not be charged in connection with her server use. As he has at other hearings, Comey did not bend from his earlier decision.
“Since you announced that there would be no prosecution of Secretary Clinton in July, there have been several very material issues that are troubling, and would those not require a reopening of the investigation to solve those issues?” Rep. James F. Sensenbrenner Jr. (R-Wis.) asked.
“I haven’t seen anything that would come near to that kind of situation,” Comey responded.
...
“I hope some day when this political craziness is over you will look back again on this, because this is the FBI you know and love,” Comey responded. “This was done by pros in the right way. That’s the part I have no patience for.”
...
Comey flatly dismissed the idea that Clinton herself should be prosecuted, though he said an FBI employee doing what Clinton did would “be in big trouble,” even if they were not criminally charged. He bristled at any suggestion that Clinton faced a double standard or that agents were influenced by politics.
“You can call us wrong, but don’t call us weasels,” Comey said. “We are not weasels.”
“You can call us wrong, but don’t call us weasels,” Comey said. “We are not weasels.”
Yeah, they're more ferret than weasel. Cause they're ferreting out information, get it? Hello? Hello? Where did everyone go?
I don't mean to badger you, but perhaps you should gopher another pun. Comey needs more rats with information, doesn't want to come across as a mouse, and t old them he pursued this line of inquiry like a Tasmanian devil in a Butchershop.
Grifman wrote:The problem in thinking of strictly of your own self interests is that it ultimately fails long term. Trump says he will tear up the Iran nuclear agreement. Well, the EU can make a lot of money selling to Iran. How will Trump get the to re-impose sanctions if he is seen as no longer supporting NATO? Why should they care? They would ask Trump, "What have you done for us lately?" His transactional view of foreign affairs is unrealistic and self defeating in the long run.
Additionally, sanctions worked *so* well with North Korea.
Black Lives definitely Matter Lorini!
Also: There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.
“You can call us wrong, but don’t call us weasels,” Comey said. “We are not weasels.”
Yeah, they're more ferret than weasel. Cause they're ferreting out information, get it? Hello? Hello? Where did everyone go?
I don't mean to badger you, but perhaps you should gopher another pun. Comey needs more rats with information, doesn't want to come across as a mouse, and t old them he pursued this line of inquiry like a Tasmanian devil in a Butchershop.
Pyperkub wrote:
Additionally, sanctions worked *so* well with North Korea.
Erm, IIUC, sanctions on NK weren't nearly as comprehensive as they were on Iran, and some of those sanctions had been relaxed as part of the agreements.
Over the past month, voter registration databases in states across the United States have continued to come under attack by hackers, FBI Director James Comey warned lawmakers today.
"There have been a variety of scanning activities, which is a preamble for potential intrusion activities, as well as some attempted intrusions at voter registration databases beyond those we knew about in July and August," he told the House Judiciary Committee. "There's no doubt that some bad actors have been poking around."
Sources have told ABC News that Russian hackers were likely behind the cyberattacks.
That's scary. What's the plausible danger here? The article quotes Comey as saying that the actual voting systems aren't in any danger (due to be dispersed and hard to crack) - is that correct? If so, what's the danger of having the voter registration lists cracked? That hackers might delete likely democratic voters' registration to try to sway the election in a couple swing states?
El Guapo wrote:That's scary. What's the plausible danger here? The article quotes Comey as saying that the actual voting systems aren't in any danger (due to be dispersed and hard to crack) - is that correct? If so, what's the danger of having the voter registration lists cracked? That hackers might delete likely democratic voters' registration to try to sway the election in a couple swing states?
I have a small (single-digit quatloo small) side bet on there being be a voter registration data leak just before (or just after) the election, purporting to prove anti-Trump voter fraud in order to undermine the legitimacy of the result. Ideally, this should be in a close battleground state, but I don't know in which states any of the four or so actual breaches occurred (the last I heard, there was supposedly probing activity in about 20 states and about 4 successful breaches). In that event, it is worth keeping in mind that the Russians have been caught fairly recently leaking documents that have been modified to make them look incriminating.
I know, I know...
"What? What?What?" -- The 14th Doctor
It's not enough to be a good player... you also have to play well. -- Siegbert Tarrasch
Pyperkub wrote:
Additionally, sanctions worked *so* well with North Korea.
Erm, IIUC, sanctions on NK weren't nearly as comprehensive as they were on Iran, and some of those sanctions had been relaxed as part of the agreements.
Not only that but NK is far more authoritarian. They brutally repress their population. Iran is no where near that level and restricting capital flows had significant impact on them. NK is basically a hermit state. Their is little that can be done that doesn't literally cause people to slowly starve to death. Plus the sanctions worked - it drove them to the bargaining table.
El Guapo wrote:That's scary. What's the plausible danger here? The article quotes Comey as saying that the actual voting systems aren't in any danger (due to be dispersed and hard to crack) - is that correct? If so, what's the danger of having the voter registration lists cracked? That hackers might delete likely democratic voters' registration to try to sway the election in a couple swing states?
