Racism in America (with data)

[Little Raven]

I've never heard "spade" used in a racial context. But then, I've lived most of my life in New Mexico and Austin, where if people are going to be racist, they're not going to be particularly coy about it.

[Blackhawk]

I have, but again: what's important is what you do once you know.

[Jaymann]

I heard spade referring to black people (mostly by other blacks) back in the '60's, but never associated it with that expression. No big sacrifice to stop using it.

[hepcat]

Ditto. Losing the use of an old saying is a small price to pay to avoid a horrible misunderstanding.

[Holman]

It's also tough sometimes to draw a line and pinpoint when a word or phrase has picked up enough baggage to make it toxic. I'm with Jaymon above: Before this discussion, I'd never once heard the word "spade" used as a racial slur. It's always just been a small shovel (usually for gardening) to me.

I wonder what percentage of people are aware that there's any racial baggage associated with "spade." My guess is, it's pretty small, at least based on Google searches.

I think "spade" has mostly fallen out of usage. My sense is that was used in the 40s/50s/60s as a less openly offensive but still belittling alternative to the N word.

You come across it in "edgy" novels of the period and in performers of that generation. I'm pretty sure I've seen it in Kerouac and Norman Mailer, for instance. I think Nixon and Kissinger use it in the revealed tapes.

[malchior]

It is still commonly used that way in blue collar NJ. I hear that and other non-n word euphemisms at extended family/friend events.

[malchior]

Damn it @aoc

[Isgrimnur]

CNN

Missouri Republican Gov. Mike Parson on Tuesday announced pardons for Patricia and Mark McCloskey, the St. Louis homeowners who pointed guns at protesters near their home last summer.

The couple, who pleaded guilty in June to misdemeanor charges stemming from the incident, were among the 12 pardons that Parson granted last week, the governor's office said in a statement.

[malchior]

With even more racism context (edited with clearer tweet)

[Skinypupy]

This fucking state...sigh.

2 @UTBoardofEd members are proposing sweeping changes to a rule surrounding #CriticalRaceTheory. In it, the definition of CRT has been expanded so broadly that any discussion of race could potentially be in violation of school board rules.

@NatalieJCline has created a list of more than 100 banned words, like "social change," "inclusion," and "Empathy." that are strictly forbidden.

also, If a teacher teaches any banned content, they will be called before a tribunal style meeting where they will have to answer to board members and parents. #utpol #utleg #uted

[Jaymann]

Word police will be shortly followed by thought police.

[Isgrimnur]

Well, we know that they lack empathy.

[Blackhawk]

And since there is no recognized right to an education, there probably isn't any way to go over their heads.

Keep the people ignorant and you keep them submissive.

[Unagi]

lovely.

can't teach about empathy?

[Skinypupy]

lovely.

can't teach about empathy?

It might influence kids to want to help “those” people, an we just can’t have that.

[LawBeefaroni]

This fucking state...sigh.

2 @UTBoardofEd members are proposing sweeping changes to a rule surrounding #CriticalRaceTheory. In it, the definition of CRT has been expanded so broadly that any discussion of race could potentially be in violation of school board rules.

@NatalieJCline has created a list of more than 100 banned words, like "social change," "inclusion," and "Empathy." that are strictly forbidden.

also, If a teacher teaches any banned content, they will be called before a tribunal style meeting where they will have to answer to board members and parents. #utpol #utleg #uted

This board has difficulty with diversity and race? Shocking!



From the aforementioned Cline's bio:

Natalie Cline has been deeply involved in the fight for religious freedom, pro-life legislation, and family-friendly education policy for the past decade. She has lobbied and testified locally in favor of parental rights, student data privacy, and the protection of our children's innocence. Her work has taken her to the United Nations on several occasions. As a registered nurse, Natalie had the privilege being part of the Utah Hospital Task Force rescue mission to Haiti after the devastating earthquake of 2010. Natalie seeks to restore freedom in America by ensuring every student in Utah is educated in the principles of freedom.

