Russia influences election

NickAragua · Post by **NickAragua** » Thu May 11, 2017 11:56 am

Depends on if you want direct control or just ineffectiveness.

I agree that Putin probably just wants ineffectiveness currently. We haven't quite gotten to "Red Dawn" or "Freedom Fighters" yet.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Thu May 11, 2017 2:03 pm

Per the Twitter, the FBI is currently executing search warrants for a GOP fundraising group in Annapolis.

Sepiche · Post by **Sepiche** » Thu May 11, 2017 9:44 pm

Ralph-Wiggum wrote:Per the Twitter, the FBI is currently executing search warrants for a GOP fundraising group in Annapolis.

I'd love for it to be more, but so far I'm reading this has more to do with them fleecing Republican donors and candidates than anything else.

Pyperkub · Post by **Pyperkub** » Fri May 12, 2017 12:50 am

Sepiche wrote:
Ralph-Wiggum wrote:Per the Twitter, the FBI is currently executing search warrants for a GOP fundraising group in Annapolis.
I'd love for it to be more, but so far I'm reading this has more to do with them fleecing Republican donors and candidates than anything else.

Leverage to flip for other testimony works. ..

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Fri May 12, 2017 5:24 am

Senate Judiciary Committee Chairman Chuck Grassley (R-IA) on Thursday vouched for President Trump’s assertion in a letter to former FBI Director James Comey that he was not under investigation by the FBI.
Grassley told committee members at an executive meeting that he and Ranking Member Dianne Feinstein (D-CA) had met with Comey last week, and that he had briefed them on who the targets of the various investigations are.

“Senator Feinstein and I heard nothing that contradicted the President’s statement,” he said.

Feinstein then said after Grassley’s statement, “I very much appreciate what you’ve said and it’s very accurate, and we were briefed.”

http://www.breitbart.com/big-government ... stigation/

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Fri May 12, 2017 7:11 am

Well, at least you're now agreeing that Trump committed a crime in demanding to know if he was under investigation while speaking with Comey.

Baby steps.

Skinypupy · Post by **Skinypupy** » Fri May 12, 2017 8:08 am

Hey, it's not animenews (although that may be more credible than Breitbart).

Baby steps.

Zarathud · Post by **Zarathud** » Fri May 12, 2017 8:29 am

Remember back when Rip was outraged at who the President just invited to the White House? Now we have him defending who the President appointed to the White House on the grounds that there's no investigation specifically targeting the President.

I think Jared is the target. That's who Trump always uses as his bagman. The other option is Don Jr.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Fri May 12, 2017 8:34 am

Rip has been on a campaign of hypocrisy for a while now. You can go back and find examples of outrage over almost everything he either praises Trump for, or for which he gives him a pass.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Fri May 12, 2017 9:28 am

A former FBI agent explains to the Senate why Russia's meddling worked this time: https://mobile.twitter.com/NetworkJunky ... 80/video/1

Scraper · Post by **Scraper** » Fri May 12, 2017 10:38 am

Ralph-Wiggum wrote:A former FBI agent explains to the Senate why Russia's meddling worked this time: https://mobile.twitter.com/NetworkJunky ... 80/video/1

Fucking scary. How can you not be horrified by that?

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Fri May 12, 2017 10:42 am

Well this clears things up...

I especially like the "with few exceptions" part. And, of course, loans don't count as income...

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Fri May 12, 2017 10:58 am

If there are exceptions, then it's not "no"

But I'm sure those tax returns will be released publicly any time now so we don't have to take Trump's lawyer's word for it.....

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Tue May 16, 2017 3:32 pm

Lest we forget about Manafort:

Former Trump campaign manager Paul Manafort took out a $3.5 million mortgage through a shell company just after leaving the campaign, but the mortgage document that explains how he would pay it back was never filed — and Manafort's company never paid $36,000 in taxes that would be due on the loan.

In addition, despite telling NBC News previously that all his real estate transactions are transparent and include his name and signature, Manafort's name and signature do not appear on any of the loan documents that are publicly available. A Manafort spokesperson said the $3.5 million loan was repaid in December, but also said paperwork showing the repayment was not filed until he was asked about the loan by NBC News.

Somebody call Mike Tyson because it's a mystery!

Combustible Lemur · Post by **Combustible Lemur** » Tue May 16, 2017 9:51 pm

Huh, I guess Chaffetz is RINO after all.

The newest quote is in an updated version of this link. Basically Chaffetz has demanded all the memos officially and even has a deadline.
Edit: Repeated on NPR
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Freyland · Post by **Freyland** » Tue May 16, 2017 10:33 pm

Combustible Lemur wrote:Huh, I guess Chaffetz is RINO after all.

