Windows XP Sunset

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Tue Jan 28, 2014 2:45 pm

Microsoft will be able to silently reach into Windows XP PCs for more than a year after it stops patching the aged OS to clean malware-infected machines, sources close to the company confirmed Friday.

The Malicious Software Removal Tool (MSRT) will continue to be updated and deployed via Windows Update through July 14, 2015, 15 months after the Redmond, Wash. company serves its final public security patches for XP on April 8 of this year.

By extending the life of the MSRT -- and more importantly, automatically running it each month -- Microsoft will be able to clean some PCs if massive malware outbreaks hit Windows XP after it's retired from support.
...
Previously, Microsoft said it would stop shipping Security Essentials' signature updates to XP PCs after April 8. But in a tacit nod to XP's widespread use, Microsoft postponed the cut-off until July 14, 2015.

Kraken · Post by **Kraken** » Tue Jan 28, 2014 11:35 pm

Yay! I had intended to replace my XP machine by April but some financial headwinds are making that look doubtful now.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Tue Jan 28, 2014 11:40 pm

I'm actually getting a little nervous about this. As I upgrade, as I work on other peoples' PCs, and through a couple of generous folks, I've manged to keep a couple of dated machines in the house to play older games/watch videos/let the kids game together on in addition to my gaming PC.

There is no way I can afford to upgrade them all to Win 7 at $100 a pop. That means that I'll have them connected to the internet and unprotected soon.

Fretmute · Post by **Fretmute** » Tue Jan 28, 2014 11:53 pm

Did the Win 7 three pack upgrade deals implode? I paid something like $80 when I went to 7.

gilraen · Post by **gilraen** » Wed Jan 29, 2014 12:02 am

Funny...first thing I do with all my Windows computers is disable automatic Windows updates. Makes for a much more stable computing environment...

hitbyambulance · Post by **hitbyambulance** » Wed Jan 29, 2014 3:57 am

Blackhawk wrote:I'm actually getting a little nervous about this. As I upgrade, as I work on other peoples' PCs, and through a couple of generous folks, I've manged to keep a couple of dated machines in the house to play older games/watch videos/let the kids game together on in addition to my gaming PC.

There is no way I can afford to upgrade them all to Win 7 at $100 a pop. That means that I'll have them connected to the internet and unprotected soon.

what about switching all the web-browsing/video-streaming computers to Ubuntu?

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Wed Jan 29, 2014 1:21 pm

hitbyambulance wrote: Ubuntu?

What did you call me?

Kasey Chang · Post by **Kasey Chang** » Wed Jan 29, 2014 7:08 pm

I have a Pentium D 1 GB RAM XP machine on my desk.

Hmmm... what should I do with it?

Anonymous Bosch · Post by **Anonymous Bosch** » Wed Jan 29, 2014 8:42 pm

Kasey Chang wrote:I have a Pentium D 1 GB RAM XP machine on my desk. Hmmm... what should I do with it?

Put Xubuntu or Lubuntu on it. In my experience, they both run great on low spec systems.

RLMullen · Post by **RLMullen** » Fri Jan 31, 2014 8:41 am

gilraen wrote:Funny...first thing I do with all my Windows computers is disable automatic Windows updates. Makes for a much more stable computing environment...

No it doesn't.

Kasey Chang · Post by **Kasey Chang** » Sat Feb 01, 2014 3:19 am

Anonymous Bosch wrote:
Kasey Chang wrote:I have a Pentium D 1 GB RAM XP machine on my desk. Hmmm... what should I do with it?
Put Xubuntu or Lubuntu on it. In my experience, they both run great on low spec systems.

Yeah, that's what Lifehacker's recommended. I'm kinda thinking personal backup server using Crashplan, but I need to find some cheap HD's.

They do have a Linux version. Hmmm...

I'm thinking about a media server / print server, but I need to find some RAM for this baby. It's only got 1 GB of RAM. XP has got its HD running NONSTOP. Windows is out.

I can also have it run my motion-sensing camera that takes a picture of everyone who walk in or out... Do they make YAWCAM and webcam drivers for Linux? Hmmm...

Frost · Post by **Frost** » Sat Feb 01, 2014 4:56 pm

RLMullen wrote:
gilraen wrote:Funny...first thing I do with all my Windows computers is disable automatic Windows updates. Makes for a much more stable computing environment...
No it doesn't.

