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The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by AWS260 » Fri May 03, 2019 9:11 am


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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Sun May 26, 2019 6:42 am

Fantastic video essay explaining how Fox has broken the news cycle - my only gripe is he doesn't explicitly says the oped side of Fox is the culprit.


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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by Kraken » Sun May 26, 2019 10:27 am

I just watched Divide and Conquer, the documentary about Roger Ailes, a couple of days ago. It's informative in its history, if its psychoanalysis skates on thin ice.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by Holman » Mon Jun 03, 2019 1:45 pm





Nothing to see here. Just the POTUS calling for a boycott of the parent company of a news organization he hates.
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by Isgrimnur » Mon Jun 03, 2019 1:53 pm

They're only #12 on the list of largest public companies worldwide. I'm sure they'll get right on that.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by ImLawBoy » Mon Jun 03, 2019 2:13 pm

I'm going to get an "Enemy of the People" shirt printed up!
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by hepcat » Mon Jun 03, 2019 2:17 pm

Well which is it, Mangerine? Is CNN the biggest source of news in the U.K., or are they dying in the ratings? It can't be both, you orange piece of shit.
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by LawBeefaroni » Mon Jun 03, 2019 2:24 pm

He seriously has the cognitive capacity of a typical 3-year-old. With all apologies to typical 3-year-olds.


I will say that all CNN is more entertainment than journalism but it's not 100% entertainment yet.
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by Holman » Mon Jun 03, 2019 5:41 pm

ImLawBoy wrote:
Mon Jun 03, 2019 2:13 pm
I'm going to get an "Enemy of the People" shirt printed up!
My dad was Long Lines. I have a Bell System hardhat to wear on the barricades.
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by LordMortis » Mon Jun 03, 2019 5:54 pm

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stoping
Stoping is the process of extracting the desired ore or other mineral from an underground mine, leaving behind an open space known as a stope.[1] Stoping is used when the country rock is sufficiently strong not to collapse into the stope, although in most cases artificial support is also provided.
I don't follow.

Also, let me get this straight. Trump wants the world to stope watching CNN because watching CNN isn't MAGA. I'm sure most of Europe gives two shits about you and your "If I make it public, it's not classified" approach to international intel and "If I don't like it's not longer an agreement" approach to... agreements... oh, and those little tarifs you want to declare as US interests every couple of weeks.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by ImLawBoy » Tue Jun 04, 2019 2:27 pm

FWIW, AT&T stock is currently higher than when Trump suggested his boycott.
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by Pyperkub » Tue Jun 04, 2019 7:13 pm

An interesting idea:
The IRS is complicated. So is running a 148-year-old newspaper in 2019.

Three weeks and one New York Times profile after announcing its shift to staffers and readers, Utah’s Salt Lake Tribune officially submitted its bid to the IRS to become a nonprofit May 30. The Tribune joins a small handful of newspapers in North America relying on nonprofit status (mostly by being owned by a nonprofit rather than being a nonprofit themselves), but it’s making a new case to the IRS.

“This ability to give to seek and share information that’s difficult for residents to do on their own is a fundamental purpose of journalism and it is fundamental of a 501(c)(3),
There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Tue Jun 04, 2019 7:57 pm

To be honest the story isnt horrible but this sentence really makes it look like the NYT is kissing ass.


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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Sun Jun 09, 2019 3:30 pm


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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by Kraken » Sun Jun 09, 2019 3:55 pm

Forbes and The Hill are right-wing? The Hill runs opinions across the spectrum. I'd call Forbes center-right.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by Holman » Sun Jun 09, 2019 4:54 pm

Kraken wrote:
Sun Jun 09, 2019 3:55 pm
Forbes and The Hill are right-wing? The Hill runs opinions across the spectrum. I'd call Forbes center-right.
I recently read mention that Forbes as it now exists online is a pale shadow of the old business magazine. Apparently there's no real editorial intelligence there.
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Tue Jun 25, 2019 1:46 pm


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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Mon Aug 05, 2019 12:00 pm





What The Fuck, Indeed.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Tue Aug 06, 2019 2:48 am


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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by msteelers » Tue Aug 06, 2019 4:23 am


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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by LordMortis » Tue Aug 06, 2019 8:54 am

Honestly I like the first headline better. If there is a war on fake news then why not have it give us the president we need instead of the president them want.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by msteelers » Wed Aug 07, 2019 6:54 am

malchior wrote:
Tue Aug 06, 2019 2:48 am
An explanation/apology.
We needed to deliver a nuanced message in a very small space under tight deadlines, and unfortunately, our first attempt at that did not hit it right.

When a group of top editors received an email with the first edition of the front page last night, we saw the headline, realized that it was not a good one and decided to change it. It’s not uncommon for our masthead editors to adjust headlines as we go.

