Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020? No, it's 2020!

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Max Peck
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Max Peck »

Can you smell what the President is cooking?
It started off as a joke, then it became more serious. Now Dwayne “the Rock” Johnson says running for president in 2020 is “a real possibility.”

The pro wrestler and Hollywood mogul made his latest quips to GQ magazine, which published a highly entertaining cover story on the star Wednesday.

Johnson said it was about a year ago, around the time The Post’s Alyssa Rosenberg published an essay explaining why Johnson could be a viable candidate, that the actor began thinking about running for office more seriously.

“There was a real sense of earnestness, which made me go home and think, ‘Let me really rethink my answer and make sure I am giving an answer that is truthful and also respectful,’ ” he told GQ’s Caity Weaver.

“I didn’t want to be flippant,” he added about what his platform might be, such as giving joke responses like “We’ll have three days off for a weekend!” or “No taxes!”

Weaver writes: “So, after all that consideration, Johnson doesn’t hesitate when I ask him whether he honestly might one day give up his life as the highest-paid movie star on earth — which is unquestionably easier, more fun, and more lucrative than being president of the United States — in order to run for office. ‘I think that it’s a real possibility,’ he says solemnly.”
And when you're a star, they let you do it. You can do anything. Grab 'em by the ballot box.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Moliere »

It's easy at this stage to be popular. But when you have to start taking positions on issues like abortion or guns then you lose 40% of your audience.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Rip »

Vote for The Rock or The Rock will lay the smackdown on your candy asses.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by YellowKing »

One of my friends on Facebook said she would vote for an actual rock over the idiot we have in office now. :D
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Jeff V »

YellowKing wrote:One of my friends on Facebook said she would vote for an actual rock over the idiot we have in office now. :D
One rock over a box of rocks?
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by gilraen »

Not yet official:
Rep. John Delaney (D-Md.) plans on bypassing runs for governor and reelection and has told associates he is seriously considering a bid for president in 2020, according to two Democratic sources.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Kraken »

his moderate stances and background in finance don’t match a left-leaning Democratic primary electorate.
There's a chance that a moderate establishment guy could ride nostalgia for the status quo before Trump, but I don't think going backward will be the Dem's winning strategy in '20. Way too early to be sure about that though.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by LordMortis »

Kasich has some odious stances, but he doesn't push them and he's openly willing to to say the GOP is unacceptable, so, yes please. I don't know anything about hickenlooper but Kasich has already been vetted by me this last go around as the closest thing to acceptable from the gallery, with his worse quality being that even if he'd work against "pro business" agendas, he wouldn't work against the GOP. He never got back in to his corner is conceding and this pushes the last of the right buttons for me.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by RunningMn9 »

I voted for Kasich in the primary, and appreciated that he never caved to the human garbage that went on to win the nomination. That earns solid points in my book.
And in banks across the world
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And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by malchior »

RunningMn9 wrote:I voted for Kasich in the primary, and appreciated that he never caved to the human garbage that went on to win the nomination. That earns solid points in my book.
Same thoughts though I disagree *strongly* with some of his positions.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by RunningMn9 »

malchior wrote:Same thoughts though I disagree *strongly* with some of his positions.
Me too. But as I've explained several times, when it comes to the President, I rarely vote based on ideology. I vote based on the character of the candidate. I point to the piece of shit in the White House now as my example for why I vote that way.

I believe that John Kasich is a good man. I believe that the Presidency is bigger than a candidate's ideology, and that generally that's not apparent until they get in the office. Their success or failure depends on character, IMO. However, I respect that opinions vary on this point.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Jeff V »

My opinion of Kasich improved a great deal last week after he went on somewhat of a tirade on the Today Show in response to Trump's nod-nod-wink-wink "admonishment" of his beloved deplorables.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by malchior »

RunningMn9 wrote:
malchior wrote:Same thoughts though I disagree *strongly* with some of his positions.
Me too. But as I've explained several times, when it comes to the President, I rarely vote based on ideology. I vote based on the character of the candidate. I point to the piece of shit in the White House now as my example for why I vote that way.

I believe that John Kasich is a good man. I believe that the Presidency is bigger than a candidate's ideology, and that generally that's not apparent until they get in the office. Their success or failure depends on character, IMO. However, I respect that opinions vary on this point.
I'm 100% with you here. The office magnifies character flaws and I think Kasich is a decent man as well.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by El Guapo »

RunningMn9 wrote:
malchior wrote:Same thoughts though I disagree *strongly* with some of his positions.
Me too. But as I've explained several times, when it comes to the President, I rarely vote based on ideology. I vote based on the character of the candidate. I point to the piece of shit in the White House now as my example for why I vote that way.