I have a small (single-digit quatloo small) side bet on there being be a voter registration data leak just before (or just after) the election, purporting to prove anti-Trump voter fraud in order to undermine the legitimacy of the result. Ideally, this should be in a close battleground state, but I don't know in which states any of the four or so actual breaches occurred (the last I heard, there was supposedly probing activity in about 20 states and about 4 successful breaches). In that event, it is worth keeping in mind that the Russians have been caught fairly recently leaking documents that have been modified to make them look incriminating.
Exhibit A in the case is this document created and later edited in the ubiquitous Microsoft Word format. Metadata left inside the file shows it was last edited by someone using the computer name "Феликс Эдмундович." That means the computer was configured to use the Russian language and that it was connected to a Russian-language keyboard. More intriguing still, "Феликс Эдмундович" is the colloquial name that translates to Felix Dzerzhinsky, the 20th Century Russian statesman who is best known for founding the Soviet secret police. (The metadata also shows that the purported DNC strategy memo was originally created by someone named Warren Flood, which happens to be the name of a LinkedIn user claiming to provide strategy and data analytics services to Democratic candidates.)...
...All three pieces of evidence were teased out of the documents and noted on Twitter by an independent security researcher who goes by the handle PwnAllTheThings. The theory is also consistent with everything previously published by CrowdStrike, the security firm the DNC hired to investigate its suspicions that its servers had been breached. CrowdStrike researchers said they quickly determined that the servers had been infiltrated by two separate Russian hacking groups. In response to Wednesday's leak, CrowdStrike raised the possibility that the leak was part of a Russian Intelligence disinformation campaign. Company officials declined to comment on Thursday for this post.
A pattern of mischaracterization, misrepresentation, and outright alteration of breached data has emerged in two of the latest headline-grabbing batches of hacked files. Investigators discovered that recently published data from anti-doping testing at the 2016 Olympics in Rio de Janeiro had been altered by parties connected to a Russia-based hacking group behind the breach, according to a report issued by the World Anti-Doping Agency (WADA) yesterday...
...Some of the more controversial documents in the collection posted directly on the Guccifer 2.0 WordPress blog, including one titled "Master Spreadsheet PAC Contributions," may have been modified before posting. That file was created and edited once in February 2009. Based on file metadata, it was pulled off the DCCC server on May 23, 2016.
Black Lives definitely Matter Lorini!
Also: There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.
The U.S. government on Friday formally accused Russia of a campaign of cyber attacks against Democratic Party organizations during the campaign for the Nov. 8 presidential election.
U.S. officials have said in the past few months that they believe cyber attacks were orchestrated by hackers backed by the Russian government, possibly to disrupt the election in which Democratic Party candidate Hillary Clinton faces Republican Party candidate Donald Trump. Russia has dismissed allegations it was involved in cyber attacks on the organizations.
"We believe, based on the scope and sensitivity of these efforts, that only Russia's senior-most officials could have authorized these activities," a U.S. government statement said on Friday about hacking of political groups.
The statement by the Department of Homeland Security and the Office of the Director of National Intelligence did not blame the Russian government for hacking attempts against state election systems, but said "scanning and probing" of those systems originated in most cases from servers operated by a Russian company.
"These thefts and disclosures are intended to interfere with the U.S. election process," the statement said. "However, we are not now in a position to attribute this activity to the Russian Government," the statement said.
"What? What?What?" -- The 14th Doctor
It's not enough to be a good player... you also have to play well. -- Siegbert Tarrasch
and really, isn't the fact that Russia attacks the Democratic party, and not the Republican, part telling here?
Not that I would expect a trump supporter, like Em2 or Rip, to recognize this for what it is.
Unagi wrote:and really, isn't the fact that Russia attacks the Democratic party, and not the Republican, part telling here?
Not that I would expect a trump supporter, like Em2 or Rip, to recognize this for what it is.
It is telling. That's why this is a setup by the DHS.
Unagi wrote:and really, isn't the fact that Russia attacks the Democratic party, and not the Republican, part telling here?
Not that I would expect a trump supporter, like Em2 or Rip, to recognize this for what it is.
It is telling. That's why this is a setup by the DHS.
Unagi wrote:and really, isn't the fact that Russia attacks the Democratic party, and not the Republican, part telling here?
Not that I would expect a trump supporter, like Em2 or Rip, to recognize this for what it is.
It is telling. That's why this is a setup by the DHS.
And just like that, I had the irresistible urge to play a game of Illuminati.
"What? What?What?" -- The 14th Doctor
It's not enough to be a good player... you also have to play well. -- Siegbert Tarrasch
“My father loved to complain about big business and big government, but we had a solid middle class upbringing. We had good public schools. We had accessible health care. We had our little, you know, one-family house that, you know, he saved up his money, didn't believe in mortgages. So I lived that,” she said in the speech. “And now, obviously, I'm kind of far removed because the life I've lived and the economic, you know, fortunes that my husband and I now enjoy, but I haven't forgotten it.”
"My dream is a hemispheric common market, with open trade and open borders, some time in the future with energy that is as green and sustainable as we can get it, powering growth and opportunity for every person in the hemisphere,” Clinton told a Brazilian bank in 2013. She added, “We have to resist, protectionism, other kinds of barriers to market access.”
wow.
