The Former Trump Presidency Thread

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Zarathud
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Zarathud »

The way it usually happens is the US Attorney General (Sessions) works behind the scenes to schedule US Attorneys to leave or stay. If you're working a critical case or well-respected, you can stay on longer. A few US Attorneys stayed on through most/all of Obama's term. New appointees are named shortly after the resignations.

US Attorney Bharara would have been likely to stay--he's a high profile superstar. Trump said he could stay, then changed his mind or allowed Sessions to remove him anyway. Why the sudden change?

It's an issue because (1) it's handled poorly (Bannon), (2) it looks like a loyalty purge especially after Trump fired acting US Attorney General Yates, (3) Trump faces investigation but not by an independent prosecutor, (4) Trump's unknown business and foreign dealings, (5) Trump has been overreaching with his Executive Orders, and (6) no one trusts Trump's motives.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Blackhawk »

Being completely politically naive, why do people take a job, leaving whatever they had behind, when job security is almost guaranteed to be zero? Is it just for the line on their resume afterwards?
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Kraken »

ImLawBoy wrote:The New York AG refused to resign because he said that Trump promised him he could keep his job, so his feelings were hurt.
Nah, like any Democrat he just wants to collect unemployment.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Scraper »

Blackhawk wrote:Being completely politically naive, why do people take a job, leaving whatever they had behind, when job security is almost guaranteed to be zero? Is it just for the line on their resume afterwards?
Any halfway decent federal prosecutor will be able to get plenty of well paying jobs once they are done with the public job. An AG like him will be able to hand pick damn near any high paying attorney job he wants to. So it's not always about job security or even the income.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Paingod »

Scraper wrote:
Blackhawk wrote:Being completely politically naive, why do people take a job, leaving whatever they had behind, when job security is almost guaranteed to be zero? Is it just for the line on their resume afterwards?
Any halfway decent federal prosecutor will be able to get plenty of well paying jobs once they are done with the public job. An AG like him will be able to hand pick damn near any high paying attorney job he wants to. So it's not always about job security or even the income.
They're getting a really, really sweet line on the resume and can probably afford to take a few months off to find the right job.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by msteelers »

Chrisoc13 wrote:At one point CNN has an article about how trump has made a powerful enemy and what a mistake that was. No way around it that smells like bias.
Was it a news article, or an editorial? Plenty of people confuse the two.

Either way, 24 hour cable news channels are garbage. Sometimes you'll find a good piece of journalism in there, but usually it's all bad.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Sepiche »

msteelers wrote:
Chrisoc13 wrote:At one point CNN has an article about how trump has made a powerful enemy and what a mistake that was. No way around it that smells like bias.
Was it a news article, or an editorial? Plenty of people confuse the two.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by LordMortis »

msteelers wrote:Either way, 24 hour cable news channels are garbage.
I've found myself growing accustomed to watching CNBC :shifty:

I will say that they completely overhyped the SNAP IPO and that was a pretty sensationalist garbage thing to do...
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

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msteelers wrote:
Chrisoc13 wrote:At one point CNN has an article about how trump has made a powerful enemy and what a mistake that was. No way around it that smells like bias.
Was it a news article, or an editorial? Plenty of people confuse the two.

Either way, 24 hour cable news channels are garbage. Sometimes you'll find a good piece of journalism in there, but usually it's all bad.
Obviously an editorial but their tone is the same regardless and CNN has a bad habit of putting their editorials up like front line news. Big headlines. Bold type. Doesn't say editorial until you hit the article and then in small print on the side. I obviously could tell it was an editorial immediately but it doesn't change that they push it like it's real news, they attach it to the real article and push it hard. A mountain was made of a molehill on this issue and the constant drone is playing right into Trump's hands, tiny as they are.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by hepcat »

While I somewhat agree with you, I only have to head over to Brietbarts for a few minutes to realize CNN could be much worse.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Paingod »

The delicious turn of Trump's "I'm not taking the salary" promise.

