The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Zaxxon · Post by **Zaxxon** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 12:17 am

CNN headline: Flynn's downfall means there is now no way for the President to cry 'witch hunt'

CNN: Still adorable.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 2:32 pm

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 2:48 pm

OK, so he just straight-up admitted to obstruction of justice on Twitter.

If he knew Flynn had lied to the FBI, then told Comey to drop the investigation, then fired Comey for not dropping it, well...

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 2:49 pm

Apparently he'll be using the "I am not a smart man" defense.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:01 pm

I think it'll end up being the Chewbacca defense - he has nothing else at this point.

Archinerd · Post by **Archinerd** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:54 pm

Maybe instead of a wall along the Mexican border, he should have proposed a trench. Trump is much better at digging himself some holes.

Zaxxon · Post by **Zaxxon** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:06 pm

Nothing like admitting publicly that you knew for months that an associate had lied to the FBI, and you concealed that fact.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:26 pm

And then specifically asked Comey to lay off Flynn.

Skinypupy · Post by **Skinypupy** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:30 pm

I can't help but wonder if, given the tax bill passing, the useful idiot is reaching the end of his usefulness.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:41 pm

Uhhh...

On Dec. 29, a transition adviser to Mr. Trump, K. T. McFarland, wrote in an email to a colleague that sanctions announced hours before by the Obama administration in retaliation for Russian election meddling were aimed at discrediting Mr. Trump's victory. The sanctions could also make it much harder for Mr. Trump to ease tensions with Russia, "which has just thrown the U.S.A. election to him,"

However:

It is not clear whether Ms. McFarland was saying she believed that the election had in fact been thrown. A White House lawyer said on Friday that she meant only that the Democrats were portraying it that way.

Riiiiight.

From this article.

Scoop20906 · Post by **Scoop20906** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 6:48 pm

There is just too much smoke now. There is more going to come out for sure. And I mean confirmation from Russia of an agreement.

Xmann · Post by **Xmann** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 7:30 pm

he's so narcissists I knew he'd keep on with his big mouth

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Holman · Post by **Holman** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 8:25 pm

I wonder when the Russians will decide that Trump is finally too crippled to deliver anything they want, and they move on to leaking info that makes impeachment and attempted removal more likely.

Anything that destabilizes our institutions is good news for them. At some point a full-blown constitutional crisis (especially if the Deplorables cry Fake News and threaten resistance) will be their best available outcome.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 8:30 pm

But which is more damaging to the nation? Whatever chaos comes from impeachment proceedings or the daily chaos caused by Trump’s tweets? I honestly don’t know.

RunningMn9 · Post by **RunningMn9** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 10:39 pm

Apparently the Trump camp realized that Trump admitted to a felony today on twitter. So now the story is that his lawyer wrote and sent the tweet. Comical.

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malchior · Post by **malchior** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 10:40 pm

I'm not going to post them all but Trump is on a tear tonight. The WH story is that his lawyer wrote the obstruction tweet. Well guess what happens when you have a lawyer draft something for you..and you say it... you own it. What a fucking moron.

And now he is saying the system is rigged against him and they are going after him instead of Hillary. He is back in Hitler's bunker again.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:01 pm

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 8:30 pm But which is more damaging to the nation? Whatever chaos comes from impeachment proceedings or the daily chaos caused by Trump’s tweets? I honestly don’t know.

If their puppet can overturn our democracy, they'll keep playing him. If he's fatally crippled, they'll throw fuel at a constitutional crisis that will make half of our populace lose faith in the system. Putin wins either way, and with very little risk of blowback. This is some evil genius-level stuff here.

Skinypupy · Post by **Skinypupy** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:20 pm

RunningMn9 wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 10:39 pm Apparently the Trump camp realized that Trump admitted to a felony today on twitter. So now the story is that his lawyer wrote and sent the tweet. Comical.

Comical, but with Trump's lawyer, also Comic Sans.

it does bring up an interesting legal point regarding Twitter that perhaps some of you OO lawyer types know the answer to. Can tweets be put forward as evidence in a criminal proceeding? (not just for Trump, but in general) If so, how would it be proven that the person in question actually wrote it? Couldn't they just say, "An intern writes all my tweets"...which is something I've always semi-suspected with Trump anyways.

Zaxxon · Post by **Zaxxon** » Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:32 pm

The interns write the o es that sound like an actual politician. It's pretty simple to tell when Trump has or hasn't written a tweet.

Legally, who knows... I guess we'll find out soonish.