As this conversation was happening among Times editors, readers began discussing the initial headline on Twitter. They rightly pointed out that the initial headline didn’t reflect the story accurately.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Wed Aug 07, 2019 8:14 am

NY Times wrote:We needed to deliver a nuanced message in a very small space under tight deadlines, and unfortunately, our first attempt at that did not hit it right.
I don't think this is going to cut it. I have to think they'll be lambasted even further now. This technical explanation is trying to blaming the process while their judgement is what is in question. The process exposed that weakness. Just weeks ago they also backtracked by admitting they underplayed the latest Trump rape allegations.

This is a paper that looks like it might have an editorial preference to be far too risk adverse. Just another systemic failure while everything is on the line. To put that in context, the Trump damage control board rolled him out to read a teleprompter and the Times -- to not make it seem like only the Times got it wrong I'll also add Norah O'Donnell--fell for it hook, line, and sinker. We need them to be better than this.

Anyway, to me this apology sounds like the when they 'apologized' for their election coverage. (Then said it wasn't an apology). And like then...they don't sound like they mean it and more importantly haven't said how they'll fix it.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Wed Aug 07, 2019 12:05 pm

Note: This is publicly available information. Is it not the best use of this information - perhaps. Is it inherently dangerous? I guess that must be because antifa is around every corner.


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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by noxiousdog » Wed Aug 07, 2019 3:09 pm

It's not that much different that doxxing. It depends on the context, really.
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Wed Aug 07, 2019 3:26 pm

noxiousdog wrote:
Wed Aug 07, 2019 3:09 pm
It's not that much different that doxxing. It depends on the context, really.
You can't dox something that is already public information. Personally I would have left off the retired folks and left it as a list of businesses to boycott. That aside, the larger point is that there is little evidence of violence on the left that could be inflamed here.

Even if you were fair and talked about how the Dayton shooter was 'leftist', it apparently had little to do with the violence as he had at least an anecdotal if not documented history of mental illness with violent urges. There has been no (public) evidence of political motive. That one of the NY Times top Trump reporter thinks that there is some equivalence on the left is what I think most people are wondering about here. It is a bit of evidence of the bothsides mentality that has broken discourse across large swaths of the main news media.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by noxiousdog » Wed Aug 07, 2019 3:43 pm

malchior wrote:
Wed Aug 07, 2019 3:26 pm
noxiousdog wrote:
Wed Aug 07, 2019 3:09 pm
It's not that much different that doxxing. It depends on the context, really.
You can't dox something that is already public information. Personally I would have left off the retired folks and left it as a list of businesses to boycott. That aside, the larger point is that there is little evidence of violence on the left that could be inflamed here.

Even if you were fair and talked about how the Dayton shooter was 'leftist', it apparently had little to do with the violence as he had at least an anecdotal if not documented history of mental illness with violent urges. There has been no (public) evidence of political motive. That one of the NY Times top Trump reporter thinks that there is some equivalence on the left is what I think most people are wondering about here. It is a bit of evidence of the bothsides mentality that has broken discourse across large swaths of the main news media.
Of course you can.

That's the whole point of doxxing. To make it easy for idiots to harass someone. In this case, they didn't add contact information so it's certainly not horrible, but I can understand why it makes people uncomfortable.
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by LawBeefaroni » Wed Aug 07, 2019 3:52 pm

It's abhorrent but it's less doxxing and more aggregating and making vague threats.

Doxxing, as I understand it to be, specifically means promulgating private or not readily available information about an individual.
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Wed Aug 07, 2019 3:53 pm

noxiousdog wrote:
Wed Aug 07, 2019 3:43 pm
malchior wrote:
Wed Aug 07, 2019 3:26 pm
noxiousdog wrote:
Wed Aug 07, 2019 3:09 pm
It's not that much different that doxxing. It depends on the context, really.
You can't dox something that is already public information. Personally I would have left off the retired folks and left it as a list of businesses to boycott. That aside, the larger point is that there is little evidence of violence on the left that could be inflamed here.

Even if you were fair and talked about how the Dayton shooter was 'leftist', it apparently had little to do with the violence as he had at least an anecdotal if not documented history of mental illness with violent urges. There has been no (public) evidence of political motive. That one of the NY Times top Trump reporter thinks that there is some equivalence on the left is what I think most people are wondering about here. It is a bit of evidence of the bothsides mentality that has broken discourse across large swaths of the main news media.
Of course you can.

That's the whole point of doxxing. To make it easy for idiots to harass someone. In this case, they didn't add contact information so it's certainly not horrible, but I can understand why it makes people uncomfortable.
We will have to disagree on this. Your definition is pretty expansive. This was public finance data available on the web. Still that wasn't the point anyway. Even if it was 'doxxing' there isn't really any danger.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by Holman » Sun Aug 18, 2019 9:19 pm

I wish I'd posted earlier. Today is a significant journalistic milestone.

