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The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

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Pyperkub
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Pyperkub » Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:57 pm

Zaxxon wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:58 pm
Kraken wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:56 pm
He doesn't suddenly become credible because he's saying what we want to hear. We already know he's an unreliable narrator.
Indeed. But the receipts sure help.
As well as corroborating witnesses like Weissman.
There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by GreenGoo » Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:58 pm

Kraken wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:56 pm
He doesn't suddenly become credible because he's saying what we want to hear. We already know he's an unreliable narrator.
He's reliable because he's saying what we already knew, not what we wanted to hear. None of this is is a revelation. That's the whole point. The GOP know this as does everyone else.

Tell me the dems would be talking about the semantics of the witness's form if a personal lawyer with over a decade of service to Obama was testifying before Congress against him. There'd be some holdouts I'm sure, but the majority would flee the sinking ship, not because they're disloyal, but because the fucking ship is broken wide open and is sinking.

Tell me how any rational person on either side of the aisle can believe that Cohen is dirty but Drumpf is clean.
Last edited by GreenGoo on Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:04 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Pyperkub » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:04 pm

GreenGoo wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:58 pm
Kraken wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:56 pm
He doesn't suddenly become credible because he's saying what we want to hear. We already know he's an unreliable narrator.
He's reliable because he's saying what we already knew, not what we wanted to know.
Also, this:
Here’s the biggest takeaway from this morning’s hearing: Not a single Republican asked about the many troubling allegations about our president put forward by his former personal attorney. Instead, it was all attack, distract and deflect. Which they learned from the president.
There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Jaymann » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:12 pm

Does Vietnam have an extradition treaty with the US?
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Skinypupy » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:13 pm

Oh yeah, this is totally normal.


Cohen said the Southern District of New York is looking at “other” illegal acts by President Trump that haven’t been raised yet, but that he was asked him not to get into it publicly
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Isgrimnur » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:15 pm

Jaymann wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:12 pm
Does Vietnam have an extradition treaty with the US?
Nope.
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Pyperkub » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:21 pm

Isgrimnur wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:15 pm
Jaymann wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:12 pm
Does Vietnam have an extradition treaty with the US?
Nope.
How about a Trump property? Or is it one of his shithole countries?
There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Grifman » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:25 pm

El Guapo wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 1:48 pm
LOL! Desperation drives you to stupidity!
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Pyperkub » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:27 pm

Kraken wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:56 pm
He doesn't suddenly become credible because he's saying what we want to hear. We already know he's an unreliable narrator.
In addition to the other points, it has also been alleged that some of that "unreliable" narration may have been written by Trump's lawyer, Jay Sekulow in Cohen (and others?) testimony/statements to Congress.
There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Isgrimnur » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:29 pm

Pyperkub wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:21 pm
Isgrimnur wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:15 pm
Jaymann wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:12 pm
Does Vietnam have an extradition treaty with the US?
Nope.
How about a Trump property? Or is it one of his shithole countries?
Pro Publica
The contact with Vietnam was not set up by the State Department. Instead, Trump’s personal lawyer, Marc Kasowitz, helped arrange the call.

Kasowitz had another client with a keen interest in Vietnam: Philip Falcone, an American investor with a major casino outside Ho Chi Minh City. After the Trump call, Kasowitz traveled to Vietnam with Falcone. They met with government officials as part of an effort to persuade Vietnam to lift a ban on gambling for its citizens. Such a shift would deliver vastly more gamblers to Falcone’s casino.
...
Kasowitz has represented Trump for over 15 years, including in the Trump University fraud case, against allegations of sexual harassment, and, most recently, in the Russia investigation.

Falcone, who was barred from the securities industry several years ago after admitting to wrongdoing in managing his hedge fund, has been trying for several years to salvage his several hundred-million-dollar bet on Vietnam’s gaming industry. So far, that investment has not paid off, in large measure because of the rules limiting casinos to foreign bettors.
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by LordMortis » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:31 pm

GreenGoo wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:58 pm
There'd be some holdouts I'm sure, but the majority would flee the sinking ship, not because they're disloyal, but because the fucking ship is broken wide open and is sinking.

All of these open secrets and the ship isn't sinking. McConnell keeps commanding republicans in Congress to bail and the ship stays afloat. Our system is broken. Only 2020 will be a good indicator if we are broken beyond repair. What the consequences are either way? fuqed if I know. Geatz idea of taking consequences of your actions is to have your daddy whitewash your record, become congressman, and lieutenant for a Mob boss of a president. And his district supports him and there's not a damned thing I can do about it.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by GreenGoo » Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:36 pm

LordMortis wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:31 pm
GreenGoo wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 4:58 pm
There'd be some holdouts I'm sure, but the majority would flee the sinking ship, not because they're disloyal, but because the fucking ship is broken wide open and is sinking.

