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The Trump foreign policy thread

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Vorret
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Vorret »

Why would Germany care if the US removed troops though, why are there even troops in Germany to begin with, it's a big, rich country, it has the technology to have a great military as well as enough population to have a good sized army to be a deterrent to Russia. I understand that some smaller countries might be feeling some pressure but I'm fairly sure Germany can defend itself.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by LordMortis »

Vorret wrote: Wed Jul 29, 2020 11:30 am Why would Germany care if the US removed troops though,
10,000 troops puts 10,000 troops paychecks and some supply costs from out of country into a local economy. Removing them could be rough for a local economy. (Hence the concept of spending like a drunken sailor)
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Vorret »

Good point, the communities where military bases are located will see a significant drop in revenue but in the big picture , to me anyway, it's not a big AHH AH! to Merkel, I don't think Germany will get on its knees and beg to have the troops back.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by ImLawBoy »

Vorret wrote: Wed Jul 29, 2020 11:30 am Why would Germany care if the US removed troops though, why are there even troops in Germany to begin with,
Well, historically Europe has had some concern over Germany militarizing . . . .
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by malchior »

Vorret wrote: Wed Jul 29, 2020 11:41 am Good point, the communities where military bases are located will see a significant drop in revenue but in the big picture , to me anyway, it's not a big AHH AH! to Merkel, I don't think Germany will get on its knees and beg to have the troops back.
I think it is aimed squarely at Merkel as the emerging leader in a post-"US Empire" world. Potentially part of the point of this shift is to signal that Putin has some influence over the US military's deployment in Europe. Trump and Putin have been communicating monthly and its no mistake that the justification is paper thin or that the troops are moving much further *west* away from the Russian frontier. If our allies feared Trump was compromised they just got another reality check on it and so should we.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Remus West »

Who fears he is compromised? That implies there is doubt. I fear the implications of his being under Putin's thumb. I have no doubt that he is there - whether it was coercion or desire/admiration that put him there he is most certainly there.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by malchior »

Remus West wrote: Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:35 pm Who fears he is compromised? That implies there is doubt.
My assumption is that if they had hard intelligence then we'd be living in a different world. Though they might be hanging on and hoping he goes before he gives away the farm. I can imagine Merkel might even be banking that Biden will basically say 'stop' as soon as he can.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Grifman »

Vorret wrote: Wed Jul 29, 2020 11:41 am Good point, the communities where military bases are located will see a significant drop in revenue but in the big picture , to me anyway, it's not a big AHH AH! to Merkel, I don't think Germany will get on its knees and beg to have the troops back.
German leaders in those communities supporting US troops are already lobbying Congress to block the movement of the troops. So you were saying? :)
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Remus West »

malchior wrote: Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:43 pm
Remus West wrote: Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:35 pm Who fears he is compromised? That implies there is doubt.
My assumption is that if they had hard intelligence then we'd be living in a different world. Though they might be hanging on and hoping he goes before he gives away the farm. I can imagine Merkel might even be banking that Biden will basically say 'stop' as soon as he can.
Hard intel may not be there but I feel like doubt isn't either because he is either a willing pawn or an idiot pawn and it doesn't matter to them which is the truth because the outcome is the same.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Holman »

It's a crazy move to make just before an election when half the country believes you're doing Putin's bidding and sees that you're incapable of criticizing him even when he has Americans assassinated.

There have been at least eight calls between Trump and Putin this year. That's plenty of time for suggestions, promises, and veiled threats. Plus we have no idea what super-diplomat Jared or Trumpian 007 Erik Prince have been up to.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by LordMortis »

He might not be a pawn nor even a simpatico authoritarian but he gave up benefit of doubt during his 2016 campaign and has done the exact opposite of building trust at literally possible chance. "America First" which I'm seeing everywhere on lawns :( Seems to be "Putin's Russia First" at every examination.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by LawBeefaroni »

Holman wrote: Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:24 pm It's a crazy move to make just before an election when half the country believes you're doing Putin's bidding and sees that you're incapable of criticizing him even when he has Americans assassinated.
It's only crazy if you give a shit about that half of the country.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Holman »



He calls the bounties story another "Russia hoax," then spends the rest of the answer dumping on NATO.

Also, is he covered in Vaseline?
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Democrats demand answers from U.S. ambassador after reports he asked Brazil for favor to help Trump in 2020
House Democrats are demanding a reckoning from the U.S. ambassador to Brazil after news reports there said he was urging country officials to lower ethanol tariffs to help President Trump’s chances of reelection.