I believe that John Kasich is a good man. I believe that the Presidency is bigger than a candidate's ideology, and that generally that's not apparent until they get in the office. Their success or failure depends on character, IMO. However, I respect that opinions vary on this point.
I agree with the importance of character, but I think you need to go beyond just the character of the candidate, and also consider the importance of the party leaders of the political party that they're running under. Any Republican president, including Kasich, would empower McConnell and Ryan (and others) in a way that no Democratic president would. So their character (and those of democratic leaders) matter in terms of which presidential candidate is worthy of support as well.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Moliere »

No one named "Hickenlooper" is going to be President.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by RunningMn9 »

El Guapo wrote:I think you need to go beyond just the character of the candidate
History has taught me that I don't need to go much beyond the character of the candidate, when it comes to the President. So much of what makes a President has nothing to do with laws passed or anything of the sort. Good Presidents or bad Presidents are determined (in my view) in the manner in which they handle the things that no one knew were going to happen while they were in office.

When it comes to Congress, ideology is *everything*.

You are free to not employ my voting methodology. :)
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by El Guapo »

Yeah, I think I'll stick with a methodology that considers which laws are passed / vetoed to be an important part of what makes a president good or bad.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by RunningMn9 »

That's your right. I believe that I exist in a nation of 325+ million people, each of which are entitled to occasionally get the legislation that's important to them, even if I am strongly opposed to it. So the idea of some bill getting passed that I'm against being the marker of whether a President is good or bad doesn't mean much to me.

I don't mind both sides passing legislation. If either side passes legislation that goes to far, there will be backlash and it will get dealt with in a future legislative cycle. I can live with that.

People of low moral character who get into the Oval Office have the potential to do much greater real and lasting damage to the Republic than some laws that I'm against.

In a perfect world, I'd have multiple candidates with good enough moral character that I can care about other things. In the worst of all worlds (Nov 2016), I will have no candidates available with any moral character, and I will be forced to choose based on other things. But if it was Kasich against Hillary? I wouldn't have wasted a single synapse on that choice. I would have gladly voted for Kasich.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by El Guapo »

It's a little baffling, because I think you're against repealing the ACA, thus causing tens of millions to lose insurance, and Kasich probably would have signed some terrible repeal bill, while Clinton would not have. I don't see how one divorces whether a politician is a good or a bad person from what they intend (and are likely to do) as president.

Probably also worth having a conversation another time about how the notion of Clinton as a person of low moral character is more the result of decades of GOP propaganda and spurious investigations than of any real truth.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by RunningMn9 »

El Guapo wrote:It's a little baffling, because I think you're against repealing the ACA, thus causing tens of millions to lose insurance, and Kasich probably would have signed some terrible repeal bill, while Clinton would not have.
Personally, yes, I'm against repealing the ACA. But if the country elects a Congress who ran specifically on the premise of repealing the ACA, then I guess I don't get what I want. I'm glad the repeal effort failed. But I still wouldn't have voted for Hillary over Kasich. Passing or repealing the ACA is the function of the Legislative branch, not the Executive. If we elect a Legislative branch that runs on the premise of doing X, I'm not going to lose sleep if they win and try to do X.

If they win and try to do X, but fail. And I'm against X, than bully for me.
El Guapo wrote:I don't see how one divorces whether a politician is a good or a bad person from what they intend (and are likely to do) as president.
El Guapo wrote: Candidates are partisan creatures. And while they still typically have partisan leanings once elected, they typically feel the gravity of the office, and recognize that they have an obligation towards 325+ million people. And so the reality of governing from the Executive branch can temper the more partisan intents that a candidate may have had prior to assuming office.

The visibility on the Executive is so much greater than on any individual in Congress, that it's much harder to just be a partisan stooge.
El Guapo wrote:Probably also worth having a conversation another time about how the notion of Clinton as a person of low moral character is more the result of decades of GOP propaganda and spurious investigations than of any real truth.
My opinion of Hillary's moral character is based entirely on my observations of Hillary, and not on propaganda. She lacks any moral compass in the same way that her husband does. I don't doubt that she would have been *competent*, which is why I voted for her over this fool. But I don't feel that I could ever rely on her to have principles or to do the hard things that need to be done sometimes as President. She would have done what the polls told her to do.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by El Guapo »

RunningMn9 wrote:
El Guapo wrote:It's a little baffling, because I think you're against repealing the ACA, thus causing tens of millions to lose insurance, and Kasich probably would have signed some terrible repeal bill, while Clinton would not have.
Personally, yes, I'm against repealing the ACA. But if the country elects a Congress who ran specifically on the premise of repealing the ACA, then I guess I don't get what I want. I'm glad the repeal effort failed. But I still wouldn't have voted for Hillary over Kasich. Passing or repealing the ACA is the function of the Legislative branch, not the Executive. If we elect a Legislative branch that runs on the premise of doing X, I'm not going to lose sleep if they win and try to do X.

