Amazon has whacked our affiliate account. Hosting Donations/Commitments $2063 of $1920 (Sept 13/18). In Hand $1466 (Lump sum payments minus paypal graft). Paypal Donation Link Here

Turkey

For discussion of religion and politics

Moderators: LawBeefaroni, $iljanus

Post Reply
User avatar
Isgrimnur
Posts: 56791
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:29 am
Location: Dallas, TX
Contact:
Isgrimnur’s avatar
Offline

Turkey

Post by Isgrimnur » Mon Aug 13, 2018 12:09 pm

We need a Turkey thread.

WaPo
On Friday, the Turkish lira suffered its biggest one-day devaluation in nearly two decades, dropping more than 14 percent against the dollar. The minister of finance — the son-in-law of Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan — couldn’t avert the slide, delivering a halting speech that did little to boost confidence.

But Erdogan, as he so often does, placed the blame on a foreign scapegoat: the United States.

“Shame on you, shame on you,” he declared at a rally. "You are swapping your strategic partner in NATO for a pastor.”

The pastor in question is Andrew Brunson, an American clergyman who has been in Turkish custody since 2016. He is charged with espionage and other crimes — charges that he and U.S. officials reject. Attempts to win his freedom have so far failed.

According to my colleagues, Ankara hoped to swap Brunson for Hakan Atilla, a banker convicted in the United States for his role in a scheme that skirted U.S. sanctions on Iranian oil. But the Trump administration resents Turkey’s use of Brunson as a political hostage. A high-level meeting in Washington last week with a visiting Turkish delegation ended abruptly after the Americans demanded the pastor’s immediate release.

President Trump then announced increased tariffs on Turkish aluminum and steel, which sent the value of the lira plummeting to a historic low. Turkey’s economic woes are of its own making, but the tariffs made things worse — and Trump was only too happy to take credit.
Silver - 3k

People who are wrong often get mad at people who are right. (I have surprisingly never been shot.) (h/t Kevin Underhill, Lowering the Bar)

User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 37537
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Turkey

Post by GreenGoo » Mon Aug 13, 2018 4:41 pm

I'm conflicted. On the one hand, it's very satisfying watching Erdogan lose his shit as the lire plummets and no amount of nationalistic gibberish can stop it. I hate Erdogan and watching him splutter and bleat has been awesome.

On the other hand, this can only be seen as a win for Drumpf, and I hate Drumpf even more. I expect Turkey to embrace an authoritarian despite years of democratic progress. I did not expect the US to follow suit.

I'll have to settle for watching Erdogan squirm powerlessly as his economy burns.

User avatar
Kraken
Posts: 32645
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
Location: The Hub of the Universe
Contact:
Kraken’s avatar
Offline

Re: Turkey

Post by Kraken » Mon Aug 13, 2018 11:03 pm

And I'm confused. Why did Trump and Erdogan stop being BFFs? Weren't they goose-stepping through the tulips before this row?

User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 37537
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Turkey

Post by GreenGoo » Mon Aug 13, 2018 11:30 pm

Kraken wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 11:03 pm
And I'm confused. Why did Trump and Erdogan stop being BFFs? Weren't they goose-stepping through the tulips before this row?
That's a good question. I've been assuming this is Pence's work, mainly because a Christian minister imprisoned before Drumpf was elected would normally be below Drumpf's notice.

User avatar
El Guapo
Posts: 30997
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2005 4:01 pm
Location: Boston

Re: Turkey

Post by El Guapo » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:34 am

GreenGoo wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 11:30 pm
Kraken wrote:
Mon Aug 13, 2018 11:03 pm
And I'm confused. Why did Trump and Erdogan stop being BFFs? Weren't they goose-stepping through the tulips before this row?
That's a good question. I've been assuming this is Pence's work, mainly because a Christian minister imprisoned before Drumpf was elected would normally be below Drumpf's notice.
Apparently Brunson is a cause celebre among Trump's evangelical base, which is presumably how this became a thing.

I don't doubt that Trump and Erdogan will be BFFs again in a month or two.

User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 37537
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Turkey

Post by GreenGoo » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:41 am

Erdogan is not going back to bff's. His economy is in shambles and he has been humiliated on the national stage.

And the economic damage isn't over yet. Turkey is in real trouble (unlike Canada under Saudi's attacks). You don't forgive something like this easily.

Erdogan is a real tyrant so I'm glad he's losing face. The country itself is taking a beating though and a lot of innocent people are being economically hurt. That's a little harder to celebrate.

User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 37537
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Turkey

Post by GreenGoo » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:43 am

Erdogan is not going back to bff's. His economy is in shambles and he has been humiliated on the national stage.

The powerlessness he feels is causing him to lose his shit (which is awesome to watch).

And the economic damage isn't over yet. Turkey is in real trouble (unlike Canada under Saudi's attacks). You don't forgive something like this easily.

Erdogan is a real tyrant so I'm glad he's losing face. The country itself is taking a beating though and a lot of innocent people are being economically hurt. That's a little harder to celebrate.

User avatar
Kraken
Posts: 32645
Joined: Tue Oct 12, 2004 11:59 pm
Location: The Hub of the Universe
Contact:
Kraken’s avatar
Offline

Re: Turkey

Post by Kraken » Tue Aug 14, 2018 9:51 am

Haven't we always been at war with Eastasia?

User avatar
Isgrimnur
Posts: 56791
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:29 am
Location: Dallas, TX
Contact:
Isgrimnur’s avatar
Offline

Re: Turkey

Post by Isgrimnur » Tue Aug 14, 2018 4:35 pm

WaPo
President Recep Tayyip Erdogan said Tuesday that Turkey would boycott U.S.-made electronic products, escalating a feud with the Trump administration that has contributed to the rapid decline of the Turkish currency.
...
“We are going to apply a boycott on America’s electronic products,” Erdogan said Tuesday during a televised speech, adding that there were alternatives, produced
by South Korean or Turkish companies. He did not say when the boycott would start or how it would be enforced.

