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Racism in America (with data)

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Pyperkub
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Racism in America (with data)

Post by Pyperkub »

Didn't see a topic, and felt this maybe should be in its own thread:

Google search correlations between racism and black mortality:

Enlarge Image
It's also important to note that not all people searching for the N-word are motivated by racism, and that not all racists search for that word, either. But aggregated over several years and several million searches, the data give a pretty good approximation of where a particular type of racist attitude is the strongest.

Interestingly, on the map above the most concentrated cluster of racist searches happened not in the South, but rather along the spine of the Appalachians running from Georgia all the way up to New York and southern Vermont...

...So some people are sitting at home by themselves, Googling a bunch of racist stuff. What does it matter? As it turns out, it matters quite a bit. The researchers on the PLOS ONE paper found that racist searches were correlated with higher mortality rates for blacks, even after controlling for a variety of racial and socio-economic variables.

"Results from our study indicate that living in an area characterized by a one standard deviation greater proportion of racist Google searches is associated with an 8.2% increase in the all-cause mortality rate among Blacks," the authors conclude. Now, of course, Google searches aren't directly leading to the deaths of African Americans. But previous research has shown that the prevalence of racist attitudes can contribute to poor health and economic outcomes among black residents.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by noxiousdog »

That map doesn't surprise me, but it's nice to see some data.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Defiant »

When it says "google search volume", is that per-capita or not?

If it weren't, I would expect the map to look similar to a population density map of the US (which it kinda does).

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Pyperkub »

noxiousdog wrote:That map doesn't surprise me, but it's nice to see some data.
I was surprised by the Midwest. Didn't think Ohio/Michigan would be that far off.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Remus West »

Pyperkub wrote:
noxiousdog wrote:That map doesn't surprise me, but it's nice to see some data.
I was surprised by the Midwest. Didn't think Ohio/Michigan would be that far off.
I'd guess a good portion of those searches in the Detroit metro area were by blacks. I hear that word multiple times a day every day and always from black students. It has simply become part of their vocabulary here. Yes, I mean the full on N-word and not one ending in a.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Isgrimnur »

CNN
The white woman who called police on a black man in Central Park during an encounter involving her unleashed dog has been fired from her job, her employer said Tuesday.

"Following our internal review of the incident in Central Park yesterday, we have made the decision to terminate the employee involved, effective immediately. We do not tolerate racism of any kind at Franklin Templeton," the company said on Twitter.

Amy Cooper was walking her dog Monday morning while Christian Cooper (no relation) was bird-watching at a wooded area of Central Park called the Ramble. They both told CNN their dispute began because her dog was not on a leash, contrary to the Ramble's rules, according to the park's website.

Christian Cooper recorded video of part of their encounter and posted it on Facebook, where it has since been shared thousands of times and became a trending topic on Twitter. In the video, he is largely silent while she frantically tells police he is threatening her and her dog.

"I'm taking a picture and calling the cops," Amy Cooper is heard saying in the video. "I'm going to tell them there's an African American man threatening my life."

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by pr0ner »

I've read people defending Amy Cooper's actions because Christian Cooper insinuated that he was going to lure her dog over with dog treats. What Christian did wasn't ideal, but it in no way should have led to Amy's racist, turn on the panic, fake call to 911.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by El Guapo »

pr0ner wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 10:14 am
I've read people defending Amy Cooper's actions because Christian Cooper insinuated that he was going to lure her dog over with dog treats. What Christian did wasn't ideal, but it in no way should have led to Amy's racist, turn on the panic, fake call to 911.
Yeah, in effect she's threatening to ruin / end his life by calling the police, plus wasting the time and resources of the police - even if she has a legit gripe about something, there's no way in which what she did is ok.

