Octopus Overlords

Posted: **Fri May 10, 2019 11:47 am**

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Fri May 10, 2019 11:39 am
And it comes after Mr. Trump spent more than half of his term facing questions about whether his 2016 campaign conspired with a foreign power.

It would seem the 2020 investigation should be considerably shorter.

Posted: **Fri May 10, 2019 11:53 am**

stessier wrote: ↑Fri May 10, 2019 11:47 am
Smoove_B wrote: ↑Fri May 10, 2019 11:39 am
And it comes after Mr. Trump spent more than half of his term facing questions about whether his 2016 campaign conspired with a foreign power.

It would seem the 2020 investigation should be considerably shorter.

Well they DID conspire with a foreign power, and they got away with it. Why not do it again?

Posted: **Fri May 10, 2019 12:13 pm**

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Fri May 10, 2019 11:39 am this is happening, because nothing matters.

This is happening because our system has no defense against this onslaught. To be fair, maybe no system would. To those who will point out that technically we have Congress...in reality we don't. Sure it has a Constitutional role but many of us just have not woken up to it being gutted by the Republicans. If you really sit back and think about it, it has been dysfunctional for many of us here their entire adult lives ; we've just been boiled for so long.

Kraken wrote: ↑Fri May 10, 2019 11:53 amWell they DID conspire with a foreign power, and they got away with it. Why not do it again?

Mueller didn't uncover the conspiracy - he just reported they didn't care that they were getting the help. I guess that is somehow better.

Posted: **Fri May 10, 2019 12:35 pm**

The Senate broke congress. We suffer the tyranny of the minority because of it.

Posted: **Fri May 10, 2019 9:01 pm**

Only the best subpoenas.

Posted: **Fri May 10, 2019 9:26 pm**

A good look at what's happening and where it's going, including analysis of protective executive privilege:

The last few days have seen a whiplash-worthy series of actions between Congress and the executive branch, with battles over subpoenas, threats of contempt and even cries of constitutional crisis. These events may seem bewildering to a casual observer of this dysfunctional relationship. So it’s worth slowing down, rewinding the tape, and taking a look at how the two branches got to this point...

...Nadler sent letters to Barr requesting to negotiate ways to meet the committee’s needs and explaining his views in correspondence sent on March 25, April 1, April 11, April 19 and May 3. In the May 3 letter, Nadler indicated a willingness to prioritize a defined set of underlying documents for immediate production—witness interview notes (so-called “302s”) referenced in the Mueller report. Nadler also stated his willingness to negotiate ways to limit and prioritize the broad request for the underlying materials and asked Barr to make a good faith effort to comply with the subpoena the morning of May 6.

On May 6, having received no response from Barr, Nadler issued a public notice of a meeting to mark up a contempt resolution on Wednesday, May 8. After the notification of the markup, the department proposed a meeting to try to negotiate

More on Protective Executive Privilege:

The assertion of privilege is not an actual “conclusive” assertion of executive privilege; it is only a “protective” assertion. As the Department of Justice’s letter to the committee explained, “this protective assertion of executive privilege ensures the President’s ability to make a final decision whether to assert privilege following a full review of these materials.” In other words, the president has asserted executive privilege in order to be able to determine whether to assert executive privilege. What does that even mean? And why would the administration take such an action? A bit of background helps explain what is really happening here...

...As I and others have explained, only certain categories of information fall within the scope of executive privilege. In general, those categories are presidential communications, sensitive law enforcement information, internal deliberations, confidential national security or diplomatic information (including classified information), and attorney-client information. Given that the special counsel’s investigation included criminal and counterintelligence components, it is not surprising that Barr’s letter suggests the subpoenaed materials “include law enforcement information, information about sensitive intelligence sources and methods.” The special counsel’s office assisted in making redactions to protect this type of material, which implicates the law enforcement and national security information components of executive privilege. Some of the categories of redacted material, however, do not fall within traditional executive privilege components. In particular, grand jury material has never itself been considered a component of executive privilege.

Posted: **Mon May 13, 2019 8:02 am**

A thread from Trump last night where he quotes far right loon Tom Fitton of Judicial Watch to attack FBI Director Wray.

Just another abuse of power in a long series of abuses of power by the Democrats that began during the Obama Administration, continued through the Mueller FBI operation, & now the baton has been passed to Jerry Nadler to continue to abuse power to harass President Trump and the Democrat National Committee-The Democrat Party apparatus-has been caught using donor Dollars to Collude with Russian Intelligence to attack a domestic political opponent (me). The FBI has no leadership. The Director is protecting the same gang.....that tried to overthrow the President through an illegal coup.” (Recommended by previous DOJ) @TomFitton @JudicialWatch

Posted: **Mon May 13, 2019 9:51 am**

I love that most of the time he talks like Mongo from Blazing Saddles, always referring to himself in the third person.