Maybe.... Or maybe it would favor the GOP cause to clear out all of Comey's traps before Trump stumbles into them, or the media is made aware of them. Damage control is easier if you have the initiative, even more so if you can suppress the need for damage control in the first place.

Combustible Lemur · Post by **Combustible Lemur** » Tue May 16, 2017 10:55 pm

Freyland wrote:
Combustible Lemur wrote:Huh, I guess Chaffetz is RINO after all.
Maybe.... Or maybe it would favor the GOP cause to clear out all of Comey's traps before Trump stumbles into them, or the media is made aware of them. Damage control is easier if you have the initiative, even more so if you can suppress the need for damage control in the first place.

I thought that but at this point the blowback from the FBI for tampering with evidence (that surely they're backing up quadruplefold) would have to give any politician pause.

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em2nought · Post by **em2nought** » Wed May 17, 2017 12:27 am

I'm kinda sad so many here don't actually see my posts. Naw, I don't care.

raydude · Post by **raydude** » Wed May 17, 2017 6:53 am

em2nought wrote:I'm kinda sad so many here don't actually see my posts. Naw, I don't care.

You should go back to posting clickbait articles whose content has nothing to do with the headline. Those were funnier.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Wed May 17, 2017 7:24 am

Combustible Lemur wrote:
Freyland wrote:
Combustible Lemur wrote:Huh, I guess Chaffetz is RINO after all.
Maybe.... Or maybe it would favor the GOP cause to clear out all of Comey's traps before Trump stumbles into them, or the media is made aware of them. Damage control is easier if you have the initiative, even more so if you can suppress the need for damage control in the first place.
I thought that but at this point the blowback from the FBI for tampering with evidence (that surely they're backing up quadruplefold) would have to give any politician pause.

Chaffetz had a long talk with the FBI after it was confirmed that he mishandled intel. As a result, he decided to leave the House before his term is up (and despite being treated as a potential future Speaker) and has now changed his tune here.

One suspects he knows this won't end well for Trump and his defenders.

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Wed May 17, 2017 8:25 am

Putin must be ROFL right now.

Hey man, you want to know what classified info Trump gave us? Here's the transcript!

Max Peck · Post by **Max Peck** » Wed May 17, 2017 9:03 am

Paingod wrote:Putin must be ROFL right now.
Hey man, you want to know what classified info Trump gave us? Here's the transcript!

With luck, it would be an opportunity for Western intelligence agencies to observe some collusion between Russia and Kremlin-West as they coordinate on a common story.

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Wed May 17, 2017 10:20 am

Paingod wrote:Putin must be ROFL right now.

Hey man, you want to know what classified info Trump gave us? Here's the transcript!

I'm not a fan of Rubio but this is very funny.

"I wouldn't put much credibility into whatever Putin's notes are," Rubio said on Fox News. "And if it comes in an email, I wouldn't click on the attachment."

Kurth · Post by **Kurth** » Wed May 17, 2017 10:21 am

Max Peck wrote:
Paingod wrote:Putin must be ROFL right now.
Hey man, you want to know what classified info Trump gave us? Here's the transcript!
With luck, it would be an opportunity for Western intelligence agencies to observe some collusion between Russia and Kremlin-West as they coordinate on a common story.

Does Putin actually think this is helping Trump?

At the press conference in Sochi, Putin made light of the allegations:
"I think we need to come up with some sort of punishment for him, because he didn't share this secret information, not with us, not with the special services. This is really not nice of him," Putin joked, laughing with Lavrov, who was also at the conference.

Or does he just not care?

But he then took a more serious tone, accusing Americans of "rocking the internal political situation in the US under anti-Russian slogans."
"They either don't understand that they are harming their country -- which makes them just dumb -- or they understand, which makes them dangerous and dirty."

Them's fighting words.

Remus West · Post by **Remus West** » Wed May 17, 2017 10:28 am

Why do you imagine that Putin actually wants to help Trump? Putin is, among a list of horrible things, extremely smart. He likely recognizes that Trump is uncontrollable long term so is simply benefiting from the chaos Trump causes. Adding fuel to the fire caused by Trump won't help Trump but it will certainly help Russia as it just makes the US look that much worse on an international level. His comments highlight the fact that Russian media were allowed in and American media were not. Doesn't exactly make our government look responsible.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Wed May 17, 2017 10:40 am

Yeah this is pro-level manipulation of the propaganda value of Trump. He is highlighting how unsuitable he is. How out of control he is. This event was amazing. They got the pictures of the visit the day after he fired Comey. He hit the full fucking moron lotto. And then Trump blabs and gives Putin an opening to drive a wedge between us and a major ally. All while also getting in some jingoism for the home crowd. Putin probably says a prayer for Trump every night. Trump is the gift that keeps giving.