If they win and try to do X, but fail. And I'm against X, than bully for me.
Passing and enacting a repeal law is the function of both the legislative and executive branch, since the President can effectively prevent any bill that lacks utterly overwhelming support from becoming law.

More importantly, the fact that it would be legitimate for a Congress and President elected (in part) on repealing the ACA seems completely irrelevant to whether it is a good idea to vote for someone who will try to repeal the ACA.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by RunningMn9 »

El Guapo wrote:Passing and enacting a repeal law is the function of both the legislative and executive branch, since the President can effectively prevent any bill that lacks utterly overwhelming support from becoming law.
It's tangentially the function of the Executive branch. Yes, the President must sign a bill into law. Yes, the President can veto a law. But I don't consider those to be the primary function of their job. I'm also not a big believer in our current implementation where the President pretends like he's the king of the legislature and gets to tell them what to do.

And I'm keenly aware that we've have a very recent example of a President who tried to let Congress actually do their job, and they failed spectacularly at it (and then blamed him for not telling them what to do) - with the aforementioned ACA.
El Guapo wrote:More importantly, the fact that it would be legitimate for a Congress and President elected (in part) on repealing the ACA seems completely irrelevant to whether it is a good idea to vote for someone who will try to repeal the ACA.
I have bigger concerns than any particular piece of legislation.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Alefroth »

El Guapo wrote: Probably also worth having a conversation another time about how the notion of Clinton as a person of low moral character is more the result of decades of GOP propaganda and spurious investigations than of any real truth.
Unfortunately, I think that conversation has already run it's course and there won't be anymore ah-ha moments, especially now that opinions on the matter don't have any real world effect.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Zarathud »

Kasich only looks good in comparison to the rest of the Republican Party. Kasich meets the minimum standards.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by RunningMn9 »

Zarathud wrote:Kasich only looks good in comparison to the rest of the Republican Party. Kasich meets the minimum standards.
From a policy perspective? Or from a character perspective?
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by LordMortis »

RunningMn9 wrote:
Zarathud wrote:Kasich only looks good in comparison to the rest of the Republican Party. Kasich meets the minimum standards.
From a policy perspective? Or from a character perspective?
For my money the former... which meets the minimum requirements. ;)
For the later it's night and day, which meets a necessary requirement the rest of the field from 2016 lacked. I wasn't even sold that he truly was set apart until he was the last man standing to refuse the idea of Trump and then continued to stand after the entire GOP knelt before him.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by El Guapo »

ok, let me ask you it this way - is there any policy which, if Kasich (say) announced his support for it, would cause you to view him as a person of poor moral character?
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Jeff V »

Zarathud wrote:Kasich only looks good in comparison to the rest of the Republican Party. Kasich meets the minimum standards.
This was my impression all along and he still isn't someone who would lure me back to the party of elephants (at this point, I can't imagine anyone who would). But he'd certainly be less of an embarrassment.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by RunningMn9 »

El Guapo wrote:ok, let me ask you it this way - is there any policy which, if Kasich (say) announced his support for it, would cause you to view him as a person of poor moral character?
I mean, I have to admit that it's possible. If Kasich came out in support of a policy of feeding every third baby to ravenous English bulldogs, I would contemplate that perhaps he has become a person of poor moral character.

Him supporting the repeal of a flawed law that he believes is bad (I suspect his position isn't limited to repeal)? We don't disagree that it is a fundamentally flawed law. We disagree on what we should do about it. And I'm ok with that. My opinion on this topic is only partially educated. I'm not a health policy expert. That I think something is the right answer doesn't make it so.

Given that, how harshly can I judge someone for reaching a different conclusion - as long as that conclusion is within the realm of sane possible conclusions?
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Jeff V »

Kasich was on Meet the Press yesterday and emphatically denied this, stating "Hickenlooper would never fit on a bumper sticker."
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Pyperkub »

RunningMn9 wrote:
El Guapo wrote:I think you need to go beyond just the character of the candidate
History has taught me that I don't need to go much beyond the character of the candidate, when it comes to the President. So much of what makes a President has nothing to do with laws passed or anything of the sort. Good Presidents or bad Presidents are determined (in my view) in the manner in which they handle the things that no one knew were going to happen while they were in office.

When it comes to Congress, ideology is *everything*.

You are free to not employ my voting methodology. :)
In the past I would have agreed with you, however, the GOP has recently (pretty much the past 3 decades) made rigid adherence to ideology such a staple of every candidate that it truly needs to be factored into the candidate's character, IMHO.

Whether that's a function of GOP leadership, GOP/Conservative Media or just the GOP voters doesn't matter so much, but as we've seen with the Obamacare Repeal (as a single example), the rigid ideological path isn't conducive to good (or even effective) Government, and IMHO any GOP Candidate's character HAS to be viewed through that lens.