In a letter Friday to Ambassador Todd C. Chapman, House Foreign Affairs Committee Chairman Rep. Eliot L. Engel (D-N.Y.) and Western Hemisphere subcommittee Chairman Albio Sires (D-N.J.) cited a report in prominent Brazilian newspaper O Globo depicting Chapman telling Brazilian officials about “the importance for the [President Jair] Bolsonaro government of maintaining Donald Trump as U.S. President.” In the article, according to the letter, Chapman also communicated to Brazilian officials that it was important for their “government to do the U.S. a favor” by reducing ethanol tariffs, as those are important in the state of Iowa, a potential “key player” in 2020.

Panel Democrats are asking Chapman to state in writing whether the comments are true, and back up his claim with documents related to his conversations with Brazilian officials, “to reassure Congress” that he “is truly representing the interests of the United States and not the narrow, political interests of President Trump.”
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by LawBeefaroni »

Panel Democrats are asking Chapman to state in writing whether the comments are true, and back up his claim with documents related to his conversations with Brazilian officials, “to reassure Congress”...
Oh, the gloves are off now!

Wait, no they're not.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Remus West »

LawBeefaroni wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 6:47 pm
Panel Democrats are asking Chapman to state in writing whether the comments are true, and back up his claim with documents related to his conversations with Brazilian officials, “to reassure Congress”...
Oh, the gloves are off now!

Wait, no they're not.
Sure they are. The Dems are just now sitting on their hands to keep their fingers warm in case they have to slap his wrist.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by malchior »

Robert O'Brien wants you to know Trump is tough on Russia. He really, really means it in this op ed in the Washington Post that appeared this afternoon.
Ronald Reagan is looking down on us with a knowing smile. Like Reagan, President Trump strives for good relations with all nations, including Russia. But no nation, including Russia, should doubt the president’s commitment to defending the United States and our allies.

President Trump has demonstrated to Russia that he means what he says about putting “America First.” If recently reported allegations of Russian malign activity toward Americans in Afghanistan prove true, Russia knows from experience that it will pay a price — even if that price never becomes public.

Two weeks ago, President Trump imposed additional sanctions against Russian oligarch Yevgeniy Prigozhin, who owns both the Internet Research Agency, a troll farm that spread disinformation around the 2016 election, and the Wagner Group, whose mercenaries are deployed in Syria, Ukraine and Libya.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by LawBeefaroni »

malchior wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:40 pm Robert O'Brien wants you to you Trump is tough on Russia. He really, really means it in this op ed in the Washington Post that appeared this afternoon.
Ronald Reagan is looking down on us with a knowing smile. Like Reagan, President Trump strives for good relations with all nations, including Russia. But no nation, including Russia, should doubt the president’s commitment to defending the United States and our allies.

President Trump has demonstrated to Russia that he means what he says about putting “America First.” If recently reported allegations of Russian malign activity toward Americans in Afghanistan prove true, Russia knows from experience that it will pay a price — even if that price never becomes public.

Two weeks ago, President Trump imposed additional sanctions against Russian oligarch Yevgeniy Prigozhin, who owns both the Internet Research Agency, a troll farm that spread disinformation around the 2016 election, and the Wagner Group, whose mercenaries are deployed in Syria, Ukraine and Libya.
Russia knows from experience that it will pay a price — even if that price never becomes public.
This is a personal insult to the intelligence of anyone who reads that jumble of shit.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by malchior »

LawBeefaroni wrote: Sun Aug 02, 2020 7:51 pm
Russia knows from experience that it will pay a price — even if that price never becomes public.
This is a personal insult to the intelligence of anyone who reads that jumble of shit.
I snorted at that line. It's also funny timing right? What could be going on that the NSA has to run some ridiculously transparent propaganda piece on a totally random Sunday night?
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Holman »

Shame on WaPo for publishing it.

If the NSA head wants to go public with actions against Russia, especially given recent news reports, he should meet with the paper's journalists and allow them to ask questions and report on it.

They shouldn't abet such obvious electioneering propaganda.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Defiant »

Not so much foreign policy as something that happened elsehwere in the world:
A "colossal" explosion rocked the port area of Lebanon's capital, Beirut, on Tuesday, injuring thousands and causing widespread damage in a densely populated part of the city.