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Wed May 17, 2017 10:43 am

Remus West wrote:Why do you imagine that Putin actually wants to help Trump? Putin is, among a list of horrible things, extremely smart. He likely recognizes that Trump is uncontrollable long term so is simply benefiting from the chaos Trump causes.

"Chaotic" may have been the Russian assessment all along since they've checked him out and probably had a good profile on him before helping to elect him. The more we see and the longer this goes on, the more I believe Putin knew he was simply dropping a rabid badger into the core of our political system and his whole end-game was just to let that play out and leverage the chaos it caused for his own benefit, political or otherwise. I mean, c'mon - the world can't even keep up with the scandals Trump is producing on a daily basis. Whatever Putin wants to do will slide right under the radar. Trump and the GOP gave Putin a (hopefully) once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. How could he not exploit that?

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Wed May 17, 2017 11:05 am

Yep. Just think about it from the flip side. What would you rather have? An organized Russia smoothly pushing its agenda in the Middle East and around the world, or a disorganized Russia so plagued with scandal that they can't even organize a lunch order, much less global policy? I bet Putin sleeps like a baby at night.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Wed May 17, 2017 11:07 am

Helping Trump get elected was a win-win. If he comes close and falls short, that tarnishes American standing and hurts Clinton's presidency (especially since Trump would be crying voter fraud and possibly mounting recounts). If he wins, either Putin gets a close ally in the White House, or he gets a chaotic President undermining U.S. interests. Neither is bad.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Wed May 17, 2017 12:16 pm

El Guapo wrote:Helping Trump get elected was a win-win. If he comes close and falls short, that tarnishes American standing and hurts Clinton's presidency (especially since Trump would be crying voter fraud and possibly mounting recounts). If he wins, either Putin gets a close ally in the White House, or he gets a chaotic President undermining U.S. interests. Neither is bad.

I posted an analysis a while ago that pointed out that the one thing that would worry Putin is if Trump were impeached and there were an anti-Russia backlash because of their interference.

Max Peck · Post by **Max Peck** » Wed May 17, 2017 12:22 pm

Defiant wrote:
El Guapo wrote:Helping Trump get elected was a win-win. If he comes close and falls short, that tarnishes American standing and hurts Clinton's presidency (especially since Trump would be crying voter fraud and possibly mounting recounts). If he wins, either Putin gets a close ally in the White House, or he gets a chaotic President undermining U.S. interests. Neither is bad.
I posted an analysis a while ago that pointed out that the one thing that would worry Putin is if Trump were impeached and there were an anti-Russia backlash because of their interference.

But the backlash would likely be no worse than if Clinton had won the election, so the downside is pretty much already baked into the original decision to follow this course of action. And in the meantime, there's already been a tremendous amount of disruption to the Western geopolitical order, as well as American domestic politics.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed May 17, 2017 12:26 pm

Max Peck wrote:
Defiant wrote:
El Guapo wrote:Helping Trump get elected was a win-win. If he comes close and falls short, that tarnishes American standing and hurts Clinton's presidency (especially since Trump would be crying voter fraud and possibly mounting recounts). If he wins, either Putin gets a close ally in the White House, or he gets a chaotic President undermining U.S. interests. Neither is bad.
I posted an analysis a while ago that pointed out that the one thing that would worry Putin is if Trump were impeached and there were an anti-Russia backlash because of their interference.
But the backlash would likely be no worse than if Clinton had won the election, so the downside is pretty much already baked into the original decision to follow this course of action. And in the meantime, there's already been a tremendous amount of disruption to the Western geopolitical order, as well as American domestic politics.

Yeah, if this was Putin, the calculated upside seems to already be evident, whereas what does he lose, if criminally exposed, short of going to war?

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Wed May 17, 2017 12:40 pm

This whole thing is particularly frustrating for me since one of the sugar coatings on the bitter "Voting Hillary" pill I had to swallow was the fact that Putin DESPISED her. I'm not saying a Clinton presidency would have been all sunshine and roses, but I can guaran-dam-tee you the Russians wouldn't be getting invited into the Oval Office for intelligence briefings.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Wed May 17, 2017 3:07 pm

It wasn't--at least in 2016--only about hoping to destabilize American democracy.

If Trump had been merely gullible rather than erratic and incompetent, Putin stood to gain a lot from the partnership: an end to sanctions, normalization of Russian Crimea with possible territory in Ukraine, and the status as at least a pseudo-ally. Plus, of course, all the American oil and minerals money he could skim from sweetheart deals within his sphere of influence.