Today is a good day to buy the Sunday New York Times, as it includes sections (including the NYT magazine) devoted to the paper's 1619 Project, a study of the history and lingering effect of slavery in multiple aspects of American culture. It's a very impressive presentation.

Right-wing media outlets are of course treating it like treason.
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by Smoove_B » Sun Aug 18, 2019 9:37 pm

But also,


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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by Kraken » Sun Aug 18, 2019 9:44 pm

We already knew that science is a liberal conspiracy...shouldn't be surprised that history is, too.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:00 pm

This headline is journalistic malpractice. Influential voices in the media are incomprehensibly incompetent in the face of this guy. They literally just megaphone whatever empty bullshit falls out of his 'mouth'.


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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by LordMortis » Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:26 pm

It is convenient that should happen after China stop making Ivanka clothes.

Has the Trump Trust removed all of the Chinese business from their properties?

How is MNC Corp doing? Have they cut all business related to China?

Have the Trumps withdrawn from Damac Properties and their relationship with Dubai (no emolument problems there)

What's Mitch doing? And the millions of dollars he and his cohorts have received from the Chaos? Are they planning on shutting down the Foremost Group?

I wonder how Tim Apple is responding.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by Holman » Fri Aug 23, 2019 7:30 pm

malchior wrote:
Fri Aug 23, 2019 1:00 pm
This headline is journalistic malpractice. Influential voices in the media are incomprehensibly incompetent in the face of this guy. They literally just megaphone whatever empty bullshit falls out of his 'mouth'.

Journalists are used to describing political events in a "first draft of history."

The problem with Trump is that the actual *event* is often less significant than the context of the event and the rhetoric by which it is expressed.

So, sure, today the president pressed companies to do a policy. That's something many presidents have done. But the importance of it today is that Trump did it in the mode of an authoritarian who believes he can dictate private behavior, something *no* legitimate president has done.
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by Kraken » Fri Aug 23, 2019 10:40 pm

If you click through to their story, you'll find accurate, level-headed reporting. So Reuters wrote a neutral headline. It is not American media.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Mon Aug 26, 2019 8:38 am

Kraken wrote:
Fri Aug 23, 2019 10:40 pm
If you click through to their story, you'll find accurate, level-headed reporting. So Reuters wrote a neutral headline. It is not American media.
I'm not arguing the story is the problem. I'm arguing that the headline is the problem. You call it neutral and I call it inadequate. It lacks the crucial context as mentioned above.

Also I'll point out that while the editorial staff for TR is indeed international, the two people on the by-line are Americans and it was published mid-day on the East coast. The headline was the almost certainly the product of the American editorial staff that mostly are housed here in NJ/NY or Washington, DC.

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Tue Aug 27, 2019 6:20 am

Sorta Death Watch material as Bret Stephens really, really shouldn't be a columnist at the NY Times. He has been an intellectual disgrace on race issues and climate change but now he has shown that he is a thin-skinned bully as well.

A tweet calling him a bedbug touches off a Bret Stephens manbaby tantrum.
WaPo wrote:The tweet seemed harmless enough to David Karpf. The associate professor of media and public affairs at George Washington University took a story that bedbugs had infested the New York Times newsroom as an occasion to dig at his least favorite Times writer, the conservative columnist Bret Stephens.

“The bedbugs are a metaphor,” Karpf wrote on Monday. “The bedbugs are Bret Stephens."

The tweet got nine total likes and zero retweets, Karpf said. So the professor was surprised when an email from Stephens himself popped in a few hours later.

Then, he noticed his provost at GWU was copied on the email. And Stephens was furious.

“I’m often amazed about the things supposedly decent people are prepared to say about other people — people they’ve never met — on Twitter. I think you’ve set a new standard,” Stephens wrote. “I would welcome the opportunity for you to come to my home, meet my wife and kids, talk to us for a few minutes, and then call me a ‘bedbug’ to my face. That would take some genuine courage and intellectual integrity on your part.”

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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by LawBeefaroni » Tue Aug 27, 2019 9:04 am

The only thing worse than not being talked about is the Steisand effect.
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Re: The Semi-Official Death Watch of the 4th Estate Thread

Post by malchior » Tue Aug 27, 2019 11:49 am

What a #bretbug! Add coward and liar to his list of quality personality traits. There are PR specialists giving him the old double Picard right now. One thing is sure, he did not convince the world that his carapace is anything but razor thin.

Edit: Watch it to the end for bonus hyperbole - 'totalitarian regimes'. This guy CAN NOT BE REAL.


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