All of these open secrets and the ship isn't sinking.
My reference was to the same situation but with Obama at it's core. It would absolutely sink in that case.

Wtf is going on right now in America is the closest thing to evidence of Kraken's "fall of the American empire" prophecy that I can identify. That it *isn't* sinking because of which side of the aisle it is happening on is my point.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Holman » Wed Feb 27, 2019 6:03 pm

Pyperkub wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:21 pm
Isgrimnur wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:15 pm
Jaymann wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:12 pm
Does Vietnam have an extradition treaty with the US?
Nope.
How about a Trump property? Or is it one of his shithole countries?
Is there a POW/MIA flag for when you DON'T want them home?
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by El Guapo » Wed Feb 27, 2019 6:17 pm

Pyperkub wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:27 pm
Kraken wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:56 pm
He doesn't suddenly become credible because he's saying what we want to hear. We already know he's an unreliable narrator.
In addition to the other points, it has also been alleged that some of that "unreliable" narration may have been written by Trump's lawyer, Jay Sekulow in Cohen (and others?) testimony/statements to Congress.
That's suborning perjury, right? Seems like a crime on its face, if true. Though that supposes that they know it's false when making the edits.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Pyperkub » Wed Feb 27, 2019 7:01 pm

El Guapo wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 6:17 pm
Pyperkub wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 5:27 pm
Kraken wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 3:56 pm
He doesn't suddenly become credible because he's saying what we want to hear. We already know he's an unreliable narrator.
In addition to the other points, it has also been alleged that some of that "unreliable" narration may have been written by Trump's lawyer, Jay Sekulow in Cohen (and others?) testimony/statements to Congress.
That's suborning perjury, right? Seems like a crime on its face, if true. Though that supposes that they know it's false when making the edits.
Like Don Jr's first letter to Congress? Yeah.

Here's some great info on the exchanges:
Cohen asked for copy of audit behind Trump's claim he couldn't release tax returns. Never got it.

Didn't want tax experts to rip apart his tax returns bc he'd get audited.

Gomez points out that suggests he wasn't being audited. Cohen agrees.
GOmez: THey keep beating you up for tax fraud, but they won't ask Trump for his tax returns.
Gomez asks if Trump hires people who will lie and cheat for them.

Cohen: From facts and circumstances the answer is yes...

...
AOC: Did POTUS present inflated assets to insurance?

Cohen: Yes, names who to get the docs from.
Cohen names two other properties where Trump cheated on taxes.
Cohen doesn't know abt NYT allegations on 1990s tax fraud. Says Weisselberg would.
Trump tasked Cohen to find the straw bidder to ensure his painting went for the highest amount on the day.
There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by YellowKing » Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:07 pm

My only consolation is that somehow, someday, the truth will come out. And every one of these GOP ass-kissing toadies will be exposed as the corrupt, fraudulent bunch of shit-weasels they are.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Pyperkub » Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:16 pm

YellowKing wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:07 pm
My only consolation is that somehow, someday, the truth will come out. And every one of these GOP ass-kissing toadies will be exposed as the corrupt, fraudulent bunch of shit-weasels they are.
It is coming out, slowly. Here's the take of one of those ass-kissing toadies:
“The interesting thing is that there hasn’t been one Republican yet who has tried to defend the president on the substance, and I think that’s something that should be concerning to the White House,” Christie noted.

Asking “why are no Republicans standing up and defending the president on the substance” in the hearing, the former Trump transition-team chief added that this is “either a failure of those Republicans on the Hill or a failure of the White House to have a unified strategy with them.”

Christie concluded that they had to know this was coming with Cohen, so it will be a tired line of attack going after Cohen as the hearing continues.

“He’s not a credible witness, but he does have corroboration on certain things,” he asserted, asking once again: “Where is the defense of the president?”
Where indeed?

The fact of the matter is that this is the only refuge of a party which has sold its soul for power and is morally bankrupt.
There are three ways to not tell the truth: lies, damned lies, and statistics.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by LawBeefaroni » Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:29 pm

YellowKing wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:07 pm
My only consolation is that somehow, someday, the truth will come out. And every one of these GOP ass-kissing toadies will be exposed as the corrupt, fraudulent bunch of shit-weasels they are.
No they won't. Not every one, at least.


That's not reason to stop fighting though.
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by GungHo » Thu Feb 28, 2019 1:58 am

Pyperkub wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:16 pm
YellowKing wrote:
Wed Feb 27, 2019 8:07 pm
My only consolation is that somehow, someday, the truth will come out. And every one of these GOP ass-kissing toadies will be exposed as the corrupt, fraudulent bunch of shit-weasels they are.
It is coming out, slowly. Here's the take of one of those ass-kissing toadies:
“The interesting thing is that there hasn’t been one Republican yet who has tried to defend the president on the substance, and I think that’s something that should be concerning to the White House,” Christie noted.