Rip · Post by **Rip** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:34 am

Kraken wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 11:01 pm
Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Sat Dec 02, 2017 8:30 pm But which is more damaging to the nation? Whatever chaos comes from impeachment proceedings or the daily chaos caused by Trump’s tweets? I honestly don’t know.
If their puppet can overturn our democracy, they'll keep playing him. If he's fatally crippled, they'll throw fuel at a constitutional crisis that will make half of our populace lose faith in the system. Putin wins either way, and with very little risk of blowback. This is some evil genius-level stuff here.

Nearly half the populace lost faith in the system many years ago or never had it. One-third hasn't voted since before I was born and these day barely half bother.

Thing is it isn't the system failing them, it is them failing the system.

Voter suppression isn't even needed, voters are self suppressing.

tjg_marantz · Post by **tjg_marantz** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 7:48 am

Early riser.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 8:47 am

That's the kind of doubling down we've come to love.

Of course covering Comey's assertion that Trump asked him to stop investigating Flynn can't possibly be Fake News since we all saw it happen in live senate testimony.

We're close to the claim that this is all one massive conspiracy against him: the MSM, Comey, Mueller, Flynn, and all of us too.

Tell us about the strawberries, Captain Queeg.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:05 am

Oh, he's on a roll now.

He's attacking the FBI, which was apparently "in tatters" under Comey and which participated in conspiracies to protect Hillary from justice.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:10 am

Rip wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:34 am
Nearly half the populace lost faith in the system many years ago or never had it.

I think we're seeing a groundswell of people realizing that this has resulted in such a monumental fuck up as the Mangerine slipping in through the door because they gave up. I suspect we'll see a change over the next few years as they realize they're turning the country over to racists, extremists and oligarchs.

Chaz · Post by **Chaz** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:14 am

Holman wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:05 am Oh, he's on a roll now.

He's attacking the FBI, which was apparently "in tatters" under Comey and which participated in conspiracies to protect Hillary from justice.

He's also started to really lean on people on the Mueller team are biased, and therefore nothing the investigation turned up can be trusted. Look forward to that being his main line of defense when things start to get real.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:17 am

Chaz wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:14 am
Holman wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:05 am Oh, he's on a roll now.

He's attacking the FBI, which was apparently "in tatters" under Comey and which participated in conspiracies to protect Hillary from justice.
He's also started to really lean on people on the Mueller team are biased, and therefore nothing the investigation turned up can be trusted. Look forward to that being his main line of defense when things start to get real.

Of course, Mueller actually *fired* one of his team this week for nothing more than a Trump-critical tweet.

Chaz · Post by **Chaz** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:27 am

Holman wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:17 am
Chaz wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:14 am
Holman wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:05 am Oh, he's on a roll now.

He's attacking the FBI, which was apparently "in tatters" under Comey and which participated in conspiracies to protect Hillary from justice.
He's also started to really lean on people on the Mueller team are biased, and therefore nothing the investigation turned up can be trusted. Look forward to that being his main line of defense when things start to get real.
Of course, Mueller actually *fired* one of his team this week for nothing more than a Trump-critical tweet.

Doesn't matter! He only did that because Trump called him out! If one's bad, you can't trust anyone because they're all tainted!*

*None of this logic applies to Trump or anyone else in the GOP.

Max Peck · Post by **Max Peck** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:58 am

Holman wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:17 am
Chaz wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:14 am
Holman wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:05 am Oh, he's on a roll now.

He's attacking the FBI, which was apparently "in tatters" under Comey and which participated in conspiracies to protect Hillary from justice.
He's also started to really lean on people on the Mueller team are biased, and therefore nothing the investigation turned up can be trusted. Look forward to that being his main line of defense when things start to get real.
Of course, Mueller actually *fired* one of his team this week for nothing more than a Trump-critical tweet.

No, the reason for Strzok 's dismissal was in the news this week but he was removed from the investigation back in July (his transfer was reported at the time, but not the reason for the move, iirc). It was because of private text messages to another individual back in 2016, not public tweets.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 10:22 am

I sorta have a love hate relationship when someone posts something so informative in a twitter thread but IMO this one is worth diving into. I won't paste in the whole thing because it is a pain in the ass but basically she argues that Obama kicking out 35 Russians was a very strong reaction to Russian meddling. She goes on to explain how the Trump administration actions to undermine that were very unusual and should be investigated as potentially criminal.

Holman · Post by **Holman** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 10:31 am

Max Peck wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:58 am
Holman wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:17 am
Chaz wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:14 am
Holman wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 9:05 am Oh, he's on a roll now.

He's attacking the FBI, which was apparently "in tatters" under Comey and which participated in conspiracies to protect Hillary from justice.
He's also started to really lean on people on the Mueller team are biased, and therefore nothing the investigation turned up can be trusted. Look forward to that being his main line of defense when things start to get real.
Of course, Mueller actually *fired* one of his team this week for nothing more than a Trump-critical tweet.
No, the reason for Strzok 's dismissal was in the news this week but he was removed from the investigation back in July (his transfer was reported at the time, but not the reason for the move, iirc). It was because of private text messages to another individual back in 2016, not public tweets.