“If they have the iPhone, there is Samsung on the other side,” he said, referring to the phone by Apple that became closely associated with Erdogan himself two years ago when he used the device’s FaceTime feature to rally citizens during a coup attempt.
Silver - 3k

People who are wrong often get mad at people who are right. (I have surprisingly never been shot.) (h/t Kevin Underhill, Lowering the Bar)

User avatar
GreenGoo
Posts: 37537
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 10:46 pm
Location: Ottawa, ON

Re: Turkey

Post by GreenGoo » Tue Aug 21, 2018 8:54 am

Just read a state-run op-ed piece in a Turkey paper. Well, a translated one.

Good lord, I don't know who it was written for, but it was hilarious in the amount of winning Turkey is doing, how Drumpf has played right into Erdogan's hands, and how the rest of NATO should step into protect one of it's members.

Also how Brunson should get off his ass and demand Drumpf stay out the Turkey justice system. Brunson is the Christian Pastor central to the issue for those not paying attention.

It's...Drumpf era worthy in its denial of reality.

User avatar
Isgrimnur
Posts: 56791
Joined: Sun Oct 15, 2006 12:29 am
Location: Dallas, TX
Contact:
Isgrimnur’s avatar
Offline

Re: Turkey

Post by Isgrimnur » Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:23 pm

WaPo
A Turkish court on Friday convicted American pastor Andrew Brunson of aiding terrorism but sentenced him to time served and ordered his immediate release.
...
In Washington on Friday, Jay Sekulow, an attorney working for Brunson’s family and involved in pushing for his release, said the pastor had been released to the custody of U.S. diplomatic officials and would be flown to a U.S. air base in Germany. There, his health would be evaluated and eventually he would be flown back to the United States, Sekulow said.
...
Within minutes of the verdict, President Trump tweeted, “working very hard on Pastor Brunson.”

“PASTOR BRUNSON JUST RELEASED,” he tweeted later. “WILL BE HOME SOON!”
...
In recent months, the administration made the pastor’s release a priority, and in August, the United States imposed sanctions on two senior Turkish cabinet ministers as a way to pressure authorities here.

Turkish President Recep Tayyip Erdogan had said that his government could not interfere in a judicial case. But U.S. officials said Thursday that an agreement between the two sides to free Brunson was negotiated on the sidelines of the U.N. General Assembly last month.

The deal, they said, would include the lifting of U.S. sanctions in exchange for reduced charges that would allow Brunson to either be sentenced to time served or serve any remaining sentence in the United States.

Turkish prosecutors had sought a 35-year sentence for Brunson, whom they accused of spying and supporting terrorists under the cover of humanitarian aid and interfaith dialogue. That request was later reduced to 10 years at the trial.
Silver - 3k

People who are wrong often get mad at people who are right. (I have surprisingly never been shot.) (h/t Kevin Underhill, Lowering the Bar)

User avatar
Unagi
Posts: 16191
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 5:14 pm
Location: Chicago

Re: Turkey

Post by Unagi » Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:28 pm

I wonder how this dovetails with the bugged torture/murder audio release.

kinda an 'all in' move by Turkey it feels like.

malchior
Posts: 7964
Joined: Wed Oct 13, 2004 12:58 pm

Re: Turkey

Post by malchior » Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:45 pm

I think those are coincidental. That deal was likely struck well before the Khashoggi incident.

User avatar
Holman
Posts: 19265
Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2004 8:00 pm
Location: Approximately Wissahickon

Re: Turkey

Post by Holman » Fri Oct 12, 2018 5:53 pm

I wonder what we're giving Turkey in exchange. This release gives Trump an October win to parade for his base, and Ankara clearly knows how valuable that is.

As it happens, Turkey is holding other Americans as well, but none of them are a cause célèbre like Brunson.
Much prefer my Nazis Nuremberged.

User avatar
em2nought
Posts: 2868
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 5:48 am

Re: Turkey

Post by em2nought » Sat Oct 13, 2018 11:52 am

I'm hoping to get one for about $0.39 per pound this Thanksgiving. :wink:
Remember, remember this 6th of November that a little white lie to your significant other about whom you voted for is perfectly acceptable. ;)

User avatar
naednek
Posts: 8647
Joined: Tue Oct 19, 2004 9:23 pm

Re: Turkey

Post by naednek » Sat Oct 13, 2018 4:55 pm

So the recently freed pastor and his wife prayed with Trump, and the first thing Trump asks after the prayer, Who did you vote for?

Jesus, the guy can't be more of a self serving, egotistical asshole.
hepcat - "I agree with Naednek"

User avatar
em2nought
Posts: 2868
Joined: Fri Oct 15, 2004 5:48 am

Re: Turkey

Post by em2nought » Sat Oct 13, 2018 6:01 pm

naednek wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 4:55 pm
So the recently freed pastor and his wife prayed with Trump, and the first thing Trump asks after the prayer, Who did you vote for?

Jesus, the guy can't be more of a self serving, egotistical asshole.
Trump's slipping, he should have gotten in the fact he didn't pay a $1.8 billion ransom either. :wink:
Remember, remember this 6th of November that a little white lie to your significant other about whom you voted for is perfectly acceptable. ;)

User avatar
Default
Posts: 5896
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 9:01 pm
Location: In the Fozzie, somewhere in the buckwheat

Re: Turkey

Post by Default » Sat Oct 13, 2018 8:45 pm

Yeah, with his negotiating skills, it was 2.3 billion.
"pcp, lsd, thc, tgb...it's all good." ~ Kraken

Post Reply