Asking “why are no Republicans standing up and defending the president on the substance” in the hearing, the former Trump transition-team chief added that this is “either a failure of those Republicans on the Hill or a failure of the White House to have a unified strategy with them.”

Christie concluded that they had to know this was coming with Cohen, so it will be a tired line of attack going after Cohen as the hearing continues.

“He’s not a credible witness, but he does have corroboration on certain things,” he asserted, asking once again: “Where is the defense of the president?”
Where indeed?

The fact of the matter is that this is the only refuge of a party which has sold its soul for power and is morally bankrupt.
Well Christie, maybe they aren't standing up on substance because there isn't any substance to stand on? I feel like members of congress would have thought if they had anything legit they'd have gone with it. It's amazing the level of delusion these people have sunk themselves into to find even a glimmer of hope 'their guy' isn't the despotic POS the rest of the world knows him to be.
I'm with YK: I can only hope someday they all take it in the shorts for what they've done but sadly knowing that Lawbeef is right, too.
OR
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Isgrimnur » Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:22 pm

CNN
Two of President Donald Trump's closest allies on the House Judiciary Committee referred Trump's former personal lawyer, Michael Cohen, to the Justice Department Thursday for possible criminal prosecution, claiming to have evidence that Cohen "committed perjury and knowingly made false statements" to lawmakers during his day-long testimony Wednesday.

The criminal referral -- sent by Ohio Rep. Jim Jordan, the top Republican on the Oversight Committee, and North Carolina Republican Rep. Mark Meadows -- outlined several areas of testimony they urged the Justice Department to investigate, including Cohen's claims Wednesday that he did not seek a job in the Trump White House, his denial of committing bank fraud, as well as his assertion that the did not have any reportable contracts with foreign entities.
...
"I was extremely proud to be the personal attorney for the President of the United States of America," Cohen told lawmakers Wednesday. "I did not want to go to the White House."

Yet Republicans have pointed to court filings from prosecutors in the Southern District of New York that stated Cohen "privately told friends and colleagues, including in seized text messages, that he expected to be given a prominent role and title in the new administration" -- an assertion Cohen said Wednesday was "not inaccurate."

"Mr. Cohen's testimony is material to the Committee's assessment of Mr. Cohen's motive to monetize his former association with President Trump," Jordan and Meadows wrote to the Justice Department on Thursday. "It is essential that the Department of Justice investigate these remarkable contradictions between Mr. Cohen, the SDNY prosecutors, and the public accounts of witnesses with firsthand information."
...
Jordan and Meadows also claim that Cohen's testimony that he "never defrauded any bank" was "intentionally false" given that Manhattan prosecutors "specifically referred to Mr. Cohen's crimes of making false statements to financial institutions as 'bank fraud'" in a footnote of his plea agreement.

Cohen pleaded guilty to making false statements to a financial institution, however, not bank fraud, and prosecutors have not alleged that any bank lost money.

The GOP lawmakers additionally accused Cohen of lying about his contacts with foreign entities, a point highlighted by Meadows at Wednesday's hearing. Cohen said he would review the form and amend it if necessary.
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by El Guapo » Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:35 pm

No doubt Meadows and Jordan are deeply concerned about the truth here.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by LordMortis » Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:41 pm

Did they do this when Trump Jr and Kushner lied about their contacts for security clearances or about adoption meetings.

It's too much to hope they all get theirs, but I do. I can't influence the elections of Jordan or Meadows or Geatz or Muvany or DeSantis or Lesko or Nunues or McConnell or Pual. Though I am getting close to making a personal decision to look at commerce provided from their districts and rejecting it. It'll be a big personal decision if I do, even if it is tempest in a TeaPot.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by GreenGoo » Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:43 pm

El Guapo wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:35 pm
No doubt Meadows and Jordan are deeply concerned about the truth here.
Monetize his former association with a dude who's sole focus at all times is monetization of everything, including his family members. Clearly such a motivation besmirches Cohen's character, particularly when the relationship was a business relationship, because the dude in the WH doesn't have friends or acquaintances, just sources of revenue.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by LawBeefaroni » Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:59 pm

El Guapo wrote:
Thu Feb 28, 2019 3:35 pm
No doubt Meadows and Jordan are deeply concerned about the truth here.
Like the saying goes, "Apply zeal for the truth equally or stick it up your own stupid ass."
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Zarathud » Thu Feb 28, 2019 8:19 pm

Accomplice #1 and #2 to Obstruction of Justice (using the Dept of Justice).
"If the facts don't fit the theory, change the facts." - Albert Einstein
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Moliere » Fri Mar 01, 2019 12:52 am