[Jaymann]

Can we get a list of the 100 words? Too bad George Carlin is no longer around.

[malchior]

Insane

[LawBeefaroni]

That's so bad it seems broken. I'd need to see the data.

Not that I don't believe it but I'm not going to get enraged until I can verify.

I can only guess that it's student debt that is the drag on wealth and it's mostly fairly recent debt.

I think a chart showing income would also be important.

[LawBeefaroni]

Yep:

More than 84% of college-educated Black households in their 30s have student debt, up from 35% three decades ago, when many baby boomers were at the same age. The younger generation owes a median of $44,000, up from less than $6,000. By comparison, 53% of white college-educated households in their 30s have debt, up from 27% three decades earlier. The median amount rose to $35,000 from $8,000. All figures are adjusted for inflation.

[malchior]

Yep:

More than 84% of college-educated Black households in their 30s have student debt, up from 35% three decades ago, when many baby boomers were at the same age. The younger generation owes a median of $44,000, up from less than $6,000. By comparison, 53% of white college-educated households in their 30s have debt, up from 27% three decades earlier. The median amount rose to $35,000 from $8,000. All figures are adjusted for inflation.

Though the median amount is only slightly above the national average but more than double the median. It's ugly. Is that less scholarship opportunities? Less support? Predatory schools? Some data indicates blacks in particular often seem to end up in expensive for profit institutions though the data shows blacks are overrepresented in IT and business management degrees. These should pay well but it isn't showing up in net worth. It's complicated, there are likely a lot of confounders, but the macro data is really appalling.

[Smoove_B]

You did it, Senate Republicans. Congrats.

Hilarious and absurd that Senate Republicans are celebrating passing a non-binding amendment to a non-binding resolution that bans Pre-K and K-12 schools from using federal $ to teach college-level education on structural racism. Well done, sir!

[Blackhawk]

Our future depends on raising a generation of kids who love America.

That's a call to state indoctrination if I've ever heard one.

[malchior]

I'll give you one guess who voted with the Republicans to enable this purely ceremonial messaging amendment.

[LordMortis]

Our future depends on raising a generation of kids who love America.

Hmmm... what could possibly be happening to make a generation of kids who don't love America. Hmmm... What are the proximate causes? Why would children look at the word patriot with contempt? Why would they see the American flag as symbol use to enforce lies? I wonder...

[Alefroth]

At this point I'd settle for

Our future depends on raising a generation of kids

[Blackhawk]

Our future depends on raising a generation of kids who love America.

Hmmm... what could possibly be happening to make a generation of kids who don't love America. Hmmm... What are the proximate causes? Why would children look at the word patriot with contempt? Why would they see the American flag as symbol use to enforce lies? I wonder...

Quiet. It doesn't matter. Their future depends on raising a generation of kids who love America. At all costs.

(Also, the "our" in the original quote was the Republican party, not the nation. And "love" apparently means 'not criticizing or questioning.')

[LawBeefaroni]

Our future depends on raising a generation of kids who love America.

That's a call to state indoctrination if I've ever heard one.

Is love built on lies really love? I mean I know it passes for Marriage(tm) but it makes unreliable patriots.

[Holman]

Our future depends on raising a generation of kids who love America.

That's a call to state indoctrination if I've ever heard one.

There aren't enough eye-rolls in the world for Tom Cotton.

He graduated magna cum laude from Harvard in only three years. He *knows* what's wrong with what he's saying about history education.

This kind of cynicism is at least as dangerous as the dumb cunning of a Donald Trump. The worst is yet to come for the GOP.

[malchior]

This is why I'm glad he has not gotten any traction. He likely won't be the great leader. Still that might not stop him from being empowered in a future authoritarian GOP administration.

[Kurth]

Insane

I watched an episode of John Oliver the other night that really opened my eyes to some of the structural causes of the racial wealth gap. It explained a lot about why Black Americans have so little wealth today compared to whites.