Thanks. So... even more integrity then.

Meanwhile, Trump this morning has tweeted still another attack on the FBI, implying that it was corrupted by pro-Hillary bias.

For some reason he's very very nervous about the the FBI this morning.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 10:55 am

Your tears (tweets) are delicious.

Combustible Lemur · Post by **Combustible Lemur** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:17 pm

hepcat wrote:
Rip wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:34 am
Nearly half the populace lost faith in the system many years ago or never had it.
I think we're seeing a groundswell of people realizing that this has resulted in such a monumental fuck up as the Mangerine slipping in through the door because they gave up. I suspect we'll see a change over the next few years as they realize they're turning the country over to racists, extremists and oligarchs.

This is interesting to me with the general perception of gen-x and gen-y being scene as overly cynical. Millenials generally seen as much more idealistic. Hmmmm. Sounds like a good sociology research paper.

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Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:30 pm

Combustible Lemur wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 12:17 pmThis is interesting to me with the general perception of gen-x and gen-y being scene as overly cynical. Millenials generally seen as much more idealistic. Hmmmm. Sounds like a good sociology research paper.

I sort of follow this and I think it's important to note they might seem more idealistic, they're also not joining the public sector workforce. It's a cultural issue - the culture of the public sector - that's the problem. And while I can't claim that as a kid I was dreaming of being a public servant, once I found myself in the system, I knew it was for me. So (the theory would be) that if you have a generation of people that doesn't place value on public service...trouble.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 1:32 pm

Trump's lawyer falls on his sword

President Donald Trump's personal lawyer, John Dowd, says he drafted the president's Saturday morning tweet that stated he fired former National Security Adviser Michael Flynn for lying not only to Vice President Mike Pence but also to the FBI.

Skinypupy · Post by **Skinypupy** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 1:37 pm

Defiant wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 1:32 pm Trump's lawyer falls on his sword

President Donald Trump's personal lawyer, John Dowd, says he drafted the president's Saturday morning tweet that stated he fired former National Security Adviser Michael Flynn for lying not only to Vice President Mike Pence but also to the FBI.

Wait a sec. Spicey told us all in no uncertain terms that Trump's Tweets are official White House statements.

So which is it, Mangerine? These are official, or "oops, we were just kidding"? You can't have it both ways.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 1:43 pm

It's still his lawyer and his account. Not much damage actually controlled here.

Ralph-Wiggum · Post by **Ralph-Wiggum** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 3:32 pm

And, of course, there’s no way Trump’s lawyer did any such thing.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 4:06 pm

Setting the stage to fire Rosenstein? Or perhaps Nunes is just continuing his favorite activity--undermining investigations into the Russian interference.

hepcat · Post by **hepcat** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 4:15 pm

Ralph-Wiggum wrote: ↑Sun Dec 03, 2017 3:32 pm And, of course, there’s no way Trump’s lawyer did any such thing.

Of course not. The orange pile of shit will always grab a scapegoat when things go south for him. He really is a detestable scumbag.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Sun Dec 03, 2017 7:50 pm

Apparently there's a potential connection between the N.R.A., Trump and Russia. We are absolutely living in a movie.

A conservative operative trumpeting his close ties to the National Rifle Association and Russia told a Trump campaign adviser last year that he could arrange a back-channel meeting between Donald J. Trump and Vladimir V. Putin, the Russian president, according to an email sent to the Trump campaign.

...

Russia, he wrote, was “quietly but actively seeking a dialogue with the U.S.” and would attempt to use the N.R.A.’s annual convention in Louisville, Ky., to make “ ‘first contact.’ ” The email, which was among a trove of campaign-related documents turned over to investigators on Capitol Hill, was described in detail to The New York Times.

What does it all mean?

Mr. Erickson, a longtime conservative operative who has been involved in several presidential campaigns, presented himself in the email as a well-connected intermediary to the upper reaches of the Russian government. By “happenstance” and the reach of the N.R.A., Mr. Erickson wrote, he had been put in position to “slowly begin cultivating a back-channel to President Putin’s Kremlin” in recent years.

“Russia is quietly but actively seeking a dialogue with the U.S. that isn’t forthcoming under the current administration,” he wrote.

Indeed, evidence does appear to show deep ties between Mr. Erickson, the N.R.A. and the Russian gun rights community that were formed in the years when many American conservatives, put off by the Obama administration’s policies, were increasingly looking to Mr. Putin as an example of a strong leader opposing immigration, terrorism and gay rights.