Boom!
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Jaymann » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:44 am

No wonder the Republicans are scared shitless of AOC.
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by GungHo » Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:27 am

Moliere wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 12:52 am

Boom!
Since Cohen was talking about that alleged(I'd hate to say anything bad about this president that wasn't true) tax fraud, does that mean the SDNY has already investigated it? Or is it possible they didn't already know about this (surely not...)?
Be pretty awesome if what took trump down was his getting elected...actually that would still suck but at least we'd get a little schadenfrude.
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Blackhawk » Fri Mar 01, 2019 3:11 am

Wait, somebody asked some relevant questions? I thought they were just going to take turns making speeches. At least that's what I took away from the portion I was able to watch.
[This space left intentionally blank.]

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Holman » Fri Mar 01, 2019 8:39 am

GungHo wrote:
Since Cohen was talking about that alleged(I'd hate to say anything bad about this president that wasn't true) tax fraud, does that mean the SDNY has already investigated it? Or is it possible they didn't already know about this (surely not...)?
Be pretty awesome if what took trump down was his getting elected...actually that would still suck but at least we'd get a little schadenfrude.
Given how under-investigated and under-prosecuted White Collar crime actually is, Trump and his spawn might have continued to thrive on shady deals for the rest of their lives.
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Pyperkub » Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:39 am

Blackhawk wrote:Wait, somebody asked some relevant questions? I thought they were just going to take turns making speeches. At least that's what I took away from the portion I was able to watch.
The dems and Amash actually asked relevant questions.
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by hepcat » Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:45 am

Pyperkub wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:39 am
Blackhawk wrote:Wait, somebody asked some relevant questions? I thought they were just going to take turns making speeches. At least that's what I took away from the portion I was able to watch.
The dems and Amash actually asked relevant questions.
I read that initially as "The dems and Amish", which then lead me down a path of envisioning a group of people in a buggy asking Cohen if Trump purposely inflated the value of any barns he helped raise.
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Remus West » Fri Mar 01, 2019 12:23 pm

hepcat wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:45 am
Pyperkub wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:39 am
Blackhawk wrote:Wait, somebody asked some relevant questions? I thought they were just going to take turns making speeches. At least that's what I took away from the portion I was able to watch.
The dems and Amash actually asked relevant questions.
I read that initially as "The dems and Amish", which then lead me down a path of envisioning a group of people in a buggy asking Cohen if Trump purposely inflated the value of any barns he helped raise.
You my friend have a most powerful imagination. I can only wonder at the ability it takes to be able to envision a world in which Trump actually did any work.
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by LawBeefaroni » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:18 pm

hepcat wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:45 am
Pyperkub wrote:
Fri Mar 01, 2019 10:39 am
Blackhawk wrote:Wait, somebody asked some relevant questions? I thought they were just going to take turns making speeches. At least that's what I took away from the portion I was able to watch.
The dems and Amash actually asked relevant questions.
I read that initially as "The dems and Amish", which then lead me down a path of envisioning a group of people in a buggy asking Cohen if Trump purposely inflated the value of any barns he helped raise.
How now, English?
Ben Walters, Amish PAC co-founder, said they knew Donald Trump, the president-elect, was going to win Ohio so the organization shifted its focus to Pennsylvania, where more than 500 volunteers helped register Amish and Mennonite voters and drive them to the polls on Election Day.

...

He said Pennsylvania is the state that put Trump over the 270 electoral college votes needed to win the election.

“Trump won by just a razor thin margin across Pennsylvania,” said Walters, who said the Amish votes helped and that he doesn’t think Trump would have won Pennsylvania “if it hadn’t been for the Amish vote.”

“Trump’s margin of victory in Pennsylvania was identical to the Amish population of Pennsylvania. Again, I’m not claiming every single Amish person voted, but without the votes of those who went to the polls that day…a recount would have been likely,” Walters said.
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by hepcat » Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:13 pm

Welp, I never thought it would happen. But I now agree with JeffV. The Amish suck.
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Isgrimnur
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by Isgrimnur » Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:19 pm

Silver - 2k

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El Guapo
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by El Guapo » Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:22 pm

I never thought I would see such virulent anti-amitism on this board.

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by hepcat » Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:28 pm

I had always believed they were basically good people. But now?

Let's just say I have my suspicions as to whether or not they're responsible for the Hillary email hack.
I beat a camel to death with a monkey. Can I do that?
-Mr Bismarck

You have to whack a few rabbits before you are ready to punch a camel.
-Coopasonic

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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by pr0ner » Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:29 pm

Hodor.

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stessier
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Re: The Trump Investigation(s) Thread

Post by stessier » Fri Mar 01, 2019 2:40 pm

Can you summarize as I have no idea what to make of that (or even what I'm looking at) from a brief scan.
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