The Trump foreign policy thread

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LordMortis
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by LordMortis »

LawBeefaroni wrote:
It’s impossible to endlessly tolerate this kind of insolence toward our country.
Yes, "insolence".
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I was watching CSPAN last week and they said it can't be proved but they believed Putin to be worth over $150 billion and also that he is taking in excess of $20 Billion a year right off the top of the Russian economy, which is no small percentage. I mentioned here before but they essentially said the Panama Papers should be a much larger focus than it has been (Take that, Zarathud!) and that we've been looking at all of the wrong players and that "The West" need to crack down anonymous ownership both in real estate and the corporate world because that is where Russian Government meets Russian Mafia and is the major way in which Russian influence peddling over "western democracy" is happening.

I'm not smart or knowledgeable enough to back any of this up beyond hearsay. Still, it was interesting enough for me to sit and actually watch CSPAN for over two hours.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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To be fair, if it doesn't work at home, why promote it abroad.
Secretary of State Rex Tillerson has ordered his department to redefine its mission and issue a new statement of purpose to the world. The draft statements under review right now are similar to the old mission statement, except for one thing — any mention of promoting democracy is being eliminated.

According to an internal email that went out Friday, which I obtained, the State Department’s Executive Steering Committee convened a meeting of leaders to draft new statements on the department’s purpose, mission and ambition, as part of the overall reorganization of the State Department and USAID. (The draft statements were being circulated for comment Friday and could change before being finalized.)
  • The State Department’s draft statement on its purpose is: “We promote the security, prosperity and interests of the American people globally.”
  • The State Department’s draft statement on its mission is: “Lead America’s foreign policy through global advocacy, action and assistance to shape a safer, more prosperous world.”
  • The State Department’s draft statement on its ambition is: “The American people thrive in a peaceful and interconnected world that is free, resilient and prosperous.”
Compare that to the State Department Mission Statement that is currently on the books, as laid out in the department’s fiscal year 2016 financial report:
“The Department’s mission is to shape and sustain a peaceful, prosperous, just, and democratic world and foster conditions for stability and progress for the benefit of the American people and people everywhere. This mission is shared with the USAID, ensuring we have a common path forward in partnership as we invest in the shared security and prosperity that will ultimately better prepare us for the challenges of tomorrow.”
Former senior State Department officials from both parties told me that eliminating “just” and “democratic” from the State Department’s list of desired outcomes is neither accidental nor inconsequential.

“The only significant difference is the deletion of justice and democracy,” said Elliott Abrams, who served as deputy national security adviser for global democracy strategy during the George W. Bush administration. “We used to want a just and democratic world, and now apparently we don’t.”
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Trump's State Dept. has no interest in protecting us from Russian cyber attacks. Why? Because, awh gee we don't wanna make em' mad at us, do we?
Secretary of State Rex Tillerson is resisting the pleas of State Department officials to spend nearly $80 million allocated by Congress for fighting terrorist propaganda and Russian disinformation.

It is highly unusual for a Cabinet secretary to turn down money for his department. But more than five months into his tenure, Tillerson has not issued a simple request for the money earmarked for the State Department’s Global Engagement Center, $60 million of which is now parked at the Pentagon. Another $19.8 million sits untouched at the State Department as Tillerson’s aides reject calls from career diplomats and members of Congress to put the money to work against America’s adversaries.
Sources cited another sensitive factor at play: Russia. At one point during the discussions, Tillerson aide R.C. Hammond suggested the money is unwelcome because any extra funding for programs to counter Russian media influence would anger Moscow, according to a former senior State Department official.

"This is an extraordinary example of the dysfunction that is ripping through the State Department," said Brett Bruen, a former U.S. diplomat in contact with State employees involved in the funding fight. "What we're seeing is a small group of people with very thin knowledge making all the decisions in a very centralized and isolated process. It causes unnecessary delays and confusion."
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Everything is fine.


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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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When you're a former CEO that has good business ties with Russia, it doesn't make much sense to go ahead and lead the charge against them when you're going to be a CEO again in short order and will need good business ties with Russia again. This inaction isn't unexpected.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by malchior »

Politico has a good piece about the trade power vacuum that that all the 'winning' has created with trade in Asia. China and the EU are happily stepping into the breach and Donald's base will likely bear a significant portion of the suffering.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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And yet, somehow, magically, it will still be the fault of Democrats and Elites when they feel the pain.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Paingod wrote:And yet, somehow, magically, it will still be the fault of Democrats and Elites when they feel the pain.