I will say that her getting fired from her (totally unrelated) job is kind of a weird remedy, though.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Paingod »

Her being fired is just a ripple in the pond, though - not an intended consequence. She could have been a fast food worker or stay-at-home mom for all the guy knew; it just happened to be that she worked for someone who caught on and didn't like their company having it's name attached to an inflamed racist meme waiting to happen.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by LordMortis »

El Guapo wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 10:26 am
I will say that her getting fired from her (totally unrelated) job is kind of a weird remedy, though.
Doxxing is to be generally feared. I'm not sure this is a good use of it, even as garbage of a person as she seems to be, willing to incite legal injustice with implied unjust law enforcement violence with race baiting so she can break the law for ??? reasons. I'm not sure I condemn the doxxing but I sure as hell question it.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by pr0ner »

El Guapo wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 10:26 am
pr0ner wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 10:14 am
I've read people defending Amy Cooper's actions because Christian Cooper insinuated that he was going to lure her dog over with dog treats. What Christian did wasn't ideal, but it in no way should have led to Amy's racist, turn on the panic, fake call to 911.
Yeah, in effect she's threatening to ruin / end his life by calling the police, plus wasting the time and resources of the police - even if she has a legit gripe about something, there's no way in which what she did is ok.

I will say that her getting fired from her (totally unrelated) job is kind of a weird remedy, though.
She was doxxed so quickly on social media and people hounded the Franklin Templeton Twitter account so incessantly about her after that they really had no choice.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by El Guapo »

pr0ner wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 11:03 am
El Guapo wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 10:26 am
pr0ner wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 10:14 am
I've read people defending Amy Cooper's actions because Christian Cooper insinuated that he was going to lure her dog over with dog treats. What Christian did wasn't ideal, but it in no way should have led to Amy's racist, turn on the panic, fake call to 911.
Yeah, in effect she's threatening to ruin / end his life by calling the police, plus wasting the time and resources of the police - even if she has a legit gripe about something, there's no way in which what she did is ok.

I will say that her getting fired from her (totally unrelated) job is kind of a weird remedy, though.
She was doxxed so quickly on social media and people hounded the Franklin Templeton Twitter account so incessantly about her after that they really had no choice.
Yeah, I get why the employer would fire her. What you say, plus you figure some coworkers would raise an issue / not want to work with her anymore, plus maybe the owners were upset, etc.

I guess it just bothers me a bit as not the right result. Public shaming, for sure. She did lie to the police, so some fine / penalty seems appropriate (I would think that she could be criminally charged, though that would seem a bit draconian).

Anyway, it makes sense for the employer to fire her, and I'm not weeping for her, so it is what it is in the end.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by LordMortis »

El Guapo wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 11:21 am
I would think that she could be criminally charged, though that would seem a bit draconian
I'm shaky on the doxxing but charging her criminally, doesn't seem too much to me. From my seat of ignorance, this is worse than calling 911 for something trivial. She was intentionally deceiving the police and using race both to bring the police to action and to strike fear into someone insisting she follow the law (from a distance)

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Tao »

I doubt it would have been the intended consequence but given the state of things in this country and incidents in just the past few weeks, this woman could have put this man's life in jeopardy or gotten him killed. The surreal part is the Police were/are the threat.

I think normally I would agree that an individual losing their job for actions outside of the work place is unfair, however this women deserves whatever fallout comes her way, I also believe Karma is a bitch. This does not strike me as the actions of someone caught off guard or something that would be uncharacteristic. The ease in which she immediately went to that place and the way she did it and to the extreme she did while the gentlemen was still standing there, to me shows evidence this was not just reactionary, this complete disdain for another human, in my opinion, came from her core.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by raydude »

LordMortis wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 12:20 pm
El Guapo wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 11:21 am
I would think that she could be criminally charged, though that would seem a bit draconian
I'm shaky on the doxxing but charging her criminally, doesn't seem too much to me. From my seat of ignorance, this is worse than calling 911 for something trivial. She was intentionally deceiving the police and using race both to bring the police to action and to strike fear into someone insisting she follow the law (from a distance)
I don't get the mindset of someone like her who would escalate it to that level. Were I in a similar situation, say with my kids who went on "keep off grass" areas and got called out on it, I'd just say "oops, sorry. Didn't see the sign. Kids! Come back here!" Done. Why escalate when it's easier to just say "you know what? I was wrong. Let me leash my dog". Even if I were inclined to be a jerk about it, I'd put the dog on the leash, wait until he left, and then unleash the dog to spite him.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Unagi »