Hint: He's taking it, donating it, and getting a tax break for it - costing the taxpayers more than if he had just taken the money.

Edit: Just a wistful reminder of our past, and the Trump that was before the Presidency.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by El Guapo »

Zarathud wrote:The way it usually happens is the US Attorney General (Sessions) works behind the scenes to schedule US Attorneys to leave or stay. If you're working a critical case or well-respected, you can stay on longer. A few US Attorneys stayed on through most/all of Obama's term. New appointees are named shortly after the resignations.

US Attorney Bharara would have been likely to stay--he's a high profile superstar. Trump said he could stay, then changed his mind or allowed Sessions to remove him anyway. Why the sudden change?

It's an issue because (1) it's handled poorly (Bannon), (2) it looks like a loyalty purge especially after Trump fired acting US Attorney General Yates, (3) Trump faces investigation but not by an independent prosecutor, (4) Trump's unknown business and foreign dealings, (5) Trump has been overreaching with his Executive Orders, and (6) no one trusts Trump's motives.
The coverage of this whole thing wasn't great. The headlines were all "TRUMP ASKS 46 US ATTORNEYS TO RESIGN". But that's fairly normal (if poorly handled, per Trump's usual), so that's not really a huge story. I think a big part of why this got big headlines like this is mainly because Trump has shown open contempt towards democratic norms, so reporters (who often don't know the history off hand) are inclined to view items like this through the lens of "Trump is destroying democracy", before they do their homework. This probably doesn't get the same headlines if it were President Kasich, for example.

Bharara is potentially a story, because obviously something unusual happened there, since he refused to leave. The most straightforward explanation is based upon Trump telling Bharara that he could stay and then reneging on that (which seems to have happened). Then the question becomes, why did Trump change his mind on that? There *could* be a scandal there, but we don't really have much more than speculation on that at this point (though hopefully at least a couple reporters are going to do some digging).
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The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Chrisoc13 »

hepcat wrote:While I somewhat agree with you, I only have to head over to Brietbarts for a few minutes to realize CNN could be much worse.
Haha yeah... I don't touch that cesspool. I would never even venture as far as fox news. I don't trust them in the slightest. I don't need news to confirm my bias, I need news to give me straight up info and I'll make up my mind.

Mainstream media could be worse, but it could be better, and I feel like they are drifting to worse not better.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by hepcat »

Breitbart intentionally baits women and minorities. And they're not even subtle about it most of the time. While I think there's something to be said for complaints that a lot of people are overly sensitive these days, Breitbart reminds me why being overly sensitive is the lesser of two evils.

But the worst part about it is that it has the ear of our POTUS. It's a trusted source of information for him. It spawned his closest advisor. That's absolutely bone chilling.

I can't think of a single time during Obama's presidency that he acted immediately on anything he heard from any media outlet. Say what you will about him, he was a "think first, act second" POTUS.

...I miss those days.
Last edited by hepcat on Thu Mar 16, 2017 3:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by gilraen »

Chrisoc13 wrote:
hepcat wrote:While I somewhat agree with you, I only have to head over to Brietbarts for a few minutes to realize CNN could be much worse.
Haha yeah... I don't touch that cesspool. I would never even venture as far as fox news. I don't trust them in the slightest. I don't need news to confirm my bias, I need news to give me straight up info and I'll make up my mind.

Mainstream media could be worse, but it could be better, and I feel like they are drifting to worse not better.
You have to separate news from opinions, though. It doesn't matter if it's a CNN anchor or a Fox News anchor delivering headlines. The difference comes when they (or their invited panel) starts *discussing* the headlines. Cable news networks have to fill 24 hours in a day with...something. You can watch a speech by Trump or someone talking in a congressional hearing or any other actual clip of someone talking, and you can have your own opinion about what was said (as long as the network isn't slicing up the clip so that the words are out of context...but in that respect, I'll trust CNN much more than I'll trust Fox News).
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Isgrimnur »

There's always the Völkischer Beobachter.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Holman »

Despite their inability to produce any evidence of Obama wiretapping Trump, the administration is doubling down and suggesting that Obama had help from British intelligence agencies.