Feelers I sat through this weekend suggest his sheeple are blaming a bad Congress just like he told them to. Congress finally start growing a backbone about Russia and that was a step to far for the American Tzar. :cry:
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Apparently the Trump admin would like to privatize the Afghan war.
The White House is actively considering a bold plan to turn over a big chunk of the U.S. war in Afghanistan to private contractors in an effort to turn the tide in a stalemated war, according to the former head of a security firm pushing the project.

Under the proposal, 5,500 private contractors, primarily former Special Operations troops, would advise Afghan combat forces. The plan also includes a 90-plane private air force that would provide air support in the nearly 16-year-old war against Taliban insurgents, Erik Prince, founder of the Blackwater security firm, told USA TODAY.
I wonder if Prince got any help from his sister Betsy Devos over in education, heh.
The plan remains under serious consideration within the White House despite misgivings by Trump's national security adviser, H.R. McMaster, an Army three-star general, and Defense Secretary Jim Mattis. Other White House officials, such as chief strategist Stephen Bannon, appear open to using private contractors.

“At what point do you say a conventional military approach in Afghanistan is not working,” said Prince, a former Navy SEAL. “Maybe we say that at 16 years.”
The U.S. military has 8,400 U.S. troops there to train and guide local forces. They do not have a direct combat role, and presumably would be replaced gradually by the contractors.
Prince said the plan will cost less than $10 billion a year, significantly lower than the more than $40 billion the Pentagon has budgeted this year.
Death at a bargain rate, how can we say no?
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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When I saw "privatize war" in Trump thread the first thing I went to look for was Blackwater. Yep.

so for shits and giggles

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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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What European Diplomats think of Trump.
They also believe Trump’s foreign policy is chiefly driven by an obsession with unravelling Barack Obama’s policies. “It’s his only real position,” one European diplomat said. “He will ask: ‘Did Obama approve this?’ And if the answer is affirmative, he will say: ‘We don’t.’ He won’t even want to listen to the arguments or have a debate. He is obsessed with Obama.”
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Holman wrote:What European Diplomats think of Trump.
They also believe Trump’s foreign policy is chiefly driven by an obsession with unravelling Barack Obama’s policies. “It’s his only real position,” one European diplomat said. “He will ask: ‘Did Obama approve this?’ And if the answer is affirmative, he will say: ‘We don’t.’ He won’t even want to listen to the arguments or have a debate. He is obsessed with Obama.”
Fake news. Just yesterday a Trumpelo told my facebook feed that Trump has already restored America's standing in the world because we aren't apologizing for anything anymore.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Holman wrote:What European Diplomats think of Trump.
They also believe Trump’s foreign policy is chiefly driven by an obsession with unravelling Barack Obama’s policies. “It’s his only real position,” one European diplomat said. “He will ask: ‘Did Obama approve this?’ And if the answer is affirmative, he will say: ‘We don’t.’ He won’t even want to listen to the arguments or have a debate. He is obsessed with Obama.”
He's jealous that everyone thinks Obama's presidency was bigger, better, and more satisfying than his itty-bitty term has been so far.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Defiant »

Is it fucking BOGO at Warmart today?
Trump says he is "not going to rule out a military option" for Venezuela. "Venezuela is not very far away."
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Carpet_pissr »

Someone should, as a joke, insert some fake news into his daily Fox News regimen about the evils of the VERY close Greenland. I mean come on, it's about time those uppity fuckers got a lesson from the wrong end of a cruise missile, amiright? Biggest island in the world, my ass!
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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He should just come out and demand a world wide dick measurement program so he can start claiming that the data shows his is bigger than anyone else and stop talking about using the military all over.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Max Peck »

On the one hand, Venezuela does have a lot of oil for Trump to keep. On the other hand, some of that oil belongs to Putin now, so I don't think Trump will grabbing Maduro by the pumps any time soon.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Max Peck wrote:grabbing Maduro by the pumps
VERY nice.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Max Peck »

Tit for tat continues.
Russia has been ordered to close its San Francisco consulate and two trade missions in response to "unwarranted" Russian action, the US has said.

The consulate, and annexes in New York and Washington, must close by Saturday.

The US state department's move follows Moscow's reduction of US diplomatic staff in Russia last month.

That in turn followed new US sanctions on Russia over Crimea and alleged election interference, which led to the expulsion of 35 Russian diplomats.

President Barack Obama had ordered those expulsions, along with the closure of two compounds, last December.

Although Russian President Vladimir Putin did not respond initially to that move, with Mr Trump set to assume office, he then announced on 31 July a reduction of 755 US diplomatic staff in Russia, in retaliation for the US sanctions.

The US diplomats expelled have until this Friday to leave Russia - a day before the US closures of the Russian consulate and two annexes, which are trade missions, must be completed.

A senior administration official said on Thursday that the consulate and the residence attached to it as well as the two trade missions would close but no Russian staff would be required to leave the country.