El Guapo wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 10:26 am

I will say that her getting fired from her (totally unrelated) job is kind of a weird remedy, though.
I don't think remedy is the right word. This was just a consequence. A 'remedy' is designed - this was not designed, this is like watershed.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by LordMortis »

raydude wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 12:59 pm
Even if I were inclined to be a jerk about it, I'd put the dog on the leash,
That's me and I hope I come out on the other side the same way but my identifying with the golden rule is starting to crack. I think I mentioned it here before but the golden rule is the magnetic north for my moral compass and I find myself wishing things on people that I'm not comfortable with, making me very unhappy with myself. I don't want to be the guy who says "fuck the law. I can get away with it." or the guy who says "I hope you experience the loss that 100,000 people in the US have experienced along with their loved ones who couldn't even be present to say goodbye." Not being that guy has never been a struggle until 2020. (I'm the guy who didn't walk away from their mortgage in 2008/2010 when everyone around me did, as my neighborhood escalated to lose 75% of its property value because when everyone does what's wrong, it's over. That's my worldview. I don't want that to change.)

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by raydude »

LordMortis wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 1:17 pm
raydude wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 12:59 pm
Even if I were inclined to be a jerk about it, I'd put the dog on the leash,
That's me and I hope I come out on the other side the same way but my identifying with the golden rule is starting to crack. I think I mentioned it here before but the golden rule is the magnetic north for my moral compass and I find myself wishing things on people that I'm not comfortable with, making me very unhappy with myself. I don't want to be the guy who says "fuck the law. I can get away with it." or the guy who says "I hope you experience the loss that 100,000 people in the US have experienced along with their loved ones who couldn't even be present to say goodbye." Not being that guy has never been a struggle until 2020.
Understood but also understand that there are many levels of jerkitude that don't involve getting the other person arrested, killed, fired from their job, or doxxed on social media. She could have talked to her dog "Mommy is gonna put the leash on now, because the bad man said I had to. Yes, who's a good dog? Not like that jerk over there." As said previously, she could have waited till he left, then unleashed the dog. She could have given him the middle finger after leashing the dog then walking away. There are many avenues of jerkitude she could have persued, but she chose one of the most extreme ones. And for what? Because she didn't want to leash the freekin dog?

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Holman »

raydude wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 1:22 pm
There are many avenues of jerkitude she could have persued, but she chose one of the most extreme ones. And for what? Because she didn't want to leash the freekin dog?
Nope. Because she didn't want to take instructions from a black man.

The simple test is whether she would have done all this is the bird-watcher had been white. Even if he had been white and incredibly rude, it's hard to believe she would have called 911 to have the cops come a treat him as an assailant.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by LawBeefaroni »

A coworker came into my office this morning. She's a black woman in the 50-60 YO range. Great co-worker, great person. We had a long discussion on race and current events. Towards the end she said she is looking to purchase a firearm and get some training.

Now, no one at work knows I have my CCW (don't carry where I work anyway, state law) and don't know that I train a lot. Basically I'm not the "gun guy". So her telling me this came out of the blue.

But she cited the fact that she can't trust anyone to protect her and that unarmed black men get killed in the street while armed white men get the keys to the Capitol building.

She also said there is a growing unease that there will be a reckoning come November regardless.of what happens.
Sadly she might not even receive her FOID by then, even if she applies tomorrow.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Tao »

raydude wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 1:22 pm
LordMortis wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 1:17 pm
raydude wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 12:59 pm
Even if I were inclined to be a jerk about it, I'd put the dog on the leash,
That's me and I hope I come out on the other side the same way but my identifying with the golden rule is starting to crack. I think I mentioned it here before but the golden rule is the magnetic north for my moral compass and I find myself wishing things on people that I'm not comfortable with, making me very unhappy with myself. I don't want to be the guy who says "fuck the law. I can get away with it." or the guy who says "I hope you experience the loss that 100,000 people in the US have experienced along with their loved ones who couldn't even be present to say goodbye." Not being that guy has never been a struggle until 2020.
Understood but also understand that there are many levels of jerkitude that don't involve getting the other person arrested, killed, fired from their job, or doxxed on social media. She could have talked to her dog "Mommy is gonna put the leash on now, because the bad man said I had to. Yes, who's a good dog? Not like that jerk over there." As said previously, she could have waited till he left, then unleashed the dog. She could have given him the middle finger after leashing the dog then walking away. There are many avenues of jerkitude she could have persued, but she chose one of the most extreme ones. And for what? Because she didn't want to leash the freekin dog?
Your summation and reasoning leaves out one key component, racism. I don't know this women and was not present during the incident but the appearance is that this was a reaction based on racist attitude. How dare you, a black man, try and correct me, a privileged white women! Made worse most likely by the fact that she knew he was in the right, which most likely angered her more. That you are missing that element or confounded by its mechanism speaks well for your character. :D
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Skinypupy »

There have been lots of articles written lately about this topic. For whatever reason, this one - and this passage specifically - hit me hard today.
“You oppose the inhumanity or you abide it.