At least 3,000 people have been injured and 50 killed, Minister of Health Hassan Hamad said at a press conference. Those numbers are likely to rise with hospitals filling up fast.

Images and videos on social media appear to show large plumes of smoke and damaged buildings in the Middle Eastern country, but the cause of the blast and its exact location were not immediately clear.

Lebanon's National News Agency reported the cause may have been a fire in a hangar where explosives were being stored in the Beirut port, on the country's west coast.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/larg ... r-n1235767
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by LawBeefaroni »

Thread here.


Normally this would be top news but in 2020, everyone has their own problems.

Even odds Trump says something dumb and insensitive while the rest of the world offers aid and condolences.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Skinypupy »

LawBeefaroni wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 6:40 pm Thread here.


Normally this would be top news but in 2020, everyone has their own problems.

Even odds Trump says something dumb and insensitive while the rest of the world offers aid and condolences.
He’s already calling it an attack, without providing any evidence as to how they determined that (I.e. made it up out of whole cloth).

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/pol ... 292842001/
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by El Guapo »

Skinypupy wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 7:10 pm
LawBeefaroni wrote: Tue Aug 04, 2020 6:40 pm Thread here.


Normally this would be top news but in 2020, everyone has their own problems.

Even odds Trump says something dumb and insensitive while the rest of the world offers aid and condolences.
He’s already calling it an attack, without providing any evidence as to how they determined that (I.e. made it up out of whole cloth).

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/pol ... 292842001/
Also there's a reasonable chance that this is the result of gross negligence by Hezbollah, so Trump labeling it an attack without apparent evidence is very helpful to them (as they would love to blame it on an attack by Israel or someone else, rather than their own incompetence).
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Defiant »

Lebanon's prime minister announced his government's resignation on Monday, saying a huge explosion that devastated the capital and stirred public outrage was the result of endemic corruption.
In a televised address, Prime Minister Hassan Diab said he backed calls by ordinary Lebanese for those responsible for "this crime" to be put on trial.
Diab made the announcement after the cabinet, formed in January with the backing of the powerful Iranian-backed Hezbollah group and its allies, met on Monday, with many ministers wanting to resign, according to ministerial and political sources.
Diab said on Saturday he would request early parliamentary elections.
Demonstrations broke out again in central Beirut, with some protesters hurling rocks at security forces guarding an entrance leading to the parliament building, who responded with tear gas.
https://www.jpost.com/middle-east/leban ... ent-638130
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Defiant »


Gen Michael Hayden wrote: Holy shit.
Rudy Mehrbani wrote: National Security Advisor Robert O’Brien on @FaceTheNation right now, in response to whether Trump has told Putin to stop meddling in US elections: “Unlike my predecessors, I don’t get involved in conversations the President has with foreign leaders.”

No kidding.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Full quote for context:
O'BRIEN: Well the- the president has told the Russians, and we've told the Russians, our counterparts, many, many times not to get involved in our election. That it's----a red line. You know, what I don't get involved in, you know, unlike perhaps some of my predecessors or others who leaked documents, I don't- I don't get into the- the conversations that the president has with foreign heads of state, whether it's Russia or France or the UK for that matter. Those are private conversations. But I can tell you, we've made it very clear to the Russians, very clear. No- no administration has been tougher on the Russians. We've sanctioned hundreds of Russian entities. We've sanctioned the troll farms. We've sanctioned Rosneft--
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by malchior »

I don't think the context adds anything but the same nonsense he wrote in the Washington Post OpEd. The quote was correct - O'Brien said out loud that Trump doesn't allow him to do the job he is there for. Cool.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Max Peck »

#Actually, it seems to me that he was simply trying to say that he won't discuss the issue, not that he is completely disengaged from Trump's dealings with foreign heads of state. Still, as soon as he parrots the "no administration has been tougher with the Russians" line, I can't really give credence to anything he says.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Tao »

I agree he shot holes in his credibility with the whole "we are tougher" BS but my read of the full text is that he was trying, poorly, to say he would not discuss private conversations with the press, not that he was hands off.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by malchior »

This is a side note to the other thread where Trump commented on the wall indictment. He is taking open questions on foreign policy questions. It's beyond embarrassing. He denied the intelligence about Russian bounties outright. He said we have a great relationship with the Kurds. We've got great oil deals for our American oil companies because they were taking advantage of us...etc. He is a continuing disaster.

