Corona Virus: It's a Marathon, Not a Sprint

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Tue Dec 01, 2020 5:56 pm

Lassr wrote: ↑Tue Dec 01, 2020 12:21 pm We just got notification to see if we (MSFC) had the capability to store vaccines at -92F. Wow, that is cold.

Imagine getting the jab before it's brought up to temperature.

I got a flu shot once that was still at fridge temps. Hurt like hell. Last time I volunteered for the pharmacy residents.

pr0ner · Post by **pr0ner** » Wed Dec 02, 2020 2:29 pm

Huh.

YellowKing · Post by **YellowKing** » Wed Dec 02, 2020 2:36 pm

What does the under 40 have to do with anything? Asking out of genuine curiosity. I realize younger people are prone to be asymptomatic, but it seems like a sort of arbitrary cutoff. Shouldn't anyone who gathered with a bunch of people outside the home assume they're infected?

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Wed Dec 02, 2020 2:39 pm

YellowKing wrote: ↑Wed Dec 02, 2020 2:36 pm What does the under 40 have to do with anything? Asking out of genuine curiosity. I realize younger people are prone to be asymptomatic, but it seems like a sort of arbitrary cutoff. Shouldn't anyone who gathered with a bunch of people outside the home assume they're infected?

It has to be linked to the higher odds of asymptomatic infection. Like, I think the general assumption is that anyone who is symptompatic is likely to isolate themselves, so there's some logic in focusing on those more likely to be asymptomatic.

Enough · Post by **Enough** » Wed Dec 02, 2020 4:34 pm

FFS people, wear your damn masks!

https://twitter.com/StevenTDennis/statu ... 4328219648

Little Raven · Post by **Little Raven** » Wed Dec 02, 2020 4:47 pm

*sigh* You'd think elected officials would have learned by now.

In early November, as health officials warned of a impending COVID-19 spike, Austin Mayor Steve Adler hosted an outdoor wedding and reception with 20 guests for his daughter at a trendy hotel near downtown.

The next morning, Adler and seven other wedding attendees boarded a private jet bound for Cabo San Lucas, Mexico, where they vacationed for a week at a family timeshare.

One night into the trip, Adler addressed Austin residents in a Facebook video: “We need to stay home if you can. This is not the time to relax. We are going to be looking really closely. ... We may have to close things down if we are not careful.”

Daehawk · Post by **Daehawk** » Wed Dec 02, 2020 4:50 pm

I keep seeing things about some nurses being idiots. One was fired I think because she posted on TikTok about not wearing masks outside work and going t omultiple gathering because screw the rules. Another was going to parties of 100s of people. Not the type you want coming to work to care for you or others.

Oregon Nurse Is Placed on Leave Over TikTok Video Mocking Masks

The video shows her wearing scrubs and a stethoscope around her neck, with a caption saying that she does not wear a mask in public, arranges play dates for her children and still travels.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Wed Dec 02, 2020 5:10 pm

I've met plenty of nurses. Some of them are idiots.

Little Raven · Post by **Little Raven** » Wed Dec 02, 2020 5:17 pm

A significant portion of health care workers do not want to take a COVID vaccine.

So many health care workers are expressing concerns and anxiety about getting COVID-19 vaccines that the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention says addressing hesitancy in this group is a top priority. A CDC survey, shared at a public meeting of its vaccine advisory committee on Nov. 23, found that 63% of health care workers polled in recent months said they would get a COVID-19 vaccine.

To be clear, the 37% are not anti-vaxxers or anything, they just think that this particular vaccine has been very rushed, and are concerned that corners have been cut in order to get the vaccine out as quickly as possible. Most of them are open to the idea, they just want more data.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Wed Dec 02, 2020 5:36 pm

Little Raven wrote: ↑Wed Dec 02, 2020 5:17 pm A significant portion of health care workers do not want to take a COVID vaccine.
So many health care workers are expressing concerns and anxiety about getting COVID-19 vaccines that the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention says addressing hesitancy in this group is a top priority. A CDC survey, shared at a public meeting of its vaccine advisory committee on Nov. 23, found that 63% of health care workers polled in recent months said they would get a COVID-19 vaccine.
To be clear, the 37% are not anti-vaxxers or anything, they just think that this particular vaccine has been very rushed, and are concerned that corners have been cut in order to get the vaccine out as quickly as possible. Most of them are open to the idea, they just want more data.

Quite reasonable, IMO. I wouldn't want to be in the first cohort, either.