You condemn the violence or you are complicit in it.

You declare yourself a fierce and vocal adversary of bigotry—or you become its silent ally.

White friends, we are being asked to be speak clearly because when we do, we place ourselves alongside those people who deserve to get up today and run and stand outside convenience stores and sit in their cars and play in the park and relax in their homes—and we place ourselves across from the bigots who feel they will never be held accountable for not wanting them to do these things.

To be clear—this outward stance doesn’t erase our privilege or exempt us from our prejudices or remove the blind spots within us that perpetuate inequity. Those are realities we’ll have to continually confront in the small and close and quiet moments of the remainder of our lives. It doesn’t dismantle systemic racism or the institutional inequalities woven into our nation, which we benefit from.

But what our outward declaration will do, is to let other white people know where we stand: our neighbors and and pastors and co-workers and family members and social media friends.”
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by malchior »

In the wake of the George Floyd incident in Minneapolis there are pockets of rioting and looting breaking out now. Ugly stuff. People have had it. And some people are going to take advantage of it. It'll all get lumped in together as black people problems even though you can clearly see white people running out of that target as well.


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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by LawBeefaroni »

It's day two. This is when the opportunists take full advantage.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Holman »

malchior wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 8:13 pm
In the wake of the George Floyd incident in Minneapolis there are pockets of rioting and looting breaking out now. Ugly stuff. People have had it. And some people are going to take advantage of it. It'll all get lumped in together as black people problems even though you can clearly see white people running out of that target as well.

That Twitter feed is describing violence I'm not seeing reported elsewhere: Molotov cocktails, long guns vs cops, etc.

It claims to be hearing reports of massive violence on police radio. (e.g "Pipe bombs mentioned.") Is any of this verified?
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Unagi »

casually speaking as a white guy here: fuck the police and how they treated that person. Fuck them - and if it was racist , which I'm sure it was, then fuck them even harder. Not sure I even care about the communities 'loss' here with looting, etc... seriousl - as long as that bullshit police department gets a majority of the blame. Fuck them. Seriously - this was Murder in open sight, and we know it.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by malchior »

No reasonable person would think that putting your weight on the side of someone's neck for nearly 10 minutes isn't extremely dangerous. Worse this was a trained peace keeper. His alleged crime? Passing a $20 counterfeit note. It's ludicrously disproportionate use of force and they did it on body camera, with a cell phone trained on him, and a crowd including a first responder yelling at the officer to provide aid. Fuck that cop. The cops constantly are flexing and abusing their power in plain sight for effect.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by LawBeefaroni »

Holman wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 9:22 pm


That Twitter feed is describing violence I'm not seeing reported elsewhere: Molotov cocktails, long guns vs cops, etc.

It claims to be hearing reports of massive violence on police radio. (e.g "Pipe bombs mentioned.") Is any of this verified?
There was a lot of chatter on the radio but nothing I could verify. Fire was very busy.

Also, widespread looting was made possible partially because MPD and county sheriff's were protecting Chauvin's property. I highly doubt he or his family were actually at home.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by malchior »

Got to love the police essentially protect the precinct and that guys house. Everyone else? You're on your own. The MN governor has got to be hoping this "burns out" on its own because imposing order might set off a wider escalation.

I just watched a few hours of a guy walking around the riot. 'Alpha News' on Facebook if you are interested. It was pure mayhem. One night's mayhem caused several million dollars of damage. What is the inventory in any given Target? It was looted, then set on fire, the sprinkler system activated so much of what remained is ruined.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by LawBeefaroni »

malchior wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 8:21 am
Got to love the police essentially protect the precinct and that guys house. Everyone else? You're on your own. The MN governor has got to be hoping this "burns out" on its own because imposing order might set off a wider escalation.
When shit goes down they're just like everyone else. Protect you and yours.

I did see somewhere that 94% of Minneapolis police officers live outside the city. Here CPD is required to live in the city. There are loopholes but the vast majority do live in the city, even if it is often concentrated in small cop/fire enclaves.