Sean Spicer says Trump means it. Unless he doesn't? Maybe? Who knows?

Are we to take it literally or not when the POTUS accuses our closest and most important ally of espionage and betrayal?

--

Looking at the big picture, what's incredible is that every one of Trump's crises since taking office has been self-inflicted. The world has been relatively quiet this winter, but how long can that last? What's going to happen when Trump has to deal with a global event that isn't just him or one of his cronies shooting himself in the foot or the nuts?
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by LordMortis »

Holman wrote:Are we to take it literally or not when the POTUS accuses our closest and most important ally of espionage and betrayal?

Trump accused Putin of espionage and betrayal? I'll believe it when I see it.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Holman »

I'm still trying to get my head around this.

Coordination between U.S. and U.K. spy agencies has been crucial to the defense of the Free World since Hitler, and Trump is willing to throw that all in the trash.

Why? Because some Limbaugh-wannabes puked up yet another Obama conspiracy myth?

That's not enough to explain it.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by RunningMn9 »

Paingod wrote:Hint: He's taking it, donating it, and getting a tax break for it - costing the taxpayers more than if he had just taken the money.
That seems to be a bad way of looking at it.

If I get paid $100,000 and I donate it all to charity, it's true that I get a tax deduction. But the reality is that I'm just not paying taxes on that $100,000 (assuming that my deductions aren't capped which is likely the case for Trump).

So it seems disingenuous to suggest that it is costing the taxpayer even more because it won't get the tax back.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by $iljanus »

Holman wrote:Despite their inability to produce any evidence of Obama wiretapping Trump, the administration is doubling down and suggesting that Obama had help from British intelligence agencies.

Sean Spicer says Trump means it. Unless he doesn't? Maybe? Who knows?

Are we to take it literally or not when the POTUS accuses our closest and most important ally of espionage and betrayal?

--

Looking at the big picture, what's incredible is that every one of Trump's crises since taking office has been self-inflicted. The world has been relatively quiet this winter, but how long can that last? What's going to happen when Trump has to deal with a global event that isn't just him or one of his cronies shooting himself in the foot or the nuts?
Actually I can imagine MI 6 spying on Trump pre election because their powers that be thought he was batshit crazy but had a chance at the presidency. Do I think Obama was in cahoots with them if such an operation was being carried out? Uh, no. Do I think that the Brits did such a thing? No.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Zarathud »

RunningMn9 wrote:If I get paid $100,000 and I donate it all to charity, it's true that I get a tax deduction. But the reality is that I'm just not paying taxes on that $100,000 (assuming that my deductions aren't capped which is likely the case for Trump).

So it seems disingenuous to suggest that it is costing the taxpayer even more because it won't get the tax back.
Trump has shown that his idea of "charity" is buying paintings of himself to put in his buildings. Or paying for his son's Boy Scout fee.

Or he could be contributing to some white nationalist conservative group, with no benefit to the taxpayer.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Chaz »

RunningMn9 wrote:
Paingod wrote:Hint: He's taking it, donating it, and getting a tax break for it - costing the taxpayers more than if he had just taken the money.
That seems to be a bad way of looking at it.

If I get paid $100,000 and I donate it all to charity, it's true that I get a tax deduction. But the reality is that I'm just not paying taxes on that $100,000 (assuming that my deductions aren't capped which is likely the case for Trump).

So it seems disingenuous to suggest that it is costing the taxpayer even more because it won't get the tax back.
I think the difference Paingod's getting at is that in this case, your $100k is coming from taxpayers either way. Now, we don't know where, or even if, Trump's actually planning to "donate" his $400k salary to, and he's said it might get donated to the Treasury. But for the purposes of worst-case-scenario-ing, let's assume he's donating it to an NGO. The $400k comes out of the funds collected via taxes and goes to Trump. Trump then donates it to Super Awesome Charity That Does Something Aside From Buying Trump Portraits, and then writes the donation off on his taxes, lowering his tax burden by some amount. He's now cost the taxpayers the $400k+whatever amount he reduced his tax burden by. Compared with him keeping it, in which case he costs the taxpayers the $400k, and then they get some portion of that back in the form of taxes.