Posted: **Sat May 18, 2019 5:03 pm**

Admirable honesty and patriotism from Republican representative Justin Amash.

Thread:

This makes him the first in the GOP to call this what it is.

Posted: **Sat May 18, 2019 5:17 pm**

I'd say it makes him one of the few on either side being that clear and assertive.

Posted: **Sat May 18, 2019 6:16 pm**

Holman wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2019 5:03 pm Admirable honesty and patriotism from Republican representative Justin Amash.

Thread:

This makes him the first in the GOP to call this what it is.

I like him a lot. While he represents my district I have never voted for him, but I might some day. I attended one of his town hall meetings and came away with a very favorable impression. Too bad about that "R" next to his name, for now at least.

Posted: **Sat May 18, 2019 6:27 pm**

Alefroth wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2019 5:17 pm I'd say it makes him one of the few on either side being that clear and assertive.

Disagree. A lot of Dems are calling for impeachment or public-investigation-towards-impeachment.

Pelosi is pumping the brakes, but it's still possible that her strategy is the latter.

Posted: **Sat May 18, 2019 6:30 pm**

Z-Corn wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2019 6:16 pm
Holman wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2019 5:03 pm Admirable honesty and patriotism from Republican representative Justin Amash.

Thread:

This makes him the first in the GOP to call this what it is.
I like him a lot. While he represents my district I have never voted for him, but I might some day. I attended one of his town hall meetings and came away with a very favorable impression. Too bad about that "R" next to his name, for now at least.

I want to believe that the R Party will come to its senses one day and become the reasonable and principled (if wrongheaded) opponent that it was until the 1980s. I don't believe it, but I want to. Our system only succeeds when everyone stays within its rules.

Posted: **Sat May 18, 2019 6:50 pm**

Kraken wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2019 6:30 pm I want to believe that the R Party will come to its senses one day and become the reasonable and principled (if wrongheaded) opponent that it was until the 1980s. I don't believe it, but I want to. Our system only succeeds when everyone stays within its rules.

There's too much partisan gain to be had by ignoring the rules.

It's genuinely surprising that it took our Republic 230 years to figure that out.

Spoiler:

Posted: **Sat May 18, 2019 6:59 pm**

The Republican party will only shift when they start losing elections *despite* their corruption, gerrymandering, etc. It's bound to happen sooner or later, since I don't see the progressives shrinking. But it could take decades.

Posted: **Sat May 18, 2019 9:35 pm**

Kraken wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2019 6:30 pm
Z-Corn wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2019 6:16 pm
Holman wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2019 5:03 pm Admirable honesty and patriotism from Republican representative Justin Amash.

Thread:

This makes him the first in the GOP to call this what it is.
I like him a lot. While he represents my district I have never voted for him, but I might some day. I attended one of his town hall meetings and came away with a very favorable impression. Too bad about that "R" next to his name, for now at least.
I want to believe that the R Party will come to its senses one day and become the reasonable and principled (if wrongheaded) opponent that it was until the 1980s. I don't believe it, but I want to. Our system only succeeds when everyone stays within its rules.

And I have lived, as you very well know my friend, in the heart of this inbred and ingrained hardcore "R" world my entire life. Just because Amash chose an "R" path in his political career absolutely means he can not sway me to his party. I might respect the man but he can't transcend the affiliation.

I fear (and hope?) he will soon be chewed up and spit out.

Either way, I'll probably drink a beer with him someday. Because all politics are local.

Posted: **Sat May 18, 2019 9:50 pm**

YellowKing wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2019 6:59 pm The Republican party will only shift when they start losing elections *despite* their corruption, gerrymandering, etc. It's bound to happen sooner or later, since I don't see the progressives shrinking. But it could take decades.

They will end elections before they will allow that to happen. Most citizens think they're a hassle anyway.

Posted: **Sun May 19, 2019 7:43 am**

That was certainly brave of Amash - now we wait and see how bad it gets for him.

Posted: **Sun May 19, 2019 8:18 am**

He's from, what, Grand Rapids?

Ballotpedia shows Amash being re-elected very safely in the past few cycles.

The larger county went Trump 47.7 to Clinton 44.6 in 2016. Amash's own numbers were much better than Trump's. He seems personally popular, so it seems possible that he could survive this.

I guess the question isn't the general election but whether the GOP primaries him out.

Posted: **Sun May 19, 2019 11:40 am**

Holman wrote: ↑Sun May 19, 2019 8:18 am I guess the question isn't the general election but whether the GOP primaries him out.