In Minneapolis? Only around 6% live in the community they serve. Does it matter? Not 100% clear but certainly you'd be more inclined to stop mass looting and arson if it was happening in your back yard.

Here's an older source.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by malchior »

LawBeefaroni wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 8:51 am
malchior wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 8:21 am
Got to love the police essentially protect the precinct and that guys house. Everyone else? You're on your own. The MN governor has got to be hoping this "burns out" on its own because imposing order might set off a wider escalation.
When shit goes down they're just like everyone else. Protect you and yours.

I did see somewhere that 94% of Minneapolis police officers live outside the city. Here CPD is required to live in the city. There are loopholes but the vast majority do live in the city, even if it is often concentrated in small cop/fire enclaves.

In Minneapolis? Only around 6% live in the community they serve. Does it matter? Not 100% clear but certainly you'd be more inclined to stop mass looting and arson if it was happening in your back yard.

Here's an older source.
Yup - totally get it. They are doing nothing to tamp down the 'gang with a badge' idea that many folks have had in these communities for years. There has been problems with this police force for years. The cop involved was involved in multiple incidents that had abuse of force allegations. He did this in the wide open and that is because he expected to get away with it. He probably still does.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by pr0ner »

malchior wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 11:03 pm
No reasonable person would think that putting your weight on the side of someone's neck for nearly 10 minutes isn't extremely dangerous. Worse this was a trained peace keeper. His alleged crime? Passing a $20 counterfeit note. It's ludicrously disproportionate use of force and they did it on body camera, with a cell phone trained on him, and a crowd including a first responder yelling at the officer to provide aid. Fuck that cop. The cops constantly are flexing and abusing their power in plain sight for effect.
As long as qualified immunity continues to be a thing, stuff like this will happen.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by malchior »

pr0ner wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:12 am
malchior wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 11:03 pm
No reasonable person would think that putting your weight on the side of someone's neck for nearly 10 minutes isn't extremely dangerous. Worse this was a trained peace keeper. His alleged crime? Passing a $20 counterfeit note. It's ludicrously disproportionate use of force and they did it on body camera, with a cell phone trained on him, and a crowd including a first responder yelling at the officer to provide aid. Fuck that cop. The cops constantly are flexing and abusing their power in plain sight for effect.
As long as qualified immunity continues to be a thing, stuff like this will happen.
That's definitely a piece of it but I don't know how they operate without it either. Maybe civil lawsuits would tamp it down but it seems much more complex. The warp and weave of it is that they act this way because juries, voters, and politicians generally turn a blind eye to it. That is changing but this is just another broken part of our society that needs significant repairs. Like so much that has gone unaddressed it may have severe consequences because it was ignored for so long. Millions are out of work and anger is real out there that has nothing to do with the pandemic. Do we see a few flare ups or is this looking like 1967? Who knows at this point.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

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LawBeefaroni wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 7:35 am
All of these cops are aligned with this guy and think he's in the clear? If not, why not just arrest him and spare the 70 police they seem to have creating a wall around the guy?
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by LawBeefaroni »

malchior wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:25 am
Millions are out of work and anger is real out there that has nothing to do with the pandemic. Do we see a few flare ups or is this looking like 1967? Who knows at this point.


Well, LA got pretty hot yesterday too. 101 got blocked, police cars smashed up.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by LawBeefaroni »

Paingod wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:32 am
All of these cops are aligned with this guy and think he's in the clear? If not, why not just arrest him and spare the 70 police they seem to have creating a wall around the guy?
I doubt he's even there. No way he and his family are at home. They're protecting his property and the idea of solidarity.