Assuming he doesn't find some other loophole that he's morally required to exploit as much as possible to pay less tax on it.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

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gilraen wrote:
Chrisoc13 wrote:
hepcat wrote:While I somewhat agree with you, I only have to head over to Brietbarts for a few minutes to realize CNN could be much worse.
Haha yeah... I don't touch that cesspool. I would never even venture as far as fox news. I don't trust them in the slightest. I don't need news to confirm my bias, I need news to give me straight up info and I'll make up my mind.

Mainstream media could be worse, but it could be better, and I feel like they are drifting to worse not better.
You have to separate news from opinions
Right... But that's exactly what I'm saying. That's why I ignore CNN now, opinion bleeds everywhere there. And I don't even usually disagree with it, I just get very annoyed seeing it.

You don't have to explain to me how news networks work. I'm not some uneducated person uninitiated to our media. Responses like this are... Interesting? To say the least. It's a condescending tone implying I can't separate news from opinion. You can see that right?

It should be noted that bias can be part of news and not just opinion pieces. An example is this very situation. At one point trump replacing these positions (a very normal thing to do) had around 4 or 5 headlines at major sites. CNN had around half their page dedicated to it for several days! That's bias, and not in the form of opinion pieces. It hurts their credibility when they look to be out for blood enough to report on a non-story to the point of trumping it up to be something it isn't. But anti trump gets ratings so... Hey whatever it takes, whether that is 2 worthless pages of a 1040... Or huge somewhat inflammatory headlines about a normal practice. It undermines their credibility on things that matter, like for instance restriction of the free press, or an essentially religion based test for banning entry into the country. Real issues. That moderate Americans will wave off more and more as the media looks to just be out for blood and can't fully be trusted to be reporting what is important with the proper emphasis. They have a responsibility as well. And sadly at this point they should be the adults in the room since our president clearly won't be.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by RunningMn9 »

Chaz wrote:then writes the donation off on his taxes, lowering his tax burden by some amount.
He lowers his tax burden by the amount that he would have had to pay on that $400k. In other words, like for every other citizen (including me), if you donate your income to charity, we don't treat it as your income anymore. Because you donated it to charity.

The idea that someone should pay income tax on income they are giving to charity is contrary to how we operate.

I mean, I dislike Trump as much as the next one, but some of these claims are getting to be a bit much. OF COURSE he's going to write off (to the extent that he is able, which may not be much if he has other sources of income still) income that he's giving away to charity. I don't consider that "costing the tax payer money" any more than it costs the taxpayer money when I deduct my own charitable contributions.

And the taxpayer pays my salary too, so it's effectively the exact same situation.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by RunningMn9 »

Chrisoc13 wrote:That's why I ignore CNN now
In the interest of fairness, that's why I ignore CNN now too.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by YellowKing »

The so-called fake news liberal mainstream media is also the same institution that gave Trump virtually limitless free press in his run to the nomination and beyond. If they were truly biased, wouldn't they have been better off suppressing his coverage and extolling the virtues of Hillary Clinton? Instead, they devoted DAYS to every "email bombshell" story that came out about her.

I'm fine criticizing the media in general, but you can't have it both ways. You can't say they're biased when they say something you don't agree with, and magically unbiased when they say something you do agree with. We've seen this time and time again with Trump. He blasts the news when they're covering him negatively, but will take direct quotes from those same outlets when they're covering job growth or something else that puts him in a positive light.