I've never really thought reparations were a great idea. Always seemed too divisive and too heavy handed an approach to dealing with historic wrongs.

But after watching John Oliver explain the extent to which wealth in America has been generated by rising home prices and the government sanctioned (led) ways in which Blacks were purposefully excluded from taking part in that wealth generation, I'm not sure any solution other than reparations makes sense.

[malchior]

Right. I haven't seen the segment but I also read recently that black neighborhoods were systematically targeted and destroyed when the highway system was built. The government condemned homes, they split up neighborhoods and made entire areas inaccessible to each other, and they ultimately devalued their property. The current infrastructure bill has some funds (much less than Biden requested naturally) to try to reconnect those neighborhoods and address the changes.

[Kurth]

Right. I haven't seen the segment but I also read recently that black neighborhoods were systematically targeted and destroyed when the highway system was built. The government condemned homes, they split up neighborhoods and made entire areas inaccessible to each other, and they ultimately devalued their property. The current infrastructure bill has some funds (much less than Biden requested naturally) to try to reconnect those neighborhoods and address the changes.

No question that's an issue, but after watching the John Oliver episode I linked to, I can't imagine it's anything like the damage done by the FHA's policies regarding federal backing for mortgages based on racial neighborhood makeup. Entire neighborhoods were devalued and Black buyers shut out of the housing market as a result.

Everyone should watch that episode, especially those, like me, who may have looked sideways at calls for reparations.

[LawBeefaroni]

Insane

I watched an episode of John Oliver the other night that really opened my eyes to some of the structural causes of the racial wealth gap. It explained a lot about why Black Americans have so little wealth today compared to whites.

I've never really thought reparations were a great idea. Always seemed too divisive and too heavy handed an approach to dealing with historic wrongs.

But after watching John Oliver explain the extent to which wealth in America has been generated by rising home prices and the government sanctioned (led) ways in which Blacks were purposefully excluded from taking part in that wealth generation, I'm not sure any solution other than reparations makes sense.

I think calling them reparations is dangerous though. They should be called a start. Maybe "initial remediation". You can't just pay your way out of it with a lump sum.

[malchior]

There is a big realpolitik problem in all this. People call our nation systemically racist for a reason. There is all this shit obviously. It is however a white majority nation. It's a tough sell for a start. Then layer on that our system is constrained by a minority in the white population that is essentially racist or blasé racist -- meaning they don't hate them but don't think they need the help. Any effort to support blacks in this nation leads to massive backlash, anger, and regressive politics. That is what this CRT bullshit is. It is anger at the very idea that we might tell kids the truth about our racism. Big programs are pretty much impossible. They snuck some dollars into the bipartisan bill but it was gutted from the original ask because the Senate is pretty much the central cornerstone in our system of racism. In this environment, the limit of our power to improve things is at an individual level.

[Blackhawk]

Does anyone know of a particularly solid primer on CRT? It isn't something I've looked deeply in to. I've generally accepted it because the people who I agree with other, similar issues on are universally behind it, but I think I want a better understanding.

Digging up such information yourself can be a minefield if you don't know the biases of the presenter.

[Holman]

Does anyone know of a particularly solid primer on CRT? It isn't something I've looked deeply in to. I've generally accepted it because the people who I agree with other, similar issues on are universally behind it, but I think I want a better understanding.

Digging up such information yourself can be a minefield if you don't know the biases of the presenter.

Here's a 14-minute NPR story (transcript provided) on "How CRT went from Harvard Law to Fox News."

Here's a comprehensive summary of the issues and the controversy in The Atlantic.

The most influential "founder" of CRT was Derrick Bell, who wrote both popular works and legal studies on the issues. You can probably find summaries and introductions at Amazon etc. (I think Faces at the Bottom of the Well was his breakout book.)

[malchior]

Ready for a surprise? Though I'm sure the source of the report isn't going to influence many of folks on the right.

[malchior]

Law and order.

[Holman]