Russia will be allowed to maintain the properties, but not use them, the official added.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by GreenGoo »

I know in my 4x games that cessation of diplomatic contact always results in positives for both sides.

We live in a time of ideals, hope and positivity. What a time to be alive.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Rip »

Not like there is any choice at this point.

The most efficient way to shoot down the "administration in cahoots with Putin" rhetoric is to slap them back every chance you get. The relationship is no longer driven by actions and diplomatic agendas, it is driven by political appearances.

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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Fitzy »

I wonder how long until these newly available properties end up in the hands of one of Trump's companies. :think:
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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This is hardly a slap at all. We're expelling no one, so the whole staff can just be reassigned elsewhere.

It's a weak response intended to look like a strong one. It's *definitely* not comparable in scale to the actions for which it pretends to retaliate.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Holman wrote:This is hardly a slap at all. We're expelling no one, so the whole staff can just be reassigned elsewhere.

It's a weak response intended to look like a strong one. It's *definitely* not comparable in scale to the actions for which it pretends to retaliate.
Pretty sure they noted that it was less than an equal response for a reason, which was to avoid a back and forth retaliation.
U.S. officials pointed out that Russia, when it ordered the cut in U.S. diplomats, had argued it was merely bringing the size of the two countries' diplomatic presences into "parity." Both countries now maintain three consulates on each other's territory and ostensibly have similar numbers of diplomats posted, though such numbers are difficult to independently verify.

"The United States hopes that, having moved toward the Russian Federation's desire for parity, we can avoid further retaliatory actions by both sides," Nauert said.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Some positive news for the administration - the UN has extended it's peacekeeping operation in Lebanon, and there were apparently some positive changes after some compromises were reached.

UN extends Lebanon peacekeeping; US, Israel prompt changes
The longtime U.N. peacekeeping operation in Lebanon was extended Wednesday with new directions to conduct more patrols with Lebanese forces and report when peacekeepers run into roadblocks in Hezbollah strongholds in the country’s south.

The U.N. Security Council unanimously approved the plan for the mission known as UNIFIL, extending it another year after a flurry of negotiations over U.S. and Israeli desires to do more to keep Hezbollah from gathering illegal weapons.
Relatedly, Israel has identified a liaison officer to the peacekeeping force as a plant by Hezbollah.
Jerusalem asked UNIFIL to ensure that Major Yahya Husseini, who serves as a “liaison officer” for Hezbollah, be removed immediately from his position, the report said.

Hezbollah “planted” Husseini into the Lebanese army as part of its goal to increase the influence of the terror group within the army, Israeli sources alleged.

Israel said that Husseini maintains continuous contact with Hezbollah operatives, gets instructions from them, and hands over information to the terror organization.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Freyland »

Defiant wrote:Some positive news for the administration - the UN has extended it's peacekeeping operation in Lebanon, and there were apparently some positive changes after some compromises were reached found.

UN extends Lebanon peacekeeping; US, Israel prompt changes
The longtime U.N. peacekeeping operation in Lebanon was extended Wednesday with new directions to conduct more patrols with Lebanese forces and report when peacekeepers run into roadblocks in Hezbollah strongholds in the country’s south.

The U.N. Security Council unanimously approved the plan for the mission known as UNIFIL, extending it another year after a flurry of negotiations over U.S. and Israeli desires to do more to keep Hezbollah from gathering illegal weapons.
Relatedly, Israel has identified a liaison officer to the peacekeeping force as a plant by Hezbollah.
Jerusalem asked UNIFIL to ensure that Major Yahya Husseini, who serves as a “liaison officer” for Hezbollah, be removed immediately from his position, the report said.

Hezbollah “planted” Husseini into the Lebanese army as part of its goal to increase the influence of the terror group within the army, Israeli sources alleged.

Israel said that Husseini maintains continuous contact with Hezbollah operatives, gets instructions from them, and hands over information to the terror organization.
link
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Max Peck »

Trump is playing some damn fine 13-dimensional tiddlywinks this weekend.

Trump says Tillerson is ‘wasting his time’ trying to pursue negotiations with North Korea
President Trump signaled Sunday that he does not believe that attempts at direct communications with North Korea are worth the effort despite escalating tensions between Washington and Pyongyang.

A day after Secretary of State Rex Tillerson suggested that the United States maintains “lines of communications” with Kim Jong Un's regime, Trump wrote on Twitter that Tillerson is “wasting his time trying to negotiate with Little Rocket Man” — his nickname for Kim.
...Save your energy Rex, we'll do what has to be done!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) October 1, 2017
The president has taken an increasingly hard-line stance toward Pyongyang over its nuclear weapons and ballistic missile tests, threatening in a speech to the U.N. General Assembly two weeks ago to “totally destroy” North Korea if necessary.