Absorbing news should be the same as reading product reviews or anything else - never trust just one source. But if multiple sources are saying the same thing, chances are pretty high that it's valid.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by RunningMn9 »

My issue with CNN is much more about sensationalism than bias.
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And every other race, creed, colour, tint or hue
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by LordMortis »

Zarathud wrote:Or he could be contributing to some white nationalist conservative group, with no benefit to the taxpayer.
While I doubt that, I don't doubt for a second that his charities are charities that some are the card that pays him back.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by gilraen »

Chrisoc13 wrote: You don't have to explain to me how news networks work. I'm not some uneducated person uninitiated to our media. Responses like this are... Interesting? To say the least. It's a condescending tone implying I can't separate news from opinion. You can see that right?
That was absolutely not what I was saying, I was discussing why you choose to cut out CNN as a news source - which is totally your prerogative, I just thought it was curious. I have on occasion turned on Fox News - which I generally can't stand for more than 5 seconds - when there was some major event happening and I just wanted to hear *what was happening*, and other networks were on a commercial break (and it was just an anchor, no opinions, no discussions, just actions happening). Anyway, it's interesting that you see every response now as "condescending" (and no, I won't be replying to any more of your posts, I'm not interested in engaging your paranoia).
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

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Formal apology to Britain
The US has made a formal apology to Britain after the White House accused GCHQ of helping Barack Obama spy on Donald Trump in the White House.

Sean Spicer, Mr Trump's press secretary, repeated a claim on Thursday evening – initially made by an analyst on Fox News - that GCHQ was used by Mr Obama to spy on Trump Tower in the lead-up to last November's election.

The comments prompted a furious response from GCHQ, which in a break from normal practice issued a public statement: "Recent allegations made by media commentator Judge Andrew Napolitano about GCHQ being asked to conduct 'wiretapping' against the then president-elect are nonsense. They are utterly ridiculous and should be ignored."

Intelligence sources told The Telegraph that both Mr Spicer and General McMaster, the US National Security Adviser, have apologised over the claims. "The apology came direct from them," a source said.

General McMaster contacted Sir Mark Lyall Grant, the Prime Minister's National Security adviser, to apologise for the comments. Mr Spicer conveyed his apology through Sir Kim Darroch, Britain's US ambassador.
...
Mrs May's official spokesman said the White House has assured the Government that allegations that British intelligence services spied on Donald Trump will not be repeated.

The Government "made clear" to the US that the "ridiculous" claims should be ignored and received assurances in return that they will not be repeated, showing that the administration does not give them any credence, Mrs May's spokesman said.
...
The British official told Reuters that under British law, GCHQ "can only gather intelligence for national security purposes" and noted that a US election "clearly doesn't meet that criteria".
I think that has to be one of the most understated burns I have ever seen.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Smoove_B »

I feel like there needs to be a Trump foreign policy thread. Between the British news this morning and the implication that we're apparently willing to go to war with North Korea, it's apparently a great weekend to head back to Florida.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Paingod »

The British official told Reuters that under British law, GCHQ "can only gather intelligence for national security purposes" and noted that a US election "clearly doesn't meet that criteria".
In all fairness, having the leader of you biggest ally in bed with leaders of a dangerously corrupt regime you openly disapprove of is a pretty big national security hazard.
Black Lives Matter

2021-01-20: The first good night's sleep I had in 4 years.
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hepcat
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by hepcat »

Month 3 and the idiot's unchecked ego is already alienating our closest allies. Just freakin' drop it, you POS POTUS. :x
Covfefe!
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Isgrimnur
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Isgrimnur »

Smoove_B wrote:I feel like there needs to be a Trump foreign policy thread. Between the British news this morning and the implication that we're apparently willing to go to war with North Korea, it's apparently a great weekend to head back to Florida.
Done.
It's almost as if people are the problem.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by Smoove_B »

Thanks. :D

This thread is a veritable hydra of topics. Anything we can do to keep them semi-organized is likely helpful.
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Re: The Trump Presidency Thread

Post by msteelers »

Chrisoc13 wrote:Right... But that's exactly what I'm saying.
No. This all started because you claimed CNN and the media are biased against Trump, and then pointed to an opinion piece to back up your claim.
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