I'm no expert, but many of those updates are to sure up security holes that could allow a hacker to "gack" your rig up.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Sat Feb 01, 2014 5:31 pm

hitbyambulance wrote:
Blackhawk wrote:I'm actually getting a little nervous about this. As I upgrade, as I work on other peoples' PCs, and through a couple of generous folks, I've manged to keep a couple of dated machines in the house to play older games/watch videos/let the kids game together on in addition to my gaming PC.

There is no way I can afford to upgrade them all to Win 7 at $100 a pop. That means that I'll have them connected to the internet and unprotected soon.
what about switching all the web-browsing/video-streaming computers to Ubuntu?

Despite all of the joking, I did do some research into the suggestion. This would probably work beautifully on one of my PCs, but the others are used for occasional gaming along with streaming, and I'm a little concerned about that.

My kids use one of them, along with my main Windows 7 PC, for LAN gaming all the time. How much of an issue would that be?

Also:

~How do system resources used by the OS compare between XP and Ubuntu?

~Every time I look to see if Program X can run on Ubuntu, I find pages full of what look like arcane command-line inputs for the fix. Is that really how it works?

gilraen · Post by **gilraen** » Sat Feb 01, 2014 5:50 pm

Frost wrote:
RLMullen wrote:
gilraen wrote:Funny...first thing I do with all my Windows computers is disable automatic Windows updates. Makes for a much more stable computing environment...
No it doesn't.

I'm no expert, but many of those updates are to sure up security holes that could allow a hacker to "gack" your rig up.

I didn't say I never install Windows updates. I manually check for critical security updates and install them myself - instead of having Windows constantly download god-knows-what and insist on rebooting my computer at the least convenient time possible.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Sat Feb 01, 2014 5:54 pm

Actually, I do the same. I have it notify me when updates are available, then download them myself. I manually check every couple of days, just to be sure. But automatic, hands-off updates? I haven't done that in as long as I can remember.

Kasey Chang · Post by **Kasey Chang** » Sat Feb 01, 2014 11:15 pm

Windows games won't run on Ubuntu unless it's compatible with WINE (windows library emulator?)

Jeff V · Post by **Jeff V** » Mon Feb 10, 2014 2:56 pm

Kasey Chang wrote:Windows games won't run on Ubuntu unless it's compatible with WINE (windows library emulator?)

Correct, and even then, they run badly.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Mon Feb 10, 2014 3:43 pm

Yeah, that pretty much removes the option for two of the three machines in question. My oldest PC is used to browse the web while gaming (so I can use skill trees, maps, etc) and occasionally to play podcasts. That's it - it is a very old system, and isn't even on most of the time. It seems like a great candidate for learning Linux.

Both of the other systems are used to game to differing extents. One I may try and find a way to upgrade to 7.

The other? I may have to stick with XP and just limit browsing on that machine to minimize the risk. It is the system I keep hooked up to my TV, and is used primarily for watching video files, plus LAN gaming when the kids want to play together (mostly Minecraft and Roblox lately - it won't run most modern games.)

hitbyambulance · Post by **hitbyambulance** » Tue Feb 11, 2014 12:33 am

Blackhawk wrote: The other? I may have to stick with XP and just limit browsing on that machine to minimize the risk. It is the system I keep hooked up to my TV, and is used primarily for watching video files, plus LAN gaming when the kids want to play together (mostly Minecraft and Roblox lately - it won't run most modern games.)

if those are pretty much the only two games that are used on that machine, keep in mind that Minecraft is Java, so there is a Linux client available. the developers of Roblox may also come out with one as well (based on what i read on their dev journal).

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Tue Feb 11, 2014 12:40 am

hitbyambulance wrote:
Blackhawk wrote: The other? I may have to stick with XP and just limit browsing on that machine to minimize the risk. It is the system I keep hooked up to my TV, and is used primarily for watching video files, plus LAN gaming when the kids want to play together (mostly Minecraft and Roblox lately - it won't run most modern games.)
if those are pretty much the only two games that are used on that machine, keep in mind that Minecraft is Java, so there is a Linux client available. the developers of Roblox may also come out with one as well (based on what i read on their dev journal).