...or whether he starts a renegade movement. GR is a conservative, bible-thumping, staunchly Republican city, but I can't imagine that its citizens are very fond of Trump's debauchery. If its rep can survive making a stand for truth, justice, and the American way, so can others. It's a ray of hope, anyway.

Posted: **Sun May 19, 2019 11:55 am**

Romney has publicly been supportive of the above Republican, so that's two.

Ok, never mind then.

Posted: **Sun May 19, 2019 12:50 pm**

You don't say...
Anti-money laundering specialists at Deutsche Bank recommended in 2016 and 2017 that multiple transactions involving legal entities controlled by Donald Trump and his son-in-law, Jared Kushner, be reported to a federal financial-crimes watchdog

The transactions, some of which involved Mr. Trump’s now-defunct foundation, set off alerts in a computer system designed to detect illicit activity… Compliance staff members who then reviewed the transactions prepared so-called suspicious activity reports that they believed should be sent to a unit of the Treasury Department that polices financial crimes.

But executives at Deutsche Bank, which has lent billions of dollars to the Trump and Kushner companies, rejected their employees’ advice. The reports were never filed with the government.

Posted: **Sun May 19, 2019 2:04 pm**

Posted: **Sun May 19, 2019 2:11 pm**

Holman wrote: ↑Sun May 19, 2019 2:04 pm

Courage is not binary. Every person not running into a burning house to save a cat is not a coward.

Posted: **Sun May 19, 2019 2:43 pm**

It is always fun and right to mock Mitt Romney for his inadequate measures.

No exceptions.

Posted: **Mon May 20, 2019 10:26 am**

Holman wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2019 6:50 pm
Kraken wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2019 6:30 pm I want to believe that the R Party will come to its senses one day and become the reasonable and principled (if wrongheaded) opponent that it was until the 1980s. I don't believe it, but I want to. Our system only succeeds when everyone stays within its rules.
There's too much partisan gain to be had by ignoring the rules.

It's genuinely surprising that it took our Republic 230 years to figure that out.

Spoiler:

He is only the end of the road, not the one thatput the Rs there. Newt destroyed Democracy.

Posted: **Mon May 20, 2019 11:02 am**

Holman wrote: ↑Sat May 18, 2019 6:27 pm Disagree. A lot of Dems are calling for impeachment or public-investigation-towards-impeachment.

Pelosi is pumping the brakes, but it's still possible that her strategy is the latter.

Her strategy is to investigate and if anything unbelievably daring comes up grudgingly allow impeachment to proceed. However, absent that, the strategy is to win back the presidency, at best, and hold the House, at worst.

Posted: **Mon May 20, 2019 11:24 am**

malchior wrote: ↑Sun May 19, 2019 7:43 am That was certainly brave of Amash - now we wait and see how bad it gets for him.

I had not idea until last week but it looks like Trump has been going after him through proxy for a good while now. I learned this when I learned he had a social media guy who is his longest tenured presidential advisor. So I rather doubt it will get worse.

That said, it could turn ugly for the president. Michigan conservatism that is still conservative after Trump's election love Amash. He is the guy they point to when they need to make an appeal to "I don't care what side you're on". Amash attacks very realistically could shift Michigan's electoral votes from red to blue. If the state is that close, that could tip the scales.

I am both not a fan of and respect Amash. I don't know how that's possible but it is. I fear he's too caught in the Rand virtue of selfishness libertarianism but I think he does it from a much more rational place than 99% of those blinded by it. He's what all the lies told have sold Paul Ryan or Rand Paul as.

Posted: **Mon May 20, 2019 11:59 am**

malchior wrote: ↑Sun May 19, 2019 7:43 am That was certainly brave of Amash - now we wait and see how bad it gets for him.

If you had "two days", collect your prize:

Two days after Republican U.S. Rep. Justin Amash said President Donald Trump “engaged in impeachable conduct,” a state representative from Montcalm County has announced he will attempt to unseat Amash in the August 2020 Republican primary.

“I am a Pro-Trump, Pro-Life, Pro-Jobs, Pro-2nd Amendment, Pro-Family Values Republican,” Jim Lower, R-Greenville, said in a statement. “Congressman Justin Amash tweets yesterday calling for President Trump’s impeachment show how out of touch he is with the truth and how out of touch he is with people he represents.”

Posted: **Mon May 20, 2019 12:23 pm**

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 11:59 am“I am a PRAISE JESUS! Republican,” Jim Lower, R-Greenville, said in a statement. “Congressman Justin Amash tweets yesterday calling for President Trump’s impeachment show how out of touch he is with our truth and how out of touch he is with people we need to remain ignorant.”

How it reads to me.