Defiant · Post by **Defiant** » Wed Dec 02, 2020 10:28 pm

Daehawk · Post by **Daehawk** » Wed Dec 02, 2020 11:36 pm

I like her. I wonder if she can squeeze me in?

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 12:02 am

Another milestone - at least 2760 recorded deaths today.

The United States on Wednesday recorded its single-worst daily death toll since the pandemic began, and on a day when Covid-19 hospitalizations also hit an all-time high, the pace of loss showed no signs of slowing any time soon.

Not since spring, during the pandemic’s first peak, were so many deaths reported. The high point then was 2,752 deaths on April 15. On Wednesday it was at least 2,760.

Hospitalizations from the virus topped 100,000 — more than double the number at the beginning of November. That is a clear indicator of what the days ahead may look like, experts say.

“If you tell me the hospitalizations are up this week, I’ll tell you that several weeks down the road, the deaths will be up,” said Dr. Jeremy Faust, an emergency medicine physician at Brigham and Women’s Hospital in Boston.

For all the similarities to the spring pandemic peak, there are some profound differences.

In April, the virus and the deaths were concentrated in New York and New England. Today, the pandemic’s toll is being felt across the country.

Still more sobering: The April peak represented the worst moment of spring. It was followed by a decline in deaths as lockdowns were imposed and many Americans altered their behavior.

And as staggering as it is, the death toll reported Wednesday appears likely only to worsen, experts say, as the delayed effects of Thanksgiving travel are felt. And many Americans are now weighing how to celebrate Christmas and New Year’s.

“This is a much worse situation,” said Dr. Ashish Jha, dean of Brown University’s School of Public Health. “Summer is not going to bail us out. Things are not shut down.”

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 8:07 am

COVID+ census at work is right around our previous high. It only took a month and a half to go from low-ish to peak. And Thanksgiving effect is still to come.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 1:46 pm

Isgrimnur wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:00 pm

WWI levels will take us 369,178.

USA Today

The nation's one-day toll of coronavirus deaths surpassed 3,000 for the first time Wednesday, a number perhaps inflated by fatalities reported days late because of the Thanksgiving holiday but still reflective of a pandemic racing out of control.

The death toll of 3,157 came as hospitalizations surpassed 100,000 for the first time. The director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention predicted the U.S. could reach 450,000 deaths by February.
...
IBM analysts have detected a global phishing campaign targeting organizations associated with an overseas supply chain used for vaccine distribution. Spoofed emails impersonating a Chinese biomedical executive targeted organizations that help meet "transportation needs within the COVID-19 cold chain,” analysts wrote.

Jeff V · Post by **Jeff V** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 2:04 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 8:07 am COVID+ census at work is right around our previous high. It only took a month and a half to go from low-ish to peak. And Thanksgiving effect is still to come.

It was reported this morning that state wide, only 18% of ICU beds are available. My wife said some of the worse-off patients at her nursing home are being sent straight to hospice after testing positive.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 2:34 pm

I read elsewhere that YTD "excess deaths" number 347,000. Some feel that that's a better indicator of Covid's toll, because it captures indirect deaths due to such things as suicide, opioids, foregone health care, etc. The actual death toll is probably somewhere between the official count and 347k.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:32 pm

Not really sure what thread this belongs in, but it's the most succinct encapsulation of what so many have struggled to communicate that I've seen.

This whole pandemic has been characterized by comfortably employed white people ignoring the fact that everything we do for fun while “being careful” is dangerous for somebody, and that somebody is probably not another comfortably employed white person.

pr0ner · Post by **pr0ner** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:42 pm

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:53 pm

The president will look down and say, "Save yourselves." And they'll scream back, "NO!"

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:27 pm

pr0ner wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:42 pm

Ask them? Won't move the numbers much if at all.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:30 pm

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:32 pm Not really sure what thread this belongs in, but it's the most succinct encapsulation of what so many have struggled to communicate that I've seen.

This whole pandemic has been characterized by comfortably employed white people ignoring the fact that everything we do for fun while “being careful” is dangerous for somebody, and that somebody is probably not another comfortably employed white person.

I don't accept this. Maybe it's because I live in a mixed area that isn't full of comfortably employed (white) people and I work in a mixed office that is full of comfortably employed people. I find ethnicity is a factor in screaming FREEDOM but the idea that it's white folks is just... wrong from my corner of the world. It's kids having fun. It's large swaths of people just keeping on while "being careful." The White folks are just the ones who are ven diagrammed with a subset threatening some sort of righteous patriotism while doing it.