We're probably watching Putin reassess his options in real time as Trump loses his grip on the office. It will be interesting (in a terrifying and infuriating sort of way) to see how he tries to leverage the chaos as the potential benefits slip away.

Paingod · Post by **Paingod** » Wed May 17, 2017 3:12 pm

YellowKing wrote:This whole thing is particularly frustrating for me since one of the sugar coatings on the bitter "Voting Hillary" pill I had to swallow was the fact that Putin DESPISED her. I'm not saying a Clinton presidency would have been all sunshine and roses, but I can guaran-dam-tee you the Russians wouldn't be getting invited into the Oval Office for intelligence briefings.

She also wouldn't have accomplished anything yet, good or bad - Republican'ts would have seen to that. Government agencies wouldn't be trying to scrub scientific knowledge from their websites and we'd still be waiting on a confirmation for the Supreme Court. Bill would have done a bang-up job of planning the Easter Egg hunt, even submitting orders ahead of time.

It would be an exceptionally boring Presidency.

Max Peck · Post by **Max Peck** » Wed May 17, 2017 4:23 pm

Paingod wrote:
YellowKing wrote:This whole thing is particularly frustrating for me since one of the sugar coatings on the bitter "Voting Hillary" pill I had to swallow was the fact that Putin DESPISED her. I'm not saying a Clinton presidency would have been all sunshine and roses, but I can guaran-dam-tee you the Russians wouldn't be getting invited into the Oval Office for intelligence briefings.
She also wouldn't have accomplished anything yet, good or bad - Republican'ts would have seen to that. Government agencies wouldn't be trying to scrub scientific knowledge from their websites and we'd still be waiting on a confirmation for the Supreme Court. Bill would have done a bang-up job of planning the Easter Egg hunt, even submitting orders ahead of time.

It would be an exceptionally boring Presidency.

Fortunately, though, her emails! And so we have constant excitement...

Hamlet3145 · Post by **Hamlet3145** » Wed May 17, 2017 6:46 pm

Former FBI director Robert Mueller appointed special counsel to oversee Russia probe

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Thu May 18, 2017 6:28 am

Reuters: Trump campaign had at least 18 undisclosed contacts with Russians.

Michael Flynn and other advisers to Donald Trump’s campaign were in contact with Russian officials and others with Kremlin ties in at least 18 calls and emails during the last seven months of the 2016 presidential race, current and former U.S. officials familiar with the exchanges told Reuters.

The previously undisclosed interactions form part of the record now being reviewed by FBI and congressional investigators probing Russian interference in the U.S. presidential election and contacts between Trump’s campaign and Russia.

Six of the previously undisclosed contacts described to Reuters were phone calls between Sergei Kislyak, Russia's ambassador to the United States, and Trump advisers, including Flynn, Trump’s first national security adviser, three current and former officials said.

noxiousdog · Post by **noxiousdog** » Fri May 19, 2017 4:00 pm

FWIW, I got this response from Senator John Cornyn's office:
(excerpt)
"Most recently, several agencies of the U.S. Intelligence Community jointly assessed that the Russian government orchestrated the hacking of the Democratic National Committee and other organizations of the Democratic Party in the year prior to the 2016 presidential election, releasing thousands of stolen emails. I support the bipartisan congressional probe of alleged Russian interference in the 2016 presidential election, including investigating former national security adviser Michael Flynn’s interactions with the Russian ambassador. As a member of the Senate Select Committee on Intelligence, I am pleased this committee is conducting a robust, independent review of Russian interference in the election and will keep your comments in mind as the inquiry moves forward. Ensuring U.S. elections remain transparent, fair, and free of foreign influence is essential for the future of our democracy. Russian actions that seek to undermine American public confidence in the electoral process must have consequences. The United States must also increase its defensive cybersecurity capabilities to protect against states and individuals who wish to do us harm, such as stealing intellectual property from U.S. businesses and compromising our national security."

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Fri May 19, 2017 4:07 pm

Holman wrote:Reuters: Trump campaign had at least 18 undisclosed contacts with Russians.

Michael Flynn and other advisers to Donald Trump’s campaign were in contact with Russian officials and others with Kremlin ties in at least 18 calls and emails during the last seven months of the 2016 presidential race, current and former U.S. officials familiar with the exchanges told Reuters.

The previously undisclosed interactions form part of the record now being reviewed by FBI and congressional investigators probing Russian interference in the U.S. presidential election and contacts between Trump’s campaign and Russia.

Six of the previously undisclosed contacts described to Reuters were phone calls between Sergei Kislyak, Russia's ambassador to the United States, and Trump advisers, including Flynn, Trump’s first national security adviser, three current and former officials said.

I am the absolute last person to ever defend the mangerine, but I'm curious as to whether or not they had contact with any other foreign entities to that extent.