Those are currently the only games in question, but with kids, that isn't necessarily an unchanging situation. With fewer and fewer console games allowing local co-op, I want to keep it as an option.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:46 pm

Ubuntu-ing one system today. Wish me luck.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:50 pm

Here's a question: I have eleventy-gazillion Office files - Word, Excel, etc.

Will I be able to read/modify them under Ubuntu? I'm just assuming that Microsoft hasn't made Office Linux compatible. Wonder why I'd assume that?

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:52 pm

Office Online. Now it doesn't matter what your OS is.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 1:54 pm

Blackhawk wrote:Here's a question: I have eleventy-gazillion Office files - Word, Excel, etc.

Will I be able to read/modify them under Ubuntu? I'm just assuming that Microsoft hasn't made Office Linux compatible. Wonder why I'd assume that?

MS has not (though they do Mac). However, there are Linux programs that can work with .doc or .docx etc... files but they are usually behind the times with MS formats. So, you might be on 2003 or 2007 right now but now work right with 2010 or some such thing.

http://www.openoffice.org/download/other.html

And almost forgot. You should be able to try google docs as well.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:01 pm

LordMortis wrote:
Blackhawk wrote:Here's a question: I have eleventy-gazillion Office files - Word, Excel, etc.

Will I be able to read/modify them under Ubuntu? I'm just assuming that Microsoft hasn't made Office Linux compatible. Wonder why I'd assume that?
MS has not (though they do Mac). However, there are Linux programs that can work with .doc or .docx etc... files but they are usually behind the times with MS formats. So, you might be on 2003 or 2007 right now but now work right with 2010 or some such thing.

http://www.openoffice.org/download/other.html

And almost forgot. You should be able to try google docs as well.

Yeah, Open Office and/or Google docs are the answers unless you're on a cutting edge Office and use a lot of the XML features. Guessing if you're going from XP you're not though.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:01 pm

I really don't want to be tied to only reading my documents when I'm online. Thunderstorm season is coming, and internet downtime is assured around here.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:03 pm

Blackhawk wrote:I really don't want to be tied to only reading my documents when I'm online. Thunderstorm season is coming, and internet downtime is assured around here.

Open Office is downloadable.

And Google Docs can handle it too: Set Up Offline Access.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:04 pm

It's tied to the OneDrive service, which gives you a folder on your HDD that auto syncs with the cloud, so you still have stuff locally. Of course, the PC program is not XP compatible.

dfs · Post by **dfs** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:04 pm

RLMullen wrote:
gilraen wrote:Funny...first thing I do with all my Windows computers is disable automatic Windows updates. Makes for a much more stable computing environment...
No it doesn't.

Like many here I'm unofficial tech support for several friends/relatives and I have to confirm that many of the calls I get are from folks where windows update is in some kind of endless loop. It's usually far easy to fix that kind of problem than I real virus, but it happens pretty often.

As is detailed downthread....there is nothing wrong with windows update. It's the automated features that is trouble.

TheMix · Post by **TheMix** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:11 pm

dfs wrote:
RLMullen wrote:
gilraen wrote:Funny...first thing I do with all my Windows computers is disable automatic Windows updates. Makes for a much more stable computing environment...
No it doesn't.
Like many here I'm unofficial tech support for several friends/relatives and I have to confirm that many of the calls I get are from folks where windows update is in some kind of endless loop. It's usually far easy to fix that kind of problem than I real virus, but it happens pretty often.

As is detailed downthread....there is nothing wrong with windows update. It's the automated features that is trouble.

What she left out, is that this is mostly for our work computers. For some reason the Desktop Support team at our work has never seen fit to do any kind of screening of updates. They just let everyone get updated at the discretion of MicroSoft.

I can tell you, it's pretty annoying to be in the middle of working a critical issue and suddenly have your computer decide to reboot (sometimes I either don't see the window that allows me to delay, or don't get it). And with our encrypted hard drives, you are then down for about 10 minutes.

And don't get me started on Adobe, java, browser, etc updates that suddenly install and then break your app functionality. I get tired of rolling back updates....

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:28 pm

I'm not a writer anymore. I don't really need Office - I may just make the switch to Open Office.

On the other hand, reading the installation instructions for Open Office on Linux is making my head spin.

Windows: Double click the .exe, accept.