Octavious · Post by **Octavious** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:51 pm

It's not just white people. My office has a ton of Indian people and they all love Trump and don't wear masks. I just don't get why so many people love that fuckface.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 10:16 pm

LordMortis wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:30 pm I don't accept this. Maybe it's because I live in a mixed area that isn't full of comfortably employed (white) people and I work in a mixed office that is full of comfortably employed people. I find ethnicity is a factor in screaming FREEDOM but the idea that it's white folks is just... wrong from my corner of the world. It's kids having fun. It's large swaths of people just keeping on while "being careful." The White folks are just the ones who are ven diagrammed with a subset threatening some sort of righteous patriotism while doing it.

Class and race issues often overlap and are frequently conflated. This is a class issue. Wife and I are comfortably employed (at home) white people who carefully dined outdoors several times over the summer, when it was reasonably safe (for us) to do so. The uncomfortably employed workers who served us were overwhelmingly, if not exclusively, white. While it might be different in LA, it's not a race issue here.

I deemed it no longer safe in mid October, when the second wave was starting up. Now we're back to getting takeout once a week, and that might get suspended soon, too. I'm flabbergasted when I see people dining indoors on my quick trips to the takeout window. A friend who lives in FL posted some pics of a celebration at a bar there. No distancing, no masks, completely normal pre-Covid scene. Unreal.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:24 pm

pr0ner wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 6:42 pm

Here's the details:

Joe Biden said Thursday that he will ask Americans to commit to 100 days of wearing masks as one of his first acts as president, stopping just short of the nationwide mandate he’s pushed before to stop the spread of the coronavirus.

...

Speaking with CNN’s Jake Tapper, Biden said he would make the request of Americans on Inauguration Day, Jan. 20.

“On the first day I’m inaugurated, I’m going to ask the public for 100 days to mask. Just 100 days to mask — not forever, just 100 days. And I think we’ll see a significant reduction” in the virus, Biden said.

The president-elect reiterated his call for lawmakers on Capitol Hill to pass a coronavirus aid bill and expressed support for a $900 billion compromise bill that a bipartisan group of lawmakers introduced this week.

“That would be a good start. It’s not enough,” he said, adding, “I’m going to need to ask for more help.”

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:31 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:27 pm Ask them? Won't move the numbers much if at all.

Maybe not, but what I saw with the state mandate is that it gave individuals, and especially businesses, an excuse for masks. They weren't wearing them because they were afraid, no, they were wearing them because it was required. It wasn't the grocery store making people mad by requiring masks, it was the state. It let them all wave off the responsibility and avoid the backlash. And it did move the needle here, noticeably.

Even if it only adds 5%, it's something.

stimpy · Post by **stimpy** » Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:54 pm

I live in one of the Counties with the highest infection rate in the State.
Every store I have been to during this has required masks. Almost everyone I saw in the stores had masks.

Know what I do see?
Neighbors kids playing outside with other kids.
Large groups of families still gathering in house.
People out walking or biking with other people.

Point is....masks are worn when required to by the establishment.
Not so much when the decision is left up to the individual.

Our Governor has asked everyone to wear them.
Our Mayor has asked everyone to wear them
That's not gonna change by the President asking people to do it..

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:13 am

stimpy wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:54 pmThat's not gonna change by the President asking people to do it..

To a degree, you're right. However, I'm going to offer two ingredients.

(1) 1/20/21 is going to look and feel very different than 12/3/20. I'm going to go out on a limb and say for some communities in the U.S., the next ~2 months are going to be potentially catastrophic.

(2) Having the leader of United States modeling behavior and asking everyone to participate is a big deal. Back when President Eisenhower had a heart attack in office, it helped raise awareness around the risks for all Americans. If he completely hid it or tried to downplay it as "no big deal" it would have changed the tone of preventative public health efforts focused on lifestyle diseases that had really just started out in the early 1950s.

I know it's been a few years, but the Office of the Presidency can actually be used for noble, respectable things that have real positive impacts.

I'm not naive enough to believe we're going to experience a sea-change in nationwide behaviors, but to start changing the message on this starting at Day 0 is laudable.

stimpy · Post by **stimpy** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:16 am

Smoove_B wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:13 am
stimpy wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 11:54 pmThat's not gonna change by the President asking people to do it..
To a degree, you're right. However, I'm going to offer two ingredients.

(1) 1/20/21 is going to look and feel very different than 12/3/20. I'm going to go out on a limb and say for some communities in the U.S., the next ~2 months are going to be potentially catastrophic.