Edit: I'll quote him - "We kept the oil" (to paraphrase) ...we'll deal with that with the Kurds...but we kept the oil and we'll reach a deal with them soon. WTF!?
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Serbia and Kosovo have agreed to embark on a new chapter in their recently tumultuous relationship, establishing economic normalization in a signing ceremony at the White House Friday alongside President Donald Trump, who has been aggressively pursuing new foreign policy endeavors with the presidential election just under two months away.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/04/politics ... index.html

Had you asked me four years ago where the Trump administration would have the most success, foreign policy (as limited as those successes have been) wouldn't have been my guess.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by gilraen »

Defiant wrote: Tue Sep 08, 2020 11:26 am
Serbia and Kosovo have agreed to embark on a new chapter in their recently tumultuous relationship, establishing economic normalization in a signing ceremony at the White House Friday alongside President Donald Trump, who has been aggressively pursuing new foreign policy endeavors with the presidential election just under two months away.
https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/04/politics ... index.html

Had you asked me four years ago where the Trump administration would have the most success, foreign policy (as limited as those successes have been) wouldn't have been my guess.
Perhaps one shouldn't be too impressed just yet...

Sloppy White House package does little to advance dialogue and comes at a high price.
[...E]ach side left the meeting armed with their own narrative for domestic consumption. The White House claimed victory in advancing the peace process in a long-standing conflict. Serbian President Aleksandar Vučić interpreted the event as a bilateral meeting with Washington aimed at improving bilateral relations. Kosovo, meanwhile, chalked it up to a win because it gained recognition from Israel.

Contrary to Grenell’s claim that the U.S. had landed on something "new" and "creative," most of the pledges already exist within the framework of the EU negotiations and Berlin process, or as independent initiatives — including infrastructure projects, regional cooperation, border crossing points, the recognition of diplomas and missing persons and IDPs.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by malchior »

Pew Research
Since Donald Trump took office as president, the image of the United States has suffered across many regions of the globe. As a new 13-nation Pew Research Center survey illustrates, America’s reputation has declined further over the past year among many key allies and partners. In several countries, the share of the public with a favorable view of the U.S. is as low as it has been at any point since the Center began polling on this topic nearly two decades ago.

...

The publics surveyed also see Trump more negatively than other world leaders. Among the six leaders included on the survey, Angela Merkel receives the highest marks: A median of 76% across the nations polled have confidence in the German chancellor. French President Emmanuel Macron also gets largely favorable reviews. Ratings for British Prime Minister Boris Johnson are roughly split. Ratings for Russian President Vladimir Putin and Chinese President Xi Jinping are overwhelmingly negative, although not as negative as those for Trump.

Views of Trump are more positive among Europeans who have favorable views of right-wing populist parties, though confidence is still relatively low among all groups.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Max Peck »

This would seem to be the quid pro quo for the UAE normalizing diplomatic relations with Israel.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Unagi »

Defiant wrote: Tue Nov 10, 2020 2:22 am
Is this how it works?
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Isgrimnur »

The Hill
A bipartisan trio of senators launched an effort Wednesday to block the Trump administration’s $23 billion arms package to the United Arab Emirates.

Sens. Bob Menendez (D-N.J.), the ranking member of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee; Rand Paul (R-Ky.); and Chris Murphy (D-Conn.) introduced four separate resolutions Wednesday that would kill the administration’s plan to sell the UAE F-35 fighter jets, armed drones, missiles and bombs.

“As I tried to warn the Trump administration, circumventing deliberative processes for considering a massive infusion of weapons to a country in a volatile region with multiple ongoing conflicts is downright irresponsible,” Menendez said in a statement.
...
The formal notification kicked off a 30-day period in which Congress can block the sales with resolutions such as the ones introduced Wednesday.

Under the law governing U.S. arms sales, such resolutions are considered “privileged,” meaning senators can force a vote even if Senate leadership doesn’t support them.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

Post by Defiant »

Israel and Morocco agreed on Thursday to normalize relations in a deal brokered with U.S. help, making Morocco the fourth Arab country to set aside hostilities with Israel in the past four months.
It joins the United Arab Emirates, Bahrain and Sudan in beginning to forge deals with Israel, driven in part by U.S.-led efforts to present a united front against Iran and roll back Tehran’s regional influence.
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Re: The Trump foreign policy thread

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Ah, yes. The classic swagger of proud humility.
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