Ubuntu: Just type in...

sudo apt-get remove --purge libreoffice* libexttextcat-data* && sudo apt-get autoremove

cd /tmp

wget

tar -xvf Apache_OpenOffice*.tar.gz

sudo dpkg -i en-US/DEBS/*.deb

sudo dpkg -i en-US/DEBS/desktop-integration/*.deb

Is it seriously like this to install everything in Linux? If so, I'm seriously doubting installing it.

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:29 pm

TheMix wrote:And don't get me started on Adobe, java, browser, etc updates that suddenly install and then break your app functionality. I get tired of rolling back updates....

Oh sweet baby Pancake, I have come to despise Java both and Java Developers. Everything is constantly breaking because everything is constantly changing and everyone just shrugs and they have to have everything constantly chance because new malware is always finding ways to exploit java. And heaven forbid you get people to make something that works on more than one or two versions of whatever it is they are supposed to be working with or maybe divorce your damned java stuff from working with browsers all together and then make it work with more than one or two generation of java.

As to the rebooting. You can turn that feature off and I usually do.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/555444

http://www.sevenforums.com/tutorials/60 ... start.html

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:31 pm

Blackhawk wrote:I'm not a writer anymore. I don't really need Office - I may just make the switch to Open Office.

On the other hand, reading the installation instructions for Open Office on Linux is making my head spin.

Windows: Double click the .exe, accept.

Ubuntu: Just type in...

sudo apt-get remove --purge libreoffice* libexttextcat-data* && sudo apt-get autoremove

cd /tmp

wget

tar -xvf Apache_OpenOffice*.tar.gz

sudo dpkg -i en-US/DEBS/*.deb

sudo dpkg -i en-US/DEBS/desktop-integration/*.deb
Is it seriously like this to install everything in Linux? If so, I'm seriously doubting installing it.

This is why I made the jump back form linux. It's not easy or intuitive. And I just don't have it in me to figure it out for fun anymore after I work all day. I was kind of hoping things has changed over the last ten years. I guess not.

Isgrimnur · Post by **Isgrimnur** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:33 pm

Is this a bad time to tell you that they just released JDK 8?

LordMortis · Post by **LordMortis** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 2:34 pm

Isgrimnur wrote:Is this a bad time to tell you that they just released JDK 8?

I hate you.

TheMix · Post by **TheMix** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 3:12 pm

LordMortis wrote:
Isgrimnur wrote:Is this a bad time to tell you that they just released JDK 8?
I hate you.

And ...

Oh sweet baby Pancake

... also made me laugh. No idea what it means, but I do find it highly amusing.

And thanks for the links. I'm going to have to look into that.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 3:29 pm

Blackhawk wrote: Is it seriously like this to install everything in Linux? If so, I'm seriously doubting installing it.

What distro are you using? Have you looked at Mint?

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 3:46 pm

LawBeefaroni wrote:
Blackhawk wrote: Is it seriously like this to install everything in Linux? If so, I'm seriously doubting installing it.
What distro are you using? Have you looked at Mint?

Ubuntu?

I have Ubuntu installed now. My audio doesn't work. My display flickers, windows draw slowly (as they would in Windows before video card drivers are installed), and I haven't the faintest idea about how to find or install drivers to make this usable.

/edit and every solution I see involves long strings of command line code.

I haven't used command line for anything in a decade. I feel like I'm trying to use my PC like it is 1992.

Blackhawk · Post by **Blackhawk** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 4:26 pm

I'm going to try Mint. If I can't get that at least functional, I'll just reinstall XP and cross my fingers.

LawBeefaroni · Post by **LawBeefaroni** » Wed Mar 19, 2014 4:33 pm

Blackhawk wrote: Ubuntu?

I have Ubuntu installed now. My audio doesn't work. My display flickers, windows draw slowly (as they would in Windows before video card drivers are installed), and I haven't the faintest idea about how to find or install drivers to make this usable.

/edit and every solution I see involves long strings of command line code.

I haven't used command line for anything in a decade. I feel like I'm trying to use my PC like it is 1992.

Give Mint a try. It's an Ubunto distro[bution]. I'd recommend trying out a few distros before you put too much time into any particular one. Packages make installing software much easier. Here's a Mint manual.

The nice thing right now is that you don't have a whole lot of time or data invested. You can reformat freely and try out various distros.

You will have to know some command line ("terminal") code no matter what but not a whole lot if you're just doing basic computing.