(2) Having the leader of United States modeling behavior and asking everyone to participate is a big deal. Back when President Eisenhower had a heart attack in office, it helped raise awareness around the risks for all Americans. If he completely hid it or tried to downplay it as "no big deal" it would have changed the tone of preventative public health efforts focused on lifestyle diseases that had really just started out in the early 1950s.

I know it's been a few years, but the Office of the Presidency can actually be used for noble, respectable things that have real positive impacts.

I'm not naive enough to believe we're going to experience a sea-change in nationwide behaviors, but to start changing on the message on this starting at Day 0 is laudable.

Trump had Corona!!!
If that didnt scare the anti-maskers into taking this seriously and start wearing masks, I'm afraid nothing will.

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:20 am

stimpy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:16 amTrump had Corona!!!
If that didnt scare the anti-maskers into taking this seriously and start wearing masks, I'm afraid nothing will.

He did and he received $1.5+ million worth of experimental treatments that no one else on planet earth had ever been given. If he was Donald J. Trump car salesman in upstate NY, I'm guessing there would have been a very different outcome.

And that's why he's been so dangerous. I'm not saying he should have suffered (at least not publicly) but the fact that he seemingly recovered without any problems and so quickly allowed him to continue to project the message that this isn't a big deal. If only we all had access to the same level of care as the PotUS.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:39 am

Octavious wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:51 pm It's not just white people. My office has a ton of Indian people and they all love Trump and don't wear masks. I just don't get why so many people love that fuckface.

When I was in India I got a lot of questions about Trump. And I tried to be neutral about it because they some were very happy when Trump came to India and embraced Modi. Hindu nationalism as a populist movement is big and they think that Trump is aligned to that movement.

El Guapo · Post by **El Guapo** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:43 am

malchior wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:39 am
Octavious wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:51 pm It's not just white people. My office has a ton of Indian people and they all love Trump and don't wear masks. I just don't get why so many people love that fuckface.
When I was in India I got a lot of questions about Trump. And I tried to be neutral about it because they some were very happy when Trump came to India and embraced Modi. Hindu nationalism as a populist movement is big and they think that Trump is aligned to that movement.

He kind of is. Not that Trump is anywhere close to understanding the situation, but Trump would be 100% happy to align with Modi's strident Hindu nationalism. Modi would just need to flatter Trump, but Trump would be 100% happy to let Modi go authoritarian and/or violently suppress India's muslims.

Post by **ImLawBoy** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:01 am

Kraken wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 10:16 pm
LordMortis wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:30 pm I don't accept this. Maybe it's because I live in a mixed area that isn't full of comfortably employed (white) people and I work in a mixed office that is full of comfortably employed people. I find ethnicity is a factor in screaming FREEDOM but the idea that it's white folks is just... wrong from my corner of the world. It's kids having fun. It's large swaths of people just keeping on while "being careful." The White folks are just the ones who are ven diagrammed with a subset threatening some sort of righteous patriotism while doing it.
Class and race issues often overlap and are frequently conflated. This is a class issue. Wife and I are comfortably employed (at home) white people who carefully dined outdoors several times over the summer, when it was reasonably safe (for us) to do so. The uncomfortably employed workers who served us were overwhelmingly, if not exclusively, white. While it might be different in LA, it's not a race issue here.

I deemed it no longer safe in mid October, when the second wave was starting up. Now we're back to getting takeout once a week, and that might get suspended soon, too. I'm flabbergasted when I see people dining indoors on my quick trips to the takeout window. A friend who lives in FL posted some pics of a celebration at a bar there. No distancing, no masks, completely normal pre-Covid scene. Unreal.

Were you looking in the kitchen? It's been a while since I worked in restaurants (both fast food and sit down) in largely white suburbs, but while the customer facing folks were usually white, the kitchen staff was 90%+ Hispanic.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:04 am

stimpy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:16 am Trump had Corona!!!
If that didnt scare the anti-maskers into taking this seriously and start wearing masks, I'm afraid nothing will.

He made a superman recovery. No big deal. If you're afraid of the 'rona you're a girly-man.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:13 am

ImLawBoy wrote: ↑Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:01 am
Kraken wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 10:16 pm
LordMortis wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 7:30 pm I don't accept this. Maybe it's because I live in a mixed area that isn't full of comfortably employed (white) people and I work in a mixed office that is full of comfortably employed people. I find ethnicity is a factor in screaming FREEDOM but the idea that it's white folks is just... wrong from my corner of the world. It's kids having fun. It's large swaths of people just keeping on while "being careful." The White folks are just the ones who are ven diagrammed with a subset threatening some sort of righteous patriotism while doing it.
Class and race issues often overlap and are frequently conflated. This is a class issue. Wife and I are comfortably employed (at home) white people who carefully dined outdoors several times over the summer, when it was reasonably safe (for us) to do so. The uncomfortably employed workers who served us were overwhelmingly, if not exclusively, white. While it might be different in LA, it's not a race issue here.