Tillerson, on a visit to Beijing, told reporters Saturday that the State Department is “probing” through direct channels with the North whether Kim would be open to talks and under what conditions.

“We ask, ‘Would you like to talk?’ We have lines of communications to Pyongyang. We’re not in a dark situation, a blackout. We have a couple, three, channels open to Pyongyang; we can talk to them; we do talk to them,” Tillerson said.

“Stay tuned,” he added.

Trump, who is spending the weekend at his Bedminster golf resort in New Jersey, has said repeatedly that he is open to military options. North Korean officials have suggested that Trump's threats amount to a declaration of war.
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malchior
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by malchior »

Tillerson: Trump is a moron. He is apparently saying he won't quit - maybe to save what is left. Or who knows why anymore. The POTUS is a moron said the Secretary of the State?!?! I have no words.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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What are the odds that Tillerson is still Secretary of State at the end of the year? 20%?
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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malchior wrote:Tillerson: Trump is a moron. He is apparently saying he won't quit - maybe to save what is left. Or who knows why anymore. The POTUS is a moron said the Secretary of the State?!?! I have no words.
"Nonsense"
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by El Guapo »

Rip wrote:
malchior wrote:Tillerson: Trump is a moron. He is apparently saying he won't quit - maybe to save what is left. Or who knows why anymore. The POTUS is a moron said the Secretary of the State?!?! I have no words.
"Nonsense"
Well that settles that! No reason for skepticism there.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Captain Caveman »

He was explicitly asked about calling Trump a moron and he didn't deny it.

NBC later updated their reporting to say that the actual quote was "a fucking moron".
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Holman »

The way to handle reports of infighting is to ignore them. Every administration has always known this.

That Tillerson called an immediate press appearance to refute the report means that Trump demanded it.

And, no, it won't save Rex's job.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Captain Caveman »

Holman wrote:The way to handle reports of infighting is to ignore them. Every administration has always known this.
And it's totally counter-productive. There are many stories every day that paint the administration in a less than flattering light. They burn bright but fast and recede from memory once the next damning story appears (usually within a couple of hours). By making Tillerson call a press conference to refute the story, they guarantee that it breaks through the noise and makes even bigger headlines.

But I guess Trump can use it as anti-media ammunition and to demonstrate his dominance over the cucks in his cabinet, so I'm sure it makes him happy.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by malchior »

Captain Caveman wrote:He was explicitly asked about calling Trump a moron and he didn't deny it.

NBC later updated their reporting to say that the actual quote was "a fucking moron".
I might not like Rex's politics but he is 100% right here. Trump is a huge fucking moron.
Captain Caveman wrote:
Holman wrote:The way to handle reports of infighting is to ignore them. Every administration has always known this.
And it's totally counter-productive. There are many stories every day that paint the administration in a less than flattering light. They burn bright but fast and recede from memory once the next damning story appears (usually within a couple of hours). By making Tillerson call a press conference to refute the story, they guarantee that it breaks through the noise and makes even bigger headlines.

But I guess Trump can use it as anti-media ammunition and to demonstrate his dominance over the cucks in his cabinet, so I'm sure it makes him happy.
The press conference was clearly in response to the story. Someone called for comments and Trump pushed old Rex forward to blatantly lie. And he did it because...forget guessing at this point...no one has a fucking clue how theses assholes make decisions. It is almost like they spin a wheel.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Kraken »

malchior wrote:
Captain Caveman wrote:He was explicitly asked about calling Trump a moron and he didn't deny it.

NBC later updated their reporting to say that the actual quote was "a fucking moron".
I might not like Rex's politics but he is 100% right here. Trump is a huge fucking moron.
"Moron" was used to describe a person with a mental age in adulthood of between 8 and 12 on the Binet scale. It was once applied to people with an IQ of 51–70. These classifications fell out of favor when they entered common parlance as insults.

Trump's emotional age is probably below 8, since normal 8-year-olds are capable of empathy and Trump has never demonstrated that quality. That would make him an imbecile, one level below moron. His IQ (based on his observed speech and reasoning patterns) might very well be below 85, which is the lower cutoff for normal, but we can't say if he's in that magic 51-70 bracket unless he actually takes an IQ test. I doubt that he could sit through one, so we'll never know.

He certainly presents as a moron, so I think it's a fair description.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Holman »

He used to be much savvier in interviews and appearances. He demonstrated no empathy then either, but he could talk his way through sequential, complete sentences.

There is definite deterioration.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Rip »

He didn't call him a moron.

He said he was acting like a moron.

Clearly fake news.

:ninja:
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