The thinking is something like "If I get jammed up, I'd want someone getting my/my family's back, no questions asked too..."
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by El Guapo »

malchior wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:25 am
pr0ner wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:12 am
malchior wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 11:03 pm
No reasonable person would think that putting your weight on the side of someone's neck for nearly 10 minutes isn't extremely dangerous. Worse this was a trained peace keeper. His alleged crime? Passing a $20 counterfeit note. It's ludicrously disproportionate use of force and they did it on body camera, with a cell phone trained on him, and a crowd including a first responder yelling at the officer to provide aid. Fuck that cop. The cops constantly are flexing and abusing their power in plain sight for effect.
As long as qualified immunity continues to be a thing, stuff like this will happen.
That's definitely a piece of it but I don't know how they operate without it either. Maybe civil lawsuits would tamp it down but it seems much more complex. The warp and weave of it is that they act this way because juries, voters, and politicians generally turn a blind eye to it. That is changing but this is just another broken part of our society that needs significant repairs. Like so much that has gone unaddressed it may have severe consequences because it was ignored for so long. Millions are out of work and anger is real out there that has nothing to do with the pandemic. Do we see a few flare ups or is this looking like 1967? Who knows at this point.
I would think that exposing police departments to civil liability for abuses would give the departments the necessary incentive to actually police this stuff.

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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by LawBeefaroni »

El Guapo wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:44 am
malchior wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:25 am
pr0ner wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:12 am
malchior wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 11:03 pm
No reasonable person would think that putting your weight on the side of someone's neck for nearly 10 minutes isn't extremely dangerous. Worse this was a trained peace keeper. His alleged crime? Passing a $20 counterfeit note. It's ludicrously disproportionate use of force and they did it on body camera, with a cell phone trained on him, and a crowd including a first responder yelling at the officer to provide aid. Fuck that cop. The cops constantly are flexing and abusing their power in plain sight for effect.
As long as qualified immunity continues to be a thing, stuff like this will happen.
That's definitely a piece of it but I don't know how they operate without it either. Maybe civil lawsuits would tamp it down but it seems much more complex. The warp and weave of it is that they act this way because juries, voters, and politicians generally turn a blind eye to it. That is changing but this is just another broken part of our society that needs significant repairs. Like so much that has gone unaddressed it may have severe consequences because it was ignored for so long. Millions are out of work and anger is real out there that has nothing to do with the pandemic. Do we see a few flare ups or is this looking like 1967? Who knows at this point.
I would think that exposing police departments to civil liability for abuses would give the departments the necessary incentive to actually police this stuff.
Not necessarily. And that's only through 2017. 2018 alone was $113M.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by Paingod »

El Guapo wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:44 am
I would think that exposing police departments to civil liability for abuses would give the departments the necessary incentive to actually police this stuff.
I completely agree - though it would also provide an option for every single person they ever interact with, and even some they didn't - to try and dip their fingers into that pie. The people the cops are tangling with most frequently are people who wouldn't mind exploiting loopholes like that. We'd probably see a crippling number of lawsuits flood the courts, drowning out any legitimate ones.
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Re: Racism in America (with data)

Post by malchior »

El Guapo wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:44 am
malchior wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:25 am
pr0ner wrote:
Thu May 28, 2020 9:12 am
malchior wrote:
Wed May 27, 2020 11:03 pm
No reasonable person would think that putting your weight on the side of someone's neck for nearly 10 minutes isn't extremely dangerous. Worse this was a trained peace keeper. His alleged crime? Passing a $20 counterfeit note. It's ludicrously disproportionate use of force and they did it on body camera, with a cell phone trained on him, and a crowd including a first responder yelling at the officer to provide aid. Fuck that cop. The cops constantly are flexing and abusing their power in plain sight for effect.
As long as qualified immunity continues to be a thing, stuff like this will happen.
That's definitely a piece of it but I don't know how they operate without it either. Maybe civil lawsuits would tamp it down but it seems much more complex. The warp and weave of it is that they act this way because juries, voters, and politicians generally turn a blind eye to it. That is changing but this is just another broken part of our society that needs significant repairs. Like so much that has gone unaddressed it may have severe consequences because it was ignored for so long. Millions are out of work and anger is real out there that has nothing to do with the pandemic. Do we see a few flare ups or is this looking like 1967? Who knows at this point.
I would think that exposing police departments to civil liability for abuses would give the departments the necessary incentive to actually police this stuff.
It creates an incentive but it isn't enough. Since that is the way it often works now. Many departments routinely pay large settlements and their insurance companies often cover them. The insurance industry could 'police them' but in reality will have stiff headwinds. The system has responded to spread the risk enough that as long as police violence is kept to a certain level it is allowable. In other words, they've contained their risk on the civil and criminal side to acceptable levels to continue to act with not complete impunity but continuing lack of accountability in all but the worst cases.
Last edited by malchior on Thu May 28, 2020 10:11 am, edited 1 time in total.

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