IMHO, the Democrats don't have this problem (yet), but the GOP ideology and governing philosophies are definitely pushing them there.
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Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Scoop20906 »

If you think there is a future in racism then you have to be ecstatic with the republican party.

If you think racism cuts both ways and realize once the tables are turned (and they are turning demographically) you aren't going to be happy with systematic discrimination then maybe the democratic are for you.


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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Scoop20906 »

If you think there is a future in racism then you have to be ecstatic with the republican party.

If you think racism cuts both ways and realize once the tables are turned (and they are turning demographically) you aren't going to be happy with systematic discrimination then maybe the democratic are for you.


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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Carpet_pissr »

I don't know. It seems like this past cycle brought out a strong 3rd party potential, but not where we all suspected it was coming from.

You've got the Democrats, struggling as always with their identity, trying to be progressive in a right, almost far right country, and getting walloped recently.
You've got the Republicans, facing increasing pressure from non-white pop. growth, and cheating to try to get ahead of that curve. Hesitantly in bed with Trump because he won, but certainly no love lost.
Then you've got the maybe Pure Populists let's call them. Led by Trump, hate Obama and Hillary with a fiery passion because of all the...stuff they did to them. This group has disavowed the Republicans and see them as having sold out, not nearly hard core enough for their extreme MAGA views.

So maybe we can consider that the R party has already splintered (you could make the case that that happened somewhat with the D part re: Bernie, but that party didn't win, so not as obvious now).
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by pr0ner »

Carpet_pissr wrote:So maybe we can consider that the R party has already splintered (you could make the case that that happened somewhat with the D part re: Bernie, but that party didn't win, so not as obvious now).
I normally vote Republican. I didn't vote for Trump in 2016, because no. I specifically voted in the Republican primary for Governor here in Virginia in 2017 to vote against the guy running on the Trump platform.

I'll happily vote for a sensible Republican. I will not vote for Trump or anyone who's going along for a ride on the Trump train.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by RunningMn9 »

Yeah, people keep telling me that I have to care about ideology because reasons. I don't have to care.

I'm comfortable living in a country where people that disagree with me get to make laws too - even ones I disagree with.

When the shit hits the fan though, I need to have confidence in the President to be a goddamn President. And that is where Trump fails. I don't care that he's willing to rubber stamp anything a GOP congress manages to pass. That's normal (to me).

He's a fuck head that can't be trusted to do what's right when it matters.

I respect that other people can vote however they want for whatever reasons they want. I was just explaining my methodology. If someone doesn't approve, they shouldn't use it.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Kraken »

RunningMn9 wrote:Yeah, people keep telling me that I have to care about ideology because reasons. I don't have to care.

I'm comfortable living in a country where people that disagree with me get to make laws too - even ones I disagree with.
IDK if I'm fer ya or agin ya. I try to vote for the person who is the most rational and reasonable, which I suppose is character, although it's generally revealed by policy positions. Morality is a different ball of wax, and that's also character, and it also matters. But I'll always take the Vulcan over the Romulan.
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by Pyperkub »

RunningMn9 wrote:Yeah, people keep telling me that I have to care about ideology because reasons. I don't have to care.

I'm comfortable living in a country where people that disagree with me get to make laws too - even ones I disagree with.

When the shit hits the fan though, I need to have confidence in the President to be a goddamn President. And that is where Trump fails. I don't care that he's willing to rubber stamp anything a GOP congress manages to pass. That's normal (to me).

He's a fuck head that can't be trusted to do what's right when it matters.

I respect that other people can vote however they want for whatever reasons they want. I was just explaining my methodology. If someone doesn't approve, they shouldn't use it.
Fair enough. I think a huge portion of it (to me) is that the GOP's dogmatic approach to ideology seems to completely ignore facts in favor of that ideology, which I do see as a character issue (as well as a grave risk).
Black Lives definitely Matter Lorini!

Also: There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.
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RunningMn9
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Re: Too Soon To Start Thinking About 2020?

Post by RunningMn9 »

I certainly don't disagree that the currently Republican Party is made up of a large amount of people that are *really* enamored with their ability to believe things that have nothing to do with facts.

And it leads them to want to do any number of things that I think are stupid, hurtful and counter-productive. Ideally I would like them to lose elections over it.

But there's a lot of them, and emailghazi!!

So they get to do things their way until the next election. That's the way of it. Although it's a moot point now given that I won't vote for a Republican for any reason for any office in the foreseeable future.
And in banks across the world
Christians, Moslems, Hindus, Jews
And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
Get down on their knees and pray
The raccoon and the groundhog neatly
Make up bags of change
But the monkey in the corner
Well he's slowly drifting out of range
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