Posted: **Mon May 20, 2019 3:29 pm**

YellowKing wrote:The Republican party will only shift when they start losing elections *despite* their corruption, gerrymandering, etc. It's bound to happen sooner or later, since I don't see the progressives shrinking. But it could take decades.

Yeah, probably decades (if they don't maintain control and turn us into a theocracy).

Especially as it looks like they will re - nominate Roy Moore in Alabama.

Posted: **Mon May 20, 2019 4:04 pm**

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 11:59 am
malchior wrote: ↑Sun May 19, 2019 7:43 am That was certainly brave of Amash - now we wait and see how bad it gets for him.
If you had "two days", collect your prize:

Two days after Republican U.S. Rep. Justin Amash said President Donald Trump “engaged in impeachable conduct,” a state representative from Montcalm County has announced he will attempt to unseat Amash in the August 2020 Republican primary.

“I am a Pro-Trump, Pro-Life, Pro-Jobs, Pro-2nd Amendment, Pro-Family Values Republican,” Jim Lower, R-Greenville, said in a statement. “Congressman Justin Amash tweets yesterday calling for President Trump’s impeachment show how out of touch he is with the truth and how out of touch he is with people he represents.”

I do not doubt the machine will fund a challenger [huge but even if a challenger wins and I don't think they will, the damage will be done to Trump's winnability in state which he only got by a narrow margin. Amash standing against the president literally on principle will pull many of those stand on principle and voted for Trump anyway away from the POtuS. Libertarian Michiganders not dragged down by religious dogma <3 Amash.

Posted: **Mon May 20, 2019 5:55 pm**

LordMortis wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 4:04 pm I do not doubt the machine will fund a challenger [huge but even if a challenger wins and I don't think they will, the damage will be done to Trump's winnability in state which he only got by a narrow margin. Amash standing against the president literally on principle will pull many of those stand on principle and voted for Trump anyway away from the POtuS. Libertarian Michiganders not dragged down by religious dogma <3 Amash.

Narrator in 2020: Amash was "primary-ed" easily.

Posted: **Mon May 20, 2019 10:44 pm**

LordMortis wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 4:04 pm Libertarian Michiganders not dragged down by religious dogma <3 Amash.

Both of them?

Posted: **Mon May 20, 2019 10:49 pm**

El Guapo wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 10:44 pm
LordMortis wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 4:04 pm Libertarian Michiganders not dragged down by religious dogma <3 Amash.
Both of them?

They're his parents. They don't really get a choice.

Posted: **Tue May 21, 2019 1:29 am**

Pyperkub wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 3:29 pm
YellowKing wrote:The Republican party will only shift when they start losing elections *despite* their corruption, gerrymandering, etc. It's bound to happen sooner or later, since I don't see the progressives shrinking. But it could take decades.
Yeah, probably decades (if they don't maintain control and turn us into a theocracy).

We won't be a theocracy. We'll be a plutocratic oligarchy that manipulates it's religious base with a theocracy on a stick.

Posted: **Tue May 21, 2019 7:40 am**

The twitterverse is telling me that the judge hearing the appeal of the Mazar's case is...

...Merrick Garland.

Posted: **Tue May 21, 2019 8:59 am**

El Guapo wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 10:44 pm
LordMortis wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 4:04 pm Libertarian Michiganders not dragged down by religious dogma <3 Amash.
Both of them?

There are a lot here. And I don't doubt they all voted for Trump in 2016.

GreenGoo wrote: ↑Mon May 20, 2019 10:49 pm They're his parents. They don't really get a choice.

Sadly no. I'm beginning to fear for mom. I want her to be happy, so I won't ever interfere with her happy, much in the way my parents never indoctrinated their children in to their religious beliefs. It makes me happy that she has found a comfort in her church. It makes me sad that she gives so much of herself to that church. Churches seem to be financial, temporal, and emotional sponges with infinite absorption. My mom is such a good person. She is ripe for being taken advantage of by those she cares about. It's a strength within our family because we carry the corollary trait that we don't take advantage others. It can be considerable weakness from outside the family. My dad isn't so much libertarian or religious as he is influenced by the all of the right propaganda for the Fox News and talk radio listeners around him. Mom is not Trump supporter. She see him for what he is. She *would* support Pence though. Dad needs a path away from propaganda but his outlet to people is mom's siblings and their spouses. And let's just say not all of them aren't deplorable. Some of them I can't be in the same room with any more.

Posted: **Tue May 21, 2019 9:31 am**

I meant Amash's parents.

Posted: **Tue May 21, 2019 9:33 am**

Zaxxon wrote: ↑Tue May 21, 2019 7:40 am The twitterverse is telling me that the judge hearing the appeal of the Mazar's case is...

...Merrick Garland.

I can't wait to hear how Trump colors this judge as completely biased against him.

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