I deemed it no longer safe in mid October, when the second wave was starting up. Now we're back to getting takeout once a week, and that might get suspended soon, too. I'm flabbergasted when I see people dining indoors on my quick trips to the takeout window. A friend who lives in FL posted some pics of a celebration at a bar there. No distancing, no masks, completely normal pre-Covid scene. Unreal.
Were you looking in the kitchen? It's been a while since I worked in restaurants (both fast food and sit down) in largely white suburbs, but while the customer facing folks were usually white, the kitchen staff was 90%+ Hispanic.

The place we went the most is an Irish pub owned and run by off-the-boat Irish, though, so it's a safe bet my bangers and mash were cooked by someone named Cillian or Finn.

It's a valid point, though. IDK who's cooking any of my takeout orders.

malchior · Post by **malchior** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 3:23 am

It's not just the backend staff at the restaurants, the entire food chain is built on cheap, often undocumented labor using cutout staffing agencies to 'legitimize' them. Heck most in country manufactured dollar store goods are built on those type of labor practices. And they are often the ones getting sick and dying. They work in crowded conditions and have poor to nonexistent access to health care. It was bad in normal times - in covid times it is deadly.

Montag · Post by **Montag** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:30 pm

Isgrimnur wrote: ↑Thu Dec 03, 2020 1:46 pm
Isgrimnur wrote: ↑Sun Oct 04, 2020 10:00 pm

WWI levels will take us 369,178.
USA Today

The nation's one-day toll of coronavirus deaths surpassed 3,000 for the first time Wednesday, a number perhaps inflated by fatalities reported days late because of the Thanksgiving holiday but still reflective of a pandemic racing out of control.

The death toll of 3,157 came as hospitalizations surpassed 100,000 for the first time. The director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention predicted the U.S. could reach 450,000 deaths by February.
...
IBM analysts have detected a global phishing campaign targeting organizations associated with an overseas supply chain used for vaccine distribution. Spoofed emails impersonating a Chinese biomedical executive targeted organizations that help meet "transportation needs within the COVID-19 cold chain,” analysts wrote.

Can you give a link to the article that had this graphic?

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 12:50 pm

https://elemental.medium.com/us-covid-1 ... 7495a43280

GungHo · Post by **GungHo** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:05 pm

Kraken wrote: ↑Wed Dec 02, 2020 5:36 pm
Little Raven wrote: ↑Wed Dec 02, 2020 5:17 pm A significant portion of health care workers do not want to take a COVID vaccine.
So many health care workers are expressing concerns and anxiety about getting COVID-19 vaccines that the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention says addressing hesitancy in this group is a top priority. A CDC survey, shared at a public meeting of its vaccine advisory committee on Nov. 23, found that 63% of health care workers polled in recent months said they would get a COVID-19 vaccine.
To be clear, the 37% are not anti-vaxxers or anything, they just think that this particular vaccine has been very rushed, and are concerned that corners have been cut in order to get the vaccine out as quickly as possible. Most of them are open to the idea, they just want more data.
Quite reasonable, IMO. I wouldn't want to be in the first cohort, either.

Yeah it's the longitudinal studies on safety that simply can't have been done yet. There just hasn't been any time to find out what, if any, long term effects there are. Not to mention that while 30,000 or even 60,000 subjects is a nice start it's nowhere near representative of the population at large. The flu vaccine in 2009( I *think*) caused gullian-barre in about 1/1million recepients.

I'm not going to have any choice in the matter as I'm a front line essential health care worker, and I fully expect I'll be getting this thing before new years. I'll do it obviously as I have to keep my job but I'm not super excited about it. I'm blown away by the combo of science and technology that has allowed these scientists to get this far in such an incredibly short amount of time but yeah I have concerns

Smoove_B · Post by **Smoove_B** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:09 pm

Not that my opinion has any weight, but for both the Moderna and Pfizer vaccinations, I've seen nothing but support from the greater public health community - individuals and groups involved in vaccine research, safety, efficacy, etc...

If I had seen (or see) any type of collective concern expressed, I'd be the first to start yelling.